The Race Goes On -- And Gets Uglier

The Race Goes On -- And Gets Uglier

McClatchy/NBC News   |   March 5, 2008 01:55 AM


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"Now it could get ugly," McClatchy reports in its Tuesday night wrap-up.

Hillary Clinton's victories in Ohio and Rhode Island aren't enough to turn the tide and overtake Barack Obama, who still leads in delegates needed to win the Democratic presidential nomination.


But her victories were enough to stop his winning streak at 12 and break his momentum. Perhaps more important for the party, Tuesday's results likely ratified her scathing attacks on Obama as a dangerous neophyte who would endanger the country.

As long as Clinton thinks that works -- she could say she's found her voice again -- and suspects that other forces also might be starting to line up against Obama, she'll stay in the race and keep hitting him harder and harder.

"We're going on, we're going strong and we're going all the way," she told supporters in Columbus Tuesday night.

She almost certainly can't overtake him in the 11 states left to vote. However, she can stay in and hope that he falters under her attacks, tough new scrutiny from the news media and more Clinton wins in states such as Pennsylvania, which votes on April 22.

Seemingly confirming this take, senior Obama advisor David Axelrod told reporters on Tuesday that his candidate is ready to go toe-to-toe with Clinton:

"We have not hesitated to draw distinctions between the candidates," he said, "and we'll continue to do that. If Sen. Clinton wants to take the debate to various places, we'll join that debate. We'll do it on our terms and in our own way, but if she wants to make issues like ethics and disclosure and lawfirms and real estate deals and all that stuff issues, as I've said before I don't know why they'd want to go there, but I guess that's where they'll take the race."


But is Obama willing to go there?

"We're willing to draw distinctions that are honest and legitimate," Axelrod said before raising the issue of Clinton's tax returns and the records from the Clinton library.

It's going to be a long seven weeks to Pennsylvania....


 
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How about Obama/ Clinton ticket..............with Clinton as VP since Obama would win pledged delegates. That could save time, money and a convention disaster. Democrats need the money to fight republicans and to start painting John McCain before he gets a free ride for five months and saves money. Don’t you think the mess would go worst and hurt the Dems?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:35 PM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

I agree. That should be the solution. I don't think that the ticket should be Clinton/Obama, since she will prob. lose this thing, even if she does play a game of scorch the planet.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:40 PM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

I'm FAR from a Clinton supporter, but I sense that she doesn't wish to go down the road of dirty tricks if she can avoid it. She already implied that she would be up for considering a combined 'dream' ticket (just to clarify - not MY dream, but it might be better than warfare in the dem ranks). Would you want to be known as the one who took out Barack w/ dirty tricks, especially when Barack has been pretty much sticking to the high road? And, God forbid, suppose McCain won because she TANKED the democratic party's chances due to her ego. No, she doesn't wish to be defeated, but I think she's going to be pragmatic, for her own self-centered sake... Further, would you want your political career tarnished by the 'accomplishment' of having taken out the 'Yes we can' movement. Things aren't bad now because Barack w/ probably still win w/ his delegate count, but imagine if the Clinton smear machine goes into full swing!.. Sort of like fighting against Sauron, the dark lord. Can be done, but very difficult since she doesn't play by the rules, and you'll be near death when evil falls. :)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:29 PM on 03/05/2008

She's found her voice? She needs a good case of laryngitis. So she sucked in a those undecideds in Ohio with her 3:00 A.M. distorted ad, but I don't think the Super Delegates can get sucked in with that. I don't think they fall to the scare tactics that those voters fell for. I would hope they are a more sophisticated bunch - dont you?

