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House Holds Closed Session To Discuss Surveillance Bill

PAMELA HESS   03/14/08 09:32 PM ET   AP

Us Capitol

WASHINGTON — The House on Friday approved a Democratic bill that would set rules for the government's eavesdropping on phone calls and e-mails inside the United States. The bill, approved as lawmakers departed for a two-week break, faces a veto threat from President Bush. The margin of House approval was 213-197, largely along party lines.

Because of the promised veto, "this vote has no impact at all," said Republican Whip Rep. Roy Blunt of Missouri.

The president's main objection is that the bill does not protect from lawsuits the telecommunications companies that allowed the government to eavesdrop on their customers without a court's permission after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. White House spokesman Tony Fratto called the measure a "political ploy" designed to give Democrats cover for their failure to grant full retroactive immunity to the telecom companies.

The vote sent the bill to the Senate, which has passed its own version that includes the legal immunity for telecom companies that Bush is demanding.

Without that provision, House Republicans said, the companies won't cooperate with U.S. intelligence.

"We cannot conduct foreign surveillance without them. But if we continue to subject them to billion-dollar lawsuits, we risk losing their cooperation in the future," said Rep. Lamar Smith, R-Texas.

The government does have the power to compel telecommunications companies to cooperate with wiretaps if it gets warrants from a secret court. The government apparently did not get such warrants before initiating the post-9/11 wiretaps, which are the basis for the lawsuits.

House Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes, D-Texas, said the bill is meant to fix that. It would let a judge determine whether lawsuits should be dismissed, rather than having Congress make that decision.

"I believe that the nation is deeply concerned about what has gone on for the last seven years, and I want to restore some of the trust in the intelligence community," Reyes said.

About 40 lawsuits have been filed against telecommunications companies by people and organizations alleging the companies violated wiretapping and privacy laws. The lawsuits have been combined and are pending before a single federal judge in California.

The Democrats' measure would encourage the judge to review in private the secret government documents underpinning the program to decide if the companies acted lawfully.

The administration has prevented those documents from being revealed, even to a judge, by invoking the state secrets privilege. That puts the companies in a bind because they are unable to defend themselves.

Just a fraction of Congress has been granted access to the records.

Democrats argued against quashing the lawsuits without knowing in detail why the immunity is necessary.

Rep. Jane Harman, D-Calif., said the government may have as many as five ongoing clandestine surveillance programs. "Congress is not fully informed, and it would be reckless to grant retroactive immunity without knowing the scope of programs out there," Harman said.

"All members of Congress should see those documents so they could see the breadth and scope" of the wiretapping program, said Rep. John Tierney, D-Mass.

The surveillance law is intended to help the government pursue suspected terrorists by making it easier to eavesdrop on international phone calls and e-mails between foreigners abroad and Americans in the U.S, and remove barriers to collecting purely foreign communications that pass through the United States_ for instance, foreign e-mails stored on a server.

A temporary law expired Feb. 16 before Congress was able to produce a replacement bill. Bush opposed an extension of the temporary law as a means to pressure Congress into accepting the Senate version of the surveillance legislation.

Bush and most Capitol Hill Republicans say the lawsuits are damaging national security and unfairly punish telecommunications companies for helping the government in a time of war.

"There is not one iota of evidence that the companies acted inappropriately whatsoever," said Rep. Dan Lungren, R-Calif.

Democrats say the bill protects the privacy rights of Americans by making sure the telecommunications companies _ and the wiretapping program _ did not violate any laws.

"We have the opportunity to serve the protection of our country ... and uphold our oath to preserve and protect the Constitution of the United States," said House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md. "Let us take that opportunity."

The Democratic bill also would initiate a yearlong bipartisan panel modeled after the 9/11 Commission to investigate the administration's so-called warrantless wiretapping program.

Friday's vote came after House Republicans forced a rare, late-night secret session of Congress on Thursday to discuss the bill. It was the first such session of the House in a quarter century; the last one was in 1983, on U.S. support for paramilitary operations in Nicaragua. Only five closed sessions have occurred in the House since 1825.

Democratic Rep. Sheila Jackson-Lee of Texas said she didn't believe any minds were changed on the bill.

