Jewish "Modesty Patrols" Sow Fear In Israel

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AMY TEIBEL | October 4, 2008 09:45 AM EST | AP

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An ultra-Orthodox woman walks past a shop selling long-sleeve shirts and ankle-length skirts which women are required to wear according to Jewish law, in a religious neighborhood in Jerusalem, Sunday, Sept. 14, 2008. In Israel's ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, where the rule of law takes a back seat to the rule of God, religious zealots are on a crusade to stamp out unchaste behavior. They hurl stones at women for "sins" as trivial as wearing a red blouse, and attack stores that sell devices that can access the Internet. In recent weeks, modesty enforcers have been accused of breaking into the apartment of a Jerusalem woman and beating her because they suspected she consorted with men. They also torched a store that sells MP4 players, fearing devout Jews would use them to download pornography.(AP Photo/Sebastian Scheiner)

JERUSALEM — In Israel's ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, where the rule of law sometimes takes a back seat to the rule of God, zealots are on a campaign to stamp out behavior they consider unchaste. They hurl stones at women for such "sins" as wearing a red blouse, and attack stores selling devices that can access the Internet.

In recent weeks, self-styled "modesty patrols" have been accused of breaking into the apartment of a Jerusalem woman and beating her for allegedly consorting with men. They have torched a store that sells MP4 players, fearing devout Jews would use them to download pornography.

"These breaches of purity and modesty endanger our community," said 38-year-old Elchanan Blau, defending the bearded, black-robed zealots. "If it takes fire to get them to stop, then so be it."

Many ultra-Orthodox Jews are dismayed by the violence, but the enforcers often enjoy quiet approval from rabbis eager to protect their own reputations as guardians of the faith, community members say. And while some welcome anything that keeps secular culture out of their cloistered world, others feel terrorized, knowing that the mere perception of impropriety could ruin their lives.

"There are eyes and ears all over the place, very similar to what you hear about in countries like Iran," says Israeli-American novelist Naomi Ragen, an observant Jew who has chronicled the troubles that confront some women living in the ultra-Orthodox world.

The violence has already deepened the antagonism between the 600,000 haredim, or God-fearing, and the secular majority, which resents having religious rules dictated to them.

Religious vigilantes operate in a society that has granted their community influence well beyond its numbers _ partly out of a commitment to revive the great centers of Jewish scholarship destroyed in the Holocaust, but also because the Orthodox are perennial king-makers in Israeli coalition politics.

Thus public transport is grounded for the Jewish Sabbath each Saturday, and the rabbis control all Jewish marriage and divorce in Israel.

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In recent years, however, the haredim have eased up on their long campaign to impose their rules on secular areas, and nowadays many restaurants and suburban shopping centers are open on the Sabbath.

These days, most vigilante attacks take place in the zealots' own neighborhoods.

Israel police spokesman Micky Rosenfeld said the modesty police are not an organized phenomenon, just rogue enforcers carrying out isolated attacks. But Israel's Justice Ministry used the term "modesty patrols" in an indictment against a man accused of assaulting the Jerusalem woman.

The unidentified, 31-year-old woman had left the ultra-Orthodox fold after getting divorced, according to the indictment filed by the Jerusalem district attorney's office. The indictment said her assailant tried to get her to leave her apartment in a haredi neighborhood in Jerusalem by gagging, beating and threatening to kill her. He was paid $2,000 for the attack, it said.

A 17-year-old who moved to Israel from New York five years ago said she was hospitalized after being attacked with pepper spray by a crowd of men outraged that she was walking down a Jerusalem street with boys.

"They can burn in hell," said the girl, who would identify herself only as Rivka.

She lives in Beit Shemesh, a town outside Jerusalem where the vigilantism has been particularly violent. Zealots there have thrown rocks and spat at women, and set fire to trash bins to protest impiety. Walls of the neighborhood are plastered with signs exhorting women to dress modestly _ spelled out as closed-necked, long-sleeved blouses and long skirts.

