Senate Passes FISA Bill, Gives Telecoms Immunity

Bowing to President Bush's demands, the Senate sent the White House a bill Wednesday overhauling bitterly disputed rules on secret government eavesdropping and shielding telecommunications companies from lawsuits complaining they helped the U.S. spy on Americans.

The relatively one-sided vote, 69-28, came only after a lengthy and heated debate that pitted privacy and civil liberties concerns against the desire to prevent terrorist attacks. It ended almost a year of wrangling over surveillance rules and the president's warrantless wiretapping program that was initiated after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

The House passed the same bill last month, and Bush said he would sign it soon.

Opponents assailed the eavesdropping program, asserting that it imperiled citizens' rights of privacy from government intrusion. But Bush said the legislation protects those rights as well as Americans' security.

"This bill will help our intelligence professionals learn who the terrorists are talking to, what they're saying and what they're planing," he said in a brief White House appearance after the Senate vote.

* * * * * *

The LA Times reported in late June that only 23 percent of registered voters approved of the job the President is doing:

Seven months before the end of his term, President Bush's approval rating is at an all-time low.

In the just-released Los Angeles Times/Bloomberg Poll, the president won approval from 23% of all registered voters -- including 3% of Democrats and 58% of Republicans. Those numbers are down from February, when he had an approval rating of 35%. His high mark, according to the poll, was in November 2001, just after the 9/11 terror attacks, when the president's popularity rating among registered voters was at 85%.

* * * * * *

Sen. Barack Obama voted for the compromise while Sen. Hillary Clinton voted against it.

Watch a video about the money trail surrounding the bill from the American News Project. Read more about the bill here.

Comments

[laffingbear]

Instead of us leaving this country lets pack up all of Washington and put them on slow boats to China. They could be greeted as liberators there.

[Kalima]

Please don't do that. They would just send them over to Japan, because you have
bases here and we don't want them, we have enough people here. We can't feed
them an 18 course lunch and dinner every night. Sorry.

[itsafreakingame]

I never supported Obama I was a Hillary supporter, but I was willing to get on board with Obama until now. The democrats think that we don't have a choice and Obama will get elected no matter what they do. Who knows maybe their right. Obama promise of change has come true he has changed into a republican and this sickens me. I won't help Obama get elected I will however do everything I can to make sure he isn‘t elected President. My contributions will go to the ACLU from now on, and to senators like Dodd, who really did filibuster the first time the telecommunications immunity was up for a vote. Obama who promised to filibuster must A. Didn’t know what filibuster means or B. Said screw the American peoples rights to freedom, either way I don’t want this liar becoming President of anything!

[ThunderclapNewman]

First, they lacked the votes to sustain a filibuster, so there was no point in trying it.

Second, the McFlipFlop campaign would like to thank you for your weak-willed and shallow support for the Democrats.

McAncient is looking forward to having you help him continue the Booosh policies for another four years.

[uhappytoo]

And many thought George Washington lacked the men and arms to defeat the British. So why try?

Many thought the Webb GI Bill would be defeated with another Republican filibuster. So why try?

Many believed that Barack Obama would represent a change from politics as usual. So why bother with him now that he's shown he can't be trusted?

[ouroborous]

Yes, of course. Why bother to do ANYTHING unless you're guaranteed success?

Thank god our Founding Fathers were not like you.

Some things are worth fighting for, even if you know you'll lose. How hard is that to understand?

[itsafreakingame]

Apparently Thunderclap your ill informed the democrats are the weak-willed. The democrats have cried that they couldn’t do anything because they didn’t have enough to control the House or Senate now they outnumber the republicans and they all are still unzipping G. Bush’s pants while on bended knees doing his bidding. Since you so avidly support those democrats I suggest you get your knee pads on! Obama flipped on more then just the FISA bill he supports NAFTA, conditions on abortion, wait and see on Iraq, and lets use tax dollars for faith based crap, so how is he anything better? Obama is a republican he is just running on the democratic ticket!

[Indyfromny]

Can anyone explain to me why Obama voted for this Bill?

[buckygreen]

Cowardice and perceived political expediency.

[Indyfromny]

You mean, In case were attacked he wont be held responsible by the Republicans?

Not good enough.

[Kalima]

The poster boy for the O campaign. Now after reading your posts here, I
really can't believe you ever were. Nobody turns into a snake this quickly.
Enjoy your bashing, I think that is the reason you came here in the first
place. Good luck. I thought it was strange, when you offered a link, where
people could ask for a refund of campaign contributions. The only
coward here, is you.

