Florida And Michigan Remain In Spotlight

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First Posted: 03-11-08 10:58 AM   |   Updated: 03-28-08 02:46 AM

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Democratic National Committee Chair Howard Dean may only be getting a taste of what could be a grueling march to the Pennsylvania primary and beyond, in which the daily mission will be withstanding question after question on how to solve a problem like Florida and Michigan. Revote supporters have advanced just about every solution possible -- firehouse primaries, cost-effective caucuses, mail-in revotes -- but nothing has firmly moved the DNC from their position: that rules are rules and they need to be abided (at least until such time as another committee takes over the management of said rules). Neither campaign seems willing to budge on their core positions: the Clinton campaign, who might benefit from a small gain in pledged delegates, wants to revotes to go ahead, whereas the Obama camp is content with their "pocket veto" approach to the matter.

But the drum beats on. In today's Washington Post, Governors Ed Rendell and John Corzine jointly take up for the re-vote cause, saying, "We believe there should be a revote in Florida and Michigan":

Even if there were no other choice, having our nominee decided by superdelegates in the backrooms of Washington -- or Denver, at the convention in August -- would be less than ideal. But allowing superdelegates to determine the outcome of our nominating process while 366 pledged delegates, elected by more than 2 million democrats in Michigan and Florida, remain unseated is especially undemocratic and risks squandering the feelings of hope and optimism about a Democratic presidency that these two candidates themselves have done so much to engender across the country.


Fortunately, we do have another, more democratic choice: We can choose to enfranchise Democrats in Florida and Michigan, thereby increasing the likelihood that voters, not politicians or party elders, will determine who faces Sen. John McCain in the fall.

We're not suggesting, as our colleagues Jennifer Granholm of Michigan and Charlie Crist of Florida would prefer, that the results of the previous nominating contests in those states be honored. Just as there is nothing fair in disenfranchising voters for decisions they did not make, there is nothing fair or democratic about seating delegates elected in states that were not honestly contested or where all of the candidates were not even on the ballot.

We are suggesting that Democrats in Florida and Michigan be allowed -- now that the Iowa caucuses and New Hampshire primary have long since passed and now that it seems virtually impossible for either of our candidates to reach 2,025 delegates -- to cast meaningful votes for delegates who will help choose a nominee whose support from the voters of our party cannot be disputed.

Naturally, Corzine and Rendell's protestations deserve to be taken with a grain of salt. Both are committed supporters of Hillary Clinton, and long before they start talking up what's good for the party and the nation, they aim at least one dig squarely at Clinton's opponent: "When Barack Obama's campaign says that Hillary Clinton can't escape the harsh realities of delegate math, it's telling the truth. The problem with that argument is that neither can he." This ignores that one of the "harsh realities" -- indeed, perhaps the harshest -- is that the Democratic system of delegate apportionment will likely prevent the gap in delegates between the two candidates from closing substantially, especially in a re-vote scenario.

Besides, those persnickety "rules" remain. The state party was told in advance that there would be a price to pay for moving their primaries, and many believe that it's equally important for the DNC to hold firm on this point. In a competing editorial item in the Post, "Stumped" columnist Andres Martinez takes up that point of view, comparing the actions of "politicos from Florida and Michigan" to the bratty behavior of his own son, and ridiculing the notion of disenfranchisement as "ludicrous." And ultimately, he doesn't see the hurt feelings of Florida and Michigan politicos as relevant to the general election:

Besides -- especially this year -- it's not as if the Democrats need to worry about enthusiasm. The notion that Florida or Michigan Democrats are going to turn against their party in November if their delegations aren't seated in Denver strikes me as a myopic insider view. After eight years of George Bush, Democrats in Detroit and Ft. Lauderdale will be more than motivated enough to turn out in November, regardless of whether their state delegates were allowed to vote at the party's convention in Denver.

He has an interesting point. If the states' delegations don't end up getting seated, how far are party officials willing to push the matter in the fall? Will they campaign for McCain? Work to depress voter turnout? Remind their constituents of the great wrong that was done to them by the DNC? Dean might be making the right move, here, in refusing to be bluffed into action.

Nevertheless, what's clear is that the issue is not going away anytime soon. It's a little amazing that the Eliot Spitzer fiasco couldn't move the Florida/Michigan mess out of the news cycle for more than a few hours. Another couple of months of media attention might be enough to cow anybody into submission.

