Calif. high court asked to hear gay marriage cases

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LISA LEFF | November 17, 2008 09:01 PM EST | AP

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SAN FRANCISCO — The state attorney general and sponsors of the ballot initiative that banned same-sex marriage in California urged its Supreme Court to hear a series of lawsuits seeking to overturn the ban, saying the matter is too urgent to be unsettled.

"The petitions raise issues of statewide importance, implicating not only California's marriage laws but also the initiative process and the Constitution itself," Attorney General Jerry Brown argued in his filing.

"This court can provide certainty and finality in this matter," he said.

Proposition 8, which passed with 52 percent of the vote earlier this month, overturned the high court's May decision legalizing gay marriage in California. The measure inserts language into the constitution limiting marriage to one man and one woman.

Gay and civil rights groups, the city of San Francisco and other plaintiffs have asked the court to void the measure on the grounds that voters did not have the authority to make, what they say, is a fundamental constitutional change.

There is no deadline for the justices to decide whether they'll take the cases.

The litigation has made unwitting allies of supporters of the same-sex marriage ban and the attorney general, who voted against the proposition. Over the summer, anti-gay marriage groups sued Brown after his office changed the measure's wording to reflect that it would take away a right that same-sex couples then had.

Brown has since said that in his role as California's top public lawyer, he will fight to uphold Proposition 8 as an expression of public sentiment on same-sex marriage. The preliminary documents he filed Monday did not address that issue.

Andrew Pugno, a lawyer for the Yes on 8 campaign, said the measure's supporters are so confident the Supreme Court would uphold the initiative they want the court to take the cases and resolve the question quickly.

"There is no question Proposition 8 is exactly the type of amendment the framers of the Constitution envisioned for the people to be able to enact," Pugno said.

The Protect Marriage coalition is less confident about Brown's sincere interest in defending the gay marriage ban in court, according to Pugno. That's why the coalition asked the court for permission to intervene in the cases Monday.

"Everyone knows the AG opposed Proposition 8, did everything he could to undermine it and it still passed anyway," he said. "There is little hope he would make much effort at all to defend Prop. 8."

Both the attorney general and Protect Marriage asked the court to reject a request from gay marriage supporters for a stay that would allow same-sex couples to resume marrying in California until the broader legal issues are addressed.

Meanwhile, the interfaith California Council of Churches and the Episcopal bishops of Northern California and Los Angeles added their petition Monday to those asking the high court to invalidate Proposition 8. They argue that if voters are permitted to take away rights from a group based on sexual orientation, the same could happen to religious minorities.

SAN FRANCISCO — The state attorney general and sponsors of the ballot initiative that banned same-sex marriage in California urged its Supreme Court to hear a series of lawsuits seeking to overt...
SAN FRANCISCO — The state attorney general and sponsors of the ballot initiative that banned same-sex marriage in California urged its Supreme Court to hear a series of lawsuits seeking to overt...
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- nellie I'm a Fan of nellie 492 fans permalink
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Don't let us down, California. Equal protection. Constitutional rights.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:56 PM on 11/17/2008
- ohiomark I'm a Fan of ohiomark 118 fans permalink

Why am I not suprised that this is going back to court?

When liberals don't get their way at the ballot box, they get their way through judicial fiat.

Barging into churches and knocking signs out of an elderly womans hands is NOT a way to get sympathy for your cause.

Civil unions are fine, just don't re-define marraige.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:39 PM on 11/17/2008
- Eric8869 I'm a Fan of Eric8869 25 fans permalink

There were protests all over the country - peaceful, people marching singing and being together in solidarity. You can go to youtube to see all the footage.

There was one old woman who BARGED her way into one of the protests waving around a cross that got in a confrontation that SHE CAUSED.

