Hillary Hospital Story: The Original Version, And Then Some

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Huffington Post   |  Rachel Sklar   |   April 8, 2008 10:00 AM


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Hillary Clinton lied again! She loves to lie! She just can't stop! That hospital story? Totally not true! The hospital called her on it. How embarrassing! Right?

You'd think so, from the coverage, which I didn't catch up with until yesterday (sometimes, you just need a little political detox). I was generally aware of the story but in a cable-news-on-in-the-background sort of way — I knew that Clinton had told a story about the nation's awful health care system and the hospital had come out and denied it. It was being compared to Bosnia, to her exaggeration over the sniper fire — just another tall tale from Hillary Clinton. Could you trust anything she said?

Then I watched the actual clip. That's different from the clip that's gotten the most play, the clip of her telling the story, immediately followed by discussions of her credibility and fact-checking and how this was further damaging her credibility. Those are arguments we can get to later, but first, let's watch the original clip — the clip of Hillary Clinton hearing the story of Trina Bachtel for the first time, from Meigs County, Ohio Deputy Sherriff Bryan Holman, courtesy of CNN's Candy Crowley (transcript here). Sorry about the commercials:





Okay. Here's what I took from this: Clinton was told a story, in pretty specific detail, by the deputy sheriff. Here's what I consider to be the salient points:


(1) According to Deputy Sheriff Holman, Trina Bachtel went to three hospitals. One denied her treatment twice, one stopped her labor, and the third she was airlifted to. Which hospital is the one complaining?

(2) Here's how Hillary responded to the story: "Well, you know, I hear so many stories like that. People without insurance are more likely to die than people with insurance."

Let's stop for a moment and bring in print. This all started because Ann Kornblut of the Washington Post included the re-told anecdote in a story about Clinton on the stump. Kornblut's version of Clinton's version reflected Deputy Sherriff Holman's version, except with two hospitals — the first one that denied her visit based on the $100, and the Columbus hospital to which she was airlifted. Then the New York Times reported that a representative of O'Bleness Memorial Hospital in Athens, Ohio said that Bechtel had given birth there to a stillborn child and that she had had insurance. The hospital claimed that the story as Clinton (re)told it implied that O'Bleness had turned Bachtel away. According to the NYT's version of the retelling, the hospital was correct.

So now we have at least two versions of the original story being told by Clinton, differing essentially in number of hospitals, and in embellishment of details (i.e. "For fifteen days in the intensive care unit, doctors and nurses worked heroically, but she died" — Holman never said it quite like that).

Which Version Is Right?

It is still perfectly possible for the NYT's story to be correct — that the hospital claimed no malfeasance on its part, and that Bachtel had insurance — and for the WaPo story to be correct — that Bachtel had sought treatment at another hospital first, which had denied her. Kornblut has dug in with extra reporting and proved precisely this in her follow-up piece, citing Bachtel's aunt, Lisa Casto:

[Casto] said her niece had previously been in debt to a local hospital that later sent her a letter informing her that she could only be treated there in the future if she gave them a $100 deposit. At the time she went into debt to that hospital, Casto said, Bechtel was uninsured, though she later obtained health insurance and was insured at the time of her death.

This completely dovetails with the details the sheriff gave, right down to his claim that the hospital had turned her away because she'd owed money there previously. But — because this is all information that was available to the NYT when it published its story (complete with little shiv at the end for former staffer Kornblut: "Neither paper named the hospital or challenged Mrs. Clinton's account"). But the NYT — or those who picked the story up — wouldn't have even have had to challenge the hospital's account (always a possibility, too, right?), because there were so many other details from the sheriff's original story that still made sense. In fact, according to the sheriff, O'Bleness was the good hospital, the one to which she was airlifted — and Clinton's embellishments about doctors and nurses working heroically were in O'Bleness' favor.

The problem with the initial burst of coverage: No one had yet disputed the Sheriff's version. That was the original story, the source material from which Clinton drew. Jake Tapper noticed this, too: "On that, the jury is still out."

WaPo vs. NYT, Hillary vs. Hillary

This would be easier if we were only dealing with that one version. But the problem is that there are are two versions of the story: First, Holman's version as recounted by Clinton before Kornblut for the WaPo story, and second, the version retold by Clinton before Deborah Sontag for the NYT story. In that second version, Clinton mentions that Bachtel was turned away twice by one hospital and returned to that same hospital in an ambulance, where she died. Clearly different than the sheriff's version, and, according to O'Bleness, clearly wrong.

