New GDP Numbers Strongest Signal Yet The Country Has "Hurtled Into Recession"

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JEANNINE AVERSA | October 30, 2008 11:55 PM EST | AP

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Office Depot customer Callan Garber, 10, shops for school supplies at Office Depot in Mountain View, Calif., Tuesday, July 29, 2008. Office Depot says weakness in Florida and other parts of North America, and store-closing costs led it to loss in the third quarter, Wednesday, Oct. 29, 2008. (AP Photo/Paul Sakuma)

WASHINGTON — Scared and out of money, Americans stopped buying everything from cars to corn flakes in the July-September quarter, ratcheting back spending by the largest amount in 28 years and jolting the national economy into what could be the most painful recession in decades.

With retailers bracing for a grim holiday buying season, the economy isn't just slowing; it's actually shrinking, the government confirmed Thursday. It reported that the nation's gross domestic product declined at an annual rate of 0.3 percent in the year's third quarter and consumers' disposable income took its biggest drop on record.

In simpler words, "The train went off the tracks," said Brian Bethune, economist at IHS global Insight.

Wall Street took comfort in the fact that it wasn't even worse. The Dow Jones industrials rose 190 points.

But economists say tougher times are still ahead. Believing consumers are cutting back even more right now, they predict a much larger economic decline _ anywhere from a 1 to 2 percent rate _ during the current October-December period. That would meet a classic definition of a recession _ two straight quarters of shrinking GDP.

Not that there's any real doubt now.

Clobbered by pink slips, shrinking nest eggs and falling home values _ consumers are holding ever tighter to their wallets. The new report said Americans' disposable income fell at an annual rate of 8.7 percent in the quarter, the largest in records dating back to 1947.

The dismal news came just days before the nation picks the next president. Whether Democrat Barack Obama or Republican John McCain wins the White House, he will inherit a deeply troubled economy and a record-high budget deficit that could cramp his spending plans.

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Each side said the new figures supported its political case.

"The decline in GDP didn't happen by accident _ it is a direct result of the Bush administration's trickle down, Wall Street first, Main Street last policies that John McCain has embraced for the last eight years," Obama said. He pledged to provide tax relief to middle class families and help people facing foreclosure.

Pointing to the economy's sad state, Doug Holtz-Eakin, senior policy adviser for the McCain campaign, shot back that "Barack Obama would accelerate this dangerous course." McCain said his tax cuts, free-trade policies and help to struggling homeowners would help turn things around.

More than in recent recessions, consumers _ the lifeblood of the economy _ are bearing the brunt of the country's housing, banking and other ailments. The third-quarter decline in their spending was the first in 17 years, and the 3.1 percent annualized cutback was staggering _ the most since the spring of 1980 when the country was in the grip of what some call the worst downturn since the Great Depression.

Walloped by such a huge pullback, the economy toppled into negative territory.

The latest reading on GDP, which measures the value of all goods produced within the United States, showed a rapid turn from the 2.8 percent growth rate logged in the second quarter. The new figure was the worst since the 1.4 percent rate of decline in the third quarter of 2001, when the nation was suffering through its most recent recession.

Democrats on Capitol Hill are pushing for another economic stimulus package and are weighing whether to hold a lame duck session before the new president takes office.

Under attack from Democrats and Republicans alike, the White House defended giving billions of bailout dollars to banks that now are rewarding shareholders and executives _ or even buying other banks _ rather than making loans to consumers and businesses.

Ed Lazear, chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers, said the government is keeping close tabs on banks' use of the money, but he also said normal activities such as paying performance-related salaries or distributing dividends are allowed under the law Congress passed.

White House press secretary Dana Perino said that "not only rich people get dividend payments," which can form a significant portion of income for retirees and mutual funds.

A collapse of the housing market and locked-up lending have produced the worst financial crisis to hit the country in more than 70 years.

To cushion the fallout, the Fed slashed interest rates on Wednesday by half a percentage point to 1 percent, a level seen only once before in the last half century.

Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke has warned that the country's economic weakness could last for some time _ even if the government's unprecedented $700 billion financial bailout package and other steps do succeed in getting financial and credit markets to operate more normally.

"As of now, most forecasts indicate that we will experience a serious recession, perhaps comparable to the recession of the early 1980s, but nothing like the Great Depression," said Simon Johnson, former chief economist to the International Monetary Fund and senior fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics. During the 1980-1982 recession, unemployment topped 10 percent.

Other analysts, including Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody's Economy.com, predicts the downturn will be much more severe than the 2001 and 1990-1991 recessions but not as bad _ in terms of unemployment or lost growth _ as the 1980s one.

The unemployment rate, now at 6.1 percent, could hit 8 percent or higher next year.

The Labor Department said Thursday that new claims for unemployment benefits last week held steady at 479,000, an elevated figure that continued to point to troubles in the jobs market.

In the third quarter, consumers cut back on purchases of cars, furniture, household appliances, clothes and almost everything else.

Businesses cut back, too, trimming spending on equipment and software at a 5.5 percent pace, the most since the first quarter of 2002. And home builders slashed spending at a 19.1 percent pace, marking the 11th straight quarterly cutback.

Slower growth for U.S. exports _ reflecting less demand from overseas buyers who are coping with their own economic problems _ also factored into the weak GDP report. Exports grew at a 5.9 percent pace in the third quarter, less than half the second quarter's 12.3 percent rate.

___

Associated Press Writer Jennifer Loven contributed to this report.

WASHINGTON — Scared and out of money, Americans stopped buying everything from cars to corn flakes in the July-September quarter, ratcheting back spending by the largest amount in 28 years and j...
WASHINGTON — Scared and out of money, Americans stopped buying everything from cars to corn flakes in the July-September quarter, ratcheting back spending by the largest amount in 28 years and j...
 
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McCain's cure for everything is to cut taxes. High gas prices: Make a tax holiday. Unemployment: Cut taxes on dividends and businesses. Prosperity bringing in surpluses: Cut taxes.

It is possible to eliminate all taxes and just print the money. The resulting inflation will be like a sales tax and an income tax and a corporate tax. It will compound and the inflation may be sort of startling when you see it altogether. The critical thing is to raise income, perhaps by increasing the minimum wage so as to become more a living wage; then, index it to inflation. The rich will take care of themselves and prices will rise automatically as wage costs increase but consumers can meet the rise. Intermediate wages will stay ahead of the rising minimum wage.

I don't think that is a good idea, merely possible. The better thing is to balance the budget and defend the value of money. As it works now, lower class wages are depressed which keeps down the prices of the things ordinary people rely on. The excess money floats upward and enters an artificial market in investment and funny financial instruments. These markets do not make a return based on the production of actual things. So we have bubbles as people with disposable income desperately try to protect their wealth. Ordinary people tried to exploit the housing bubble by borrowing against their homes. This also moves wealth upward except that it destroys homes when they must ultimately sit empty.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:10 AM on 11/02/2008

As President, Obama promises health care, more accessible education, and work on the infra structure. These are all worthwhile things in contrast to the swelling of the national debt by half a trillion dollars in the past 23 days with nothing to show for it. Rationalizing health care and extending education are merely good industrial policy. This should lead both to health security and personal opportunity. Massive infra structure programs employ people with a high school education and bring more efficiency into our manufacturing and commerce while affording those people good lives.

Suffering the complexities of excess monies will be more challenging than it might immediately appear, the world will be moved and our lives will be as odd as $1000 for a cup of coffee. The people who lent us their money will not be happy with us. It will probably work out as an extra ordinary rate of interest at inflation plus 2%. We have to stop using monetary policy to fight unemployment and stabilize our money. It worked for Clinton (somewhat) when Greenspan left the in house interest rate at 6 1/4% for several months. Other nations with hyper inflation have cancelled all money obligations and started fresh systems of money.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:35 AM on 11/02/2008