The state, catering to religious sensitivities, subsidizes gender-segregated bus routes that service religious neighborhoods. Ragen and several other women challenged the practice in Israel's Supreme Court after an Orthodox Canadian woman in her 50s told police she was kicked, slapped, pushed to the floor and spat upon by men for refusing to move to the back of the bus.

Another Beit Shemesh girl, who asked to be identified only as Esther, said zealots threw rocks, cursed and spat at a friend for wearing a red blouse _ taboo because the color attracts attention.

Yitzhak Polack, a 50-year-old Jerusalem teacher, is one of those who deplore such behavior.

"They are stupid troublemakers who are bringing shame and disgrace on this holy community," he said.

But the rabbis are afraid to condemn them, says Yehuda Meshi-Zahav, another community member.

"They can't come out against zealots who champion modesty. Here and there they write against violence, but the militants ultimately set the tone," he said.

Stores are targeted too.

In August, a Jerusalem man was placed under house arrest on suspicion he set fire to a store in a haredi district of the city that sold MP4 players.

"It started about six months ago. They would come into the store, about 15 of them at a time, screaming, 'This store burns souls!' and they would throw merchandise on the floor and threaten customers," said 31-year-old Aaron Gold, a haredi worker at the Space electronic store.

One Friday night, just before the Sabbath was about to begin, "they smashed a window, doused the place with gasoline and lit a match," Gold said.

Now, a big sign behind the counter says, "All products sold in this store are under rabbinical supervision. By order of the rabbis, no MP4s are sold here."

Clothing stores that sell clothes regarded as provocative have been vandalized, and bleach thrown at merchandise.

Suspicion is all that's needed to spark an attack.

Girls have been expelled from school after being seen talking to boys, a punishment that ruins their marriage prospects.

"It could be very innocent; she could be talking to her brother," Ragen said. But once thrown out of school, "no one _ NO ONE _ will take you in," she added.

In one case, the violence reached the highest levels of haredi society.

Three years ago, a son of Israel's Sephardi chief rabbi, Shlomo Amar, was accused of kidnapping a 17-year-old boy, beating him at knifepoint and terrorizing him with snarling dogs because he had sought the attentions of the accused's unchaperoned sister.

The son was sentenced to two years and eight months in jail.

His sister married a different suitor the following year.

___

Associated Press Writer Ian Deitch contributed to this report.

JERUSALEM — In Israel's ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, where the rule of law sometimes takes a back seat to the rule of God, zealots are on a campaign to stamp out behavior they consider uncha...
JERUSALEM — In Israel's ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, where the rule of law sometimes takes a back seat to the rule of God, zealots are on a campaign to stamp out behavior they consider uncha...
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These are the people we give millions of tax dollars to every year. I saw someone say "Israel is going to behave like Iran?" My answer is, Iran isn't that crazy. No girl is being stoned in Iran for walking down the street with boys. You're thinking of our other close friend, Saudi Arabia who push little girls back into burning buildings for not wearing their scarfs.

Our "friends" are free to behave as they wish, knowing fulll well we will never say anything while our "enemies" try desperately to get us to notice them and take them seriously. I promise you this, as an American you will feel safer walking down a street in Tehran, than Saudi Arabia or Israel(or as I call it, Palestine). Especially if you're a woman.

Screw Israel. Free Palestine and let's end this. That's right. I, a sane American, am calling for the dissolution of the state of Israel. It's not their country. It's a chunk of land we gave them long after they had all left it. No more tax dollars to Israel. I will not have m money paying for this garbage.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:59 AM on 10/05/2008
- abdallac I'm a Fan of abdallac 9 fans permalink

Millions?? No babe, you mean BILLIONS every year - and that doesn't include the arsenal of state of the art weapons systems we supply them with.

