Will The Safety Net Catch The Economy's Casualties?

New York Times:

Economists rarely agree on anything, but a great many do agree on one unfortunate matter these days: the current economic downturn is likely to develop into the worst recession since the downturn of 1981-82.

The United States is a far different place. Government programs in place then to cushion and counter recessions have been scaled back sharply, raising questions about whether they are up to the task as the economic outlook darkens today.

Read the whole story: New York Times

Comments

[timberdoodle]

People in this day and age will just not lay down and die. They will find some way to survive and if they can't do it legally then it becomes a recipe for mayhem.

There are too many people who are on the verge of losing everything and won't be able to get employment because of things like age and health etc. They can't be ignored as they are human beings and the old line of thought that if someone doesn't have a job they are a bum just won't hold water this day and age.

Governments are needed to help their citizens not just the elite.

[GrainOSand]

These are the scariest of times, the most exciting of times, and times so pregnant with potential for peril and progress, it has many perpetually on the edge of their seats.

Showdown at the intersection of greed and unsustainable policies of unfair distribution of wealth is where we are today. For those who want to keep things as they are, you better contact Blackwater and invest heavily in other security measures. When people start to starve and when municipalities can no longer afford to staff police departments those distant mobs with pitchforks will be coming to your house for dinner -- guess who’s coming to dinner - an angry, disillusioned, hungry mob. If you are poor already, then the potential slide into mayhem will barely register on your existence meter, for all you have ever known is struggle and making something out of nothing. If you are rich and have a heart the mob will know, and like the lambs’ blood on the door, there will methods to insure pass over. The greedy (those known and not known) had better get ready, for if things do not change and change in a hurry, their will be mayhem all across the world and revolution will come down on the neck of the greedy with both feet. This is no conspiracy theory. As with the unemployment numbers, the truth of how bad it is has been revised to ward off panic.

We have nothing to fear but more of the same.

[tomas0808]

Well said. This is what Bin Laden planned. Hell, he was probably waiting for a prez that he knew he could sucker into a war that would trigger a financial crisis that would domino amongst the west. Man America has had some incredibly unwise leaders during my lifetime (47 yrs). Fortunately, for me, I've been living on six grand a year for ten years so if it gets crazy I can handle it.

[truth fairy]

Of course: The Greedy can be "blindly seen" as "any one or of a collective "with money" saved, inherited, earned the old fashioned way through toil, trouble and double hard work, built from the casting of bricks and mortar, one at a time, into the aspired Golden Arches of Success.

Billy Graham in his book THE SEVEN DEADLY SINS says: " Greed has two cousins. The first is COVETOUSNESS...THE DESIRE TO HAVE WHAT OTHERS POSSESS.

We see the ELEGANT HOME that a friend has purchased, and IN OUR HEARTS we want to own the same or BETTER.

Our neighbor has a new car and we want one like it or better...

We see that Co-worker who accumulated alot of money and we wish we had his bank account.

The Second sin that accompanies GREED is ENVY.

If Covetousness means that I want what others have, envy means that I RESENT THE BLESSINGS OR GOOD FORTUNE OTHERS HAVE RECEIVED....Because I wish the good fortune could have been MINE...and actually leads to a dislike for a person who has what I want...

The sins of Greed and covetousness never walk alone....we all know the list of sins that can come from this...when somebody else has something I want..... "

Good luck!

[brooklyncitizen]

Well we have Reagan to thank for the safety nets with crater-size holes.

There are still Republicans holding on to this trickle down economic theory......this is where the Churches and other non-profit agencies come in. Although unpopular for various reasons the Catholic Church does help the needy...as a kid I recall when my Dad was unemployed in the late '70's and we ate courtesy of the church...each week we took the subway with our folded shopping cart to a Church pantry that filled the cart with groceries for a week...3 kids 2 adults.I don't recall how long this went on for but I still remember the sandwiches we made and the pre-packaged apple juices we got.... and we also got our Christmas gifts courtesy of the Church....and the best part? we didn't attend services my Dad was a lefty "Che"-atheist kind of guy.....lol

Poverty sucks....and it leaves a lasting impact on the kids.

[TrooAmerican]

theres a safetynet? what safetynet?
our country purposely tosses everyone out in the street and laughs.
Theres no honor and decency in America - the corporate powers that be, and their ridiculous religious Zealot Allies that are the biggest hypocrites on earth Jump for joy when 45 Million families in this country Working, cant afford to live comfortably, and have to make a choice to pay rent, or feed themselves, or buy gas to get to that shi||y part time job paying minimum wage that Republicans routinely say is a Great paycheck for the masses of slaves they want in their despotic empires.

[Louisfreeze]

I read these posts and wonder what thought is going into them. I wonder if anyone really thinks through what a society without a safety net looks like. We forget history or never read about it in the first place. People who have no job or money commit crimes. Homeless people would be everywhere. Ederly people would be dying in mass and disease prevalent. We have become so comfortable with unemployment benifits, social security, public infistructure and schools, soup kitchens and shelters, and emergency rooms, that no one ever thinks about what society would be like without them. What if you work at dicount store and can't save for retirement? What if your have mental or physical disorder? What happens to the families of poverty? I just ask people to think through why we had a 'great depression' and why we won't have one again? Is it because of the great financial engineers or is it a "safety net" which saves our society from mass poverty? Just think through the rhetoric is all I ask.