Alas, if Sontag's retelling is correct, then the fault is Clinton's for telling the story carelessly and inconsistently. It doesn't change the message of the story, of course, or the basic fact — woman turned away from hospital for want of $100 for what turned out to be an urgent need — but technically O'Bleness is correct. (Though also, given the above, so was the Clinton campaign — sort of stunning how quickly they backed off as soon as they were accused of trumping up the story. Once bitten twice shy, eh?)

This brings me to point two (shorter point, don't worry): Yes, Clinton and her staff should have vetted the story, but the reason she used it in the first place was because it was so familiar to her: "I hear so many stories like that." It was a pretty detailed story that corroborated her conclusion: "People without insurance are more likely to die than people with insurance." That's a conclusion she seemed to have already drawn, that this story corroborated. As for vetting, well,that raises a larger question: How much should a candidate trust in the credibility of voter stories? Should a candidate not retell anecdotes they've heard along the way? What if they source the story? Can that ever be enough? If not, pretty much every candidate is in hot water somewhere. I tend to believe the staffer who said that they did try to vet the story, but could not based on a dearth of information; Holman told the NYT that he didn't know it himself.

Upshot: This isn't a simple story — four hospitals, two reported versions in two separate newspapers, and questions every step of the way about what was said and whether it was vetted, or could be. But it's pretty clear right off the bat that this story was very different from Bosnia, and required the patient sorting of facts — by the media, by Clinton, and by her campaign once O'Bleness got in the game. Too bad that didn't happen — but, as it turns out, Bachtel's sad story did. And from here on in, that should be the focus.

Paper Trail:
In Speeches, Clinton Often Veers to Dark Side [WaPo]
Ohio Hospital Contests a Story Clinton Tells [NYT]
Clinton Told True Tale Of Woe, Says Kin [WaPo - The Trail]

Examination:
Is Hillary's Much-Maligned Hospital Story Fundamentally True? [ABC's Poltical Punch]
Transcript: Holman's Story [First Read]

Inevitable:
Dead Pregnant Girl Killed by Neither Insurance Nor Sniper Fire [Indecision 2008]

 
 

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- WhyAreYouWearingStripes See Profile I'm a Fan of WhyAreYouWearingStripes permalink

Yes, Clinton seems to lie but she also seems to be genuinely concerned about the healthcare situation in America..... oh right.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:22 PM on 04/10/2008
- hwebb54 See Profile I'm a Fan of hwebb54 permalink

Why doesn't the media apologize for calling her a liar? They can throw anything against the wall and make it stick I guess. This reminds me of the New York Times and the John McCain story. Don't check first and see if its true just run with what you have. Bullshit

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:11 AM on 04/09/2008
- hwebb54 See Profile I'm a Fan of hwebb54 permalink

The media has done made up their minds to destroy Senator Clinton. They have ne value for fairness or a sense of balance in there coverage of these 2 candidates. Obama gives a speech on race (I call it a speech to save his ass) and every network covers it like its the Super Bowl. Then they praise him for his courage and his openness, bullshit, they just don't want Hillary to have any advantage and they saw that this was turning people against him. I know there are A LOT of Hillary supporters that feel like we have had this election stolen from us so far by the MSM and if Obama gets the nomination, i don't think they will be voting down the party line. I know I won't anyway. I do not like Obama, I do not trust him, I think the media has not told us much about him and what has leaked out here and there is not comforting. Now the Obama fans are just so caught up in "Hope and Change" when really they have no idea what that means? Change to what? Hope for what? How are you going to get us there that would be different from any other candidate? Where is this new politics you keep talking about? Why did you join a church like that? I have a lot of questions like this for Mr. Obama

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:10 AM on 04/09/2008
- Shelly1970 See Profile I'm a Fan of Shelly1970 permalink

Even the press wont give her the benefit of the doubt.


That's how much she has lost trust.


After you're known as a liar, people are more likely to assume that what you're saying isn't the truth.


She made her bed.


Now she's lying in it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:47 PM on 04/08/2008
- Pharos See Profile I'm a Fan of Pharos permalink

What proof that she lied? A lot of swift boat adds accused Kerry of being a liar, a lot of people believed it for a while, didn't meant it was true.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:04 AM on 04/09/2008
- NorVaGal See Profile I'm a Fan of NorVaGal permalink

Hi, Rachel: I am a committed Obama supporter. However, I actually DO respect and admire Sen. Clinton for her years of hard work promoting fair and equitable health care. It is one reason that I originally supported her. I do not think that she deserves for her credibility to be diminished or belittled on the health care issue. ALL Americans deserve quality health care. Both Hillary and Barack are strong advocates.