If someone is a divider and not a unifier as Obama, how can we get back our credibility on the world stage. It is not all about the U.S. It is also about the World. The rest of the world hates Bush and his administration policies. Hillary and McCain are Bush all over again. It won't be just a split in the Dem party, it will be a pulling away from America the Warmongering Nation.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:34 PM on 03/05/2008
- mix2007 I'm a Fan of mix2007 6 fans permalink

If Hillary runs the general election, and more importantly the white house, like she has run her idiotic, tonedeaf campaign, we are all in trouble!
The superdelegates know that Obama has actually GROWN the party. This is the future of the DNC. If they "steal" the nomination from the guy who won the most votes, they will instantly lose these people for decades possibly.
She can't catch up. She needed BIG wins yesterday and didn't get it.No need to ask her to bow out, eventually, with the clock running out, after her last "firewall" in PA, she will dwindle away to irrelevancy.Sorry, the voters matter. She can't win. It's over. If she wants to drag it out, spend all her supporters money, that's her call. But she can not catch up.The only downside is if she ends up helping McCain by either giving him plenty of time to raise money and attack Obama, and also provide the GOP with more and more material to attack him with. That is why I think Hillary is selfish and ruthless to go on. It seems like it is mostly out of ego or spite.

This is a victory for the GOP and their 100 years war in Iraq.

**So is Hillary the new Huckabee, or the new Nader?**

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:26 PM on 03/05/2008
- ndolomar I'm a Fan of ndolomar 11 fans permalink

need help -- trying to find the right conjugation:

"i just got kitchen sinked..."
"...pulled a kitchen sink."
"...will enact a kitchen-sink campaign..."

(still trying it out, since the term looks to be the successor to "swiftboat." and, yes, i've posted a variation of this elsewhere -- for trademark purposes. :-) )

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:40 PM on 03/05/2008

THANK THE LORD FOR THE CLINTON YEARS!!!

GDP: rose from 6300 to 11,600
NATIONAL INCOME- 5,000 to 8,000 Billion--
JOBS CREATED 237,000 per month to replace Jimmy Carter's record of 218,000.
AVERAGE WEEKLY EARNINGS--$360 to $478
AVERAGE WEEKLY HOURS WORKED--never hit 35.0--hit that mark 4 times in 80's
UNEMPLOYMENT--from 7.2% down down down to as low as 3.9%
MINIMUM WAGE--$4.25 to $5.15
MINORITIES--never better!!!
HOME OWNERSHIP--hit all time high
DEFICIT--290 Billion to whoopee a SURPLUS
DEBT----+28%---300% increase over prior 12 years by Conservatives.
FEDERAL SPENDING--+28%---+80% under Reagan- who is the true conservative?
DOW JONES AVERAGE 3,500 to 11,720 top in 2000. All it's history to get to 3500 and Clinton zooms it!!!
NASDAQ--700 to 5,000 top in 2000.---All of it's history to get to 700 and Clinton zooms it!!!
VALUES INDEXES-- almost all bad went down--good went up in zoom zoom zoom
FOREIGN AFFAIRS--Peace on Earth good will toward each other---Mark of a true Christian--what has Bush done to Peace on Earth?
POPULARITY---highest poll ratings in history during peacetime in AFRICA, ASIA AND EUROPE . Even 98.5% in Moscow--left office with Highest Gallup rating since it was started in 1920's.
STAND UP FOR JUSTICE--evil conservatives spent $40M on hearings and investigations and caught zilch!!!
Bill Clinton, the ONLY Dem President to serve 2 terms since FDR!!! Now Hillary our 44th President ... Amen ...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:19 PM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

Economics are cyclical. And did you forget the tech bubble that burst? Clinton happened to be lucky enough to be in on the upswing.. But, a larger point.. Integrity wins over dollars every time (with me that is).. Some people sell out and say, "hey, if you put money in my pocket, you can do and be whatever.. just line my pockets.." If that's you, seek help.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:21 PM on 03/05/2008
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Leave it to the Democrats to snatch defeat out of the jaws of victory. Hillary is blinded by her ambition and if she continues on with her negative ads and casting doubts on Obama's experience she will continue to define the Republican's campaign. Everyone knows that the telephone ringing ad is nasty and fear mongering. All McCain has to do is use that ad and if it has the same effect on the people voting in the primaries, just imagine the results it will have on the general.

