Pa. Voters Divided Over Obama Remarks

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MARK SCOLFORO | April 14, 2008 11:08 PM EST | AP

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Democratic president hopeful Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., center, is seen with Rep. Chaka Fattah, D-Pa., left, and Rep. Bob Brady, D-Pa., at the Sheet Metal Workers' Hall in Philadelphia, Monday, April 14, 2008. (AP Photo/Matt Rourke)

SHENANDOAH, Pa. — Yes, some Democrats in Pennsylvania's Rust Belt communities were upset by Barack Obama's suggestion that voters there "cling to guns or religion" because of bitterness about their economic lot. But many more seem to think it was no big deal _ and if there's a problem it's with the political slapfest that has followed.

Obama's comment, which the Illinois senator made during a San Francisco fundraiser last week, set off an exchange of insults between the final contenders for the Democratic presidential nomination as they vie for blue-collar support in the state's April 22 primary. Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton has criticized the comment as "elitist," while Obama has mocked the New York senator's own recent emphasis on support for gun owners' rights.

In interviews Monday in Pennsylvania communities like the ones to which Obama referred, Democrats on both sides of the race were divided over the controversy.

"It's so difficult to watch every word," said Mary Ellen Matunis, a Clinton backer from Shenandoah.

"I was not offended," she said. "Poor choice of words, but I think it was just misspoken."

Matunis, 56, is a retired teacher in this central Pennsylvania borough of barely 5,000 residents that was once a boom town of the anthracite coal industry. But that industry has been on the decline for longer than most residents have been alive, and the textile factories that followed are gone too.

Dennis Yezulinas, another Clinton supporter in Shenandoah, said he is more offended by the rhetorical fight that followed Obama's comment than by the remark itself.

"Not just for the good of the Democratic Party, but for the good of the country, they need to make it less contentious," said Yezulinas, a former state prison guard who has been laid off from a plant that manufactures doors in a neighboring town.

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In the southeastern Pennsylvania community of Coatesville _ a once booming steel city outside of Philadelphia that now has empty storefronts downtown _ two Clinton supporters sharing a meal at a Coatesville restaurant said they felt Obama was wrong to stereotype small-town voters.

"It's like we're not smart enough to understand what the politicians are saying. It's an insult to our intelligence," said Susan Kamerdze, 50.

Mike Zemacke, 57, said that, while Coatesville has seen better days, he's not bitter. He said he used to work as a press operator before a disability led him to retirement.

"I'm just frustrated," he said. "I used to live a lot better than this."

At another Coatesville eatery, lifelong resident Armon Richardson said he remains firmly committed to Obama.

"We're getting in the silly season," said Richardson, 33, a computer analyst. "It's being overanalyzed."

In Pottsville, a city south of Shenandoah that also thrived during the coal boom and is now known as the home of Yuengling beer, coffeehouse owner Mary Ann Price, 56, said she is undecided about which candidate will get her vote in the primary, but that Obama's remarks won't affect her decision. She said she is more concerned about U.S. standing in the international community.

"The whole world hates us, and with good reason," she said.

Mike McGeever, 47, a Clinton backer who works for a neighborhood revitalization agency in Pottsville, called Obama's comment "uninformed, rather than elitist."

"To throw a blanket indictment out there against the people in this area, it is definitely patronizing," he said.

Truck salesman Bob Bildheiser, 49, said he is tentatively supporting Obama and that he agreed with the point that Obama was trying to make about the nation's economic problems.

"The people are bitter about the economy, about jobs, about the gas prices. It's terrible," he said.

At the California event, Obama said some small-town voters bitter about their economic circumstances "cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

Clinton, who polls show still leading in the Pennsylvania primary, criticized the comment as "elitist and divisive," and suggested that it could cost Democrats the presidency if Obama were the nominee. Obama said he was disappointed by Clinton's criticism and questioned her opposition to the NAFTA free-trade agreement that some voters believe eliminated thousands of U.S. jobs.

___

Associated Press writers Kathy Matheson in Coatesville and Peter Jackson in Harrisburg also contributed to this report.

