House Holds Closed Session To Discuss Surveillance Bill

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PAMELA HESS | March 14, 2008 08:32 PM EST | AP

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President Bush makes a statement on FISA (Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act) legislation, Thursday, March 13, 2008, on the South Lawn of the White House in Washington. (AP Photo/Charles Dharapak)

WASHINGTON — The House on Friday approved a Democratic bill that would set rules for the government's eavesdropping on phone calls and e-mails inside the United States. The bill, approved as lawmakers departed for a two-week break, faces a veto threat from President Bush. The margin of House approval was 213-197, largely along party lines.

Because of the promised veto, "this vote has no impact at all," said Republican Whip Rep. Roy Blunt of Missouri.

The president's main objection is that the bill does not protect from lawsuits the telecommunications companies that allowed the government to eavesdrop on their customers without a court's permission after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. White House spokesman Tony Fratto called the measure a "political ploy" designed to give Democrats cover for their failure to grant full retroactive immunity to the telecom companies.

The vote sent the bill to the Senate, which has passed its own version that includes the legal immunity for telecom companies that Bush is demanding.

Without that provision, House Republicans said, the companies won't cooperate with U.S. intelligence.

"We cannot conduct foreign surveillance without them. But if we continue to subject them to billion-dollar lawsuits, we risk losing their cooperation in the future," said Rep. Lamar Smith, R-Texas.

The government does have the power to compel telecommunications companies to cooperate with wiretaps if it gets warrants from a secret court. The government apparently did not get such warrants before initiating the post-9/11 wiretaps, which are the basis for the lawsuits.

House Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes, D-Texas, said the bill is meant to fix that. It would let a judge determine whether lawsuits should be dismissed, rather than having Congress make that decision.

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"I believe that the nation is deeply concerned about what has gone on for the last seven years, and I want to restore some of the trust in the intelligence community," Reyes said.

About 40 lawsuits have been filed against telecommunications companies by people and organizations alleging the companies violated wiretapping and privacy laws. The lawsuits have been combined and are pending before a single federal judge in California.

The Democrats' measure would encourage the judge to review in private the secret government documents underpinning the program to decide if the companies acted lawfully.

The administration has prevented those documents from being revealed, even to a judge, by invoking the state secrets privilege. That puts the companies in a bind because they are unable to defend themselves.

Just a fraction of Congress has been granted access to the records.

Democrats argued against quashing the lawsuits without knowing in detail why the immunity is necessary.

Rep. Jane Harman, D-Calif., said the government may have as many as five ongoing clandestine surveillance programs. "Congress is not fully informed, and it would be reckless to grant retroactive immunity without knowing the scope of programs out there," Harman said.

"All members of Congress should see those documents so they could see the breadth and scope" of the wiretapping program, said Rep. John Tierney, D-Mass.

The surveillance law is intended to help the government pursue suspected terrorists by making it easier to eavesdrop on international phone calls and e-mails between foreigners abroad and Americans in the U.S, and remove barriers to collecting purely foreign communications that pass through the United States_ for instance, foreign e-mails stored on a server.

A temporary law expired Feb. 16 before Congress was able to produce a replacement bill. Bush opposed an extension of the temporary law as a means to pressure Congress into accepting the Senate version of the surveillance legislation.

Bush and most Capitol Hill Republicans say the lawsuits are damaging national security and unfairly punish telecommunications companies for helping the government in a time of war.

"There is not one iota of evidence that the companies acted inappropriately whatsoever," said Rep. Dan Lungren, R-Calif.

Democrats say the bill protects the privacy rights of Americans by making sure the telecommunications companies _ and the wiretapping program _ did not violate any laws.

"We have the opportunity to serve the protection of our country ... and uphold our oath to preserve and protect the Constitution of the United States," said House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md. "Let us take that opportunity."

The Democratic bill also would initiate a yearlong bipartisan panel modeled after the 9/11 Commission to investigate the administration's so-called warrantless wiretapping program.

Friday's vote came after House Republicans forced a rare, late-night secret session of Congress on Thursday to discuss the bill. It was the first such session of the House in a quarter century; the last one was in 1983, on U.S. support for paramilitary operations in Nicaragua. Only five closed sessions have occurred in the House since 1825.

Democratic Rep. Sheila Jackson-Lee of Texas said she didn't believe any minds were changed on the bill.

"We couldn't have gone more of an extra mile to make sure we're doing the best for national security," she said.

WASHINGTON — The House on Friday approved a Democratic bill that would set rules for the government's eavesdropping on phone calls and e-mails inside the United States. The bill, approved as law...
WASHINGTON — The House on Friday approved a Democratic bill that would set rules for the government's eavesdropping on phone calls and e-mails inside the United States. The bill, approved as law...
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Let's all try to bear in mind that while no one wants to see the US attacked, the issue at hand remains TELECOM IMMUNITY, and WARRANTLESS wiretapping.

The NSA has ALWAYS had the FISA court available, and the telecoms could have insisted on after-the-fact warrants.

