Clinton: Why I Voted No On FISA

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First Posted: 07- 9-08 05:00 PM   |   Updated: 07-17-08 05:12 AM

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Clinton Fisa

The Senate passed a revamped version of FISA legislation on Wednesday. But that conclusion was never in doubt. The real intrigue surrounded which Democrats would buck the compromise, which included immunity for telecommunications companies, and what side Sen. Hillary Clinton would come down on.

Late this afternoon, Clinton voted against the bill, putting her at odds with the party's presumptive nominee, Barack Obama. In a statement put out by her Internet guru, Peter Daou, the New York Democrat struck a similar chord as her Illinois counterpart, describing the compromise as legislation that will "strengthen oversight of the administration's surveillance activities over previous drafts." She also, like Obama, pinpointed shortcomings in oversight, immunity, and other aspects of the compromise. But, in the end, she, unlike Obama, was persuaded to vote no.

"[A]ny surveillance program must contain safeguards to protect the rights of Americans against abuse, and to preserve clear lines of oversight and accountability over this administration. I applaud the efforts of my colleagues who negotiated this legislation, and I respect my colleagues who reached a different conclusion on today's vote. I do so because this is a difficult issue. Nonetheless, I could not vote for the legislation in its current form."

[snip]

"Congress must vigorously check and balance the president even in the face of dangerous enemies and at a time of war. That is what sets us apart. And that is what is vital to ensuring that any tool designed to protect us is used - and used within the law - for that purpose and that purpose alone. I believe my responsibility requires that I vote against this compromise, and I will continue to pursue reforms that will improve our ability to collect intelligence in our efforts to combat terror and to oversee that authority in Congress."

Full Statement Below

One of the great challenges before us as a nation is remaining steadfast in our fight against terrorism while preserving our commitment to the rule of law and individual liberty. As a senator from New York on September 11, I understand the importance of taking any and all necessary steps to protect our nation from those who would do us harm. I believe strongly that we must modernize our surveillance laws in order to provide intelligence professionals the tools needed to fight terrorism and make our country more secure. However, any surveillance program must contain safeguards to protect the rights of Americans against abuse, and to preserve clear lines of oversight and accountability over this administration. I applaud the efforts of my colleagues who negotiated this legislation, and I respect my colleagues who reached a different conclusion on today's vote. I do so because this is a difficult issue. Nonetheless, I could not vote for the legislation in its current form.

The legislation would overhaul the law that governs the administration's surveillance activities. Some of the legislation's provisions place guidelines and restrictions on the operational details of the surveillance activities, others increase judicial and legislative oversight of those activities, and still others relate to immunity for telecommunications companies that participated in the administration's surveillance activities.

While this legislation does strengthen oversight of the administration's surveillance activities over previous drafts, in many respects, the oversight in the bill continues to come up short. For instance, while the bill nominally calls for increased oversight by the FISA Court, its ability to serve as a meaningful check on the President's power is debatable. The clearest example of this is the limited power given to the FISA Court to review the government's targeting and minimization procedures.

But the legislation has other significant shortcomings. The legislation also makes no meaningful change to the immunity provisions. There is little disagreement that the legislation effectively grants retroactive immunity to the telecommunications companies. In my judgment, immunity under these circumstances has the practical effect of shutting down a critical avenue for holding the administration accountable for its conduct. It is precisely why I have supported efforts in the Senate to strip the bill of these provisions, both today and during previous debates on this subject. Unfortunately, these efforts have been unsuccessful.

What is more, even as we considered this legislation, the administration refused to allow the overwhelming majority of Senators to examine the warrantless wiretapping program. This made it exceedingly difficult for those Senators who are not on the Intelligence and Judiciary Committees to assess the need for the operational details of the legislation, and whether greater protections are necessary. The same can be said for an assessment of the telecom immunity provisions. On an issue of such tremendous importance to our citizens - and in particular to New Yorkers - all Senators should have been entitled to receive briefings that would have enabled them to make an informed decision about the merits of this legislation. I cannot support this legislation when we know neither the nature of the surveillance activities authorized nor the role played by telecommunications companies granted immunity.

Congress must vigorously check and balance the president even in the face of dangerous enemies and at a time of war. That is what sets us apart. And that is what is vital to ensuring that any tool designed to protect us is used - and used within the law - for that purpose and that purpose alone. I believe my responsibility requires that I vote against this compromise, and I will continue to pursue reforms that will improve our ability to collect intelligence in our efforts to combat terror and to oversee that authority in Congress.