[brooklyncitizen]

Excellent post.

[twofish]

I've realized since the 1980's at least that universal health care would release a flood of creativity in our society. So many people -- as I did -- hang onto deadening, pointless jobs because they need the health insurance. Untying that from employment would let people take more risks working for themselves and starting businesses, and would bring about more failures but also more successes. Knowing that most jobs are now created by small businesses only increases my conviction. But of course the 80's were the time of Reagan and "government is the problem." We've finally figured out that government by crooks is the problem, but is it too late?

[FreedomCorpse]

No the typical safety nets won't, but buying physical precious metals, if you can find them, will.

[feo]

We will have Bailouts for Billionaires (it's like Bowling for Dollars but even better because you don't even have to bowl to win) and possibly Handouts for Everyone Else (it's like Bowling for Dollars but worse because you do have to bowl only you're not allowed to use a ball and the pins are protected by a row of barbed wire).

[anonimost]

maybe i am wrong but i certainly feel like the stock market is a scam. everyone who says stay in has an interest in us staying in. and yet we lose.

[forpeace]

*

anonimost
=======

You are not wrong at all!

This Bail out plan is not going to do any good for middle class, but it is a good start for Executives to begin early Christmas Shopping!

*

[ProfessorDuh]

Of course they tell you to stay in. You can prop up the collapsing structure for them while they get out.

[JBS]

If you've got 401k "invested" in a mutual fund, you might as well let it ride. Count that money as lost already.

What's in there is already sunk, but the market may recover someday, and it'll be worth something once again. Figure out what value it has to reach and mark that. If or when it reaches that value again, THEN pull your money out.

Right now, the money I have in 401k & IRA mutual funds are worth just about what I put into them oh so many years ago.

I know what their highest value was in the time between when I "invested" and today ... if the market recovers to that point I'll take the money out. Until then, there's nothing I can do about it. Taking it out in a market that continues to fall will just increase my losses.

[ProfessorDuh]

In a word, no. The trillion-dollar bailouts always run out right before they reach people who work for a living and play by the supposed "rules" in America.

[Pdubya]

correct. i'm working two low paying jobs that provide less income than the high paying job I lost in april of this year. when i called my mortgage company to work something out (i haven't been late), they told me they don't have a program for me. i'd have to have an ARM and be 3x late on my payments. so in effect, i'm paying for my neighbor who f*cked up. fortunately, i have some job prospects that could help change our situation....but i've plowed through our savings to keep current. and no, i didn't buy too big a house.

[WIpatriot]

...exactly as planned, Professor.

[VivaZapata]

that safety net has arizona landscape crater-sized holes

[Jacomina]

Freelancers are among the people who are most vulnerable in an economic downturn. We don't show up in unemployment statistics, but underemployment can be as frightening as unemployment, especially because there are no "underemployment benefits."

While struggling to cope with the economic downturn, many freelancers in the New York City area just found out this week that a safety net they had counted on -- their healthcare plan -- is about to disintegrate. The Freelancers Union -- the organization that has done so much for independent workers and received so much favorable media attention for its programs -- is discontinuing the healthcare plan that currently offers its members a true safety net and replacing that plan with one that exposes plan participants to the risk of bankruptcy. Yes, the "union" that is not a union is now marketing anxiety as "affordable peace of mind." This has indeed been the year of lipstick on a pig! To learn more about the problems of freelancers in the New York City area and the ongoing search for affordable healthcare insurance, see upsetfu.bl­ogspot.com and freelancer­sunion.org (click on Blog).

[Pdubya]

yep...i work for myself (when I can now)...lost alot of business since april....working two low paying jobs worth less than original.....it sucks.

[JBS]

Look on the bright side. At least you were able to find a second job.

[brooklyncitizen]

Interesting.....I use to be on their Healthplan and left last year.....I did see that they have a new insurance through Freelancers Union.

[bascombe]

at this point it is clear to me that the feudal system is the final top on this train. nothing to avert that is even being contemplated.

[NoMercy]

Feudalism might be better than anarchy.

[Pdubya]

i would do much better with anarchy.

[Rule Of Law]

We have feudalism now.

[nanny138]

Reuters reports on a weekly leading index that has correctly called the last four recessions and recoveries, without false alarm in between... punch line is that it's at its weakest reading in 60 yrs, an no recovery in sight: http://www.reuters.com/article/economicNews/idUSNAT00457020081114

[tompoe]

I'm struck by the ease of reporters to continue to find economists willing to stick to the principles of free market as they proclaim their expertise in offering guidance about the best ways to fight this financial crisis. Desperate to avoid reality, we get exclamations that unemployment is a concern, but not important. Jobs programs are not necessary, if only we had banks willing to lend. Above all, we must not touch the free market workings, simply trust those on Wall Street to receive the entitlement Paulson demanded on September 19, 2008, and gain a comfort level to continue with derivative strategies that will stimulate growth once again. And, yes, the world is waiting for our signal that all is well in La La Land.

[anonimost]

i agree. the bubble has burst. i think permanently.