SHENANDOAH, Pa. — Yes, some Democrats in Pennsylvania's Rust Belt communities were upset by Barack Obama's suggestion that voters there "cling to guns or religion" because of bitterness about th...
SHENANDOAH, Pa. — Yes, some Democrats in Pennsylvania's Rust Belt communities were upset by Barack Obama's suggestion that voters there "cling to guns or religion" because of bitterness about th...
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What Obama said , is true. And guess what , She gets it . Why do they give in to false republican propaganda about Democrats being Godless, who will take their guns away . Hillary knows this. Mr. Penn must have focus groups showing that this will win her Pennsylvania. Just like atttacking him as nothing but words won her Ohio. She had experience to counter his empty words. This time he is painted as an out of touch elitist, making fun of their Guns and religion, the intellectual basis of their voting for the republicans for decades. ( Remember the Regan democrats. ) In fact how many people in this world have the capacity to admit their own mistakes, specially if they have been made fools of. She gives them a way out. They can now believe they truly loved their guns more then their economic futures.. She is going with it and will win with a wider margin as many a voters will walk into the voting booth and punish him.

In fact if their is a single person out there , reading this post of mine, who calls himself conservative ( which most Americans do by the way ) , who realizes the truth of Obama statement, get up and admit it by a post in response to mine. I bet you, the face will turn red, heart will beat faster and the superego will not let you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:04 PM on 04/15/2008

In 100% agreement with you. However, Obama is being hit from all sides. He is the Tiger Woods of the policital American right now.

A lot of people changes careers to make money off of other people trying to do the work while so many sit on their ass and just make petty comments as if they are a movie critic.

Our lives are effected by these elected officials, yet those who are in control while we were asleep at the back of the bus, now realize someone from the back think they can get the bus out of the ditch and also drive the damn bus better after all the hard work of lifting the bus up and out of the ditch. Yet Obama has all these people standing or sitting around just looking and writing or taking pictures, and some are making sound bites all to make money.

what would all these media people have to talk about. They are just sitting,talking or watching Obama work his ass off. while get paid. Wake up America please don't let the propaganda control your mind..

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:47 AM on 04/16/2008
- intellifem I'm a Fan of intellifem 4 fans permalink

Message from central PA: Gimme my gun to cling to! Gimme dat Bible to explain my frustration! I feel a country song comin' on! Hey, what does "antipathy" mean anyway? We're too stoopid to know such a big word. We need Professor Obama to skool us.

Many of us in small town PA are laughing about Obama's HUGE slip in front of the arugula and latte crowd of San Fran. He really is out of touch and has NO CLUE about the culture of small town America. That being the case, why does he think he deserves to be President?

I think I might just go out and buy a gun today. Yee Ha!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:19 PM on 04/15/2008
- benwha I'm a Fan of benwha 6 fans permalink

Obviously you are entitled to your opinion but I am a fellow small towner and I really couldn't disagree more with your post. In fact, I think you would be surprised just how much small towners are rejecting HRCs response and see some truth in what BO said.

But hey, if you want to base your beliefs of Obama on this one sound clip, rock on.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:30 PM on 04/15/2008
- drzoon I'm a Fan of drzoon 15 fans permalink

ben....

what i meant was... its not EVERYONE. but its true for some.

the lesson is... none of this is going to fit on a bumper sticker. its so much more complicated than that.

and i don't and haven't come to how i feel about barack from one clip. i have supported him from about an hour after he launched his website.

i just know that there is a lot of distrust of ANYONE from washington. of which i don't think he even qualifies at this point, given his freshman status in the senate.

and i think even Barack was thinking out-loud about that. about the distrust issue.

he cares. and he is ready to help us .. help ourselves.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:43 PM on 04/15/2008
- drzoon I'm a Fan of drzoon 15 fans permalink

i have lived in a town of 200... and a town of 200,000 and now in los angeles.

