Reid Won't Support FISA Compromise, At Odds With Obama

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First Posted: 06-24-08 08:35 PM   |   Updated: 07- 2-08 05:12 AM

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Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid announced this evening that he will vote against the compromise FISA legislation and work with likeminded colleagues to strip immunity for telecom firms from that bill.

It is a position that puts the Democratic Senate leader at odds with his own party's presumptive presidential nominee, Barack Obama, who also has pledged to fight for the removal of immunity but will vote yes on the final package.

"I am not going to vote for the FISA bill," said the Nevada Democrat. "There are people, Mr. President, who have worked on this FISA matter for three months or more and again the administration worked with them. Did they, on the FISA bill, move enough to make me vote for the bill? The answer is no."

Reid's position seems, at this point, unlikely to change the contours of the debate. This past week, Democratic negotiators in the House and Senate came to an agreement to pass a sweeping overhaul of the nation's electronic surveillance laws, in the process granting conditional immunity for telecommunications companies who participated in the previously illegal program.

That update to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act passed the House by a vote of 293 to 129; the majority of the Democratic caucus voted nay.

On Wednesday, one of the FISA legislation's principle opponents, Russ Feingold, announced that he would try to use procedural measures to strip out the immunity provision.

"We are going to resist this bill," said the Wisconsin Democrat. "We are going to make sure that the procedural votes are gone through. In other words, a filibuster is requiring sixty votes to proceed to the bill, sixty votes to get cloture on the legislation. We will also--Senator Dodd and I and others will be taking some time to talk about this on the floor. We're not just going to let it be rubberstamped."

But the Senate has filed (and seems likely to pass) cloture on the FISA legislation and amendments to strip the bill of immunity would likely require 60 votes for passage, something that, with a divided Democratic caucus, almost certainly won't happen. As noted by Congressional Quarterly: "A similar amendment to a previous version of legislation overhauling the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA, PL 95-511) failed by a vote of 31-67 in February."

Reid's position is still a relatively bold political move. While Sen. Barack Obama has expressed reservations with the compromise (and supports an amendment stripping immunity from its language), he nevertheless said he would support the bill. That the Senate Majority Leader would willingly take a different stance from his party's presidential nominee is an indication of both the political pressures of the current election as well as the emotional divisiveness of the FISA battle.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid announced this evening that he will vote against the compromise FISA legislation and work with likeminded colleagues to strip immunity for telecom firms from that bil...
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid announced this evening that he will vote against the compromise FISA legislation and work with likeminded colleagues to strip immunity for telecom firms from that bil...
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- EarthToZoey I'm a Fan of EarthToZoey 227 fans permalink
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I am in agreement with Reid.

I hate to see this put wind underneath the GOP sail.

On another note... wicked picture of Reid, et al. Quite the cinematic shot.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:37 AM on 06/25/2008
- Clairvaux I'm a Fan of Clairvaux 61 fans permalink
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Another "halo" photo.

Political photos are no longer objective documentation.

They are expressions of bias.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:39 AM on 06/25/2008
- nellie I'm a Fan of nellie 495 fans permalink
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I'm confused.

There's nothing wrong with FISA as it stands. And this unconstitutional bill did NOT have to be brought to the floor of the House. That was Pelosi's incomprehensible decision. Now Harry Reid is saying he won't vote for the bill, BUT HE DOESN'T HAVE TO BRING IT UP FOR A VOTE AT ALL.

And where's Obama on the filibuster of this thing?

This is an effed up mess.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:35 AM on 06/25/2008

You are absolutely right that this bill is unneeded, and correct that it didn't have to be brought for a vote. So why the bill? Because the Blue Dog caucus told Pelosi that if they don't pass this bill, we will lose a minimum of 40 House seats, make no gains in the Senate, and lose the White House. And she...beli­eves them. She also believed the Blue Dogs when they told her that if she didn't take impeachment off the table they would--gasp!--lose their seats. And they extracted from her a promise she would torpedo impeachment in exchange for them voting for her for Speaker. Craven you-know-what.

