Obama Advisers: Torture Prosecutions Not Likely

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LARA JAKES JORDAN | November 18, 2008 12:21 AM EST | AP

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President-elect Barack Obama pauses during his meeting with Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., not shown, Monday, Nov. 17, 2008, at his transition office in downtown Chicago. (AP Photo/Pablo Martinez Monsivais)

WASHINGTON — Barack Obama's incoming administration is unlikely to bring criminal charges against government officials who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists during the George W. Bush presidency. Obama, who has criticized the use of torture, is being urged by some constitutional scholars and human rights groups to investigate possible war crimes by the Bush administration.

Two Obama advisers said there's little _ if any _ chance that the incoming president's Justice Department will go after anyone involved in authorizing or carrying out interrogations that provoked worldwide outrage.

The advisers spoke on condition of anonymity because the plans are still tentative. A spokesman for Obama's transition team did not respond to requests for comment Monday.

Additionally, the question of whether to prosecute may never become an issue if Bush issues pre-emptive pardons to protect those involved.

Obama has committed to reviewing interrogations on al-Qaida and other terror suspects. After he takes office in January, Obama is expected to create a panel modeled after the 9/11 Commission to study interrogations, including those using waterboarding and other tactics that critics call torture. The panel's findings would be used to ensure that future interrogations are undisputedly legal.

"I have said repeatedly that America doesn't torture, and I'm going to make sure that we don't torture," Obama said Sunday on CBS' "60 Minutes." "Those are part and parcel of an effort to regain America's moral stature in the world."

Obama's most ardent supporters are split on whether he should prosecute Bush officials.

Asked this weekend during a Vermont Public Radio interview if Bush administration officials would face war crimes, Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy flatly said, "In the United States, no."

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"These things are not going to happen," said Leahy, D-Vt.

Robert Litt, a former top Clinton administration Justice Department prosecutor, said Obama should focus on moving forward with anti-torture policy instead of looking back.

"Both for policy and political reasons, it would not be beneficial to spend a lot of time hauling people up before Congress or before grand juries and going over what went on," Litt said at a Brookings Institution discussion about Obama's legal policy. "To as great of an extent we can say, the last eight years are over, now we can move forward _ that would be beneficial both to the country and the president, politically."

But Michael Ratner, a professor at Columbia Law School and president of the Center for Constitutional Rights, said prosecuting Bush officials is necessary to set future anti-torture policy.

"The only way to prevent this from happening again is to make sure that those who were responsible for the torture program pay the price for it," Ratner said. "I don't see how we regain our moral stature by allowing those who were intimately involved in the torture programs to simply walk off the stage and lead lives where they are not held accountable."

In the years after the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, the White House authorized U.S. interrogators to use harsh tactics on captured al-Qaida and Taliban suspects. Bush officials relied on a 2002 Justice Department legal memo to assert that its interrogations did not amount to torture _ and therefore did not violate U.S. or international laws. That memo has since been rescinded.

At least three top al-Qaida operatives _ including 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheik Mohammed _ were waterboarded in 2002 and 2003 because of intelligence officials' belief that more attacks were imminent. Waterboarding creates the sensation of drowning, and has been traced back hundreds of years and is condemned by nations worldwide.

Bush could take the issue of criminal charges off the table with one stroke of his pardons pen.

Whether Bush will protect his top aides and interrogators with a pre-emptive pardon _ before they are ever charged _ has become a hot topic of discussion in legal and political circles in the administration's waning days. White House deputy press secretary Tony Fratto declined to comment on the issue.

Under the Constitution, the president's power to issue pardons is absolute and cannot be overruled.

Pre-emptive pardons would be highly controversial, but former White House counsel Arthur B. Culvahouse Jr. said it would protect those who were following orders or otherwise trying to protect the nation.

"I know of no one who acted in reckless disregard of U.S. law or international law," said Culvahouse, who served under President Ronald Reagan. "It's just not good for the intelligence community and the defense community to have people in the field, under exigent circumstances, being told these are the rules, to be exposed months and years after the fact to criminal prosecution."

The Federalist Papers discourage presidents from pardoning themselves. It took former President Gerald Ford to clear former President Richard Nixon of wrongdoing in the 1972 Watergate break-in.