Word to Hillary, do something unselfish for a change, drop out now and support your party, rather fight till the end and hand the election to the Republicans. It is my belief that if she doesn't, her career as a politician is over because no one will vote for the Democratic Senator that gave away the Presidency to the Republicans while tearing the Democratic party apart at the seams.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:33 PM on 03/05/2008

NO! Leave it to the far-left-loser-looney-fringe to try to do another 2000! The right wing attack machine will wipe the floor with Fluffy Hussein! Thank the Lord, Hillary will save the Dems, NOT the looney fringe, the DEMS!

The looney losers want the Dems to lose so they can contiue their rants and raves for that is essentially their politics and the crux of their political existence ...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:22 PM on 03/05/2008
- Rocky4356 I'm a Fan of Rocky4356 5 fans permalink

Lets get real The former Chief Hostess of the United States out foxed Obama. For folk to keep whining about her going to the dark side and Obama must stay above the fray lets get real. When you are down you must swing for the fences. Obama is going to Steel Town so he better get out his abestos draws cause its gonna get hot. Stop running home and telling about the bully who bloodied your nose. My mother would have asked me how does the other guy look. Being honest you didn't lay a glove on her. You may have maintained the delegate math but in the public eyes you got whacked. If Obamas guys ever watched a Steeler or Eagle game they would see the kinda folks who live in Penn. Ms. Clinton 35 years of exprience has never been looked at. if being Chief Hostess of America qualifies you to answer the phone at 3Am in the morning maybe we need to change the color of the phone.The fact that see traveled alot would qualify her for a travel agent gig not the presidency. Obama needs to take the gloves off and DECK HER cause she ain't no lady!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:52 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

And if her egotistical move costs us the general election, she and you amoral people who voted for her will need to look yourselves in the mirror for 4yrs and wonder what 'could have been' had you not caused the party to self destruct.. She can't win unless Barack throws in the towel, or she resorts to dirty tricks (a Clinton specialty). I don't think Barack will give up. I do think she will do what she needs to do to pacify her ego (and yours).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:09 PM on 03/05/2008

We support Barack because anybody can go negative and spin out of control. Barack please don't act foolish on us just work on the issues that is what we are concerned about beside it is in Hillary's nature to be low-down.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:32 PM on 03/05/2008
- heavencent I'm a Fan of heavencent 11 fans permalink

I am from 'the Burgh",and you are so right!Obama has been "TOO" nice To her.He has to get down and dirty just like her,because its obvious she will stop at nothing to get what she wants.I couldn't believe my ears when she started reeling off all her experience she thinks she has to be C-in-C;talking about "fairy-tales" How did what happened during BILL's TERM become her experience.WTF- is she for real.I just want this to be over.Please PA.-do the right thing Let's get on with throwing these crazies out of office.Let's take our country back before it's too late!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:21 PM on 03/05/2008
- anthonylee I'm a Fan of anthonylee 4 fans permalink
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Democrats - wasting TIME, wasting MONEY and airing DIRTY LAUNDRY to "Repugletts"!

Oh, and if that isn't enough, the Legislative Democratic Representatives (i.e. - "Losers") on Capital Hill are caving to the Bush - White House on illegal wiretaps and granting immunity to the Telecoms!?!?!?

I'm beside myself, perhaps we're looking at the "Republican Conspiracy" to destroy the DNC, once and for all? Watergate couldn't have been the only plan on the table!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:19 AM on 03/05/2008
- anthonylee I'm a Fan of anthonylee 4 fans permalink
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Taking two "Chill Pills" and will call in the morning. . . . .