Civil Unions don't have the same rights as marriage. Another Uninformed bigot trying to chime in on this topic.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:46 PM on 11/17/2008
- Merewen I'm a Fan of Merewen 3 fans permalink
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Why is that the religious right has to interfere in others lives? Shouldn't they be worried about keeping their marriages together?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:48 PM on 11/17/2008
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but the courts had already ruled that civil unions were another way of saying separate but equal...

its the neo-cons mormons, catholics, and evangelicals who put the issue on the ballot....

marriage has been re-defined countless times.. including racially, socially and financiall­y.. if it is going to represent the rule of law then it should include the homosexual community

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:53 PM on 11/17/2008
- nellie I'm a Fan of nellie 492 fans permalink
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Why am I not surprised that that someone who uses the phrase "judicial fiat" has no understanding of equal protection under the constitution?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:56 PM on 11/17/2008
- Quaoar I'm a Fan of Quaoar 28 fans permalink
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Republicans are a majority on the California Supreme Court. If this gets overturned it won't be because of liberals.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:57 PM on 11/17/2008
- Thurber I'm a Fan of Thurber 16 fans permalink

God bless the interfaith California Council of Churches and the Episcopal bishops of Northern California and Los Angeles!

There are still Christians that actually understand what Christ stood for.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:37 PM on 11/17/2008

Yep, "Do unto others" and "love thy neighbor."
Why do you care who others love? I'd rather have my 17 year old daughter living with gays then being alone with John McCain or Newt Gringrich!!!!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:56 PM on 11/17/2008
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did you actually read the bible??

it the old testament are the books that take a hard stance against homosexual­ity... and even then, it speak out against divorce WAY more than homosexual­ity.. not to mention jesus only mentions homosexuality ONCE.. wake up dude the homos are being used as scapegoats­..

humans must treat each other with EQUAL respect, only god has the power to JUDGE morality

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:08 PM on 11/17/2008
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Pray tell....ex­actly WHERE did Jesus mention homosexuality even ONCE? Enlighten me please for I am but a barbarian.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:46 PM on 11/17/2008

"not to mention jesus only mentions homosexuality ONCE"

I am not disagreeing with you, I support the overturning of Prop 8, but can you give us the passage where Jesus mentions homosexuality.

Thanks

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:50 PM on 11/17/2008

I actually agree with this point, and I am all for gay marriage & not a an of religion. Having said that, always hear "oh but we don't have to go by the old testament because of Jesus, and He never said gays were bad."

Not true folks. Well, not entirely true, anyway. Like politisophical said, read your bible. Paul petitioned the Aopstolic Council in Jerusalem for clarification on converting Gentiles. The council degreed that Gentile converts didn't have to hold to Jewish Law, but they did require that they not eat meat of sarificed animals, not meat with blood in it, no strangled animals, and no sexual immorality, as referenced in Lev. 17-18.

Paul however, interpreted it as saying that the Gentiles need only believe in Christ, and were not bound to the Torah at all. Apparently the Council grudgingly accepted Pauls wording, but insisted that the restrictons they had decreed also be followed.

Confusing, huh?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:54 PM on 11/17/2008

Um... Jesus never mentions homosexuality at all. Paul does. Jesus, when he had a chance... in the story of the centurion whose "servant" was ill... never said a word about it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:29 AM on 11/18/2008
- bbbtmenw I'm a Fan of bbbtmenw 11 fans permalink

AMEN... I totally agree..too many Leviticus Christians now days who have forgotten to listen to Jesus.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:14 PM on 11/17/2008
- SFMuscular I'm a Fan of SFMuscular 2 fans permalink

Read their lawsuit; it will bring tears to your eyes as they explain why Proposition 8 MUST be invalidated. You can find it on the page at: http://www.calchurches.org/marriage/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:42 AM on 11/18/2008
- kellygrrrl I'm a Fan of kellygrrrl 640 fans permalink
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this is THE Human/Civil Rights Issue of Our Generation, and I am 100% committed to righting this wrong.
I do believe some day "we" will look back at this the same way we look at slavery and other abuses in our history.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:36 PM on 11/17/2008
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Come on, slavery? Really?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:30 PM on 11/17/2008
- bluekatz I'm a Fan of bluekatz 13 fans permalink