WASHINGTON — Barack Obama's incoming administration is unlikely to bring criminal charges against government officials who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists d...
WASHINGTON — Barack Obama's incoming administration is unlikely to bring criminal charges against government officials who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists d...
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So presuming pre-emptive pardons, I find Leahy's comment hopeful. So Cheney, Bush, Rumsfield et al will not face charges in the United States. There is always the International Court of Justice. The next logical question becomes: if international indictments issue, will we turn these men over for prosecution? The answer had bloody well better be OH YEAH.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:17 PM on 11/18/2008
- Ramirez I'm a Fan of Ramirez 289 fans permalink
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If a European army invaded our country to overthrow and arrest our government the Democrats would be throwing flowers in the streets.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:19 PM on 11/18/2008
- kiran1207 I'm a Fan of kiran1207 9 fans permalink

Ramirez, if this is true then why did the American revolution happen?? Come on you are angry that Obama won, get over it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:29 PM on 11/18/2008

You whine about Democrats not working....what are you doing today, mocoso?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:53 PM on 11/18/2008
- piul05 I'm a Fan of piul05 58 fans permalink
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But...but..but...in that case, wouldn't the purpose to free the country from a tyrant/find WMD?? Who wouldn't be throwing flowers? What are a few towns turned to rubble, historic patrimony trampled over (or looted), over 500,000 people dead, over 2 million people displaced, neighbors, family, friends and acquaintances being taken for chats from which they don't come back ( or do, after falling downstairs - so clumsy!), an economic collapse, fratricide, cholera and other opportunist epidemics, foreigners (military and mercenaries alike) roaming your streets, when you have been brought DEMOCRACY!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:02 PM on 11/18/2008
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Technically, we can ask the international courts to try for us any cases that are of national importance that we cannot try ourselves for some reason, such as the accused has already issued himself and his co-conspirators preemptive pardons for any crimes they committed, under American law. Larry Tribe was all for it when the Supreme Court chose Bush in the first place, but Gore made him stand down, saying it was basically unseemly for us to ever make use of those courts, since we are the supreme nation in the world we should always be able to use our own courts for anything that happens. It might be time to rethink that idea, I mean we're paying for these courts, pretty much, why can't we use them?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:13 PM on 11/18/2008
- Aroura I'm a Fan of Aroura 2 fans permalink

I don't know what kind of change you were all expecting. he never promised to only have super liberal democrats in his cabinet. Quite the opposite (reaching across the isle, working together, etc), and he is fullfilling that promise.

He promised change for healthcare, energy, the 2 wars, gitmo/torture and taxes. As far as those goes, all signs says he is still going to push veryhard for those issues.

I am very dissapointed that Bush and co will not get their just desserts in the form of prosecution, but if Obama goes after him, that kind of huge legal battle involving god knows how many people could easily mire down his whole presidency, and then we won't get ANY of the change he promised. It's a triage situation people. The country, and event he world, are hemmoraging, and we have to fix that first. It stinks, but life isn't always fair.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:10 PM on 11/18/2008
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That is why you hire a special prosecutor and let him do the work. However, the responsibility lies with Nancy Pelosi. We have to send a message to the entire democratic party that we are not going to take it anymore.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:16 PM on 11/18/2008
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Absolutely correct.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:17 PM on 11/18/2008
- Aroura I'm a Fan of Aroura 2 fans permalink

I admit, I am not fully versed on how the whole thing would work. If they could prosecute without the new administration getting mired down, I am certaily all for it. People should be held responsible for their crimes. Absolutely. Just not at the expence of the new administration and therefore the American people.

I hope, I realy hope, that a way can be found to punish these criminal, without also punishing the American people. I know the rest of the world won't look to kindly on us if we just let them walk away scott free. I just do not want to blame Obama, or put the extra pressure on him (don't you think he's got enough on his plate, what with Bush wrecking things as fast as he can before he leaves office?). If it can be handled without scandle or detrimental effect to his very importand agenda, as you say, then I hope they go for it!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:03 PM on 11/18/2008
- blindhog I'm a Fan of blindhog 11 fans permalink

The ones at the bottom did what the higher ups wanted, if they didn't, they would have been repremanded. The trouble is, the higher ups have covered their trail, so where do we go from here?