So every capitulation, every loss, every humiliation, every laugh at our expense by the White House, has been to save the seats of 40 Blue Dogs who aren't even real Democrats to begin with.

And as for Obama? I suspect he saw the poll (Gallup/USA Today: Obama behind McCain on terrorism by 19 points) and concluded he has to vote yes or he will lose the election. I think he concluded that a yes vote will cost him less than a no vote, because a no vote could cost him the whole election (particularly if we have another terrorist attack which is possible, if not probable, when you remember that Bin Laden critically needs a Republican victory for fundraising and recruitment, and when you remember that he bombed Madrid to influence the Spanish elections and it worked).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 AM on 06/25/2008
- NTO08 I'm a Fan of NTO08 19 fans permalink

That Pelosi would cave to Blue Dogs and allow this to even be brought up says alot about her failures as a party leader...R­eid is coming late to the table here, and if Obama decides to go with this bill, he can no longer claim to be the candidate of change.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:54 AM on 06/25/2008

Sorry Barack-

No more money or volunteering until you make good on your promise to restore the fourth amendment. I can't believe you guys are sold us out so early in the game.

Call him up.

Obama's presidential campaign: (866) 675-2008

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:33 AM on 06/25/2008

I'm with you... I even removed one of my two Obama yard signs... I of course will be forced to vote AGAINST Mc W but I truly thought I would be able to vote FOR someone this year.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:12 AM on 06/25/2008
- Ruwa I'm a Fan of Ruwa 6 fans permalink

I did the same, but I only have one sign. I emailed Obama campaign to complain. I told them if Obama vote yes, i will delet my name from his list and don't expect any penny from me.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:35 AM on 06/25/2008
- NTO08 I'm a Fan of NTO08 19 fans permalink

Good for you...I am glad many of you are holding Obama's feet to the fire...he has to realize that the support he got from many of you was conditional on him being someone new, someone different, someone who wasn't worrying about polls and political winds to make a decision. Someone who really walks the walk about change...n­ot opposing this FISA bill will send a message to many that he is not a man of action, but one of empty promises..­.

I will say it again, it is refreshing to see many here not making excuses for him, but calling him on this...BRA­VO!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:04 AM on 06/25/2008
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Pelosi voted for it. If that ticks you off along with the tabling of impeachment, please give $ to Cindy Sheehan at http://www.cindyforcongress.org/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:14 AM on 06/25/2008

I will be anxious to see her June haul after this fiasco.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:11 AM on 06/25/2008
- scooperss I'm a Fan of scooperss 71 fans permalink
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Comparing Democrats' Votes (March 14th and June 20th votes):

Verizon, AT&T, and Sprint gave PAC contributions averaging:

$8,359 to each Democrat who changed their position to support immunity for Telcos (94 Dems)
$4,987 to each Democrat who remained opposed to immunity for Telcos (116 Dems)

88 percent of the Dems who changed to supporting immunity (83 Dems of the 94) received PAC contributions from Verizon, AT&T, or Sprint during the last three years (Jan. 2005-Mar. 2008). See below for list of these 94 Dems.

All House Members (June 20th vote:)
Verizon, AT&T, and Sprint gave PAC contributions averaging:

$9,659 to each member of the House voting "YES" (105-Dem, 188-Rep)
$4,810 to each member of the House voting "NO" (128-Dem, 1-Rep)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:34 AM on 06/25/2008
- mergina I'm a Fan of mergina 86 fans permalink
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Our civil liberties are vanishing into thin air. I know people who will not fly any longer because they are sick of strip searches and do not want a nude image of them in the hands or before the eyes of anyone.

Obama is letting one political messianic veil after another fall to reveal the true ambitious politician that he is. Change? Haaaaaaa!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:12 AM on 06/25/2008

He isn't, and never was, the messiah, and it is unfair and ludicrous of you to hold him to that standard. Let me be clear: It sickens me that he is planning to vote yes (evidently). But messianic veil? He's just a man. Calm down. He represents change because he is not Bush and not McCain.

