Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., greets supporters during a campaign stop where she spoke to the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, Wednesday, March 12, 2008, at the Ronald Reagan Building in Washington. (AP Photo/Carolyn Kaster)

Florida Dems Weigh Mail-In Plan

BRENDAN FARRINGTON | March 12, 2008 10:17 PM EST | AP

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TALLAHASSEE, Fla. — Florida's Democratic Party chair urged Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, Sen. Barack Obama, the national party and her own state's congressional delegation to consider a combined vote-by-mail/in-person plan as a redo of the Jan. 29 presidential primary.

The idea would be to mail ballots to all registered Democratic voters and set up 50 regional voting offices to help "disadvantaged communities" participate in an election ending June 3, state party Chairman Karen Thurman said in a memo to the campaigns and state and national party leaders.

Florida's nine Democratic congressmen voted Tuesday night to oppose a mail-in vote. Thurman urged them to reconsider.

"There is no question that we must move quickly to deal with the dispute over Florida's Democratic presidential primary. Fingers have been pointed in every direction, but how we arrived at this breaking point is irrelevant. The stark reality is that all Democrats lose if this is not resolved immediately," Thurman wrote in a memo that included a draft of the plan. A copy of the memo was obtained Wednesday by The Associated Press.

Thurman asked party leaders to review the draft and send feedback by Friday. On Monday, if there is consensus that the party should go forward with the plan, it would begin raising the estimated $10 million to $12 million to pay for the do-over while also gathering public comment.

Democrats in Florida and Michigan have been scrambling to come up with alternatives to ensure their delegates will be seated at the national convention in Denver this summer. The Democratic National Committee punished the states for moving their primaries ahead of Feb. 5 and stripped them of all their delegates.

Clinton won Florida and Michigan, although she was the only major candidate on the ballot in Michigan.

"In my view there are two options _ honor the results or hold new primary elections. I don't see any other solutions that are fair and honor the commitment that 2.5 million voters made in the Democratic primaries in those two states," Clinton said Wednesday.

Obama has said he is concerned about accuracy and fairness with a mail-in vote organized so quickly. Clinton's campaign has not commented on the mail-in option, except to say it will accept a do-over of the vote and "consider other scenarios as appropriate."

Obama told reporters Wednesday that his campaign is consulting with officials in Florida, Michigan and the DNC and he's confident something will be worked out.

"My bottom line is, I do want to make sure that the Florida and Michigan delegations have an opportunity to participate in the convention," he said. "And we want to figure out an equitable way to do that."

Michigan Democratic Party leaders were considering several options to get their delegates seated, including a mail-in vote or a state-run Democratic primary to be held in May or June and paid for by Democratic donors. The latter plan would have to get Republican lawmakers' approval and faces numerous other hurdles.

Despite the possible problems, four Michigan Democratic leaders uncommitted to any candidate plan to run the idea past the Obama and Clinton campaigns Thursday during separate talks. Democratic National Committee member Debbie Dingell, Rep. Carolyn Cheeks Kilpatrick, Sen. Carl Levin and Ron Gettelfinger are in that group.

In Washington Wednesday, Sens. Debbie Stabenow of Michigan and Bill Nelson of Florida, both Clinton backers, spoke to a meeting of Clinton's national fundraising team. They said the issue of seating the delegation needed to be resolved, probably through a revote, according to a person who attended. The attendee said the senators discussed potential problems with a mail-in vote, even though Nelson favors one.

But members of Florida's congressional delegation said in a statement late Tuesday that they oppose such a step "or any redo of any kind."

Officials at the Democratic National Committee were working behind the scenes to get the Florida delegation to come together and agree on a solution so the delegates can be seated.

Florida Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, who backs Clinton, spoke to DNC Chairman Howard Dean and said the delegation will work with him on a solution. But she said she will not change her mind about a mail-in vote, in part because seniors who spend the summer up North, poor residents who rent homes and often move and others could be left out.

"This is totally experimental," she said, adding Florida voters have been shaken by past election problems, including the 2000 presidential recount, and need their confidence restored. "Having a party-run election that's never been done before is not a way to do that."

Clinton also told NPR in an interview that she believes the Michigan results are fair and should be honored even though Obama removed his name from the ballot.

"That was his choice, remember," she said. "There was no rule or requirement that he take his name off the ballot, and his supporters ran a very aggressive campaign to try to get people to vote uncommitted. So it wasn't that he didn't participate at all. In fact there was a real effort to get people to vote uncommitted, and I still won 55 percent of the vote."

In Florida, state Senate Democratic Leader Steve Geller dismissed the Florida House members' concerns and said the mail-in vote is the only reasonable way to seat the state's delegates.

"What is more unacceptable to me is our having no input at all, so if I have to choose between two bad choices, I'll choose the one that's least objectionable," Geller said.

The party would run the election, rather than the state. It would hire a private election management company, an accounting firm and security and would allow representatives from each campaign to observe. The state would be paid to verify ballot signatures.

Thurman also said the election would help the party's voter outreach efforts.

The idea is gaining ground because the race between Obama and Clinton is still unresolved.

Under party rules, Florida and Michigan would have until June 10 to hold another vote.

___

Associated Press writers Nedra Pickler in Washington and Kathy Barks Hoffman in Lansing, Mich., contributed to this report.

(This version CORRECTS Corrects that fundraising would begin if consensus reached among leaders.)