i know from my own experience that when a town starts to die... everyone just seems to ... at some point... go numb. and for some...? they turn to what they know is real.... and always there. it might be god. it might be the small enjoyment of hunting or fishing. sorta like: getting back to basics.

that's not EVERYONE. but its plenty of folks.

and then when some well dressed, smooth talking person from washington shows up and starts to talk about "we can do better.... we are better" .. past a certain point. it just all sounds like BS. and .. it probably is.

the problem is, what happens when that slick washington insider shows up... and can't bowl, and doesn't know that you don't hunt duck with a "six shooter"..­... BUT... they DO.... mean it when they say they want to help?

that they understand what it feels like to be in the "wildernes­s".... and forgotten and having been used as a labor pawn .... only for your vote and your money.

then what do you do? how do you believe them? how do you know its for real? that this person making promises ... wants to keep them?

what do you do?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:32 PM on 04/15/2008

This is the response any person who has been fooled for decades, will come up with. Obama was not schooling you. Even Bill Clinton knew this long time ago. ( trends are always discussed in general terms, by the way, eg a statement like " the muslims in saudi Arabia are conservatives, who do not want their women to be driving cars " . The difference between Obama and Clintons is that he tries to tell it like it is, while they recognize the trend, and capitalize on it. She is smart , she knows people will not admit being fooled by republicans for years, so she is coming out and saying what she is. She is not stupid, her husband knew this 20 years ago, she knew it 20 years ago. But they both know , play the Gun and religion card right, specially in an economically run down state, and go get the presidency. They understand that this is a race, people will vote based on what Obama is pointing out. The Clinton's have wisened up, Obama is learning the hard way. In his next run, he will shoot a gun, have some whiskey, and then maybe he will get a few Reagan democrat vote. This issue also gives cover to the bitter racist pensylvanians their governor has been talking about. They can now say, I voted against him because he made fun of my religosity and hunting expeditions, not because he is black. End of story.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:25 PM on 04/15/2008
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How is George Bush's policies working out of you?

It's the tax dollars of the Latte Drinkers in San Francisco that help keep the small towns afloat. They receive less money in Government funds than they put in. So do us a favor, write Bush and tell him you no longer want tax money from latte sippers and that you want to pay your own way, ok?

Plus, remind us not to mourn any other mine "accidents" since you are cool with the Government's cut in inspections.

Thanks....­now back to my half-caf, soy, low foam latte.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:11 PM on 04/16/2008
- nirak I'm a Fan of nirak 8 fans permalink

No Big Deal. In fact true

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:01 PM on 04/15/2008
- helen I'm a Fan of helen 34 fans permalink
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I agree. I haven't picked sides in this election yet, but I hope the good people of Pennsylvania will send a very strong message to the likes of Hillary (and by inference McCain too) that people are indeed bitter that their heritage, futures, assets, creativity, purpose, and hopes have been sold down the river by Washington politicians who are definitely out-of-touch and craven for any way to divide and conquer and stay in power.

I hope they vote for Obama in droves and send the fear-of-Gawd into these gutless wonders.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:46 PM on 04/15/2008

every one should see the video. You will have a new understanding about every thing.

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/video08.html?videoId=1fd1c0cf-5c80-4d75-996f-bd53b2461ae0&sMPlaylistID

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:39 PM on 04/15/2008
- LoloZ I'm a Fan of LoloZ 2 fans permalink

WHERE IS THE MSM THESE DAYS??? PICKING UP HILLARY'S ATTACKS ON OBAMA AND NOTHING ELSE. THE CLINTONS AND GOV. RENDELL ARE CROOKS AND LIARS, LOOK FOR THE PETER PAUL V. CLINTON CASE IN CALIFORNIA. WHY IS THIS NOT BEING REPORTED AT ALL, WITH THE PA PRIMARY COMING UP???

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:28 PM on 04/15/2008

THIS IS WHY. THERE'S NOTHING TO IT EXCEPT IN YOUR LITTLE MIND.