The Senate passed a revamped version of FISA legislation on Wednesday. But that conclusion was never in doubt. The real intrigue surrounded which Democrats would buck the compromise, which included im...
The Senate passed a revamped version of FISA legislation on Wednesday. But that conclusion was never in doubt. The real intrigue surrounded which Democrats would buck the compromise, which included im...
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- AdLib I'm a Fan of AdLib 277 fans permalink
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Look, she may have done it for self-serving reasons but Hlllary did end up voting as many of us wanted 0bama to vote. She may not have had much to lose by doing so (she doesn't have to worry about the GOP slime machine coming after her between now and November) butg she still gets a "thank you" from me.

For those Hlllary supporters using this to bash 0bama, let's not forget that Hlllary does not exactly have the best record on protecting our Constitutional rights, she was a sponsor of a bill to criminalize those who burn American flags in her run up to running for the presidency...a similar politically motivated compromise to this one by 0bama.

Too many people in glass houses flinging stones.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:02 PM on 07/09/2008
- Grulg I'm a Fan of Grulg 6 fans permalink

Gimme a break. She can't win w/ you people. She votes the way YOUR GUY said he was gonna vote for all these months-and lookee--you slap her for doing it for the 'wrong reasons'. Shut up, okay? Really. You're gonna have all the chances to be whining about how Your Guy is selling you cultists down the river plenty of times this fall.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:47 PM on 07/09/2008

Just one more thing his thrown under the bus.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:48 PM on 07/09/2008

It is so wonderful that we are all different but equal for your thinking is so beneath anything I could conjure up - THANK GOD!

You probably are suffering from voters remorse after putting Bush in office twice!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:54 PM on 07/09/2008

Her reasons were far from self serving. Breaking from O, not covering him on this vote will not please the DNC or his campaign.

Newsday put her dilemma like this:

"The vote puts C linton in a bind. If she backs the bill, she'll be accused of reneging on her promise. If she votes no, she runs the risk of jeopardizing her newfound alliance with O bama."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:53 PM on 07/09/2008
- ohmercy I'm a Fan of ohmercy 25 fans permalink

EXACTLY.

glad to read that.
This is what I've been saying for a week, since O did his turn about on FISA and the Hill Haters started bashing her for how she would vote the same way blahblahblah.

I really thought she might vote with him because he is now the presumptive "head" of the party, the nominee and she would be campaigning for him. I really did think she would have to bite the bullet and support his vote.
I knew what her position had been (its been on her website for months and months) but with the campaigning, the unity, and the need to get a Dem elected... you know.

Good for her for voting her conscience.

I knew what these people would be saying one way or the other she would be wrong... and hey... "she voted for the war!"

aiyeeee.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:41 PM on 07/09/2008

.
"...She may not have had much to lose..."

Just like BO had nothing to lose by making his post-famous speech to some local group in IL ... and then voted just like HRC on amost every war vote since he got to the Senate.

But when he did it everybody raved BETTER JUDGEMENT!

Well, where's your better judgement now?

Da*n straight, HRC supporters are wondering who's crying now.
.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:54 PM on 07/09/2008

Amazing, every vote she takes has to be self-serving but not Obama's vote? Please. She voted no for the right reasons. A shame that Obama, who said he'd fight against the bill. As he has done when he was in the Chicago Senate, he did the same.

There is still time to correct all the back tracking BO has done since he "got the nomination" (he hasn't no vote has been taken). Talk about buyer's remorse, if BO has turned on so much in such a short time, what will he do as President. The super delegates should be allowed to reconsider.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:19 PM on 07/09/2008
- DTGB I'm a Fan of DTGB permalink

I really dont see how you can compare the eviceration of the 4th amendment to flag burning, totally lame - yes but not in the same league.

Obama just gave us the finger and you still hate on hillary? nobody knows how she would've voted if she'd won, you only assume it. of course she's still that same old "calculating, self-centered, evil, party destroying, self-serving POLITICIAN" that so many of you have painted her to be. BUT NOW, you have to look into the mirror w Mr Obama and see him for the politician he is, for his own calculations and self-serving moves.
they are all politicians, no one aspires to POTUS that isn't calculated, self-centered, self-serving.
at the end of day, none of this important, it's been a long and dissappointing year, it was supposed to be the Dem's year but now i don't know if I want to be a Dem after the FISA vote.
we have an election that we can not allow McCain to win regardless of the moves Obama makes, we have no choice to but ensure his victory.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:21 PM on 07/09/2008
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I am now very sorry I've supported Obama and disparaged Clinton throughout the primaries. It was a mistake.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:01 PM on 07/09/2008
- j0em0mma I'm a Fan of j0em0mma 37 fans permalink
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She had nothing to lose. Barack? He is right on the edge of losing my vote, too. Constitutional law perfesser my a$$.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:53 PM on 07/09/2008
- cmdrgmh I'm a Fan of cmdrgmh 2 fans permalink