Mathematically, Hillary can't win enough Pledged Delegates to overtake Obama - check out Newsweek article - http://www.newsweek.com/id/118240 - "Hillary's Math Problem"

What's really giving me heartburn is Hillary's "argument" that's being floated to win the nomination through the Super Delegate votes. If this is allowed to happen, the Democratic Party as we know it will no longer exist; It will be fractured beyond repair!

If Sen. Obama isn't the nominee, I'll "write-in" Barack Obama in the General - that's my "vote" and that's my conscience. The Respect and Honor that I have for my Country and the Office of the "Camander and Chief" will not allow me to vote the lesser of all "evils". My "vote" and others like it, will most assuredly elect McCain to the Office . . . so be it, Karl Rove wins again. After the election my time will be spent working on a grassroots level, setting my sights on Congress, helping to vote Incumbent Democrats "OUT OF OFFICE"!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:07 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

well said.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:11 PM on 03/05/2008

You're starting to sound awfully convincing...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:16 PM on 03/05/2008

Quick poll. How many of us Obama supporters will NEVER vote for Hillary after this nastiness (if she were the nominee)?

She won't get my vote. Anybody else?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:44 AM on 03/05/2008
- bauersox I'm a Fan of bauersox 4 fans permalink

Oh yes. Go ahead and vote for McCain. Vote for a Supreme Court that's a slave to the Christian Right. Vote for continuing our presence in Iraq for the next hundred years. And vote for abolishing stem cell research, keeping the price of fuel through the roof. Good plan. You're a true Democrat. If you're the sort of person who is backing Obama, that's all the more reason to make sure he doesn't get within walking distance of the White House.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:52 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

Attacking the aggrieved will not assuage them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:00 AM on 03/05/2008

Nice try. You mistake us for the typical, mindless voter who is incapable of distinguishing between good and evil, good judgment and bad, good leadership skills and lack of them, fear mongering and courage. There is little difference between Hillary and McCain (look at her voting record). She's as much a good old boy as he is. NEVER will she get my vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:02 AM on 03/05/2008

Look. As I have tried to look at this long-term I have reached a couple of conclusions:

FIrst, the reason that the Repubs are also imploding is because this whole "conservative" thing can't sustain itself. Let's suppose they got everything they wanted - no abortion, no stem cell research, no gay marriage, etc. Don't you think this would ultimately result in a bit of buyer's remorse? Women who need abortions are both democrats and repubs. Gays are both democrats and repubs. People who can benefit from stem cell research are both democrats and repubs. Their rhetoric SOUNDS better to them than it would be to them in practice. Repubs will ultimately revolt against their own practices. I say, if it comes to a choice of Hillary or McCain, let them have it and implode. It can't get much worse than it is right now - and if it does, the repubs will be the clear culprits, opening the door for democrats far into the future.

Second, Hillary would just allow them to blame all of the current ills on the democrats. People have short memories and are easily manipulated at times
(texas and ohio are evidence of this). She would simply continue along the same path as the repubs and ultimately the dems get blamed for the whole set of problems.

I say, if not Obama, then McCain, as a strategy that goes beyond a short-lived democratic victory.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:17 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

Not me. Would rather have glass shards ground into my pupils than vote for a divider like Clinton.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:53 AM on 03/05/2008
- jhink465 I'm a Fan of jhink465 13 fans permalink

When this all started, I would have voted for any of the Democratic candidates with their hat in the ring and a pulse over any Republican. Now we have the choice of Clinton and Obama. After watching the way Clinton has operated, I could never vote for her. It would be like voting for a Republican. She is just as dirty and slimy and her character reflects all that has been wrong in this country. I'm up to here with dirty Rovian politics. Aren't you?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:53 AM on 03/05/2008
- bauersox I'm a Fan of bauersox 4 fans permalink

The real Rovian politics will begin after the convention. A lot of people will get a real lesson on the distinction between opposition based on real issues -- and outright lies that are impossible to refute. Perhaps then you silly people won't be so glib about throwing around his name, as if it were a synonym for "Hitler."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:07 AM on 03/05/2008

