CERN's 17-Mile-Long Atom Smasher To Re-Enact 'Big Bang'

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ALEXANDER G. HIGGINS | September 7, 2008 02:52 PM EST | AP

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This undated photo provided by CERN on Friday, Sept. 5, 2008 shows a view into the Grid PC farm at the CERN Computer Centre, where banks of computers process and store data produced on the CERN systems. When the LHC starts operation in September 2008, it will produce enough data every year to fill a stack of CDs 20 km tall. To handle this huge amount of data, CERN has also developed the Grid, allowing processing power to be shared between computer centres around the world. (AP Photo/CERN) ** MANDATORY CREDIT: CERN * NO SALES *

GENEVA — It has been called an Alice in Wonderland investigation into the makeup of the universe _ or dangerous tampering with nature that could spell doomsday.

Whatever the case, the most powerful atom-smasher ever built comes online Wednesday, eagerly anticipated by scientists worldwide who have awaited this moment for two decades.

The multibillion-dollar Large Hadron Collider will explore the tiniest particles and come ever closer to re-enacting the big bang, the theory that a colossal explosion created the universe.

The machine at CERN, the European Organization for Nuclear Research, promises scientists a closer look at the makeup of matter, filling in gaps in knowledge or possibly reshaping theories.

The first beams of protons will be fired around the 17-mile tunnel to test the controlling strength of the world's largest superconducting magnets. It will still be about a month before beams traveling in opposite directions are brought together in collisions that some skeptics fear could create micro "black holes" and endanger the planet.

The project has attracted researchers of 80 nationalities, some 1,200 of them from the United States, which contributed $531 million of the project's price tag of nearly $4 billion.

"This only happens once a generation," said Katie Yurkewicz, spokeswoman for the U.S. contingent at the CERN project. "People are certainly very excited."

The collider at Fermilab outside Chicago could beat CERN to some discoveries, but the Geneva equipment, generating seven times more energy than Fermilab, will give it big advantages.

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The CERN collider is designed to push the proton beam close to the speed of light, whizzing 11,000 times a second around the tunnel 150 to 500 feet under the bucolic countryside on the French-Swiss border.

Once the beam is successfully fired counterclockwise, a clockwise test will follow. Then the scientists will aim the beams at each other so that protons collide, shattering into fragments and releasing energy under the gaze of detectors filling cathedral-sized caverns at points along the tunnel.

CERN dismisses the risk of micro black holes, subatomic versions of collapsed stars whose gravity is so strong they can suck in planets and other stars.

But the skeptics have filed suit in U.S. District Court in Hawaii and in the European Court of Human Rights to stop the project. They unsuccessfully mounted a similar action in 1999 to block the Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider at the Brookhaven National Laboratory in New York state.

CERN's collider has been under construction since 2003, financed mostly by its 20 European member states. The United States and Japan are major contributors with observer status in CERN.

Scientists started colliding subatomic particles decades ago. As the machines grew more powerful, the experiments revealed that protons and neutrons _ previously thought to be the smallest components of an atom _ were made of still smaller quarks and gluons.

CERN hopes to recreate conditions in the laboratory a split-second after the big bang, teaching them more about "dark matter," antimatter and possibly hidden dimensions of space and time.

Meanwhile, scientists have found innovative ways to explain the concept in layman's terms.

The team working on one of the four major installations in the tunnel _ the ALICE, or "A Large Ion Collider Experiment" _ produced a comic book featuring Carlo the physicist and a girl called Alice to explain the machine's investigation of matter a split second after the Big Bang.

"We create mini Big Bangs by bumping two nuclei into each other," Carlo explains to Alice, who has just followed a rabbit down one of the hole-like shafts at CERN.

"This releases an enormous amount of energy that liberates thousands of quarks and gluons normally imprisoned inside the nucleus. Quarks and gluons then form a kind of thick soup that we call the quark-gluon plasma."

The soup cools quickly and the quarks and gluons stick together to form protons and neutrons, the building blocks of matter.

That will enable scientists to look for still missing pieces to the puzzle _ or lead to the formulation of a new theory on the makeup of matter.

Kate McAlpine, 23, a Michigan State University graduate at CERN, has produced the Large Hadron Rap, a video clip that has attracted more than a million views on YouTube.

"The things that it discovers will rock you in the head," McAlpine raps as she dances in the tunnel and caverns.

CERN spokesman James Gillies said the lyrics are "absolutely scientifically spot on."

"It's quite brilliant," Gillies said.

___

On the Net:

CERN: http://www.cern.ch

Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory: http://www.fnal.gov

The U.S. at the LHC: http://www.uslhc.us/

Large Hadron Rap: http://www.youtube.com/watch?vf6aU-wFSqt0

GENEVA — It has been called an Alice in Wonderland investigation into the makeup of the universe _ or dangerous tampering with nature that could spell doomsday. Whatever the case, the most powe...
GENEVA — It has been called an Alice in Wonderland investigation into the makeup of the universe _ or dangerous tampering with nature that could spell doomsday. Whatever the case, the most powe...
 