 
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The system is broken.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:56 AM on 03/13/2008

If they allow this the Democrats should be viewed as enablers. They broke the rules and they need to pay the consequences.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:20 AM on 03/13/2008

As Hillary would say, "Let's get real, here". If the Florida and Michigan primarys were counted as they occurred, Hillary would gain some pledged delegates but not enough to overtake Obama. What she would gain is nearly 300,000 popular votes in Florida and another 300,000 in Michigan with none going to Obama since his name was not on the ballot. THAT is where her attention is focused. She wants to take the lead in poplular vote so she can advance the notion that she got more popular votes and won, in her mind the "important" states. She can then say the caucuses should not count because they are not a reflection of popular vote and, VOILA, see superdelegates, I actually won. Now, if you are Obama, you wait to see what happens in PA, NC and IN. If Obama loses a few delegates, most likely it will be near a draw, and a couple of hundred thousand popular votes, he should propose to let the Florida results stand and argue that Hillary keeps her votes, both popular and delegate in Florida compared to Obama's. In Michigan, Hillary keeps her votes and Obama gets all the votes cast for Uncommitted. Then the pledged delegates are assigned accordingly. Here is the penatly phase. In return, both states lose their super delegates. Since the voters did no wrong, their votes get counted, though it will be a serious undercount of both states. The people who pay the price are the superdelegates who were responsible for the debacle in the first place. I am sure the superdelegates each voted in the primary, so their vote counts, just not as a super delegate.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:51 AM on 03/13/2008
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"Would Bush's Justice Dept Have To Approve Revote?"

Bush... justice. Bush...justice. The two words don't belong in the same sentence together.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:50 AM on 03/13/2008

The Bush White House will do anything it can to help Hillary. They know full well she's the best chance they have at electing President McCain.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:20 AM on 03/13/2008

To be fair, I understand the republicans wanted the primary moved up, dems had to agree or
fund their own statewide, millions they did not have and could not spend.... caught between a rock and a hard place, they voted to move up too.

But I think a 50/50 split of the delegates half to Clinton, half to Obama, with no more revotes, and no more messing around is fair.... that way the delegates get seated, but those that didn't play by the rules don't sway what has be accomplished by the rest who did.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:33 AM on 03/13/2008
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There's chatter now that the FL Dems voted to approve Republican-sponsored HB 537 because it included a "paper trail" for elections and you would think that any election trail in Florida that isn't 97% slime would be a good thing. The bill included other goodies, such as allowing FL politicians to keep their state jobs when running for federal office, cracking down on citizen petitions (I didn't know this was a big problem in Florida!), and more. (See: http://www.sptimes.com/2007/05/08/Columns/This_bill_does_a_lot_.shtml)

This was a TERRIBLE bill, and for the Dems to come back now saying they acted for the good of the election process is disingenuous at best. I don't know if they could have defeated the measure, but they were either complicit in wanting the primary moved and/or did what Democrats seem able to do best -- allow the Republicans to put them over a barrel!

As to whether our remaining candidates "campaigned" in Florida, let's be honest -- HRC 'appeared' in FL and Obama aired a 'national' ad that just happened to spill into FL when no other primaries were happening. We should just let the FL primary stand and spend our energy figuring out how we can give Florida back to the Seminoles!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:32 AM on 03/13/2008

someone else posted the suggest - so I'm just asking it again...

Why not seat the delegates in each state, but they are apportioned 50/50....that way they do not change the over all results of those who played by the rules and the delegates get seated.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:31 AM on 03/13/2008

Might I suggest that Florida be heretofore forbidden from voting at all? When was the last time those people down there managed an uneventful, uncontested election that wasn't sullied by fraud and abuse? They're hopelessly incompetent or corrupt or both.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:11 AM on 03/13/2008
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hillary merely's wants the Super Delegates...she could care less about the individual voters. Why doesn't she just tell the truth...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:31 AM on 03/13/2008

Its being illegal shouldn't prevent it happening in Florida, should it?

It is only illegal because it is such an open invitation to fraud. Why should that bother anyone in Florida?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:35 AM on 03/13/2008
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What is this lady smoking? Do she have any idea how many people stayed home knowing their vote had no meaning whatsoever. A few hard core, early-on Obama supporters may have checked the uncommitted box, but please! Nothing is uglier than desperation Mrs. Clinton. Man, and to think I actually supported her at one point. Makes me sick.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:48 AM on 03/13/2008


There are 50 States in the US.

The 2 ,Florida & Michigan, that revolted with the Party to play first. They got sanctioned. The deciders included Hillar'y gangmen, Ikes, McAuliffe et al. No one cried as to why the disenfranchement of delegates of these states is ordered. Hillary too kept quiet, THEN.

Now that all except , FL & MI,obeyed the Party Rules, are ENDANGERED.
She wants her to rewarded these States and Herself. THUS those who followed rules are being PUNISHED!!!! what a shame.

Well OBAMA will never except manufactered defeat of him.

The Party that represent 50 States will disintegrate just to satisfy 2 states that defied rules and now say they are VICTIMS. Let the BULL in DEAN come out and reshut MI & FL as they ARE the sinners.

HOLY COW. Bring in the BULL to smell this cow.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:16 AM on 03/13/2008
- Liam I'm a Fan of Liam permalink
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I really wish Clinton would stop touting her 55% victory against "uncommitted" in Michigan, it insults our intelligence.

We all know how most people vote, they walk into the booth, they look at the names available to them and they choose one. Almost no one votes write-in, and we've all become conditioned to believe that voting "none of the above" (which is essentially what "uncommitted" is) is throwing away our vote.

I do not believe a 55% showing against "uncommitted" is the same as a 55% showing running against her strongest opponent, and I wish she'd stop trying to make us all think it is.

Liam.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:10 AM on 03/13/2008

Clinton would have to win 83.5% in every single congressional district in both Florida and Michigan to pull off a delegate victory, and the supers are not going to vote for the loser. We need a candidate who lives in reality, and Clinton is not that.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:01 AM on 03/13/2008

just say no to cheating. Would you let your children change the rules just so they could win the game ?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:31 PM on 03/12/2008
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