He supports making college more affordable, McCain wants it to remain the domain of the rich and to make sure our society remains dumb. He supports a woman's right to choose, McCain supports the re-criminalization of abortion. He supports actual cap and trade, McCain hasn't figured out what that means. He supports closing the Enron loophole, McCain and his friends helped think it up.

Do I want more? Sure. Will I get it? Who knows. But come on. Let's be realistic and not act like kids on Christmas who didn't get a Wii.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:17 AM on 06/25/2008
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Yeah, you're right. The right to privacy isn't really that important.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:33 AM on 06/25/2008
- nodonjuan I'm a Fan of nodonjuan 9 fans permalink
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Thanks Reid.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:01 AM on 06/25/2008
- TomR I'm a Fan of TomR 24 fans permalink
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Why doesn't Reid just prevent the bill from going to the floor for a vote? He is the Senate Majority Leader, isn't he? He sets the agenda doesn't he? Why doesn't he just sit on the bill for 6-8 months?

- Tom

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:59 AM on 06/25/2008
- presto I'm a Fan of presto 18 fans permalink

Harry Reid? Wow. Cool. I'm willing to put in some mind-numbing C-SPAN hours to show some filibuster support.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:51 AM on 06/25/2008

Nancy Pelosi could have stalled it in the House. She should have. But it's different in the Senate.

Dems may be capitulating on FISA because the Bush Admin got some dirt on them by this illegal spying. Or it could be because the Democratic Convention is sponsored by the telecoms. Regardless, we need to give them more pressure than the Repubs.

Call your senators.

Free tele # for Congress 800-828-0498, 800-614-2803 or 877-851-6437

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:35 AM on 06/25/2008

I buy the having dirt on them theory more than the campaign contribution theory. First, the campaign contributions are actually pretty small per capita Dem Shill, and, as Olbermann opined, the telecoms are not going to withhold contributions from the majority party. That just doesn't happen.

I think the Dems have been in Washington too long, believe it is still 2002, believe the majority of Americans support "counter-t­errorism," no matter what it involves, and believe they will get creamed in November if they don't do this. It can actually be that simple. It can be that they think we think one way, and they are just wrong. It doesn't have to be James Bond and all.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:22 AM on 06/25/2008
- NTO08 I'm a Fan of NTO08 19 fans permalink

Your first reason for Dems caving is more than likely the case, and the second, definitely so...Obama and others do not want to rile the telecoms, who could make the convention into a communications nightmare if they didn't get their way...stil­l doesn't justify giving in on this.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:07 AM on 06/25/2008
- springsm I'm a Fan of springsm 53 fans permalink

Obama needs to rethink this one. Go tell 'em Harry. Or how soon do you think you will capitulate. This idea of immunity to spies in this country on this country is sickening. And the intelligence was sitting on the desks of the great white saviors in the WH and they still missed on September 11, 2001. Any real terrorist cells that have been broken have been broken by those in other countries. This collecting of all communications in this country ito defeat terrorism is bogus.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:48 AM on 06/25/2008

The [now defunct ussr ] thought there was nothing wrong with spying on it's citizens. Next thing you know......­.we may want to immitate their forced labor camps. Many innocent people were convicted to fill in work spots as they were created. There are those who may be thinking of implimenting it here....an­d it might work....if enough people don't object. A nation spying on it's citizens is headed in the wrong direction.­...those who did the spying for the government should face the consequenc­es....they knew they were breaking the law.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:50 AM on 06/25/2008
- AdLib I'm a Fan of AdLib 277 fans permalink
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I really hope we're not being played on this, that there's a strategy here to make it look like there's a Dem effort to remove the immunity provision when in fact there's an understanding it's a fait d'accompli with just the facade of protest.

I don't doubt Dodd's and Feingold's commitment to this principle but Reid has not exactly been a beacon of principle.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:45 AM on 06/25/2008
- scooperss I'm a Fan of scooperss 71 fans permalink
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Well that's the way I see it. Election year ploy and nothing but CYA.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:12 AM on 06/25/2008
- darthdarcy I'm a Fan of darthdarcy 48 fans permalink
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With Obama favoring this terrible Bill, it may be that it will pass largely due to Obama as he will pull those who may have gone against it to his side as the nominee and head honcho now of the Democratic party...Ir­onic isn't it..