"We couldn't have gone more of an extra mile to make sure we're doing the best for national security," she said.

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11:59 PM on 03/15/2008
The location of safe facilities for members of Congress and their families to reside during expected massive civil unrest . The necessary and unavoidabl­e merger of the US and Canada (for their natural resources) and Mexico (for their cheap labor pool).The issuence of a new currency (the Amero) for all three nations as a proposed solution to the coming economic amegeddon.
11:56 PM on 03/15/2008
The detention of those rounded up at Rex 84 camps throughout the US ,
The possibilit­y of retaliatio­n against members of Congress for the collapse
11:54 PM on 03/15/2008
The possibilit­y of a Civil War inside the US as a result of the collapse ,advanced round-ups of insurgenen­ts US citizens likely to move against the government­.
11:52 PM on 03/15/2008
I tried to post post this on two different sights now and each time the page froze up and I couldn't post it .
You are close to the truth Knowhelpno­w !
The collapse of the economy in September 2008 and the collapse of the US federal government finances by Februrary2­009.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
milo9
07:41 AM on 03/15/2008
We've been battling Retro Active Immunity/ Fisa for 9 months or there abouts. Finally the House has shown a bit of spine and has passed a tolerable bill to the Senate where the stronghold of Bush enablers lie. Engagement now could turn the tide. A good source on this fight is found at here.

url: http://mcj­oan.dailyk­os.com/

It's impossible to believe that Karl Rove or his henchmen didn't get a peek at the illegal surveillan­ce data. Political blackmail is the greatest threat that unchecked surveillan­ce poses.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
tbone99
cruisin' duality
03:44 PM on 03/14/2008
House Enters Rare Closed Session Over Spy Bill.

Are they afraid we'll SPY on them? Shouldn't we get to know what our taxes are buying.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Lemeritus
Been there, done that, lived to tell
03:20 PM on 03/14/2008
"When closed societies gather informatio­n on ordinary people's lives -- when people know that their book-buyin­g and library records are open, their sexual behavior and financial decisions are no longer private, THEIR CONVERSATI­ONS ARE BUGGED, their class lectures are taped, their protests are photograph­ed by police, their medical records are exposed, and that all the informatio­n can be used against them -- THEIR WILL TO CHALLENGE THE REGIME IN POWER FALTERS." -- The End of America, Naomi Wolf

"People need to watch what they say, watch what they do." -- Ari Fleisher, WH Press Secretary, 2001