I though Greenspan's gratuitous 6 /14% interest was contemptible. i believe he did it to sabotage the economy and bring in a Republican administration. Then, he cut the rate to 1% to no avail, but the deregulation and favoritism he admired has almost destroyed us.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:44 AM on 11/02/2008
- zann I'm a Fan of zann permalink

I don't know how important it is, but for people with money, there's no "latest thing" to buy, like there usually has been for the last 20 years- PDAs, CDPlayers then mp3 players, DVD players, laptops, media center laptops, satellite TV, flat screen TV, huge TVs, blackberries- but there's no new technology at the moment. Also, people are ready for cars with good mileage, but green models are either in the planning stages or not quite there.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:10 PM on 11/01/2008

Bush: "we are absolutely not in a recession"

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:33 PM on 10/31/2008
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No more Lame Duck Economics. End the HEIST!

All the BILLION$ currently being poured down the bad paper rat hole will merely delay the inevitable until after inauguration.

duh

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:08 PM on 10/31/2008

Time to start the healing. The expenditure due to the war has caused Congress and past presidents to make bad decisions in order to fund their ventures overseas. We're now seeing the effects of the ripple.

Jay-Z backs Obama. Check out the new rap video - One vote, One Voice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNqcFI-AEOw

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:02 AM on 10/31/2008

But, but, DuganS1 says everything is great in the US ????

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:44 AM on 10/31/2008

I don't know the details of this contract, that Calif. is giving to China, but it could be a threat to our security, IT SEEMS AMERICA IS SOOO DEPENDENT ON CHINA< IT'S SCARY

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:52 AM on 10/31/2008

This is intersting this AM we get this article that the sky is falling and tonight
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/30/dow-gains-more-than-2-per_n_139367.html
Same Data but markets are rebounding and looking Firmer.
Remember kids by definition we need 2 Qtrs of negative GDP, while I think we will have that...Recession is already ending. Come 2009 things will be rolling hopefully people will wake up. Stop over spending, cut up your credit cards, buy a Car when you need one and not when you want one. I learned the hard way after the 9/11, never again. We are in control! Dont buy the hype it is never as GOOD or BAD as everyone likes to scream about. Take care of your own finances and dont copy the Jones'. Best Wishes ALL!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:01 AM on 10/31/2008
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The most terrible recession of all time, "we're in a depression", etc. Really laughable. 0.3% decline in GDP. Wow, that's horrible. -.3%?. That's it? That's the recession?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:37 AM on 10/31/2008

Country Club fees increasing on ya? Living close to food stamps? Just want somebody else to do it for you...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:53 PM on 10/30/2008
- JBS I'm a Fan of JBS permalink
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I still don't get why there's such a big debate over whether "THE NUMBERS" indicate we're in a recession or not.

You want NUMBERS, look at the Net Pay line on your paycheck and tell me you're not in a recession.

"Are you better off than you were 4 years ago?" For what it's worth, I was better off when Reagan asked that, than I am now. That's right, I'm worse off today than I was 30 years ago ... or even 4 months ago.

My economic situation has been steadily deteriorating since Jan 20, 2001.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:45 PM on 10/30/2008
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You will not be saved by a change of presidents.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:19 PM on 10/30/2008

I often think of that comment that it's Recession if your Neighbor loses HIS job but it;s a Depression when You lose yours . All I know is that I know people who lost Good Paying jobs and have not been able to get a new job even at 1/3 less money for over a year . they took a Temp job and the company would love to have hired them as a replacement for someone who left but the position was ELIMINTED . This of course does NOT mean the WORK was ELIMINATED . It will just be redistributed to the remainig employees ( more work Same pay)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:06 PM on 10/30/2008