She turned to Feax News early on. She never ever said her vote for war was a mistake. She just did this because he didnt. If the shoe were on the other foot, she would have voted for this too. Evil is as evil does.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:51 PM on 07/09/2008

Crawl back in your cave.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:42 PM on 07/09/2008

When you are going to dump on someone, at least make it understandable. She did it because he didn't? Didn't BO vote for every war funding bill? Didn't he vote against a Dem amendment to set a timetable to bring the troops home?

And WTF does "if the shoe was on the other foot, she would have voted for this too". What shoe and what foot?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:30 PM on 07/09/2008
- realtalk I'm a Fan of realtalk 13 fans permalink

OBAMA MADE THE DECISION TO VOTE FOR THIS FISA BILL TO PROTECT THE USA. OBAMA HE MADE THE DECISON TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN THE OTHER SURVEILLANCE PROGRAMS EXPIRE THIS SUMMER, THAT THERE WILL BE SOMETHING ELSE IN PLACE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE REMAIN SAFE.

OBAMA ALREADY EXPLAINED THAT FISA NEEDED TO BE IN PLACE TO MONITOR AND TRACK INDIVIDUALS LIVING OUTSIDE OUR COUNTRY, WHO WANT TO ATTACK THE USA, AND THAT BECAUSE CERTAIN ELECTRONIC SURVEILLANCE ORDERS WILL BEGIN TO EXPIRE LATER THIS SUMMER, FISA SURVEILLANCE PROGRAM NEEDS TO BE IN PLACE.

OBAMA MADE THE DECISION TO PROTECT THE USA, HE MADE THE DECISON TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN THE SURVEILLANCE PROGRAMS EXPIRE THIS SUMMER, THAT THERE IS SOMETHING ELSE IN PLACE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WILL REMAIN SAFE.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barack-obama/my-position-on-fisa_b_110789.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:47 PM on 07/09/2008

NIce try, but if the American government wants to spy on its people, they can get a court order to do it. No law expires preventing that from happening. Saying that he did it "to protect the USA" is bullsh*t! That's what Bush says when he want to circumvent the Constitution.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:56 PM on 07/09/2008

Hey Realtalk,

The war is over, you can take a chill pill with your propaganda.

OBAMA iS moving RIGHT......and he does not get my vote.....HA HA HA.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:43 PM on 07/09/2008
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As soon as the vote is published...it will be on t-shirts to protest and help vote those senators and members of the house who voted for immunity out of office.

The do not deserve their seats in Congress.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:40 PM on 07/09/2008
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Obama should be the first to go!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:49 PM on 07/09/2008
- harriscrl3 I'm a Fan of harriscrl3 191 fans permalink

You know why she voted no because she is NOT the nominee. She said the same thing Obama said and came to the conclusion of No. It was a strategic move on Obama's part and for all this saying that FIsa is going to cost him yada yada he is winning Indepdents by double digits. Obama simply wants to win and the left can complain and groan all they want but are you speaking for the left or are you speaking for most Americans. You may want to stick to your principles and have a MCain administration but they are people who are crying at Obama's rally and they werent crying about Fisa. People are have more pressing concerns I k now I do like our illegal occupation of a foreign country. He has a responsiblity to these people to win. Remember what he said in his pep talk we dont have a choice we have to win. See the left is naieve. I've spoken to other people and they are not up and arms about this FISA as the media is spinning gee I wonder why. Maybe its because they are paying $4.00 a gallon for gas, have no healthcare, are barely able to afford food. They are people crying at his rallies. You know what this reminds me of people are worried about wearing the same shoes when someone has no feet.

Carol

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:36 PM on 07/09/2008

First of all, you're wrong about HRC's position - I've posted several times that she co-sponsored the D odd amendment to strip immunity - O bama DID NOT.

Second, what she did is irrelevant. O mislead his base to get their votes. Time and time again. He's supposed to be a constitutional law expert. He could have voted NO, it was going to pass anyway. So why did he vote YES? Just ask yourself that. He is BOUGHT. He is a puppet of the DNC. HRC was too threatening to them, and she's still defying them with this vote! You'd better believe, they're furious with her for not towing the line.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:44 PM on 07/09/2008
- alamacTHC I'm a Fan of alamacTHC 5 fans permalink

When I was working so hard for Obama I would have bet my house that the vote would have been exactly the opposite. I believed Clinton to be the corporatist and Obama to be the one with integrity.