That this debate is now being held behind closed doors is not a good sign. Consider which side pushed for it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:45 AM on 03/14/2008
- racom I'm a Fan of racom 3 fans permalink

Just like roaches that come out in the dark. They do not want the American public to see the damage they are doing to our constitution. They have earned their very low ratings in the polls. They cannot be trusted, they are paid by the public but they are not working for the public.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:00 AM on 03/14/2008
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There's a joke in that headline somewhere...but the actual story isn't funny at all !

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:45 AM on 03/14/2008
- rkrenke I'm a Fan of rkrenke 20 fans permalink

FISA is fine just the way it is - anyone who believes otherwise is seriously misinformed.

Telecoms have always had immunity under FISA as long as they complied with the Rule of Law. It's apparent that the Bush administration and telecoms chose to break the law and spy on U.S. citizens.

This Congress will surely go down in the annals of history as one of the most ineffective if they fail the American people by not standing strong for our civil liberties. At this point I wonder if their continual capitulation is based on complicity, duplicity, or just outright fear.

The terrorists win each time we relinquish another freedom - the Courts, not Congress, must decide this issue.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:23 AM on 03/14/2008

The only thing Congress should be doing is the impeachment of the criminals Bush and Cheney.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:05 AM on 03/14/2008
- Ohg I'm a Fan of Ohg 5 fans permalink

This is the year when America will again declare their independence from absurd government control. 2008 is the year of the second American Declaration of Independence.......
http://thefiresidepost.com/2008/03/04/declaration-of-independence-2008/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:03 AM on 03/14/2008
- Colmore I'm a Fan of Colmore 45 fans permalink

I think the dems. are afraid of what the repugs. have on tape. Grounds for blackmail, perhaps? This would be a good reason for closed door meetings, to find out just what the repugs. have on tape. Maybe it is past time to clean house, try to find some honest representatives who really do the people's work, rather than fatten their own bank accounts. I am starting to think that Washington is devoid of those kinds of people. They are like a private club, making decisions that they know are against what the citizens really want. They knew in '06 that the American people want this Iraq "adventure" to end. So, they have meetings on drugs in sports. Who the HELL cares? Let the sports people monitor that. I would rather have meetings on getting to the truth behind all the misdeeds of this administration. Haul our "dancing fool" off the WH steps, into court.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:32 AM on 03/14/2008

So you don't want to give the government the ability to listen to KNOWN terrorists you don't want a NON TORTURE effective way to extract information from known terrorists.

Guess we should just let these mother fuckers do what ever they want to do to us like fly 747s into your back yard.

You left wing psycho Bush haters give me gas.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:27 AM on 03/14/2008
- spec4F I'm a Fan of spec4F 4 fans permalink

Let's kill em all,right???Hell make a glass parking lot out of the whole middle east. Oh I forgot, shrub loves him some Saudis, you know the country where 19 of the 9-11 hi-jackers came from. How about that August 6th PDB,what was the title again Condi??? "Bin Laden determined to strike in th U.S" that is pretty vague? Fake patriots give me ANGER!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:14 AM on 03/14/2008

Right on, right on.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:25 AM on 03/14/2008
- Colmore I'm a Fan of Colmore 45 fans permalink

Karl, go away. You have done more than enough damage to the country.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:58 AM on 03/14/2008
- Joeblue I'm a Fan of Joeblue 5 fans permalink

You don't know what you are talking about.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:33 AM on 03/14/2008
- zizyphus I'm a Fan of zizyphus 110 fans permalink
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Your dear Bush is supporting, protecting and dancing with the Saudis who killed 3000 Americans on 911-he is getting rich off the blood of Americans. Your loyalty and patriotism, while admirable, should be directed toward our Constitutional rights, not the idiot in the White House, who will be another sad chapter in our history after the general elections. Idiots in the White House come and go, it is the Constitution that needs defending, not politicians.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:52 PM on 03/14/2008
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The last time they did this it was 1983 and they discussed Iran-Contra. We all know how well that turned out! Let's all remember: Ollie North, lots of shredding of documents in the basement...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:56 AM on 03/14/2008
- zizyphus I'm a Fan of zizyphus 110 fans permalink
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Back then we were supporting the cocaine dealers and helping them ship blow into LA, this time we are supporting the opium and heroin cartels. That is the big "secret". That our government employees are making a fortune while they are supposed to be stopping the trafficking, they are profiting from it. That is always the effect of criminalizing drugs, it benefits the largest cartels.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:58 PM on 03/14/2008

So they can have Privacy when It comes to our Consitutional Rights , but We can't?
So in THIS psuedo Democracy- Gov't (Inc's)gets the Rights and we get Nothing.
These discussions of One of Our Constitutional rights is kept Secret From US????