WTF? You have to be kidding right? Tell me where in the h*ll are gays , physically being abused, tor.tured, murd.ered, made to sit in the back of the bus, separate water fountains, called "N", called less than humans, someone's property? See this is the sch!tt that irks me and many others that they are trying to make a comparison to sla.very in that their civ!l rights are being v!olated. Their rights are intact and if they keep this sch!tt up then people will continue to oppose them. Their argument is a word "marriage" and the right to get benefits of their partners.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:55 PM on 11/17/2008
- M1 I'm a Fan of M1 36 fans permalink
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A gay man was just shot to death in his car to day as the shooter screamed at him negatively for being gay. Does this work for you small mind.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:15 AM on 11/18/2008
- rmetz74 I'm a Fan of rmetz74 10 fans permalink

YOU have got to be kidding.

Gays were murdered by the thousands in the Holocaust. They have been abused, tortured, and murdered all over this country (and many others) for decades - long after emancipation and desegregation. They're still stereotyped and exploited in the media in ways that would never be tolerated by racial minorities. It took years to get any real research started on AIDS because it targeted a community most people thought was expendable. No, the wrongs are not identical - that doesn't mean they're not significant, or worth addressing.

Yes, it's about marriage. Because separate but equal does not work, and those who have been through it should know that better than anyone. There was a time in this country when blacks couldn't marry who they wanted, remember?

It's not a contest. No one is taking anything away from African Americans by fighting for gay rights. But if you think the two are that different, you are looking at the world through a tiny, tiny lens.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:54 AM on 11/18/2008

The delight in reading the postings of bigots is how they expose not only profound thoughtlessness but limitless ignorance. Ever hear of Matthew Shepard, bluekatz? Thought not!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:22 PM on 11/18/2008
- mercury613 I'm a Fan of mercury613 40 fans permalink
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"Tell me where in the h*ll are gays , physically being abused, tor.tured, murd.ered,­"
----------­----------­----------­-------

Google any of the following:

Matthew Shepard
Gwen Araujo
Brandon Teena
Lawrence King (he was 15 at the time of his murder, BTW)
Duanna Johnson
Satendar Singh

And whle you're at it, Google:

"homosexuality penalty Iraq" (or Yemen, Nigeria, Somalia, Sudan)

I take it that answers your question.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:08 AM on 11/19/2008
- Giada I'm a Fan of Giada 19 fans permalink
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Courage ....

Our founding father's had courage to stand by the truth of freedom and equality!

"These are the times that try men's souls," Thomas Paine

Marriage has four definitions: legal, social, spiritual, or legal.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:03 AM on 11/18/2008

If marriage is between one man and one woman...is that "forever" or "one spouse" at a time. Its not clear.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:33 PM on 11/17/2008
- bbbtmenw I'm a Fan of bbbtmenw 11 fans permalink

My mom tried to say that gay marriage is not right because marriage was about a man and a woman having children. I had to remind her that she married a man 20 years ago after she had her uterus taken out, and my brother was marrying a woman in the same condition and he never wanted children. How are their marriages based on having children or procreation?

Then the discussion goes to sanctity of marriage. Well, with 50 % of straight marriages ending in divorce, straights can meet, get drunk and married in the same night, and straights can even get their marriages annulled or divorced, how is that making marriage sacred?

END DIVORCE is the next ballot measure that I want to vote on. See how many of them choke on that. It would NEVER PASS. I bet there would be a 99% against vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:28 PM on 11/17/2008
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If we're going to allow religion to dictate laws pertaining to marriage, we should also make divorce illegal, and re-marriage should be considered adultery.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:35 PM on 11/17/2008
- jimdog1954 I'm a Fan of jimdog1954 7 fans permalink
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... punishable by stoning.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:16 AM on 11/18/2008
- Eric8869 I'm a Fan of Eric8869 25 fans permalink

This is the beginning of a major time for the gay rights movement.