The GDP dropped because the smoke and mirrors have went away. The election is 5 days away and the usual suspects are running and hiding all the crooked underhanded things that have been going on the last 8 years. For the republicans who voted for John McCain this is for you:
#1: The GDP dropped because we don't manufacture anything in America anymore. All the jobs and manufacturing sectors are in China,South America, Indonesia and the Middle East. Items that are imported here are not counted in the GDP.
#2: We need a switch from a service economy (call centers, concierges,brokers and hedge funds), back to a manufacture economy. That is why alternative energy is so huge right now. Companies will emerge that has to make the solar panels and wind turbines and so forth. There are other economic engines (Medicine) if Obama can eleviate them from the tax credits most of our medicines will be made here in the US instead of Canada or Mexico.
#3:We have to develop tangible technologies that other countries do not have that will tip the scale of trade back our way. which will increase the job market more. Recycling is a huge untapped market for such a growth. China and India cannot buy enough of our recycled paper and steel. We can't get the scrap items to them fast enough.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:30 PM on 10/30/2008

Wow there are so many things wrong with you argument it is not even funny, GDP has grown and continued to grow year after year as we transitioned from an Industrial nation to a Service based economy. Why?
1. - U.S. will never return to a manufacturing power, because first factories pollute, need a lot of energy, we are not building plants of any sorts. Wages are too low in other countries for us to compete look at the Auto Industry in the U.S. we have riverters making $ 30.00 an hour, add insurance and pensions.... That is not sustainable.
2 We are going to create alternative energy industry to replace what is considered older technology, NOT GROW the economy how much do you want to bet for every kilowatt produced by so called green technology will not replace the older coal plants. So that is not growth, just switching to a CLEANER way of producing the same energy. And if you did produce more energy would you allow manufacturing to create plants? it would pollute and there we go full circle again.
You whole recycling idea is great but all it does once again is replace what it being used today. That will not create growth, kind of the definition of recycling...Reusing. Nothing about expanding and growth.
My 2 cents, and with these suggestions would remain 2 cents.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:39 PM on 10/30/2008

Didn't Japan buy a lot of our steel back in the day? Just a thought. Oh well, we can just continue to borrow from china to fund and equip our troops for our 7oo plus bases scattered strategically around the world. We may have enough left to get a small country up to some shenanigans against a larger nation just for something to do.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:41 PM on 10/30/2008
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We just watched an un.settling show on the BBC, the first in a series called 'The Credit Cr@sh' or something like that. They said some of the big banks in the UK were in tr0uble as long ago as 2004 and that it was hidden from us and even from the shareholders. The latter were li.ed to.
I don't believe anymore that we avoided a meltd0wn, I believe we were in one, just, when the gov'ts in the different countries went public and started the b@ilouts, and that there is more to know about all this than the people will ever know because if they did there would be worldwide p@nic.

The show did say that the 4 biggest banks in England were in near p@nic themselves and went to the gov't cap in hand and asked for billions lest they get a run for cash.

One thing I will never understand is how a long-standing, highly respected bank would knowingly lend money to people it knew could never pay it back, but the show was about how they did know that.
(A few of the bankers, ceos, and the like, were rounded up for background for this show, ones no longer with their banks, and began b@ring their souls.) It is just plain b@d business practice to lend like that, a pet shop would know better.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:29 PM on 10/30/2008

I have family in the UK and they all blame BUSH for this.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:06 PM on 10/30/2008

Banks don't care if their loans get paid back. They expect the vast majority of their loans to end in default, and in fact they prefer a high default rate.

The only thing the banks care about is that the underlying assets are expected to appreciate steadily. If they are, then the banks can't lose. But if the assets are depreciating, then the banks can't win.

The banks will continue to contract their credit volumes no matter how much taxpayer money we put under their Christmas tree, because they expect to lose money on every loan they issue in this economic climate.

This whole crisis began with banks taking heavy losses on their loan portfolios, and they continue to do so. We can't just ask them nicely to continue lending at a loss.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:42 PM on 10/30/2008
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Here's a good NPR story about Credit Default Swaps.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=96333239

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:05 PM on 10/30/2008
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I dearly hope, that this will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

John McCain: Out of votes, out of touch, out of time.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:25 PM on 10/30/2008
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GDP is bogus. Real GDP died in the late 80s. If the "economists' and "academics" wanted to be accurate and honest, they'd call it the GAP (Gross Asian Product)

This number being low (as rediefined in Supply-Side world) is a very good thing for the underclasses.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:06 PM on 10/30/2008
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