Obama will not need to worry about how DC works becasue we will be throwing all these assholes out of Congress and into GITMO. CONSPIRATORIAL TREASON!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:24 AM on 03/14/2008
- kfdan I'm a Fan of kfdan 22 fans permalink
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Congress is a cesspool that needs serious attention. The rat pack, no ... I won't elevate them ... that's Frank Sinatra's old gang, ... the hyenas in Congress who believe that word on what they do will not get out had better think again. We will find out who among them support Bush's tyrannical and fascist moves and they will pay for their treason at some point in the game! Americans had better develop a longer attention span before the whole country goes to the dogs!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:40 AM on 03/14/2008

The main reason that Bush desperately wants telecom immunity for spying domestically on U.S. citizens is that the surveillance began BEFORE sept. 11, and that fact would be revealed in a court proceeding.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:37 AM on 03/14/2008

It seems secrecy has been the operative agenda for this administration and Congress.
We don't have the right to know the names of the advisors on energy that Cheney chaired.
We don't have the right to know the disagreements about wmds in the run up to war.
We don't have the right to see and question documents and people on justice firings.
Courts don't have the right to know who is being wiretapped and recorded.
We don't have to know the intricacies of noncompetitive bids.
Need I go on?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:20 AM on 03/14/2008
- mattwin I'm a Fan of mattwin 2 fans permalink

Court papers released in Denver this week showed that NSA began surveillance 7 months before 9/11. If this program was so successful, why did 9/11 happen? Who were they spying on?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:21 AM on 03/14/2008
- FullChat I'm a Fan of FullChat 6 fans permalink

And who were they spying on before 9/11? It certainly wasn't terrorists - I'll bet it was spying on Democrats!

Remember Nixon. Remember Hoover.

Impeach.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:46 AM on 03/14/2008
- JohnKemp I'm a Fan of JohnKemp 26 fans permalink

The trial lawyers are sending plenty to the Dems; don't worry.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:59 AM on 03/14/2008
- rkrenke I'm a Fan of rkrenke 20 fans permalink

That GOP talking point is getting old - you need to do a better job of educating yourself if you truly believe that this is what this issue is all about.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:30 AM on 03/14/2008
- aznurse I'm a Fan of aznurse 56 fans permalink

Closed door meetings late in the night. hmmmm.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:36 AM on 03/14/2008
- Libsrule I'm a Fan of Libsrule 21 fans permalink

Democracy DIES behind closed doors.

This is grounds to actually find a way to impeach everyone of the bastards and but you know what will happen?

They will sit around moaning about how much money the telecoms won't give them for running for office and well if they just sort of find someway to make breaking the law sound patriotic then the idiot public will just forget about it by voting day.

We have the WORST AND MOST COWARDLY CONGRESS IN THE HISTORY OF THIS COUNTRY!

Fire the bastards, everyone of them. Come election we really need to vote the incumbents out.

BUT ya know what happens then don't ya?

All the idiot voters always go: "BUT my congressman/woman isn't one of the bad ones, it's the other guys".

We get the government we deserve.

For the corporations and by the corporations and screw the citizens.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:21 AM on 03/14/2008
- JadedAggie I'm a Fan of JadedAggie 9 fans permalink

lol Your actually calling this congress worse then the one prior to it? Are you insane?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:34 AM on 03/14/2008
- vippy I'm a Fan of vippy 73 fans permalink

Yes, I would call it worse. We voted for change and what we got is a slap in our face!
This congress knew how despicable the previous one was but did they change anything?
How many times do we have to be fooled to wake up? And with Hillary or Obama you
deserve what you will get - NOTHING! And that includes McCain with his stupid ideas.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:52 AM on 03/14/2008
- scooperss I'm a Fan of scooperss 72 fans permalink
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Bunch of last congress people are in this congress. They need to GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:24 AM on 03/14/2008
- Abycat I'm a Fan of Abycat 4 fans permalink

If I didn't know better I' say that Karl Rove was serving as the inspiration for the House Republicans. The man who guided the Bush Administration thru the aftermath of 9/11. The man who gave us the false color coded alerts. 'Bushes Brain'. Well I like a little theater myself now and then but, doing the people's business in private is a little hard to swallow. What is more difficult to accept is the motivation behind the maneuver. Now all we need is another act or terror and the Republicans can lay the blame at the feet of the Democrats. What crap!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:20 AM on 03/14/2008
- lobear00 I'm a Fan of lobear00 26 fans permalink

The Democrats are very slow to understand the mindset of the Republicans in the Congress. Democrats the Republicans DNA is " LIE, CHEAT, STEAL, WORK IN DARKNESS, SHRED THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:58 AM on 03/14/2008

Last time I looked botox Pelosi was speaker and the congress was poorly run by d'rats. So get off your high horse and understand NATIONAL SECURITY is something that requires (at times) things to be done in private, what are you worried about. Left wing Bush hating psychos really don't make any sense anyway.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:03 AM on 03/14/2008
- scooperss I'm a Fan of scooperss 72 fans permalink
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Don't know what you're talking about but this subject is the law. What's the problem with seeing who,what,when,where,how and why it was/is being broken?

Scared of what you might have to acknowledge?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:52 AM on 03/14/2008
- spec4F I'm a Fan of spec4F 4 fans permalink

Fake Patriot ^^^^ehibit A^^^^

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:09 AM on 03/14/2008
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