[Independent voter]

Please post the link for getting a refund. I can't seem to get a human on the phone at campaign HQ

[Austintatious]

Buckygreen is right, of course. There can be no other answer. Why else would he do it?

Obama is a scholar and practitioner of constitutional law. He has already shared his awareness of the criminal activity committed by the Administration and the potential for cover-up and other harm with this kind of legislation.

Compromise is often necessary and even acceptable, in politics; however there are times when the principle involved is too important to be compromised. The principles involved in the FISA matter are among them, as so well stated by those voting against the legislation. Interestingly, Obama gave Senator Clinton the opportunity to get it right, even as he was selling out the American people.

Obama's performance, here, is nothing short of cowardly, abandoning the most important of principles for perceived political expediency, as buckygreen has so succinctly and correctly told us. Obama demonstrates weakness and poor judgment and, ironically, it may be playing right into the hands of the Republicans.

[ThunderclapNewman]

Because he's the Democratic nominee.
Had he voted against it, the Repubs would have had a field day portraying him as "soft on terrorism" and it could have significantly hurt his chances.

The bill is awful overall, but there are a couple of good provisions in it.

[Indyfromny]

I understand that. I'm just having a really hard time swallowing it.
I gave money to Obama just last week, now I'm regretting that I did.

[buckygreen]

So in order to inoculate himself from repug "soft on terrorism" attacks - which will undoubtedly occur regardless - 0bama has chosen to go "soft on the Constitution", in the process destroying his credibility and alienating tens of thousands of his supporters.

[RnR]

If he made it clear he was fighting the immunity he'd have won in a landslide. And his advisers should have known that.

[Lemeritus]

"Had he voted against it, the Repubs would have had a field day portraying him as "soft on terrorism" and it could have significantly hurt his chances."

I can't help thinking that's as empty an excuse as I've ever heard (with all due respect to your normally steady-on opinions). Obama will be portrayed as "soft of terrorism" -- that's what the Republicans do (and, to our endless amazement, Americans continue to credit this slander from a party that was asleep at the switch on 9/11 and plunged us into a hideous foreign quagmire). In addition, he will now be painted as spineless -- not only by the Right, but also by some members of his own party.

[Canaris]

So instead, they portray him as a flip-flopper, the same charge that torpedoed John Kerry in 2004.

Trying to preemptively defuse Republican attacks is a zero-sum game. Republicans will ALWAYS find something to attack democrats on, and if they can't find something, they'll make something up. Havn't you been paying attention for the last twenty years? Fear of Republican attacks is the WORST possible reason for choosing to vote yea or nay on anything. They are going to attack anyway. Obama has sold out his stated principles, alienated a significant portion of his base, gone back on his word, and helped pass a horrible bill for NOTHING.

[olivia]

He has to win the presidency before he can achieve anything much. He is taking away the GOP's ammunition. You know what they would have made of a different vote.

I don't like it either but it's pragmatic.

I still think he's playing Trojan Horse.

And I think the ACLU will help us.

[uhappytoo]

Besides being a morally bankrupt argument--the end justifies any means--what good comes from throwing out 3 supporters for every 2 he MIGHT gain from this vote?

[Independent voter]

Obama did not have the courage to stand up for the American people. This man is not willing to fight for principle. Plain and simple. End of story.

Many will whimper that Obama is just doing what he needs to do in order to get elected - but this is exactly what Obama accused Clinton of months ago "She'll say or do anything to get elected"

But at least we learned something:

Refining my position = bend over and spread 'em for Bush

[AKJM]

"....anything to get elected." Very good point.

[rkrenke]

He was afraid that the GOP would pick on him. Apparently, he doesn't understand how to frame and debate an argument, which is why the Dems lose most of them.

[jaygatsby]

192 days and a wake up. When the smoke clears, the Bush/Cheney cabal will have done more to harm this country than any other administration in my lifetime - and I'm old. Time wounds all heels.

[stargazer13]

THE ONLY THING THAT PROTECTS ME AS AN AMERICAN IS MY CONSTITUTION AND MY BILL OF RIGHTS

Do YOU SWEAR TO UP HOLD AND DEFEND I GUESS THAT HAS BEEN ANSWERED there is no rule of law by hook or by crook and no redress for Americans in the courts spying started right after Bush took office and 911 still happened get real people we have all been sold down the flooding rivers

for every action there will be a reaction I am very disappointed in my countries leaders and vote no confidence

BAD FORM BAD FORM

[Changeling]

As you should see now, the Constitution does NOT protect your rights.