Yes We Can, spy on any and all of you without a warrant...­Yes We Can..!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:42 AM on 06/25/2008

Hmn, I don't know about that. Obama is very unpopular with Blue Dogs. It's not like they're going to go home and say "See! Obama (the angry muslim black panther who is secretly a terrorist) agreed with me!" My God, the leader of the Tennessee Dem party called him a terrorist last week. Not popular with Blue Dogs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:25 AM on 06/25/2008

Reid with some backbone, Obama with none. Actually stunned.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:41 AM on 06/25/2008
- macbabe I'm a Fan of macbabe 105 fans permalink
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truly clueless aren't, so very sad for you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 AM on 06/25/2008

Please! Reid compliments? Reid is an opportunistic coward. He praised this "compromise" last week.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:26 AM on 06/25/2008
- vietveter I'm a Fan of vietveter 21 fans permalink

"Give em hell Harry"

Stick by your guns!!!

Obama may well end up without my vote

before this is over... too bad to. I won't vote for

McBush, I will withhold my vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:34 AM on 06/25/2008
- laire I'm a Fan of laire 4 fans permalink

vietveter,

I understand your frustrations at Obama but if you didn't vote for Obama you are esintially voting for McCain. I hope Obama comes out against this bill but it doesn't look like that's going to be the case. However, there are many more battles to come lets all understand that and call his office and let him know we are dissappointed in this vote to come.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:00 AM on 06/25/2008
- John51 I'm a Fan of John51 10 fans permalink

I think this goes to show that if Obama had been in the senate for the war vote he would have voted for the war. He is looking more and more like the typical washington insider. just weeks ago he stated he would review and undo, all transgressions against the constitution by the bush administration, during his first 100 days in office. now he is supporting one of bush's biggest transgressions and legitimizing it. this is a big deal.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:11 AM on 06/25/2008

How smart of you to not to vote because a candidate doesn't agree with ALL your views. There's the matter of Iraq, health care and the middle class at stake here if you're not aware. Don't be stupid.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:06 AM on 06/25/2008

Obama says he's against Telecom Immunity, but he will vote for a bill that legitimizes it.

Obama says he's against the Iraq occupation, but he have voted to fund it every year he has been in the Senate.

If he can't follow up what he says with how he votes, why on earth should I believe he will get the US out of Iraq?

Do you think everyone is POISED to pass National Health Care? You must be a freaking IDIOT. If any National Health Care act gets passed, it will be HARD fought. You still can pass a National Health Care bill that doesn't actually give health care to Americans. See: No Child Left Behind Act.

The bottom line is that what a politician stands for is reflected in their votes. If Obama votes for Telecom Immunity, I have NO REASON to believe he will work to get us out of Iraq, or fight hard for National Health Insurance. OR anything else he CLAIMS to support. If you can't see that, then you are a moron.

Obama better vote against cloture and against telecom immunity. If he wants to trade votes of his supporters for votes from conservatives that are more comfortable with McCain, its his choice. Who I vote for is mine.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:56 AM on 06/25/2008
- NTO08 I'm a Fan of NTO08 19 fans permalink

This issue is one which is key to Obama's sincerity on opposing Bush's strategies to fight war on terror at the expense of civil liberties. Nothing could be more important for Obama to show leadership on. Nothing could be more important to reject him on if he fails to vote against this bill.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:10 AM on 06/25/2008

ok

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:49 AM on 06/25/2008
- HumeSkeptic I'm a Fan of HumeSkeptic 1595 fans permalink
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Thank you Senators Reid, Dodd and Feingold. Do the right thing. If Senator Obama can't see that this is a bad bill, too bad.

As a minimum, the bill should have no retroactive immunity for corporations that might have violated basic rights of citizens. That would set a very dangerous precedent.

I am disappointed by Senator Obama's position. This is not what I expected from him.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:44 AM on 06/25/2008
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