I have a feeling the whole financial mess that developed over the past 7 years has been been handled the same way, so where do we go from here?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:55 AM on 11/18/2008
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Demand impeahcment and amending of the powers to pardon by the president. We should take away this power from the president in most circumstances. It is being used for abuse. We should investigate every pardon done since Bush Sr.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:10 PM on 11/18/2008
- Ramirez I'm a Fan of Ramirez 289 fans permalink
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You should first investigate Article II, Sec 2 of the US Constitution.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:17 PM on 11/18/2008
- pjburns11 I'm a Fan of pjburns11 10 fans permalink
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Now is precisely the time to go after Bush. Talk about Change! Actually holding ALL Americans accountable? That would be revolutionary. It would also be healing.

It's a good time to review the articles of impeachments as most of them would make strong indictments.

http://thetruthburns.wordpress.com/2008/11/17/forget-impeachment-its-time-to-probe-investigate-indict-bush/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:54 AM on 11/18/2008
- Jaybot I'm a Fan of Jaybot 11 fans permalink

How you liking all that 'change'?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:54 AM on 11/18/2008
- MikeGuy I'm a Fan of MikeGuy 3 fans permalink

Ending torture as a policy - that is change I voted for. (By the way, your guy lost. Get over it.)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:20 PM on 11/18/2008

Obama has gone totally for Jewish controll of our new goverment. Obama's Clintonite turn is evil Rahm (censure no impeachment) Carl Levine (Republican Light) Diane Finestein (crime is fine with her).
Jane Harmon got the briefs on torture years ago and never spoke out! That makes her a war criminal! This Democrat administration must be protested at every turn.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:49 AM on 11/18/2008
- Duke1225 I'm a Fan of Duke1225 4 fans permalink
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What are you doing on a site with people who can think?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:31 PM on 11/18/2008
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We need to send the Democratic party a message. This is no longer business as usual. Nancy needs to be removed. We need to start a viable third party using the same grass roots methods that Obama used. A party of justice. A party that will review all the wrong doing since the Nixon administration. A party for pardon reform. A party that will reinvestigate Iran Contra, reinvestigateCIAinvolvement in the Iranian host age situation, investigate the Bush administration etc. and even the Clinton administration because this is not about partisanship; this is about justice. We need to repeal these grievous pardons and put as many people in jail that we can legally put. We deserve clean government. We need to confront these Democrats who think there is no alternative to them. We need to replace a lot of these Democrats with members of our new party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:48 AM on 11/18/2008
- fedupinfla I'm a Fan of fedupinfla 48 fans permalink
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I'd join that party in a heartbeat>

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:49 AM on 11/18/2008
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Let's do it. Write to me at yahoo.comcrooks@yahoo.com. I will write you back with my real email address and we can discuss about how we can do this. YES, WE CAN!!! NEVER AGAIN!!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:12 PM on 11/18/2008
- SoD1 I'm a Fan of SoD1 9 fans permalink

I could not agree more with you, my dear new favorite.
The only thing that seems authentically "Bipartisan" is the corruption and the amounts of deceits coming from both Parties. It might be more than time for some other new and with fresh ideas Parties to emerge from the dust of those two.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:09 PM on 11/18/2008
- ranger5 I'm a Fan of ranger5 14 fans permalink

This is profoundly dissapointing, if true. There are many who have served in the Bush adminsitrations who are almost certainly guilty of war crimes. If Obama decides to disavow justice, it will make a mockery of our attempts to marginalize and prosecute people like Milosovich and Taylor for their crimes against their people and humanity. High-ranking Americans have been walking away from prosection for years, while some poor flunky way down the food chain served time as an example. Change we can believe in? If the Bushite criminals are not brought to justice, then very little will have changed, and the next fascist administration will only be encouraged to re-establish torture, rendition, black sites, and extra-legal activities as policy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:40 AM on 11/18/2008
- BuyRubles I'm a Fan of BuyRubles 2 fans permalink