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If it doesn't work out, are they gonna sell it on Ebay?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:35 PM on 09/10/2008

Well it might recreate the Big Bang in miniature. We will still not know if the Big Bang actually happened or not will we?

http://greenteeth.blog.co.uk/2008/09/08/it-s-not-the-end-of-the-world-or-is-it-4699450

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:39 PM on 09/09/2008
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That's precisely the point, Ian. It CANNOT recreate the "Big Bang"--in ANY size--because the "Big Bang" exists only as a science fiction that violates one of the cardinal rules of physics: no something from nothing. Given what I--and MANY other eminent researchers--believe is the true nature of the Universe, we may NEVER know how old it is, how it began, or how it (perhaps) will end.

When will we stop basically hitting things with bigger and bigger rocks? When will we evolve beyond our current percussive and mechanistic model of the Universe? When will we realize that the same Laws of Nature apply in all locations?

"Mainstream science, for the most part, looks on the universe as electrically neutral and purely mechanical; a place where the weak force of gravity holds fort. Plasma Cosmology, by contrast, acknowledges the electrodynamic nature of the universe. Gravity and inertia are NOT the only forces at work.
[...]
"It is important to understand that gravity based models were codified before space travel and high powered telescopes. Back then our galaxy, The Milky Way, was considered the entirety of the universe ... and electrically sterile! Instead of trying to shoehorn what we now see into old models, Plasma Cosmology respects the progress of the past, but is not constrained by it. Scientific theories, by definition, are vulnerable to being falsified. Science moves on."
http://www.plasmacosmology.net/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:31 PM on 09/09/2008

A waste of money if you ask me.

So what if they are successful in creating " the big bang ".

I can't wait till the movie comes out!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:01 AM on 09/09/2008
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Who's asking ya?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:04 PM on 09/09/2008
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I'm thinking that one would have to provide enough energy to break the bond of the gluons in quark pairs,and LHC does not even come close to providing a collision at that rate. To say nothing of the critical mass that is most probably necessary? (A reaction, A tendency to revert to a former state)

So, not to worry.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:12 PM on 09/08/2008
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I'm pretty sure that the goal is to produce, briefly, by collision, what is called a 'quark-gluon'
soup. That's pretty much the point of the exercise. How dangerous is that? A panel of highly
educated physicists, mostly all employed by CERN, insist that the risks are slight.

The logic is that cosmic-ray collisions, of energies that surpass even those of the LHC,
have been going on naturally for millions of years, with no catastrophic effect. Since we're
*still* here, right? The only real difference is that now there will be a lot of them over a
small time period, which makes observation much more convenient & effective. What
difference could that make?

You can worry, at least a little bit.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:14 PM on 09/09/2008
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Doofus, Thanks for the link. My point exactly was that in the quark-gluon soup the quark pairs remain together by the gluon bond, one would need an energy level well over 10 to the 20th power in order to even start to worry at all, and even at that higher level of energy it is still most likely not enough. It sure is going to be interesting as to what knowledge we will gain by the exxperiments. You can worry a wee bit for me, I'm quite comfortable at this point in time.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:30 AM on 09/11/2008
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Good article about this here... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24556999/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:47 PM on 09/09/2008

You do understand that this recreation of creation could blow us the hell up don't you?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:37 PM on 09/08/2008
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Jeeesh, How long to ya want to live anyway?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:39 PM on 09/08/2008

I just keep thinking about the "Chaos Theory".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:16 PM on 09/08/2008

Instead of all this nonsensical commentary and name calling, you guys ought to look at the scientific basis of the legitimate concerns. Links to the discussion can be found at:

http://www.lhcfacts.org/

Especially look at Otto Roessler's (Rossler) papers.

I believe it was Feynman who once said that anyone who claims that they really understand quantum mechanics is misguided. It's not like this is truly well understood science. These experiments are being performed precisely because we don't have all the answers, and at least some of the arguments both pro and con regarding possible glitches are based on speculation, not fact.

Given the risks, the prudent course would be to be as careful as possible, but as nature abhors a vacuum, sadly the human race seems to abhor caution.

As an aside, a science fiction story published by Robert Heinlein in 1940 called "Blow-Ups Happen" has a remarkably similar story line to what is actually happening with the LHC.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:01 PM on 09/08/2008
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Wow the American flat earth society is alive and well.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:01 PM on 09/08/2008

Sorry, guys--the LHC has been up and running for a month or more. They'll have the official launching, but that's for the politicians. Maybe they'll invite Sarah Palin... No, no--now we're back to sick jokes!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:44 PM on 09/08/2008
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There is no danger of the Earth being swallowed up by a "black hole"--mini or otherwise--because "black holes" do not exist.

"By what means can a black hole interact with other matter?...First, the fundamental black hole (a so-called 'Schwarzschild' black hole) is allegedly obtained from a solution for Ric = Rij = 0 (subscripts i,j = 0,1,2,3), which is a space-time that, by definition, contains no matter. So the alleged black hole can interact with nothing because its associated space-time is empty by definition --it precludes the presence of any matter by virtue of Ric = 0. So there is no matter outside the black hole by initial hypothesis."
http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblogs/guest1.htm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:40 PM on 09/08/2008
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Oh, yeah, and as for "re-enacting the 'Big Bang,'" that's also gonna be pretty hard to do seeing as THAT likely never happened, either.