I think I woke up in Alice's Wonderland after Obama got the nomination...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:34 PM on 07/09/2008

It's never too late to wake up from Wonderland. I've never been one to do told-you-sos but this time I can't resist. Throughout the campaign Obama painted Clinton as someone who "will do anything to get elected." (Now who is being accused of that?.) Now that BO is being labeled a flip-flopper and moving towards the center (although he denies it, a claim only the staunchest kool-aid drinkers will buy), Hillary is starting to look more honest and integruous than Barack. Candidates are selling themselves as a brand. Obama was different, above the mud, calling for change, talking of unity and hope. Being so charismatic, he was a good salesman. But he was also unknown. In the beginning that was an asset, but now it is a liability. Every change of position brings to voters a distrust and questioning of his character. We all know Hillary's baggage and most of us can look beyond it to her accomplishments. If BO is smart he will pick her for VP. If not, it will be a tight race.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:14 PM on 07/09/2008

I don't presume to know HRC's motivations. What I do know is that she and the other 27 senators who voted against the bill did the right thing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:27 PM on 07/09/2008

I wish that I could switch my vote in the primary from Obama to Clinton. I feel like Obama stabbed the country in the back on FISA. This is not a "run of the mill" issue; it is the Constitution "stupid."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:24 PM on 07/09/2008

Buyer's remorse? Interesting that BO is doing so quickly what he, his campaign and his loyal supporters accused HRC of. What if he made these recent position switches and comments on SCOTUS decisions public before the primaries were over?

You can do something -- call, write, email your delegates and tell them they don't have to vote for the person they were elected to vote for. That is right. One of the results of Ted Kennedy's challenge to a sitting President of his own party in 1980 (you know, the guy who brought the fight to the convention floor!! And you people dumped on HRC for seeing the primary season through). After the convention the rules committee changed the rules so that elected delegates can vote for any candidate at the convention.

Support HRC for the nomination at the convention!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:35 PM on 07/09/2008
- loria I'm a Fan of loria 147 fans permalink
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Give me a break. You think that Hillary would win the election if the nomination were overturned? Stop this talk about Hillary being the nominee. It isn't going to happen and only serves to further divide the party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:04 PM on 07/09/2008
- realtalk I'm a Fan of realtalk 13 fans permalink

HIllary Clinton should have stood up against the Republicans against the Iraq war, she should have read the report, and voted against the war, BUT instead she did not and now OVER 4000 people, soldiers are dead, and we do NOT have enough soldiers to win the war in Afghanistan.

Obama already explained that the FISA surveillance was needed to make sure that we can monitor the conversations of TERRORIST overseas, and therefore be prepared to protect our country.

Obama already explained that he voted for FISA: The ability to monitor and track individuals who want to attack the United States is a vital counter-terrorism tool, and I'm persuaded that it is necessary to keep the American people safe -- particularly since certain electronic surveillance orders will begin to expire later this summer. Given the choice between voting for an improved yet imperfect bill, and losing important surveillance tools, I've chosen to support the current compromise. I do so with the firm intention -- once I'm sworn in as president -- to have my Attorney General conduct a comprehensive review of all our surveillance programs, and to make further recommendations on any steps needed to preserve civil liberties and to prevent executive branch abuse in the future.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:19 PM on 07/09/2008

BO stated that if he was in the Senate at the time, he doesn't know how he would have voted. At least there he was being honest. If he, a new Senator trying to prove himself for a run for the Presidency had heard the intel from the Bush Administration (lies) he likely would have voted for it.

Regardless, once in the Senate BO voted for every war appropriation bill and even voted against the Feingold amendment to set a time table to bring the troops home.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:41 PM on 07/09/2008

Realtalk, I'm sick of people blaming Hillary for the Iraq war. Yes, she voted for it. So did the majority of congress. Most of the American people were for it, remember? Why don't you blame the American public? Everyone (not myself) was conned by the administration and as I recall anyone who stood up against the war was called unpatriotic (remember the Dixie Chicks?) It's true that HRC had political motivations for voting for it (like being re-elected or possibly running for President). I'm sure as a Democrat and a woman she didn't want to be perceived as weak on defense. Remember those days when Bush was popular (horrors) and the Republicans ruled congress and they painted the leftist Democrats as wusses on the war on terror? And they used fear as a tactic for the elections. Anyway, Hillary admited it was a mistake (to moderator Tim Russert in a debate.) She is now opposed to the war. Can't we move on? BO was smart to use this against her in the primary. However, he was not in congress when they had the vote and when he was he voted for funding. If he had the courage he spoke of why didn't he vote against war funding? Also why has he changed his mind on FISA, NAFTA, gun rights, public financing, abortion, Iran, and Iraq? Is he any more honorable than Hillary and her Iraqi vote?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:35 PM on 07/09/2008

