Serenity Lost: Obama And The Netroots

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First Posted: 06-25-08 11:30 AM   |   Updated: 07- 3-08 05:12 AM

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Only weeks into the general election campaign and already a notable tension is beginning to materialize within the Democratic Party. At question is Sen. Barack Obama's relationship with the progressive netroots, the online community that helped aid the Senator's rise to the presidential nomination, but has since seemingly played second fiddle in terms of courted constituencies.

Obama's decision to embrace a compromise on FISA legislation -- a virtual slap in the face to some progressive bloggers demanding no legal immunity for telecommunications companies -- was the catalyst of the recent chatter. Other concerns arose days prior when Obama cut an advertisement on behalf of a conservative southern Democrat whose primary challenger was favored by the liberal blogosphere.

But for some progressive activists, the issue is not simply one of policy, but a concern that Obama's willingness to snub their political wishes is far more endemic.

"You can see it with FISA. He really doesn't feel that much kinship with the priorities of the netroots and I don't think he has made any secret of that," said Jane Hamsher of Firedoglake. "I have to say he is very consistent. He has gone outside the netroots for his strategy... People who feel betrayed right now, I'm not sure why, because it is extremely consistent with what they should have expected."

Indeed, there is ample evidence to suggest that Obama's standing with the netroots has not always been peachy. Prior to his victory in Iowa, he consistently trailed former Sen. John Edwards (and, on occasion, Chris Dodd) in the Daily Kos primary poll. Even before then, his (now-chilled) relationship with Sen. Joseph Lieberman as well as an essay he posted (again on Daily Kos) concerning Supreme Court nominations earned him some plaudits but also skepticism among some prominent online voices.

As a former aide to Sen. Hillary Clinton told The Huffington Post, had the New York Democrat not had her own problems with the crowd, her campaign would have been a far more natural home for the progressive netroots.

"I don't understand why a group like MoveOn backs Obama," said the aide. "Hillary is the one who will build up the Democratic infrastructure. She's the one promising to fight the ideological battles. He's the one who is talking about moving beyond partisanship. And they love him for it."

Such an argument, however, assumes that the primary goal of major online progressives and their audiences is aggressive partisanship. Some want that. But many are also cognizant of another pressing reality: the need to win. And, as such, there is a willingness to cut Obama a bit of political slack.

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"The number of people Obama's campaign has brought into the political process and the development of the netroots progressive movement has been an important convergence in this election," said Ilyse Hogue, Communications Director of Moveon.org. "But it is not an endpoint. Our goal remains to hold the ground on any issue that matters to the progressive community. [Obama's] goal is... to get elected, to be honest, but also to understand the power of who's electing him. We have reason to be optimistic about that."

Moreover, the desires of the progressive netroots and the realities of the Electoral College are not always at odds. For instance, Obama's decision to forgo public financing in the general election - while viewed sourly among good government groups - was a welcomed move among the most prominent Democratic bloggers.

Others, meanwhile, have been willing to reserve judgment regarding his position on FISA, albeit with demands that he works to defeat the compromise.

"We'll see what he does this week," said Markos Moulitsas of Daily Kos. "If he's part of the capitulation or refuses to lead, then it's salient for your story. As of now, I think it's still too early to write this piece."

And, it should be noted, there will undoubtedly be future issues in which Obama and the netroots rally to the same cause (foremost, of course, being the general election). As experts of campaigns past can attest, the internal dynamics within the Senator's headquarters inevitably leave one group or another disappointed.

"There is always a tension between what the Internet department is able to put out and what all the other departments want," said Tim Tagaris, Ned Lamont's Internet Director during the 2006 Senate and an aide in similar capacity to Chris Dodd's campaign in '08. "The question is what battles do you want to fight, because it is a battle everyday. And he's not going to win it all the time because there are people on staff who have been doing this for decades and the Internet as a political tool is relative new."

But clearly, at this point in time, the honeymoon period that Obama enjoyed for the latter part of the Democratic primary and the first weeks of the general election seems to be setting. And a tug-of-war of sorts could soon emerge between progressive bloggers and the Senator, both over campaign positions as well as the affections of Democrats.

Salon.com's Glenn Greenwald offered an opening salvo by chastising Obama supporters for a willingness to rationalize their candidate's position on FISA in a way that was "unhealthy in the extreme." While at the Personal Democracy Forum, the Senator's new-media guru, Joe Rospars, was forced to dispute the premise of an assertion that his candidate was "stand-offish" with the blogs.

"Where we see that he is consistent with the netroots is his organizing and belief in organizing," explained Hogue. "Obviously there is some policy divergence which is crystallizing this week. And that's not incredibly surprising, We still have some work to do as a progressive movement to not just have candidates speak about our issues but act on our issues."

Correction: an earlier version implied that Glenn Greenwald referred to Obama supporters as "Obamabots." He did not.