It hasn't

It doesn't

It never did.

It never will.

The only thing it EVER did was enumerate them.

It's up to the men and women in government to ADHERE to them. It's only through their strength and character and belief in the document that you have ANY rights.

Look at the FISA bill. Some of your rights are now, simply....gone. Rights I firmly believe the Consitution meant you to have, but it didn't protect you, did it? It didn't say "No, this is wrong. This isn't right for the people."

Only the people who voted against it did.

Sadly, they weren't enough.

It's the people, not the paper.

[stargazer13]

yes you are right it is the people who believe in the paper so I guess not so many left who believe .

[Lemeritus]

Well said.

[ThunderclapNewman]

Exactly which rights has the FISA bill taken away?

Please be very specific.

[ouroborous]

We, the people, are what protects you.

We, the people, acting to preserve our OWN self-interest, are what can uphold the constitution as one of the finest formative documents ever produced -- if we, the people, are willing to make the sacrifices necessary to defend it.

We, the people, now know that we can no longer rely on our elected officials -- even Democrats... even the mighty Obama -- to defend it for us. They will only defend their own interests. Not ours.

So we, the people, have to re-learn how to fight for our own interests. I suggest starting with money. Anything you can spare, send it to truly progressive and Constitution-defending groups, PAC's, and elected officials. Turn off the spigot for the bad guys (the Republicans, the DNP, Obama) and turn it on, as hard as you can for the good guys (ActBlue, AccountabilityNow, the ACLU, the EFF...).

We'll see if that wakes them up.

[FOXYLADY]

WOW, ANOTHER "BIG BROTHER" ISSUE..................WHAT HAPPENED TO OUR FREEDOMS? CAN WE NOW BE CENSORED EACH TIME WE SPEAK ON THE PHONE, POST ON THE WEB? IS "BIG BROTHER" WATCHING OUR EVERY MOVE? THIS ISN'T THE COUNTRY I GREW UP IN A LONG TIME AGO.....................

[ChristianEcon.com]

"THIS ISN'T THE COUNTRY I GREW UP IN A LONG TIME AGO.... "

7 1/2 years ago wasn't that long ago.

What's even more incredible to me than the level and depth of the onset of fascism is the speed with which Neocon ideology has been able to carry it out.

[Levittown]

The FISA court is under the control of Chief Justice Roberts. He should have questioned the court when Judge Robertson resigned because of the lack of oversight on the warrants. There is a concentrated lack of judicial accountability in the Justice Department and with the Supreme Court Justices who show a very right leaning in their selection of problems to be dealt with.

When the Nuremburg trial had ended The Chief Justice of the German Supreme Court apologized to Chief Justice Jackson, the American jurist., that the Court had no idea the Hitler Germany would be so corrupt and deadly for Germany and Europe. Justice Jackson re[lied " you knew it the first time you knowingly sent an innocent man to his death ".

[Marlyn]

"The FISA court is under the control of Chief Justice Roberts."

Oh, now I feel comforted.

[rjean]

thought backtrack was AGAINST IT

[TocinoHumano]

He was against it before he was for it.

[ThunderclapNewman]

He's against the telecom immunity.

The bill has a couple of good sections, and it does re-affirm the primacy of the FISA court when wiretapping is going to happen.

The Boooshies have been spying without warrants or oversight for the last 11 months.
The bill stops that.

[deadbolt]

It does not it actually expands it.

[uhappytoo]

Are you deliberately offering this misinformation? Or are you simply ignorant about what the new bill does?

Last week a federal judge affirmed the existing FISA law. There is NOTHING in the new bill that offers any more protection than already exists in the old law. But it does expand the government's ability to spy. It extended from 3 days to 7 days for the government to ask for a warrant--after spying has begun. And then the FISA court has another 30 days to consider the request, and in some cases that period can be extended. Meanwhile the government is collecting information that quite possibly will be ruled illegally obtained.

Do you think the government will simply forget everything it learned from such an illegal tap?

[ouroborous]

He just wasn't against it enough to vote against the bill, or to be true to his word and filibuster.

He just thought that "national security was more important than going after the telecoms" (despite knowing full well that the target wasn't the telecoms; it was uncovering the truth).