Peter F. Paul
“An audit by the Federal Elections Commission found that neither Senator Clinton nor her Senate campaign had accepted any illegal funds”.
“The appellate court specifying that her behavior had been "perfectly legal.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_F._Paul

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:33 PM on 04/15/2008
- rzan I'm a Fan of rzan 6 fans permalink

Why are so many talking about this case as if it is going forward?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:46 AM on 04/16/2008

You see, the more he opens his mouth the more he reveals who he truly is.

He is a person who, deep down (though not as deep as it used to be), despises the U.S. and its citizens.

But I'm not surprised; I assume most liberals feel the same way.

And--no surprise--their reaction when told of such disdain: "Of course...w­e deserve it!"

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:20 PM on 04/15/2008
- benwha I'm a Fan of benwha 6 fans permalink

So you know for a fact how Barack thinks. Wow, I wish I had that ability. How did you develop this hugely valuable skill?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:34 PM on 04/15/2008
- Hare I'm a Fan of Hare 29 fans permalink
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Your last name must be "dunno" and your code I can't vote for the black guy

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:03 PM on 04/15/2008
- drzoon I'm a Fan of drzoon 15 fans permalink

with all due respect. you don't have a clue

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:34 PM on 04/15/2008

You are right. Your response is expected. No man who votes republican, because they stroked his religious and gun fervor will ever admit his own foolishness. You think that if a politician in pakistan says " The religous leaders are making a fool of these young men who blow themselves up, by promising them eternal BJs in heaven", that they will suddenly say: OMG what a fool I am, I will never be fooled now, thankyou for showing me the truth. That politicians will not win their votes, but the one who stands up next day and says " How dare he make fun of our brave boys, who sacrifice their lives for their cause " will win.

Politicians have made fools of people since the beginning of time by manipulating their religious believes. The white blue collars workers are not the first. DO not sweat it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:47 PM on 04/15/2008
- kristin I'm a Fan of kristin 7 fans permalink

This just out 2 PDT in LA Times:
The survey found the New York senator leading Barack Obama by just 5 percentage points in Pennsylvania, which votes next Tuesday. Such a margin would not give her much of a boost in the battle for the party's nomination.

What is more, the poll found Clinton trails Obama by 5 points in Indiana, another Rust Belt state that should play to her strengths among blue-collar voters.

In North Carolina, an Obama stronghold, he is running 13 points ahead.

Clinton losing traction over Obama in Pennsylvania, Indiana - Los Angeles Times
http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-poll16apr16,0,794499.story

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:15 PM on 04/15/2008
- intellifem I'm a Fan of intellifem 4 fans permalink

Here's the 411 from small-town PA: your poll is totally wrong--just like the ones preceding the New Hampshire primary. Gotta cut this short--need to get back to clinging to my gun and Bible to explain my frustration to myself.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:23 PM on 04/15/2008
- December7 I'm a Fan of December7 2 fans permalink

Note from Kentucky
Thank God for Obama's speech. I live in rural Kentucky and yes, many, many people here have nothing: no job, no money, and no future. Ironically, people on the coasts call him elitist for saying something that most here agree with. Maybe that's why nobody is talking about it around here--old news.

Something that he was trying to point out was that in spite of their Arkansas roots, the Clintons did nothing for rural America. Good jobs here have been vaporized or sent abroad. Now, people can work at Wal-Mart or McDonald's with no health insurance. And that is why they are bitter.

It is interesting (ironic?) that the only major candidate to mention the anger of the white poor is black.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:14 PM on 04/15/2008

Check out the audience responding to Obama's comments on bitterness in Indiana:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:13 PM on 04/15/2008
- incontempt I'm a Fan of incontempt 2 fans permalink

Anyone offended by these remarks are out of touch with reality...