Amazing that for a country founded on the ideal of the seperation of church and state that we wholly and blindly support a religious state called Israel with carte blanche.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:19 AM on 10/06/2008
- protagonia I'm a Fan of protagonia 80 fans permalink

Fundamentalism is the insane and profoundly ignorant branch of any given religion.

The broken ones who do not function correctly.

So easy to be led to e-v-i-l.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:57 AM on 10/05/2008

wow. kristallnacht comes to jerusalem. who woulda thought?...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:35 AM on 10/05/2008
- Whinger I'm a Fan of Whinger 48 fans permalink
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Israel's answer to the Taliban!

Adam & Eve went about in their birthday suits and God didn't seem to mind!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:35 AM on 10/05/2008
- jubo I'm a Fan of jubo 8 fans permalink
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Splendid.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:37 AM on 10/05/2008
- AlphaDoc I'm a Fan of AlphaDoc 13 fans permalink

Proving once again that religious fanatics are okay, as long as they are our "friends." Yikes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:26 AM on 10/05/2008
- MajorKong I'm a Fan of MajorKong 416 fans permalink
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This type of behavior sounds strangely familiar. Where else have I heard about this sort of thing going on? Hmmmmmmmm..........

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:12 AM on 10/05/2008
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Saudi Arabia, North Korea, Sudan, Kansas, and other places. Tell you where you don't hear about it at: IRAN!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:03 AM on 10/05/2008

You do, indeed, hear of it from Iran. Over the last several years, the wearing of western clothing has been more and more discouraged for women. Its now to the point where women are harassed on the street by government officials.
Semper fi

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:54 AM on 10/05/2008
- odoreida I'm a Fan of odoreida 5 fans permalink

I dunno. Where?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:15 AM on 10/05/2008
- gakabani I'm a Fan of gakabani 20 fans permalink
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Saudi Arabia may I say? Iran? Yemen? Egypt? Religious police is all over the Middle East, even Israel.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:20 AM on 10/05/2008
- Palemoon I'm a Fan of Palemoon 244 fans permalink
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I've been pondering something ever since I have seen it brought up in religious debates, and I would like to see if any theologians among the many posters here can answer it.

Someone tells me that the Bible requires men to cut their hair. That long hair on men is an abomination, sin or whatever.

If that's true, then why is every picture or painting I've ever seen of Jesus showing him with long hair and beard?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:02 AM on 10/05/2008
- Whinger I'm a Fan of Whinger 48 fans permalink
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Cor: 14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

Any painting of Jesus is the product of the artists imagination, and, most I have seen are a whiter shade of brown, to make accepting Christ more acceptable to racist tendancy perhaps?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:41 AM on 10/05/2008
- Palemoon I'm a Fan of Palemoon 244 fans permalink
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I can agree with that. It seems we create HIM in our image, lol, instead of the other way around.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:45 AM on 10/05/2008

That is a ridiculous statement in itself; if Nature didn't want men to have long hair, their follicles would work differently.

Bring back long hair!!!!! Damn, I miss the style of the '70s.

And, of course, if Jesus existed, he was not Caucasion looking. But as a child, I thought his images were gorgeous. Still think he looks cool.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:02 PM on 10/05/2008
- dct1999 I'm a Fan of dct1999 384 fans permalink
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Maybe because Jesus wasn't available to sit for the portraits.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:28 AM on 10/05/2008
- Dystopic I'm a Fan of Dystopic 20 fans permalink
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IF he was available, he probably looked like OBL

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:28 AM on 10/05/2008

when i was a teenager, my family was in israel at the wailing wall. my mother had her shoulders covered, but it was hot so she wore a short sleeved dress. she was YELLED at by the zealots and harassed. our israeli guide yelled right back and told the crazies that without tourist dollars and american tourists there probably wouldn't even BE a wailing wall any longer. the men backed off. but it was a scary interaction for our family. this was 1983. it sounds like things have gotten even worse.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:42 AM on 10/05/2008
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What's "modest" about throwing stones at people for living in the 21st century? (Oye!)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:41 AM on 10/05/2008
- Whinger I'm a Fan of Whinger 48 fans permalink
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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, that, I think, would be God!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:43 AM on 10/05/2008
- Donns I'm a Fan of Donns 9 fans permalink