"According to the authors of the Chandra X-Ray Observatory website, the galactic cluster imaged above 'was formed after the collision of two large clusters of galaxies, the most energetic event known in the universe since the Big Bang.' Though the announcement by the Chandra team never uses the words 'theory,' 'hypothesis,' or 'interpretation,' its every sentence rests on a jumble of assumptions, from supposed galactic 'collisions' to wildly conjectural 'gravitational lensing,' all wrapped around the discredited notion that redshift is a reliable measure of velocity and distance. The capper is the announcement appearing in numerous scientific media that the image 'proves the existence of dark matter.'"
http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2006/arch06/060904bulletcluster.htm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:51 PM on 09/08/2008

Kindly provide peer reviewed sources for your assertion that redshift has been discredited as a reliable measure. No excuses or bluster will be accepted.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:44 PM on 09/08/2008
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Wow you must believe in creationism too.

The existence of black holes is not only predicted but they exist based on experimental observation.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:59 PM on 09/08/2008
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I am not a creationist. FAR from it!

"Predicted?" By whom? When? I suppose that they also "predicted" that they would find galactic jets as well?

One could argue that the flat-earthers are those who insist on chasing phantoms, and inventing new and exotic matter--which can, conveniently, NEVER be created or replicated here on Earth--to account for their new and exotic sci-fi ideas about the universe; ideas that come about mainly because most astrophysicists know nothing about the electrical behavior of (even 1%) ionized space plasmas. All they have is gravity; and, to a man whose only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:11 PM on 09/08/2008
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Also, NO ONE--EVER!--has actually SEEN a black hole. They're black, of course. Just like dark matter; too dark to see. But we "know" it's there because we THINK we see "evidence" of them. Of course, this "evidence" is really just an INTERPRETATION (based on an 18th century theory--before we could "see" in x-ray and infrared and radio). What if the ASSUMPTIONS upon which that antiquated "theory" is based are completely false?

"The astronomer Fred Hoyle once wrote of the herd mentality in his profession: 'The trouble with conformity is that the process has strong positive feedback. The baaing starts up at a volume low enough to permit stronger-minded animals to think for themselves without too much trouble. Progressively, however, we break down one-by-one, losing all power of sensible judgement, to the point where we can do nothing but add our own baaing to the uproar, which eventually rises to such monumental proportions that nothing remains for the flock except the butcher's shop.'"
http://www.holoscience.com/news.php?article=qwk0u6cc

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:33 PM on 09/08/2008

Maybe I am wrong but I think I read Black Holes eat matter,
they are virtually undetectable except for escaping radiation.
Oh well, maybe I am wrong. But why does anyone have to
prove the "big bang theory? So if nothing happens, does that
mean nothing happened when the universe began?
SiriusMrE, I just wonder if it's wise to say something could not
happen.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:31 PM on 09/08/2008
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deminmo, I would suggest that since "black holes" are a complete mathematical fiction created to make an equation balance, I feel pretty secure that we are in no danger from "black holes."

If complete adherence to Einstein's TSR and TGR is the sine qua non of being a serious scientist, then it must be pointed out that the whole idea of "black holes" violates both:

"On a much simpler level the black hole is inconsistent with the Theory of Relativity. The alleged singularity of the black hole is infinitely dense. Now Special Relativity forbids infinite density because infinite density implies that a material body can acquire the speed of light in vacuum (or equivalently that there is infinite energy), which violates the fundamental premise of Special Relativity. General Relativity, by definition, cannot violate Special Relativity, and so it too forbids infinite density. Thus, the Theory of Relativity forbids infinitely dense point-mass singularities and hence forbids black holes. Consequently, all alleged black hole phenomena are meaningless."
(see link above)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:36 AM on 09/09/2008

I'm moving to Alaska... I'll be safe there as it is the land of salvation!

LOL

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:29 PM on 09/08/2008

Would we we see Adam and Eve naked?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:01 PM on 09/08/2008
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Sounds more like the tower of Babel to me. Trying to reach the sky and find out what's behind it? Personally, I've always wondered what's there and why we're here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:19 PM on 09/08/2008

LOL

Back to your cave, cavegirlnext door. Before someone flicks on a lighter and you flip out.

And wahy are we here?- Why plastic of course.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:55 PM on 09/08/2008

I hope that all goes as planned. There is no wisdom in destroying the world to prove that the scientists "can reproduce the Big Bang"! This money should be spent on starving children! I am against giving the scientists such power over my children! May God protect the planet!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:18 PM on 09/08/2008

God protect the planet?

LOL yeah because he's done such a heckuva job doing it lately.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 PM on 09/08/2008
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Perhaps 8 years of Bush proves there is no God.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:47 PM on 09/08/2008

Fox will tell us this "black hole" is an Obama thing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:34 AM on 09/08/2008
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