If your just waking up to reality, you will understand the outrage, pardon me..bitter­ness

If you are not outraged about the state of affairs in this country, the your simply not PAYING ATTENTION

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:57 PM on 04/15/2008

OutRAGE is too emotional. Cold hard logic is what is need.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:01 PM on 04/15/2008
- EinChicago I'm a Fan of EinChicago 33 fans permalink

Well, duh. Of course dems are not that annoyed. It was comments aimed primarily at the middle voters. They're the ones who actually win elections and the ones who Obama well and truly alienated. Between dismissing FL voters as a beauty pageant and PA voters as bitter religious nuts, is there a big swing state he has ever met that he wasn't determined to gift wrap for the GOP in Nopvember?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:58 PM on 04/15/2008

Obama is quite an intelligent man. Accomplishments that anybody would be proud of. What he is not good at, is his knowledge of rural America, and the basic democratic ideals, as they actually apply to people in the real world.
Obama reminds me of one those people who are intellectually brilliant, but have almost 0 common sense.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:00 PM on 04/15/2008

You really should read his books because awe of his common sense is the one thing I got out of them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:28 PM on 04/15/2008
- MisterCole I'm a Fan of MisterCole 13 fans permalink

If these last 8 years haven't made you bitter, frustrated or outraged than what the hell will? The people get it. It's the pampered dopes in the media that haven't got a clue.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:48 PM on 04/15/2008

Frustrated yes, bitter no. Long before this I learned the foolishness of being bitter. Anyone who who has a concern for this country's welfare is not going to be gushing over with love for the criminals at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
But the best way to approach almost every situation is logically, and prudently, not angrily and ineptly.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:06 PM on 04/15/2008
- 260Parkway I'm a Fan of 260Parkway 7 fans permalink

Did Tuzla and her team not interview any people of color with this commercial? Oh, but I guess she wouldn't have been able to use their footage, huh?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:28 PM on 04/15/2008

I love watching Hillary not deal in reality.
Imagine if you lie, cheat and steal your way to the nomination, besides woman and old folks who's going to vote for you? All those newly registered voters? Black folks? You go right on not dealing in reality Hillary and yeah Bill didn't get paid by those Colombians either. LOL

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:18 PM on 04/15/2008

OBAMA 2008 . LETS WIN PENNSLVANIA FORGET THE PUNDITS ITS DO-ABLE.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:25 PM on 04/15/2008

What I wan't to know is, why was Senator Obama suckin' up to those Rich White Liberals in San Francisco anyway. They wouldn't even let him enter through the front door. He was forced to go in through the servant's entrance so nobody would see him. Why can't he be satisfied with just our money? Does he want to be the "First Black President" so bad he will take these insult willingly. I bet they wouldn't have treated Senator Clinton that way. Oh Well, even Harvard Law Professors have to be willing to sacrifice for their Country.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:20 PM on 04/15/2008

Just stop please. You sound ridiculous.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:25 PM on 04/15/2008
- rmetz74 I'm a Fan of rmetz74 10 fans permalink

Seriously, that was the weirdest, most circuitous whine I've ever read.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:41 PM on 04/15/2008
- maxhnb I'm a Fan of maxhnb 3 fans permalink
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Obama doesn't suck up to anybody if you have ever been to one of his fundraisers as I have...he is enaging and tells the truth about what he sees going on. San Franciso is an expensive place to live but it is in the midst of many middle class and some struggling communities like Oakland.

San Francisco is one of the most liberal cities in America and I am certain Obama did not have to enter through a back door. Where someone gets such ridiculous ideas and then gives them voice is sheer lunacy.

Money is money and its easier to raise in large cities and among those able to give.

Effective govvernment provides for the common defense and for the well being of its constituen­ts....wher­e is your head at. ?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:38 PM on 04/15/2008
- incontempt I'm a Fan of incontempt 2 fans permalink

You clearly haven't a clue about the folks in san francisco, me either for that matter but your implication can't match one of the most open and accepting societies within this country and the fact that I know that makes me proud of them...asc­ension to fairness in society is great and i'm sure san fran will do just fine without your visits, but the rest of us would beneifit if your implications of racism did not make public light or for that matter, get out of your closet.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:07 PM on 04/15/2008
- December7 I'm a Fan of December7 2 fans permalink

San Francisco is actually in the US

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:16 PM on 04/15/2008
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