Some of you stupid incoherrent Hillary bashers would complain that Hillary had political motives if she saved you from a burning building. Seriously Obama supporters, act like some one over the age of 12.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:16 PM on 07/09/2008

FISA trampled upon our civil liberties under the Bill of Rights. I applaud Senator Clinton for voting against this Bill. It does not matter she is not a presidenttial candidate. This time she used a good judgement. Obviously, she read the FISA bill. Senator Obama likes to tout himself as the candidate of change and to that end he has succeeded and voted to restrict our civil liberties.

He has changed his stance on gun control. He has changed his stance on whether or not Iran poses a threat. He has changed his position on NAFTA. He has changed his position now on the FISA law.
He has changed his position on Jerusalem. He has changed his position on ending the Cuban emargo. He has changed his position on the decriminalization of Medical marijuana. He has changed his pastor. We need a president who is more than just a bumper-sticker slogan. Like a chamelon, Obama changes his positions depending on the direction of the political winds and that is a change we can do without. He is not an authentic person, for sure.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:08 PM on 07/09/2008
- calijon I'm a Fan of calijon 3 fans permalink

heckuva time to be brave hillary. the 4k plus dead soldiers could have used some.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:51 PM on 07/09/2008

Do you know how stupid you sound?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:23 PM on 07/09/2008
- suzyhein I'm a Fan of suzyhein 63 fans permalink
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this stupid?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:15 PM on 07/09/2008
- timinhi I'm a Fan of timinhi 10 fans permalink
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"Well obviously she can never make up for authorizing war, giving the war bipartisan legitimacy, and voting against (diplomacy) Levin Ammendment, but she paid a huge price for it (lost the nomination) and it's good that she's doing the right thing now. Better late than never."

"Do you know how stupid you sound?"

Christopher--Since you so obviously posess a superior intellect, please explain to us lesser lifeforms why the first quote "sounds stupid." I certainly disagree that Hillary has anything to "make up for" in the first place, but "toocoldout" is correct (and is entitled to his/her opinion) as to Hillary doing the right thing by voting against this pact with Satan now. At least "toocoldout" knows the importance of being conciliatory. What do you base your presumed intelligence on?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:28 PM on 07/09/2008
- toocoldout I'm a Fan of toocoldout 18 fans permalink

Well obviously she can never make up for authorizing war, giving the war bipartisan legitimacy, and voting against (diplomacy) Levin Ammendment, but she paid a huge price for it (lost the nomination) and it's good that she's doing the right thing now. Better late than never.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:45 PM on 07/09/2008
- ebbtide I'm a Fan of ebbtide 16 fans permalink

It looks to me as if Hillary Clinton thinks she is still in the primary race, or is positioning herself to win in 2012. I see this as a bunch of bull crap on her part. She knew the bill was going to be passed, and as with her Iraq war vote, she calculated this would get her a notch above Obama. Obama, imo, is a fool for doing what he did re this Fisa bill and a lot of his supporters are angry or disppointed in his vote. Many feel they have been betrayed. Clinton's motives are obvious and if this fool thinks getting her on board and paying off her outrageous debt will get her lo yalty he has a lot to learn. But then, he has hired many many of her staff members to help him destroy the fourth ammendment and screw the little people. Has he hired Penn yet? Obama, my man, you have disappointed us. We who supported you all along. Feh. They are all the same.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:51 PM on 07/09/2008
- geobushono I'm a Fan of geobushono 15 fans permalink

As a supporter of Obama, let me remind you that he too, could have voted against it.
his schtick is getting very old and very fast......­........I'­m definitely not a fan of war cheerleader hillary, but Obama just might have to win without me.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:14 PM on 07/09/2008

HRC was never a cheerleader for the war. That is just partisan dis-information. Google her speech in the Senate before the vote. It WILL surprise you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:50 PM on 07/09/2008
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Obama knew the bill would pass too he decided to screw you and everyone else anyway!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:50 PM on 07/09/2008

HRC was a co-sponsor of Dodd's amendment to strike immunity. O was not. I have written her office several times over the last two weeks. She sent back statements that if the immunity was in the bill she would not support it. So she stuck to her word. This was not political, she had more to lose than gain by breaking from O on this.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:39 PM on 07/09/2008
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