This God thing seems to have created this mess. He, she or it therefore has the MOST sin. As I remember it this God thing was always killing someone. I firmly believe that it is one of the miracles that mankind has survived in spite of God and Religion, not because of it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:47 AM on 10/05/2008
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I have supported Israel in my thoughts and feelings in the conflict with the Palestinians for one reason and one reason only. It certainly is not because I feel that they are more right in their cause against the Palestinians. The very idea that there is a patch of land that is more holy than another is an insult to intelligence. The idea that there is some kind of a divine right any patch of dirt is ridiculous. The reason I have landed firmly on the side of Israel is because they have, at least until now, allowed women the freedom to own property, to marry or more importantly, to not marry as they choose, the freedom to pursue their interests, including sexuality, and they have not denied them an education. If the Israelis allow the aforementioned kind of insanity to fester and grow in their country there will be absolutely no reason for me to support them in thought, word or deed. In fact, if the Palestinians allowed their women freedom I would support them over the Israelis if the freedom they offered their women was greater. I don't suspect that will happen anytime soon. But Israel will lose my affection if this fanaticism does not stop.

One must become vulgar to oppose vulgarity. Immodesty does not harm anyone. However, fanatics have harmed many.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:22 AM on 10/05/2008
- driven989 I'm a Fan of driven989 9 fans permalink

So you support Israel's dispossession and displacement of the Arab indigenous population on grounds that you are a feminist?

Do you support International Law?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:48 AM on 10/05/2008
- hnealehcn I'm a Fan of hnealehcn 2 fans permalink

Excellent comment and reply.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:24 AM on 10/05/2008
- Wirehedd I'm a Fan of Wirehedd 3 fans permalink
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I have enraged many of my israeli relatives by not supporting the state of israel at all. The theft of a nation at the hands of few who would inflict worse on the people who's land they have stolen then that which was done to them is a heresy. The stolen nation of Palestine is where these animals live and I personally believe that with the US interference the area will get much worse before it ever gets better.

Would you, as a feminist, support the killing of Palestinian women and children at the hands of the IDF? I don't.

Do you believe in the wholesale subjugation and internment of thousands of people in areas without food, water, healthcare or even a hint of safety at the hands of the IDF? I don't.

The Palestinians have endured 60 years of "concentration camp" life at the hands of israel and they deserve far better. The removal of the 600,000 savages in this article would go a long way to make amends to the people of Palestine and allow the remaining Jewish population to be able to bring back the rightful occupants and start moving toward peaceful coexistence with the real owners of that land.

Right of return and nothing less. That will make for a decent START.

The israelis say that would be unacceptable. Too bad. It's not their country in the first place.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:15 AM on 10/05/2008

And yet this country supports it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:19 PM on 10/05/2008

I feel the same way. This is not the mandate of the religion I was taught, we're supposed to believe in justice and fairness to the stranger (let's just pretend in this instance that we're NOT the stranger for the sake of hyperbole)

I can't even find a temple, I'm on my own if I don't want to be shouted down.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:14 PM on 10/05/2008

If it hadn't been for the Naz*s, would Israel have been created? At the expense of the previous inhabitants? Didn't the Jews and the Palestinians all live together when life was more tribal? Did they hate each other then or is this all about territory? I'm asking because I don't know. Admittedly not knowing all the ins & outs of the situation, I have more empathy with the Palestinians. Their land or country was stolen and now they are walled off like a bad solution to mold.