He was against it until he was for it.

[NoBo08]

backtrack.... that's a good one.

[eden4barack08]

Part II

Now, endure that abuse, for 6 YEARS, before your constituents finally start seeing the light and in 2006 vote a Dem majority in. From the start of the 110th Congress in Jan 2007, 'till now, that's 1&half year of PTSD. So many post-Bush problems to fix and at the same time prepare for presidential election.
I'm not excusing Dem leadership, just maybe it's that Stockholm syndrome, making it hard to bounce back quick after such long submission. We all know how ruthless the Bushies are in getting "their way or the highway" even when they're unpopular, and Bush is anything but a lame duck, even at 28% and 4 months to go!

IMO they were weak to begin with, but certainly this atrocious prolonged abuse, has rendered them even more spineless.
My suggestions? #1) We elect OBAMA for President in November! #2) We send those who still can't bounce back from PTSD even after a Dem Pres, on a looong therapeutic vacation. #3) We keep the good ones. Duh! #4) We elect ALL fresh blood and start with a clean slate.

There, that's all!

[ouroborous]

"My suggestions? #1) We elect OBAMA for President in November!"

Yeah! Let's punish them by electing one of the guys who voted this absolute horrorshow of a law into place, as President!

That'll show 'em!

I actually agree with 3 & 4, but if you start with an uncritical support of Obama, it kinda flushes the value of the rest of it down the toilet.

How about this: let's apply pressure to Obama to quit with the empty speechifying and WALK THE DAMNED WALK. IF... and only IF... he shows some sustained ability to be more than just hot air and soaring rhetoric... we might actually show up at the polls to vote for him.

[picodegallo54]

the government no longer represents the people. we've known that for some time, now, but this is like getting knifed in the back. this is a sad statement of what this nation has become. democrats, republicans, they are all taking money from the same task masters. my hat goes off to those who had the spine to vote against the bill. democracy is dead in this country.

[azyuwish]

Dear (former) United States of America,

I want a divorce.

You've gone insane and refuse to get help. You are deaf to my pleas and the pleas of the rest of the family. I can no longer be co-dependent with you. I'm just enabling you, simply by being around you and paying my taxes.

It's over.

Buh bye.....

[kjdwyer]

I hear you (out here in the world outside the U.S.)

Come into the light; all are welcome, all are welcome.

[olivia]

The worse things get, the less possible it becomes to move elsewhere.

People in other countries despise Americans.

The dollar is not worth spit around the world.

I believe I am stuck here, where my government has been irreparably changed. 8 years of Democrats is not enough to fix it.

[alainv]

Am I being censored again? Am I on a list? could you please tell my so I can stop wasting my time.

[azyuwish]

I read your original post. Probably scrubbed b/c you said "eff".

Tedious, I know, but there it is. I read your subsequent posts however. See below.

[FirstShirt]

I think you are wasting your time but you are on the blog.

[olivia]

That's too bad because your posts that made it are very much worth reading.

The moderation on here sucks.

[eahce]

Obama is a wolf in sheeps clothing, just another neocon.

[olivia]

Do you always exaggerate this much?

[ThunderclapNewman]

You continue to post lies, and you do it with ease.

[CC1]

More like an uncomfortable truth.

[Unobtainium]

Obama dropped the ball on this one.
Whith a "no vote" he shows he is not willing to defend the constution, the primary job of the president.

He has shown he is just another spineless corporate tool.

[ThunderclapNewman]

What hyperbolic bullsh*t.

[Nonamnesiac]

Hillary voted right on FISA, Obama voted wrong and lied about it -- just another two-bit executive power thug. I'm not a Hillary supporter, as she, like Obama, is a warmongerer.

But, it may be in the interests of progressives to revisit this whole thing. Obama, now that he thinks he has won the nomination, just gives those who won him the nomination the finger -- believing we have no other choice anyway.

Screw him. He didn't win by much, and the Convention can still change things. War change, FISA change, telecom immunity change and God in politics change all in two weeks -- change none of us believe in --?

Maybe Hillary would be better. She's also farther ahead of McCain in the polls than Obama.

[ThunderclapNewman]

She isn't going to be the candidate.
Ever.

And the polls do not include her, so she cannot be ahead of anyone, since she isn't included in those polls.

Lie much?