Democratic National Committee Chair Howard Dean may only be getting a taste of what could be a grueling march to the Pennsylvania primary and beyond, in which the daily mission will be withstanding qu...
Democratic National Committee Chair Howard Dean may only be getting a taste of what could be a grueling march to the Pennsylvania primary and beyond, in which the daily mission will be withstanding qu...
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There is nothing in th party rules that prevent a revote, since the original vote did not meet the qualifying criteria of being held on or after Feb 5. Any vote that is held now or later does not violate those restrictions.

At issue is who pays for a revote. Dean has riled out the DNC paying and the Governors (Crist, at least) have ruled out the state paying for them. If an acceptable alternative can be found that's funded, Dean has no say in the matter. He must allow Florida's and Michigan's delegations to be seated.

This seems like a no-brainer for Clinton. I've no doubt she could pick up more than a few delegates on the difference if SHE could bring the revote to Florida and Michigan. The fact that the Obama campaign fights any such solution would be a big blow to him. Probably the fewest dollars per delegate she'd have to spend.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:57 PM on 03/11/2008
- kylie I'm a Fan of kylie 25 fans permalink

No one wants a revote but Clinton. Don't sign contracts you do not intend to honor-speaks volumes about character or lack, there of.

She is someone who can't seem to keep her word, wants to play by Her Rules and could care less that three/fourths of Democrats want Obama, a chance to hear him debate McCain, a chance to be proud of his successful battle to win the nomintation.

She is destroying her reputation, the credibility of the Party, and the demoralizing voters.

Just what everyone wants-another George Bush-female version. Could she allow the country to heal, the Party to unify, and enjoy a candidate we want rather than a corporate plant!

How about gracefully bowing out-trying to preserve her legacy, if she still has one.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:59 AM on 03/12/2008
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It's really quite simple, once you remove all the desperate Clinton tactics to steal something they haven't earned. Will not seating the FL and MI delegations be harmful to voter turnout in the GE, no doubt! Does it make sense to let Clinton have the illegal delegates that were elected in the illegal primary elections in which there was no no fair campaigning, decidedly NOT? So if Hillary were honorable (I know...hah­aha) she would retire from the primary and then the full FL and MI delegations could be seated. Their punishment would be the realization that if they had played by the rules and stayed within the rules they would have been in a position to play a significant role in selecting the next president of the United States instead of playing no role at all. C'mon Hillary, do the right thing for FL and MI, the party and the country, do just one thing not about yourself!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:31 PM on 03/11/2008

Actualy they can't be seated unless there's some qualifying selection contest prior to the convention. Even if he's the only candidate, there must be a selection contest.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:59 PM on 03/11/2008
- anthonylee I'm a Fan of anthonylee 4 fans permalink
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"Re Do's" in FL & MI places the DNC on a slippery slope. The "Moral Authority" of the party will be compromised beyond repair.

Rules are rules, just like in cards or sports - everyone participating agrees to the rules (and wild cards) at the start. Changing the rules half way into the game, to benefit the loosing participant is called "cheating".

There is a price to be paid for "cheating" in the same way that there is a price to be paid for "breaking the rules". FL & MI broke the rules, a "re do" absolves them of any responsibility or punishment for breaking said rules. Now the rules become mere suggestions with no consequence if broken. Seat the Delegates from both States 50/50 for each Candidate, it allows participation at the convention, and the penalty is they do not change or impact voting trends or popular vote counts.

Anything else slides the party into the abyss of anarchy and disorder.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:47 PM on 03/11/2008
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I would be comfortable with a 50/50 split as well as my moral suggestion above.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:33 PM on 03/11/2008

Why 50/50 split when the voters of Florida gave 50% of the vote to Senator Clinton and only 33% to Senator Obama despite the fact that Obama advertised - campaigned in the state for the two weeks prior to the Florida primary????

Sorry, I don't go with that. The vote in the primary should stand and Howard Dean and the rest of the Obama supporters should understand that Florida Republicans were the ones who made the rules that the Democrats were expected to follow. I call it right out of Karl Rove's game plan along with his chosen candidate to oppose McCain in the Fall. What I can't understand is how the media and voters are giving Obama a pass on the possibility that it might be proved by Patrick Fitzgerald in a court room in Chicago that Obama received favors from Rezko much like the Duke Cunningham case in California.

I say count the votes in Florida and Michigan as the good citizens of those states cast them and let's get on with the campaign and if the media begins to ask hard questions of BOTH candidates, we are sure to come up with the best and most experienced to beat John McCain in the Fall. I think you will find that candidate will be Hillary Clinton.
We have too much that has gone on in the White House to put a novice who hasn't even found the restrooms in the Senate building yet...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:14 PM on 03/12/2008
- hopein I'm a Fan of hopein 2 fans permalink

Yes!!!! 50-50

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:52 PM on 03/11/2008
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