Build bridges, not walls. (Listen up Washington.)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:17 PM on 10/05/2008
- nabrum I'm a Fan of nabrum 3 fans permalink

These people are no different than fundie muslim countries, like Saudi Arbia, Afghanistan, or the other countries in the ME. If the ME countries didn't have oil, no one would care if they nuked the whole area into glass. For all I care, let Israel and Iran duke it out and get it over with. Then the world can move on.

Years ago there was a SF novel where one of the tenets was that Jerusalem and surrounding areas were nuked and couldn't be accessed for a 1000 years because of radioactivity. The religious nuts on both sides couldn't claim anything as the "center" of their religion, and over eons, people actually began to get along.

The Talibangelicals (term "borrowed" from another post), whether in the ME, US, or wherever, just want control and power over everyone else. It's as simple as that. "God is on their side", what a crock.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:03 AM on 10/05/2008

I agree with some of what you say but I also know that

My friends who are agnostic = totally cool, mostly
My friends who are religious= split 50/50
My friends who are atheist = totally prothelytize (sp?) as much as what you call "talibangelicals"

Everyone needs to find space in their minds and hearts for other perspectives and experiences.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:31 AM on 10/05/2008
- Dogmanger I'm a Fan of Dogmanger 3 fans permalink
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We're all agnostic. Agnostocism is more than just not having decided. An agnostic is "a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable". Noone can claim to "know" that God exists. One can have "faith" that God exists but any "knowledge" is purely faith based and cannot be said to be known. As Kierkegaard said:" Faith begins where understanding ends." Some agnostics, however, are atheists also.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:00 AM on 10/05/2008

Funny, I've never heard an atheist proselytize. Just those brainwashed evangelicals who never stop and use every opening to tell others how to think, what to believe, and how to live their lives. Is all there in that ancient history book that was written or dictated by god. Yawn.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:51 AM on 10/05/2008
- Palemoon I'm a Fan of Palemoon 244 fans permalink
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Interesting and thought provoking post you make. By the way, what's the Sci Fi novel that you mention? Sounds intriguing. :)

And I can agree, that oil does factor into alot of what goes on. Well, oil and religion. There has been fighting over turf in the Middle East for more than 1,000 years at least. And it shows no signs of slowing down unfortunately. I guess that's the problem when you have the wrongly held belief that the world was populated from one tiny section of the planet. I'd sooner believe aliens brought us here, than to believe that stuff. And isn't it amazing, that all these first inhabits kept running into people who were already living in other areas of the planet? I think it's hilarious, that Columbus "discovers" America only to find out that there has been people already living there for eons. He no more discovered America than I discovered the moon. The only thing he ultimately discovered, was another society of people who could be easily expoited and brainwashed for his King and Queen.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:53 AM on 10/05/2008
- MalloMel I'm a Fan of MalloMel 100 fans permalink
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...and himself.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:44 AM on 10/05/2008
- hnealehcn I'm a Fan of hnealehcn 2 fans permalink

True...............

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:24 AM on 10/05/2008

And Then They Came For Me
The Poem
They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:48 AM on 10/05/2008
- SD leaker I'm a Fan of SD leaker 4 fans permalink

They came first for the Palestinians,

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:58 AM on 10/05/2008

I hear you- that line should be included-- if it were my poem, but maybe I would not include the line first.

and I would also include the line

"They came for the women" cause regardless of the race color or creed the women and children always get it the worst-- but everyone just seems to think that is par for the course.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:26 AM on 10/05/2008
- KarlaElisa I'm a Fan of KarlaElisa 20 fans permalink
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The Christian Right here in America is pretty much just as bad. They are solidly linked with the orthodox fundies in Israel and have a history of bombing abortion clinics, black churches, engaging in bigotry, racism and love old testament rules and war. Cause God is always on their side...or so they firmly believe.
Religion PERIOD is the problem.
Friggin Freaks.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:18 AM on 10/05/2008
- SD leaker I'm a Fan of SD leaker 4 fans permalink

Religion is the problem. No State should be based on one religion or one ethnic background. The US is turning a blind eye on just one country.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:00 AM on 10/05/2008
- hnealehcn I'm a Fan of hnealehcn 2 fans permalink

True..............