Churches better be ready to defend their tax exempt status:

Everyone join AMERICANS UNITED FOR THE SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE

http://www.au.org/site/PageServer

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:30 PM on 11/17/2008
- bbbtmenw I'm a Fan of bbbtmenw 11 fans permalink

Love it. They should not be exempt. Especially the Mormons for their involvement in this, and the Catholic church for avoiding their responsibility for all of the molestation cases. It is horrible that they will defend not allowing the church to pay up for their conspiracy to help hide what was happening, and can vilify the victims, but can't see they are ever wrong, selfish, and exactly acting like the church leaders Jesus talked against.

Whatever happened to not judging, helping the poor and helpless, accepting others, not being greedy, love thy neighbor..­..........­.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:35 PM on 11/17/2008

The more religion-based bigotry surfaces, the better we are for it. This torrent of religious intolerance has finally caused decent people to stand against it and caused many reticent non-believers to finally announce their disbelief. This ugliness shows more rational and reasonable people what religion is - mythology useful for any prejudice a person with little moral integrity may entertain.

As a teacher, I see how youth are alienated from religion and, as the hideous ethics of many religious groups are revealed, the more turned off the young are. They detect hypocrisy easily, and they despise it. The contradiction between "to love thy neighbor as thyself" but "to hate, or at the very least deny rights, to homosexuals" is missed by few. And they easily discern which of the teachings has the greater moral weight.

Sadly, tolerant religionists are tarred with the same brush. But they deserve it for, at least for the Christians, they ignored their deity's directive to denounce false teachers and prophets and will share the fate of their antediluvian brethren.

When the young come to power, expect an end to legalized hatred and discrimination. There will be a clear view of how, through tax exemptions, the state subsidizes religion and the abuse will be ended. Because they will have been turned off to religion, at least the organized kind, the young will have little sympathy for it. Let the bigots rant; they sow the seeds of their destruction.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:13 PM on 11/18/2008

One has to hope that SCoCAL doesnt make one of those make of those decisions that can't be used as precedence ala 2000 SCOTUS. Wingers scream about policy making courts until it benefits them. How can Bush v Gore be less than the worse abuse of judicial power in history? 'Equal protection under the law' ?
JMJ.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:18 PM on 11/17/2008

Actually, Bush v. Gore did not set any legal precedent. The SCOTUS decision was made with language that specifically made it a one-time, Bush v. Gore-specific thing -- which is even scarier than setting precedent, in my opinion.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:14 AM on 11/18/2008

Here is an article from the Sacramento Bee.

http://www.sacbee.com/101/story/1403369.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:17 PM on 11/17/2008
- E K I'm a Fan of E K permalink

that is what is so ironic. there may be a a fear of taking other rights away from people, i.e. religious rights, but the people who opposed the marriage amendment are the same people who wouldn't go as low as to try to take away the rights of another group.

the outcome of prop 8 still makes me sick. i was, and continue to be, embarrassed by the ignorance and stupidity of 52% of the voting population in the state of CA.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:14 PM on 11/17/2008
- Eric8869 I'm a Fan of Eric8869 25 fans permalink

When the religious people are forced to die alone because their spouse can't get in to see them you may have a point. Until then your argument is apples and oranges.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:29 PM on 11/17/2008

This issue is constitutional. It's the gay community's RIGHT to the PURSUIT of HAPPINESS. Period. Religion has NOTHING to do with it and shouldn't. Hear that?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:14 PM on 11/17/2008
- Chicago48 I'm a Fan of Chicago48 10 fans permalink

The Gay community is going to turn the majority of Americans off and they election NEXT TIME is going to be for a Republican. It was the gay community and their demands that contributed to Dems losing the last 2 elections. I write "contributed" because gays are pushing their agenda, people look at it and they get afraid that their so-called "rights" are coming to THEIR state.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:38 PM on 11/17/2008
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the next time your rights are taken away, call me, we'll cry on the phone about it,,,,,,k?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:52 PM on 11/17/2008
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