I would not vote for Hilary or McCain, and anyway what's the difference?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:10 AM on 03/05/2008

There is NO scenario under which I'd vote for Hillary Clinton (see my post below).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:54 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

I know you are disappointed, but don't be rash. Ask, would you rather have Clinton or McCain. Would you rather have at least an attempt at health care, or the chance of WWIII? Clinton isn't Obama, but at least she's not McCain. (That could be her intra-party campaign slogan ^^.)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:55 AM on 03/05/2008

It doesn't matter if we get Hillary we will end up getting McCain anyway.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:56 PM on 03/05/2008

Clinton / Obama' 08 that's the way it should be right now. If Hillary is smart she should follow Barracks lead and target McCain. I come to this conclusion for the good of the country and the Democratic Party. I still think Obama might have the delegate lead at the end but he is astute enough to realise that if the democratic voters split and there is a ugly fight,McCain wins.So Hillary be smart and follow Barrack's lead. Let's see what Hillary is made of and takes the high road here. She can turn this into a win/win and let the people decide from here or destroy the party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:34 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

I don't know why you all think Clinton is now winning. She wasn't "knocked out" (not that she would have stepped aside had Obama won the Texas primary anyway), but she is still way behind.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:58 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRPike I'm a Fan of DRPike 14 fans permalink
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It's still Obama/? 08. SHe didn't even put a meaningful dent in his lead last night.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:00 AM on 03/05/2008
- JUSTME I'm a Fan of JUSTME 17 fans permalink

Fuck NO!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:24 PM on 03/05/2008

"As Ohio goes, so goes the nation"...duh!
From two states that NAFTA has devasted, the brianless have prevailed. Once again, Texans and Ohioans have voted against their own best self interests.
Never underestimate the stupidity of the American people.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:26 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

The "stupidity" of the American people is seen in the new dilemma -- when is, she can't win without scorching the playing field! Reminds me of an old adage. Put 10 democrats in a room and you'll have 12 opinions. *We* are our own worst enemy in this party.. What Limbough didn't realize is that he didn't need to send Republican spoilers into the Democratic districts to vote for Hillary. We were stupid enough to do it to ourselves. Chalk one up to enlightenment.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:41 AM on 03/05/2008

Hillary would get killed in a race against the republicans. Her own words and tactics can only come back to bite her. If she's running on "experience" who will have the most experience between her and McCain? Duh. If she's trying to scare up votes with national security issues who do you think will appear more qualified? This is so obvious. She has sealed her own fate with this direction.

Obama has the moral high ground. He represents change in a time when McCain is running to continue a direction that has seen an attack on the country, a record deficit, a housing crash, a horrific economy, $4/gallon gas....

Not to mention that McCain will NOT run a campaign even as nasty as Hillary. He's already apologized for the words of that radio host. He still feels the pain of the attacks on him from his last presidential run and is not inclined to stoop to those levels - as Hillary is.

Obama is not only the best way - he's the only way.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:01 AM on 03/05/2008

or the similairites between Clinton and Bush. He won those two states in 04. It's mystifying

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:37 AM on 03/05/2008
- obamavet I'm a Fan of obamavet 2 fans permalink

Okay, it's time to start asking in a serious way, just what is Hillary's "real" experience? What is Bill's Canadian connection and was that related to the "leaked" memo? It's time to DEMAND Hillary's tax returns. I could go on. If Hillary wants to take this into the gutter, then Obama needs to roll up his sleeves, hold his nose and dive in after her and stop letting her get away with her rediculous tactics.

obamavets.com

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:26 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

No, he should not follow her into the gutter. He should not sink to her level, or he abandons what he stands for and she really does win.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:30 AM on 03/05/2008
- fredamae I'm a Fan of fredamae 53 fans permalink

I must ask you...."WHO is Obama?" He comes out of left field, an unknown, a year ago. Most of his votes were not offering an opinion but rather "present". What ARE his accomplishments?
he touts "CHANGE". Change what? How will this "change take place? He touts "hope"... Hope? WTF does That mean? Hope is Not new. We have been Hoping" for the last 7 years, for the love of God! How will he Address Hope and Change?