Unfortunately, Hillary has run her campaign on the premise that Sen. Obama has nothing but a speech to qualify him for CIC. And yet, all candidates make numerous stump speeches. Just as it is fair for opponents and voters to parse and judge every word in Obama's speeches, it is equally fair to parse and judge Clinton's. Anecdotes being used to illustrate critical political points should be fully vetted prior to their use. If candidates don't factcheck, their opponents and the media will. Discovered inaccuracies cause huge crediblity hits.

IMO, this is one of those times when Hillary has reaped what she has sown. This type of mistake was completely avoidable.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:12 PM on 04/08/2008
- PioneerKing See Profile I'm a Fan of PioneerKing permalink

Dear Ms. Sklar:

"...the version retold by Clinton before Deborah Sontag for the NYT story. In that second version, Clinton mentions that Bachtel was turned away twice by one hospital and returned to that same hospital in an ambulance, where she died. Clearly different than the sheriff's version, and, according to O'Bleness, clearly wrong."
This is exactly the point. The version that Sen. Clinton told, on numerous occasions, is not as portrayed to her by the sherrif. Sen. Clinton takes liberties with the story that was told to her by the sherrif.
The reason this is troubling is that Sen. Clinton DID in fact embelish in an effort to move her aganda. Clearly if Sen. Clinton's staff had desired to get the facts to vett the story they could have done so, since the sherrif was front and center - live and in person - sitting there talking to Sen. Clinton.
So, for Sen. Clinton's staff to say that they could not vett the story is even further from the truth.
However, Sen. Clinton's staff could not have counted on Sen. Clinton retelling the story in the manner in which she did, which was contrived and distorted. WORDS MATTER!
A young woman and her child are dead but it is not for the reason that Sen. Clinton implies.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:17 PM on 04/08/2008
- Pharos See Profile I'm a Fan of Pharos permalink

The woman and her child are dead of a condition that no rich person dies from anymore. The health care system failed her. That was the point of the story. Why focus on the details of the story, a tool used to illustrate a point with which no Democrat disagrees, instead of focusing on how to work together to make sure it never happens again?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:44 PM on 04/08/2008
- FCanyon See Profile I'm a Fan of FCanyon permalink

I agree that the point of the story is lost here. I think Mrs. Clinton was trying to point out that all should have health care, regardless of income. I live in BC Canada and here it is LAW to be medically covered, premiums dependent on income. The health system is in crisis. There is over 100,00 people in BC alone, me being one of them, that does not have a doctor. People are dying waiting for surgery. Elective surgeries, such as hip replacement etc can take as long as 2-3 years. For all us baby boomers this is a very important crisis. Please research, as questions and find out what your candidates are actually standing for.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:14 PM on 04/08/2008
- AnninCA See Profile I'm a Fan of AnninCA permalink

Hillary loves to lie? Good grief, there's a strange lead.

But in any case, I've read the background of the story and have no problem with how it was used in her stump speech.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:40 PM on 04/08/2008
- NorVaGal See Profile I'm a Fan of NorVaGal permalink

Ann, what a surprise. That YOU have no problem with how Sen. Clinton relates truths or untruths in her stump speeches. Are you equally as tolerant when Sen. Obama "misspeaks"? Let me guess.......NAH!!!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:35 PM on 04/08/2008
- Shelly1970 See Profile I'm a Fan of Shelly1970 permalink

Amazing...

So some of us have apparently reached a point where lying has become so commonplace amongst politicians that, it is considered OK to lie, even in the most major speeches they use to define themselves?

"Hillary defines herself as a liar. But I'm OK with that."

Sorry, but I can't set my standards that low.

No wonder Hillary's support is drying up faster than an ice cube in hell.

She will probably win PA, but thank goodness she was revealed to lack what it takes to be our president.

Bush Clinton Bush Clinton = liar liar liar liar.

"But I'm OK with that."

HAHA!

:)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:06 PM on 04/08/2008
- RussnCA See Profile I'm a Fan of RussnCA permalink

What is lost in all of this kind of gotcha story is that Hillary Clinton is actually concerned that all Americans have health coverage. The paramount importance of universal health coverage is lost on the other candidates. Commitment to universal healthcare distinguishes Hillary's campaign.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:29 PM on 04/08/2008
- PhoenixtheUndying See Profile I'm a Fan of PhoenixtheUndying permalink

Here's my question: who in the hell is Hillary Clinton's fact checker?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:27 PM on 04/08/2008
- strifeknot See Profile I'm a Fan of strifeknot permalink

Rachel Sklar.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:53 PM on 04/08/2008
- strifeknot See Profile I'm a Fan of strifeknot permalink

Which explains why Hillary is lying on the mat, screaming, "Adriaaaaan! Adriaaaaaan!"