Only weeks into the general election campaign and already a notable tension is beginning to materialize within the Democratic Party. At question is Sen. Barack Obama's relationship with the progressiv...
Only weeks into the general election campaign and already a notable tension is beginning to materialize within the Democratic Party. At question is Sen. Barack Obama's relationship with the progressiv...
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I'm as against telecom immunity as anyone- but has anyone considered that maybe without the threat of civil suits, these telecom people might start to roll over and spill the beans as to what really happened..­.....
But then again there's always the possibility that the light at the end of the tunnel is just a freight train.....

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:31 AM on 06/26/2008

BillyShears: "But then again there's always the possibility that the light at the end of the tunnel is just a freight train.....­"

HA! Great image.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:09 PM on 06/26/2008
- jdenham I'm a Fan of jdenham 7 fans permalink

It is time that the Democratic party find out we are serious about change. Senator Obama has to realize also that we are not lemming like the Republicans. Most Americans are against Telecom Immunity it appears that only the Administration and the Congress are for it. Immunity hides any wrong doing committed by the Administration and the Congress. The Democrats have us between a rock and a hard place, because their is no alternative to voting for them. After they clear the Primaries they try to slip Immunity through. If this Immunity goes through I think there should be a Democrat that pays the price for this. I am talking about you Stenny Hoyer. I think one new Republican might be needed in the new Congress. Maybe from the Maryland 5th District.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:21 AM on 06/26/2008
- alkamm I'm a Fan of alkamm 42 fans permalink
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Yes, we're lemmings like Democrats! There's nothing between lemmings and the air beneath the cliff they so cheerfully, ill-consideredly line up to jump from.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:45 PM on 06/26/2008

The trolls are deeply depressed. Posing as an angry Hillary supporter isn't credible anymore and Obama is gaining strenghth across all demographic.

Kos just decided to throw the trolls a bone. This is it.

Enjoy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:14 AM on 06/26/2008
- zann I'm a Fan of zann 11 fans permalink

Obama is a so-called centrist politician with a lot of excellent qualities. He's smart, fair-minded, energetic, knowledgeable, popular overseas and he listens, plus his name is fun to say over and over. Unlike Bush.

The so-called left actually represents the views of about 60% of the population. So we are the real centrists.

Out big lifetime challenge is the same as always- to see past the so-called conflicts, smoke and mirrors that the media pollute the air with and unite around ???? so we can be the center and heart of our own country again.

Obama isn't the ???? like some hoped he would be. I keep wondering, what is?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:23 AM on 06/26/2008

McOldGuy's public financing alone will not be enough to expose all of O's constituent group dependent self-contr­adictions.
And we know the MSM won't be doing it.

When the teleprompter closes its eyes there's no telling what O's mouth will say.
No wonder he gets the flop-sweats at townhalls.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbpWonUzlrc&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxBX8sz3tO8&feature=related

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:08 AM on 06/26/2008
- mike53 I'm a Fan of mike53 8 fans permalink

Looks like BHO has senior moments also. Maybe David Axelrod should be the dem nominee.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:03 AM on 06/26/2008

The only video that matters is the one of McCain on MTP in 2005 declaring that he was "with the President on every major issue". Now he's suddenly the Maverick. If they put McCain on Mt. Rushmore it would just be a giant pair of stone flip-flops.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:13 PM on 06/26/2008
- amo I'm a Fan of amo permalink

Give me a break, Obama's just another politician, I mean I'm voting for the guy, (I voted for Clinton in the primary) McCain's out of the question, but they're all politicians and all of them will do what ever to get in the big office. The progressives remind of Bush supporters, just stay in denial and vote for Obama and everything will be alright. Grow up.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:53 AM on 06/26/2008
- repearwo I'm a Fan of repearwo 35 fans permalink
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It is sad that the people of the US just do not get it. They did not get Bobby, or Martin. We have made Bobby and Martin myths now, but there were not shot for no reason.

If one thing makes you change from support to non-support, you were not really there to begin with.


Obama is a man. He says it is not about him it is about us. If you don't want the politics as usual, then stop acting like you did with the politics as usual. Obama, or whoever, will make mistakes. We have to stop acting like petulant children when we think he has made a mistake.

This is still a democracy. We are still free. What shall we do with that freedom?

If you expect someone else to solve your problems you are in trouble. A leader helps us to find ways to solve our own problems. We are the Government, that means we must find a way to provide healthcare, Security, housing, food, clean air, clean water, jobs, and all the rest of the things we need. We just need a leader to keep us in the right direction, and Obama is such a man, if we let him. Obama's slogans tell the story. Change we can believe in, not a changer we can believe in. Yes We Can, not Yes I can.