I like Obama. He is a most excellent speaker, but I want to know What he plans to do, How he believes he CAN accomplish All of these "changes" or is it all just More bullshit? He does make me want to get up, get busy and help...but doing what, why and how?

I really do not know anything about him, not really....do you?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:51 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRPike I'm a Fan of DRPike 14 fans permalink
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He has MORE legislative experience than HRC.

His name is on MORE (better) legislation in the last two years than HRC.

Unless you count her time as First Lady, marked by one SPETACULAR policy failutre and picking the flatware, she has NOTHING on Obama but exposure...
Exposure Experience.

And for HRC, Exposure = 100% republicasn and 50% of democrats dislike and distrust her.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:04 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

Yes. There's lots of information available. The Internet is a good place to start.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:04 AM on 03/05/2008

The one thing I know about him, is the day that he is elected we are better off. Not only in the eyes of the world, but in the eyes of people in the U.S. who never thought they had a chance to be represented.

The second thing I know about him is he will not play games with us, or send our people to die for no reason.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:16 AM on 03/05/2008

Please try his website,

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:43 AM on 03/05/2008

So this makes Hillary qualified? He is only an unknow to people like you I was shocked to hear so many people say they did not know anything about the only black senator I was wondering why the media never did a story on it. But they will do plenty of stories now just to satisfy the Clintons. I also know several of the senators and representives by names and faces and how they vote, I listen to them talk, I know what they will or will not fight for. Most of the congress needs replacing both dems and repubs they really don't try hard enough to work together to get anything done. So it doen't matter who the president is if they are not willing to work together nothing is going to get done anyway. Do you really thing they will work better for Hillary?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:26 PM on 03/05/2008
- fredamae I'm a Fan of fredamae 53 fans permalink

More to the point......."what is Obama's Canadian Connection?" Do you really believe, as a politician, Obama would stand up and admit he got caught?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:54 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

Got caught doing what, precisely. Think the situation through, including all the evidence. And let's see how Obama addresses the issue before passing hasty judgement.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:03 AM on 03/05/2008

Absolutely Obamavet. But it's our job as voters to demand these things too. Let's blog, and email, contact the media and the DNC -- that's the only way to get transparency and complete information that voters need to decide.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:47 AM on 03/05/2008

I will not vote for Hillary Clinton. She needed not only to win Ohio and Texas, but win big. She won by 10 percentage points in Ohio, and by 3 in Texas. Texas was basically a tie with Obama winning the caucus. While I admire Obama for taking the high road, it's time to fight. Fighting dirty does not have to be his fight. He just has to fight tough.
Her experience? What is she referring to, this foreign policy experience?
She turned the other way when Bill disgraced her and America with his cheating. what kind of example is that to women?
Her campagn manager Michelle Williams; why go to France?
The Clintons shady land deals, have we forgotten?
Denise Rich and her husband? come on
release your taxes Hillary!
How do you legally loan your campaign 5 million dollars?
I will not vote for either Clinton nor McCain as they represent the same thing to me.
Ive been voting since 1986, this will be the first time I dont vote if Hillary becomes the dem nominee.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:11 PM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

If Obama responds to Clinton's attacks in kind, and McCain keeps up his pretense of civility, McCain is strengthened. If Obama ignores Clinton's attacks, he may look weak and lose, and McCain is greatly strengthened. A no-win situation? It's going to be tough to point this out to the (Democratic) electorate, who seem to even get beyond rumor and xenophobia. (If only more Americans had post-secondary educations!) This is a very difficult situation.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:21 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

Well said.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:23 AM on 03/05/2008
- SShaw490 I'm a Fan of SShaw490 38 fans permalink

It's definitely time for the party to step in. Barack won't lose the nomination because she'll attack him and he won't attack her - he'll start attacking her on her tax returns, her business deals, Bill's foundation, Bill's conduct, Bill's pardons while he was in office, and anything else that's out there. Barack's campaign will have no trouble at all reminding America why they were happy when the Clintons left the White House the first time and why they don't want the Clintons going back.