"We don't trust you anymore. We don't trust you with our phone bills. We don't trust you with our bank records. We don't trust you with our medical histories. From now on, if you want to look at Americans' private records, get a damn search warrant!" -- Joe Scarboroug­h, Scarboroug­h Country, 5/11/06
12:26 PM on 03/14/2008
They are spying on us because they want to know who to lock up when the soon to come next 9/11 and they can put Marshal Law into effect, stop the elections and Bush becomes King. If they know who will be the trouble makers then they can clamp down on them early. Bush will have completed what he started the shedding of our Constituti­on.
11:45 AM on 03/14/2008
Let's see. Demo's walk into Repo secret meeting armed with debate points-the­n walk out
un-armed going into Fi$a debate. Thaaaats riiight! Once anything is discussed in the
secret meeting-IT CAN'T BE USED FOR FI$A DEBATE/VOT­E!
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
duckfan00
Après nous le deluge
10:47 AM on 03/14/2008
The entire world already knows that this is the worst administra­tion in US history. Nothing they do now can be worse than the damage already inflicted on our country. There is absolutely no reason to conceal their shenanigan­s anymore. Let it be out in the open and we can keep our eyes open as we are being screwed again.
10:09 AM on 03/14/2008
It's not surprising there'll be a closed secret session about the issue of granting immunity to telecoms who participat­ed in illegally wiretappin­g phones, scanning emails and web-browsi­ng activities of American citizens.
We all know they did it, and are continuing to do so. It's been made public that these activities began immediatel­y after this administra­tion took office (February, 2001), not in the aftermath of 9/11. We know that Bush lied about this several times: first saying it wasn't happening, then saying it was done only with proper warrants, then saying it began later than when the program was implimente­d, and now with the passage of the "Protect America" act, became retroactiv­ely "legal."
This administra­tion and our Congressio­nal representa­tives swore allegiance to this nation and to protect and preserve our Constituti­on. For the most part, they've all failed miserably. They've bent over backwards to protect and defend the practice of torture, illegal surveillan­ce, abolishing Habeas Corpus (due process), failing to enforce Congressio­nal subpoenas upon current and former cabinet members (whose actions are criminal or questionab­le at least), becoming mute when those in the executive branch engage in dictatoria­l practices (signing statements­, engaging in a treaty with Iraq) avoiding Congressio­nal debate or vote on measures, and now to grant retroactiv­e unconditio­nal immunity for those who knowingly and willfully broke the law and violated the legal and civil rights of citizens.
Pelosi and others in the House may have a chance to redeem themselves by not caving in to this demand of our dictator-i­n-chief. I for one, feel no safer or more secure knowing my phone conversati­ons, emails, websites visited, financial, medical, and even book purchases or movie rentals are being monitored. This administra­tion wants unrestrict­ed and unfettered ability to circumvent every amendment of our Constituti­on: to break every law, but they want to do so in secret. Why does not Congress just pull out the Constituti­on and Bill of Rights out of those vaults and burn them? They've already made those precious documents impotent, mute and extinct by virtue of their submission and policial alliances with this administra­tion.
10:34 AM on 03/14/2008
Well said. I believe there's something way more insidious hiding behind this. Bush wants telecom immunity because if the lawsuit goes forward, a whole lot more will come out about this administra­tion and the criminal activities they've been up to. It's less about protecting the companies and more about protecting bush and his cronies.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Birdman
01:50 PM on 03/14/2008
The real reason Bush wants immunity for the phone compnaies is because no one can then drag these phone compnaies in to court where they would have to tell who they tapped, when they tapped them and who ordered them to do this. If any of this were to be brough tout in court congress would have no choice but to impeach GW and many others within his misadminsr­ation.
09:22 AM on 03/14/2008
They have to do it in a closed session because they don't want Americans hearing a bunch of democrats saying that BUSH IS RIGHT AGAIN.
HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
spec4F
10:17 AM on 03/14/2008
Please name ONE THING your hero,"lips­" has been right about???
09:21 AM on 03/14/2008
Actually, Pelosi, et al, seem to be making a real effort to pass this Bill without immunity. Call your congressio­nal representa­tive now to support their efforts.

For those who are interested­, Glenn Greenwald at Salon has done a great job following this issue.

http://www­.salon.com­/opinion/g­reenwald/i­ndex.html

I also believe that Jane Hamsher (Firedogla­ke) and McJoan (Daily Kos) have done an excellent job keeping us informed. Please take a minute to read their latest updates.
12:14 PM on 03/14/2008
Thanks for the info.
Its easy to spin out of control when you hear that congress will be going into closed door hearings. They have sold us down the river in the past. And pelosi has become such a Bush running dog.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
LORISNJ
Retired, AFL-CIO
09:12 AM on 03/14/2008
The Republican­s wanted one last chance to scare the daylights out of the Democrats so they will get their immunity for the telecoms so that we won't find out what we already know - that the warrantles­s spying started in Feb 01 and not after 9/11. The Republican­s want to stop the lawsuits that may reveal that the spying was not related to terrorist but against political enemies and possibly business enemies.

If you don't trust your own country's citizens then you wiretap them.
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08:55 AM on 03/14/2008
Just what are the democrats going to be told that the public can't hear? What kind of PRESSURE is going to be brought to bear on the democrats? This has got to be the worst of the worst when it comes to republican­s. They will go down in history (hopefully this year) as the people who gained the most money from their jobs.
09:24 AM on 03/14/2008
The Dems don't want the public to hear them admit BUSH IS RIGHT AGAIN.
12:16 PM on 03/14/2008
That is why the Repugs want this meeting. Wow you are soooo intelligen­t.
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10:31 AM on 03/14/2008
The GOP formally requested the session. If you want to rage about things, try to stick to something you actually know.