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:26 AM on 10/05/2008
- Dystopic I'm a Fan of Dystopic 20 fans permalink
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Name 1 successful state with a state sponsored religion.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:34 AM on 10/05/2008

If this article doesn't make the case for an absolute separation of church and state, then I don't know what does. Iran, Saudi Arabia, the Taliban (and I suspect our own Talibangelicals) are dictatorships, but Israel?????? They gotta straighten this stuff out OR if it continues and grows risk losing the support of the American people. The stakes are big time.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:07 AM on 10/05/2008
- SD leaker I'm a Fan of SD leaker 4 fans permalink

Of all countries you mentioned, just one is based on ethnic cleansing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:02 AM on 10/05/2008
- Palemoon I'm a Fan of Palemoon 244 fans permalink
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LOL, took me a moment to realize what you were talking about. But I see it. And you are right. But nobody will ever admit to it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:56 AM on 10/05/2008

As disturbing as this report is, what's equally disturbing are the comments equating this behavior with all Israelis. The mainstream of Israel is secular. Most of the government is also secular. Israel is not a theocracy. People are fighting the good fight against this type of extreme religion, but it's not as widely reported. There are even Israelis fighting for peace and justice with the Palestinians. We have relgious fundamentalists in America too, quite a lot if I recall. There are hate crimes committed here in the name of religion. No one would confuse those crimes with the mainstream of this country. We have gay-hating, racist and despicable people in our government. Before everyone points fingers and judges others, put our country up to the same standards. This hate that rears its ugly head online whenever Israel gets mentioned does not sound like tolerance and lack of prejudice to me, so before you generalize in your comments, take a moment and think...do the Jerry Fallwells and Pat Robertsons of this country speak for me? Then, you can perhaps criticize and condemn the modesty patrols and only them, not an entire country or faith.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:54 AM on 10/05/2008

Couldn't the same thing be said about Iran?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:46 AM on 10/05/2008

i posted that these guys are acting the same way as the taliban did when they started, the religious police in saudi arabia acted when they started, as well as in egypt and iran. unfortunately, this was unacceptable for someone who was unable to come to terms with their own culture's fundamentalist-inspired violence and they reported my comment as flagged.

so, i will keep posting it.

these guys are acting no different than the taliban or the religious police in egypt, iran, or saudi arabia.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:56 AM on 10/05/2008

Absolutely. I've always seen it that way.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:58 AM on 10/05/2008

There are moderate elements in Iran. I couldn't speak to whether they are the mainstream of society or government. The only point above I know for certain that couldn't be applied to Iran is that Iran is strictly not a theocracy, since the ultimate power rests with the Ayatollah.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:38 AM on 10/05/2008
- Gripen I'm a Fan of Gripen 14 fans permalink
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Most iranians i have met is decent hardworking ppl, very polite and nice. In general i say i like them.

But it learned me one thing, never judge a ppl for its goverment or country, my impression is most iranians are just as you and me, but they got tyrants to rule them and there problem is that they havent any elections so they replace the tyrants with decent ppl.

I heard alot of americans think europeans and other ppl in the world hate them, the truth is most europeans i know and i am a european my self like americans but we dislike your goverment, heck many of us dislike our own goverment also so dont take it personaly.

But we have the privilage that we can vote them out.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:27 AM on 10/05/2008

And IRAQ before the American Invasion.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:48 PM on 10/05/2008
- Wirehedd I'm a Fan of Wirehedd 3 fans permalink
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If they were "fighting the good fight" they wouldn't allow these imbeciles authority over anything and would pass and ENFORCE laws making the behaviour of these zealots criminal and punishable in EVERY case.

Not just the episode where it is so severe as to make international news.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:23 AM on 10/05/2008
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