[TheLastProphet]

oo snap

[Kalima]

I feel for you Tc, I really do. Everyone woke up this morning, had their
coffee or tea, did what they do every morning when they wake up, I
should think. When you are being beaten in the streets for voting for
the opposition, when you are thrown in jail for years for dissent, when
they hang your son for being gay, then maybe I will believe as some here
that America is going to the dogs. Until then, thank your lucky stars and don't
waste your vote if you want a better future for your country.

[LongBeachDave]

Well, perhaps...but many of us who cheered wildly when he uttered the words "because of you, I can stand here tonight and say that I will be the Democratic nominee for the President of the United States," and got chills up and down our spines are feeling chills of a different type today. The enthusiam and anticipation of a new day---gone. In its place, the awful realization that so many things are just going to be the same on January 20th as they were on January 19th....very sad, when what we were looking for was something different and fresh.

[Nonamnesiac]

Thunder, you get the story half right. The last polls done putting Hillary up against McCain found she did better against McCain than your hero --Obama. Progressives have leverage over Obama now, through Hillary. If progessives just let Obama get away with this wholesale move to the right -- delude themselves into buying his lying that he has not changed -- McCain will win. True progressives, those who scoff at two-bit Nader-baiting, "good German", Democratic Party sycophants, will vote massively for Cynthia McKinney or Nader, despite being screamed at by those "Good German" sycophants.. Obama is already starting to look like the equal of the evils. If he's not about change, then people will opt for the candidate they view to be most experienced -- and, according to the polls, that candidate is McCain.

Let's tell Obama you either support Immediate, safe withdrawal of all US troops and contactors from Iraq, you oppose "faith-based" initiatives, and you admit voting wrong on FISA or we'll revisit Hillary's candidacy prior to the Convention. And as for money --- hahaha.

Before the honest ones of you reflexively react against this, remember he's shown where he's at, and this is the only effective way to use our leverage.

[olivia]

H would have voted differently if she were running for president.

They are hardly in the same position.

[Oldtt]

Think back to the MoveOn ad mocking General Petraeus, Hillary voted against the Senate resolution condemning it, while Barack failed to vote. Who was covering their bases for the GE? See a pattern?

[alainv]

Let me say it again. The spying started the day these traitors stole the first election not as a response to 911 as the article suggests. Wake up people we no longer live in a free society. If hillary was the presumptive nominee she would have taken the same position as Barack. The fix is in and we are all boned. We should not let them get away with continuing to spread the falsehood that the illegal eavesdropping came after 911. It is well documented that this was started long before that.

[Bjarni]

Bill Clinton's Eavesdropping program was Called "Echelon"
'If you made a phone call today or sent an e—mail to a friend, there's a good chance what you said or wrote was captured and screened by the country's largest intelligence agency.' (Steve Kroft, CBS' 60 Minutes)
Those words were aired on February 27, 2000 to describe the National Security Agency and an electronic surveillance program called Echelon whose mission, according to Kroft,
'is to eavesdrop on enemies of the state: foreign countries, terrorist groups and drug cartels. But in the process, Echelon's computers capture virtually every electronic conversation around the world.'

[azyuwish]

alainv,

I think you ARE being censored for writing the "eff" word, but not before I had a chance to read your original comment, which was great btw.

Also, you are NOT nuts to question the events and explanation for 9/11. Last week, i had lunch with a girlfriend whose husband is an engineer who for many years worked for a defense contractor. He now works in bio-med technology. Their daughter is a Civil Engineer. I asked my friend how her husband and daughter view 9/11 and she immediately said (in hushed tone) that they both say NO WAY the airplanes could have caused the towers to collapse. Had to have been plastic explosives. Had to have been an inside job. The pent-a-gon was a total set-up too, they say. She told me that privately they hold these views but tell no one, lest they be seen as whack jobs, unpatriotic, conspiracy theory nuts etc.

I wonder how many other engineers and pilots etc. secretly KNOW the truth in their hearts but are also, keeping quiet.

[Bjarni]

http://www.ae911truth.org/
Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth

[FirstShirt]

J. Edgar Hoover was doing during the Kennedy administration. Think Bobby didn't do it against the communists and the Teamsters and the Mob? Where have you "progressives" been?

[hugs4u]

Obama's Yes vote for the Fisa blll, cost him my contributions to him.

[ThunderclapNewman]

Does your face like being without its nose?

[USAisEVIL]

Does your head like being without its brain?

[CC1]

Wow. How mature can you get? Go back to preschool.