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:11 AM on 04/09/2008
- NoGoodNamesLeft See Profile I'm a Fan of NoGoodNamesLeft permalink

Come on now. You know that FACTS don't matter if it is something that Hillary said, she is just automatically WRONG. YOu can find out now that she was totally right and it still won't matter, they will claim that she paid them off to change their story

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:47 PM on 04/08/2008
- FreedomLoverX See Profile I'm a Fan of FreedomLoverX permalink

She is not automatically wrong. She is automatically a LIAR. whether she tells the truth on occasion is irrelevent to the fact that she is a bald-faced LIAR. That everyone was quick to perceive this story as a lie, whether it was true or not, is because she is a constant LIAR. The amazing thing is how YOU always stand ready to grasp at any steaw, instead of being honest enough to admit that she is a perpetual LIAR. I am making one claim only. That Hillary is a LIAR. Can you ever refdute that point? I didn't think so.

"Zeifman fired Hillary from the committee staff and refused to give her a letter of recommendation " one of only three people who earned that dubious distinction in Zeifman"s 17-year career.

Why?

'Because she was a liar,' Zeifman said in an interview last week. 'She was an unethical, dishonest lawyer. She conspired to violate the Constitution, the rules of the House, the rules of the committee and the rules of confidentiality.'"

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:15 PM on 04/08/2008
- Pharos See Profile I'm a Fan of Pharos permalink


Trying to find info on Zeifman I ran across this:

------------
Democratic Party "Leper" Endorses Bush
FrontPageMagazine.com ^ | 8/02/04 | Jerome Zeifman

Posted on Mon 02 Aug 2004 02:53:25 AM CDT by kattracks

During the Clinton administration I was described jokingly by Insight Managing Editor Paul M. Rodriguez as "The Leper of the Democratic Party." Since then I have continued to be a renegade Democrat -- and I am now supporting the re-election of President George W. Bush."
-----------------

His judgment is obviously flawed, I haven't found who he is supporting this year? Anyone know? He thought all democratic candidates last time were demagogues.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:45 AM on 04/09/2008
- ChrisS13 See Profile I'm a Fan of ChrisS13 permalink

Yep you got it correct Nogoodnameleft. It doesn't matter to the media nor to Obama supporters. They could care less if the story was true, or it millions others are exactly the same. They only care about smearing HRC, they don't care that the story was being told to point out how horrible our health care system is (even though most Obama supporters agree with that point) they don't care that the story helps shine on a light on how horrible it is, and would actually help get the system better and even be helpful to Obama. None of that matters.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:01 PM on 04/08/2008
- NorVaGal See Profile I'm a Fan of NorVaGal permalink

ChrisS, YOU, too, are perpetrating untruths. Obviously, it DID matter to the media and to some Obama supporters. It mattered enough that someone took the time to actually check out the story and try to verify the facts. Then, someone in the media cared enough to print the results that were discovered: facts that actually verified statements made by Sen. Clinton, as well as the statements that appeared to be inconsistent with the facts.

I think that fair observers will agree that Hillary has fought very hard for health care coverage for many years. So, has Barack. Fair observers will also agree that parts of her retelling were factual and some parts were not. Either way, if the Clinton campaign and their surrogates had factchecked the story before using it, this would have been a non-issue.

Yes, some posters have smeared Sen. Clinton; but, some posters have also smeared Sen. Obama. We each need to clean up the vitriol on our own side, before we can criticize supporters on the other side.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:32 PM on 04/08/2008
- stlswest See Profile I'm a Fan of stlswest permalink

It matters. But Hillary opted to go negative. Had she followed Obama to the high road and rejected silly season, maybe some Obama supporters would come to her rescue. She made her bed...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:51 PM on 04/08/2008
- rbdc See Profile I'm a Fan of rbdc permalink

Ugh, the story of this unfortunate woman is confusing. For example, in the first WaPo story, it saysthat the several thousand dollars that the young woman owed to the first hospital had been paid off in 2005 but that the woman died in August, 2007. If her debt had been already paid off, why would the hospital insist on $100 up front before seeing her -- to the young woman's credit, it appears she had managed to scrounge up over $4000 dollars to make good on her previous debt. -- in the end, only to be denied care later. The sheriff says the hospital to which she was airlifted was small and not able to deliver optimal care -- but generally people are airlifted away from, not towards the smaller, less well equipped hospitals. And Rachel, you say four hospitals were involved; I count three.