If you want Change become that change.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:54 AM on 06/26/2008

as unconstitutional and illegal as this whole mess is, i can't help but wonder what the ramifications would have been for any telecom that refused to cooperate with bush and his minions --- does anybody know if there were any phone companies that did refuse to participate or at least put up any kind of serious resistance? --- are they still in business? --- i can well imagine bushco threatening dire consequences for any telecom that refused to cooperate ...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:41 AM on 06/26/2008
- Lexie I'm a Fan of Lexie 9 fans permalink

I have a hate-hate relationship with the telecoms, but you may have a point. I believe Qwest Communications refused to spy and they were later charged with something such that they underwent a lot of harassment. Also, I believe it was individuals from Qwest Communications who stated that they were asked to start spying in February of 2001, well before 9/11. On the other hand, I read a few months ago that some telecoms who *were* spying for the Bush administration were suspending their spying operations because they weren't getting paid.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:45 AM on 06/26/2008

Would love to see an investigative piece on the Qwest story by Seymour Hersh or one of the other heavy hitters.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:36 AM on 06/26/2008

That is an excellent an point. The corollary is that whether or not the telecoms have immunity, they will not be prosecuted for any violation, no matter how egregious, if McCain is elected.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:34 AM on 06/26/2008
- EdCoughlin I'm a Fan of EdCoughlin 10 fans permalink

Actually there are documented cases of people who resisted the Bush minions, three of them to be exact, including an online library project. What happened? The Bushites backed down because taking it to court would bring this whole mess to the light of day which is what they were trying to avoid by bullying in the first place.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:51 PM on 06/26/2008
- LeSamourai I'm a Fan of LeSamourai 16 fans permalink
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Talk about disturbing.
One of the minds behind the shaping of the DOJ:

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/06/who_is_esther_slater_mcdonald.php

And some background info on her school Pensacola Christian College:

http://www.pensacolachristiancollege.com/rules.htm

SCARY SCARY stuff.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:29 AM on 06/26/2008
- OlskoolDem I'm a Fan of OlskoolDem 3 fans permalink

I see Barach has taken a page out of Hillary/McCain's book, Sad very Sad !!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:21 AM on 06/26/2008
- meanguy I'm a Fan of meanguy 17 fans permalink

what's sad is that it's taken so long for his supporters to get it thru their heads that obama is a POLITICIAN

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:56 AM on 06/26/2008

Poor lonely hearts club kids - they've finally seen the marionette strings.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:28 AM on 06/26/2008
- whizkid I'm a Fan of whizkid 28 fans permalink

Obamababies don't know Frank Zappa from Victor Mature.
Orville from Wilbur.
But they tell you that you're not a Democrat.
Kinda odd the way we're to unify.
Wisdom first. Dreams second.
Statist HS way down the to do list.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkP0bsiCgDQ&feature=related

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:16 AM on 06/26/2008
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You know what the most ironic part is right now my DSL is down for some technical reason. So I am piggybacking off of someone else's unsecured wireless network and I don't even know whose.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:02 AM on 06/26/2008
- AdLib I'm a Fan of AdLib 277 fans permalink
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Hey! Get off my router! Or at least bring a sixpack next time!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:04 AM on 06/26/2008
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Good one!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:52 AM on 06/26/2008
- whizkid I'm a Fan of whizkid 28 fans permalink

Does VolvoBirkenstock own this site or the comments and snarky retorts posted with alacrity just to irritate real Democrats?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:34 AM on 06/26/2008

Please define "real Democrats". That should be fun.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:41 AM on 06/26/2008
- whizkid I'm a Fan of whizkid 28 fans permalink

You try it first.
Here's a tip. They're not Marxists.
But they don't fall for Rasputin.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:49 AM on 06/26/2008
- AdLib I'm a Fan of AdLib 277 fans permalink
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Why don't you ask one to find out?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:43 AM on 06/26/2008
- whizkid I'm a Fan of whizkid 28 fans permalink

Adlib
You're another one who really irritates to the point where I might vote for McCain.
Smug, pretentious.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:57 AM on 06/26/2008

Poor pissoir. Even when presented with the facts, it keeps on lying like the sniveling boil on the arse of humanity it is.

Meltdowns tonight by pissoir, UncensoredRupauline AND neo.

Full moon out?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:23 AM on 06/26/2008
- SuperBunny I'm a Fan of SuperBunny 32 fans permalink
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LOL These 3 are crazier than a soup sandwich wrapped in tinfoil.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:29 AM on 06/26/2008

whizkid
Uh
abc "go" .com.
Wake up.
Thats not ABC.
You got punk'd.
Flagged Posted 02:59 AM on 06/26/2008

Wrong AGAIN, pissoir:

ABC News: Online news, breaking news, feature stories and moreIncludes American and world news headlines, articles, chatrooms, message boards, news alerts, video and audio webcasts, shopping, and wireless news service.
abcnews.go.com/ - Similar pages - Note this

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=abc+news

abd.go.com is the ABC NEWS web address.

You IGNORANT piece of tihs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:07 AM on 06/26/2008

Not much of a whizkid, is he? ABC, ESPN and all their affiliated companies have the go.com thing going on in their URLs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 AM on 06/26/2008

Go.com (also known as The Go Network) is a web portal created and operated by the Walt Disney Internet Group, which is a part of The Walt Disney Company. The portal includes content from ABC News, ESPN, Movies.com and FamilyFun.com, all of which are associated with Disney and are hosted under a go.comm name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go.com

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:15 AM on 06/26/2008
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