But at the end of the day, that's a zero-sum game - both candidates are going to wind up damaged and they're going to be doing the Republican party's work for them. The party needs to add it all up, come to the inescapable conclusion that Hillary can't possibly win enough earned delegates to overtake Obama; the party can't re-do the Florida and Michigan rules; and the superdelegates can't overturn a sizable Obama lead at the convention. The party high-ups need to start urging superdelegates to go to Obama and try to prevent a blood bath that will wind up helping nobody but McCain.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:17 AM on 03/05/2008
- briel I'm a Fan of briel 2 fans permalink

I agree. Howard Dean needs to stop the bloodletting *before* it starts, or McCain is seriously strengthened. Have you listened to McCain lately? He really doesn't sound that bad (from the standpoint of (or in terms of appeal to) a moderate/independent). He's explained his '100 year in Iraq' comment to mean that we would "occupy" in the way that we "occupy" other countries. Not war, just troop presence. He's explaining a lot, and really he doesn't sound *that* bad. And to tell you the truth, if Obama goes negative, which is to say that Clinton forces him to be negative, McCain might start to sound good. Dean better get on the ball.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:29 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

I agree with you that McCain (and Huckabee) sounded very nice last night. Hopefully, after Bush, people will recognize the friendly war monger. Very scary.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:10 AM on 03/05/2008
- fredamae I'm a Fan of fredamae 53 fans permalink

why not just let the Democratic Process play out as it was intended. Hurt the Party? No, it won't. isnt this "the Peoples choice"? just because there are TWO Very good candidates and just because "We The People" are having a historical election cycle DOES NOT MEAN its time to call it quits when there are STILL Millions of People left who HAVE Not had an opportunity to vote in the Primary!

I resent the very suggestion that "the party" wishes for one or the other to drop out before the completion of the "democratic process"!!!!!!!

I sense it has more to do with ending it now because those at the top wish for one candidate over the other to succeed and they are threatened because it IS so close.

Screw that! I want to vote and I want MY Damn vote to MEAN something!!!!!!!

This time, it IS time for "the big guys at the top" to get the hell out of our (we the people) way. THIS is OUR choice, not the MEDIA'S, NOT HOWARD DEAN'S, and MOST certainly NOT the choice of the Super Delegates and Delegates if it goes AGAINST the will of the voters.

We must not allow Bullshit to supersede our rights! Have we NOT been bullshitted enough by "those at the top"?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:39 AM on 03/05/2008
- DRHoen I'm a Fan of DRHoen 3 fans permalink

It would be wrong to subvert the democratic process. It would also be a tactical error. It is not enough to win nomination. The whole point, which some have already forgotten -- don't join them, is to win in November. Disenfranchising Clinton's supporters will discourage them from voting and will alienate independents.

On the other hand, as everyone agrees the super-delegates are (unfortunately, in my opinion) part of the process. If the trickle of 'supers' flowing to Obama becomes a flow, perhaps the voters will begin to wonder why, perhaps they will see the big picture. And it would certainly not be undemocratic if Obama came to enjoy, based on his wins at the polls, at least as much support from the supers as Clinton has enjoyed since before the voting began. He is currently 5% ahead in elected ('pledged') delegates and 9% behind in appointed ('super') delegates, according to Real Clear Politics. Now would be a good time for them to make their choice.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:53 AM on 03/05/2008
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