Regardless of the absolute facts of the case, Hillary was right on the take away; a pregnant woman in the USA should be able to get medical care, period, end. Not only is it the morally right thing for a wealthy country such as ours, but it is well known that, in general, timely pre-natal care beginning early in pregnancy results in better outcomes than when care is first delivered late. Lack of timely care will often result in poor outcomes such as premature and low birth weight babies -- outcomes which ultimately are very costly to the individuals involved and society at large. An

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:21 PM on 04/08/2008
- comatoast See Profile I'm a Fan of comatoast permalink

OK- so this story wasn't a blatant lie like the other one. You got me there. Rachel.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:18 PM on 04/08/2008
- TheOtherMaven See Profile I'm a Fan of TheOtherMaven permalink

Unfortunately, the salient points of Senator Clinton's account, that she has been using to support her push for her health insurance plan, are precisely the points that are in dispute. She should drop *this* story and find another one that is fully checked out and documented. It shouldn't be hard.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:49 PM on 04/08/2008
- NorVaGal See Profile I'm a Fan of NorVaGal permalink

ALL "stories" politicians trot out to illustrate/justify particular issues, should be vetted first. I don't believe that HRC's camp was UNABLE to verify the accuracy of Deputy Sheriff Holman's account. If good investigative reporters are able to ferret out facts from fiction, surely candidates running national campaigns have enough surrogates at their disposal to verify information before presenting it publicly. They seem to excel at debunking every word uttered by their opponents. The "gotcha" element is in high gear.

Although an avid Obama supporter, I salute Sen. Clinton for her passion in fighting for health care for all. I take no joy from the controversy that has resulted from this story. And, I am saddened that sloppy work by the Clinton team has created an opportunity for her credibility to be questioned in regards to the health care issue. Universal health care should not be a political football; and IMO, Sen. Clinton does not deserve for her successes in this area be diminished.

Each campaign has bloodhounds assigned to factcheck his or her opponents' statements and deeds . All inconsistencies are trumpeted to the media with great fanfare and glee. The vast majority of that energy should be expended on factchecking themselves and their own surrogates, instead. It would probably save a lot of embarrassment, and loss of credibility on extremely critical issues.

As brilliant as all of these candidates are, they should never be tripped up on small stuff like this.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:43 PM on 04/08/2008
- Pharos See Profile I'm a Fan of Pharos permalink

Who says they should be vetted? Is everyone who retells the story of George Washington and the cherry tree a liar? Story telling is a tool. How factually accurate the story needs to be depends on the situation (none in the case of the cherry tree told to a six year old). The essential facts of this story are true. A women and her unborn child die from a condition that is treatable. She did not need to die, the health care system failed her, her child and her family.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:58 PM on 04/08/2008
- dmj618 See Profile I'm a Fan of dmj618 permalink

She had run up bills when she was uninsured, and was told they would need $100 to help pay her debt, (it sounds like they wanted to put her on a payment schedule) and she paid it all some time in 2005. She owed no money to the hospital by the time she was pregnant, and never went back during her pregnancy, but chose a different clinic/hospital instead. If they had bill collectors harrassing her when she was uninsured she probably just didn't want to deal with the first hospital at all. It sounds to me like O'Bleness is the second hospital and they and their clinic treated her during her entire pregnancy, delivered the stillborn baby, and eventually had to fly her out to a larger university hospital. It's the university hospital that is the "good" hospital with the "heroics". O'Bleness comes out looking neutral, at least they didn't turn her away, but the baby died there and they were too small to do much for the mother, or bad if Clinton is making it sound like they are the ones who turned her away for lack of $100, then returned to them in an ambulance later where they lose the baby, insinuating if they had seen her sooner the baby would have lived and so would the mother.

(more)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:37 PM on 04/08/2008
- dmj618 See Profile I'm a Fan of dmj618 permalink

(second part)
It is the shifting details and exaggerations that make this like the Bosnia story. When she first told that one there were reports of possible snipers in the area, by the last telling she is dodging bullets and running with her head down to speed away in the waiting vehicles. If she had stuck to the WaPo story instead of the embellished NYT one you could chalk it up to the deputy giving her the wrong story, but she was starting to make shit up as she went along, just like with Bosnia. The first version there are more hospitals involved, the second makes it sound like the hospital that delivered her stillborn baby is the one that originally turned her away, no wonder O'Bleness wants her to stop telling that story.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:45 PM on 04/08/2008
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