Get out of the party then. Based on the way democrats are acting - demanding EVERYTHING from the sun to the moon from Obama - 2012 will be a sweep for the republicans. HOW ABOUT trusting Obama and letting him govern the country in JANUARY, not november or december? It is absolutely sickening to hear liberals cry over every little decision OBAMA has not even made yet. The next 4 years will be light years better than Bush if democrats stick together, rather than parsing over little "promises" Obama made that won't change the grand scheme of things. I want accountability on the Economy, I want accountability on the War, I want accountability in our dealings with Foreign governments that are hostile to us - what I don't want is a 4-year soap opera about the horrors of the Bush Administration. Let history hold the rethuglicans accountable b/c Barack has a huge task on his hands.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:28 PM on 11/18/2008
- fedupinfla I'm a Fan of fedupinfla 48 fans permalink
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Lets face it...Pardons are going to FLY off Bush's desk as fast as he can sign them and there's nothing we can say or do about it. He ran his whole administration that way didn't he? He's looking at his approval rating dip lower & lower and he's thinking "screw it, they already hate me so I'll do what I want & the hell with them." And that will be his final legacy. That will forever be deemed the cherry on the cake of his administration. Which will go down as the worst in American history I'm sure.

No, this is never going to be played out in a Federal Court anywhere. But it will be played out in the People's Court. No, not the one on TV although that'd be fun. I mean in the media, the internet, and around the dining room tables across the country. WE are going to have to be the ones who judge them & hold them accountable. And WE are going to have to be the ones who make sure this is NEVER again allowed to become American policy. No one asked our permission to conduct torture in our names before but we'll make damn sure they have to from now on.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:39 AM on 11/18/2008
- Yermammy I'm a Fan of Yermammy 137 fans permalink
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Pardoning powers are voided if there are Impeachment Proceedings started. Demand Impeachment, it's not too late. Jan. 20 is too late. We snooze, we lose. Period.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:48 AM on 11/18/2008
- fedupinfla I'm a Fan of fedupinfla 48 fans permalink
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You're absolutely right!!

Here are some websites I found:

www.impeachbush.org

www.petitiontoimpeach.com

And send an email directly to Congressman Dennis Kucinich who drafted the 35 Articles of Impeachment:

www.kucinich.house.gov/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:43 PM on 11/18/2008
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It would be foolish to call for the prosecution of the people who still have to hand over power. This is Nancy's job and we have to make a stand to show that we mean business.

I want to see them all doing the perp walk in chains. That is what I dream about to make me dream happily.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:33 AM on 11/18/2008
- weatherwaxx I'm a Fan of weatherwaxx 259 fans permalink

If I may point out ... Bush is still in the White House. Let's wait till post-January 20 to see what President Obama is actually going to do.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:29 AM on 11/18/2008
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Obama is already showing he'll fold like a two dollar suit case by even considering Hillary as Sec. of State. It appears he may have the backbone of Harry Ried, which is that of an earth worm.
Boy, we're in real trouble here !

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:10 PM on 11/18/2008
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It is a little early to come to this conclusion. I believe he is doing what is wise knowing that these criminals are still in power. It is the House's job to police the white house, not Obama's.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:28 PM on 11/18/2008
- lthuedk 1 I'm a Fan of lthuedk 1 64 fans permalink
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Agreed. But if Bushists skate, Obama will be a one-term president.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:14 PM on 11/18/2008
- SoD1 I'm a Fan of SoD1 9 fans permalink

It is ESSENTIAL as it will be existential that Bush/ Cheney and the entire Bush Administration are prosecuted!
Their cumulative crimes alone goes far beyond water boarding. If we take into considerations the unjustified intentional created wars, lying the U.S. and others into Wars thus DIRECTLY involved in the Death of Millions. attempt of establishment of a Military Police Sate, Abuse of Powers on every level and CORRUPTION, we have more than enough for a clear case not only to imprson a number of them..
Prosecuting the Bush Administration now or as soon as possible will not only bring back the economical confidence needed to heal the economy, but would surely bring back a few Billions of Bush/ Cheney's stolen personnel Wealth back into the Federal Budget but it will also be the perfect Way of disarming foreign Terrorist and will bring back the TRUST of the entire World toward the U.S.A.
Now what we have to find out and clarify now already is that onces Bush is imprisoned shouldn't and COULD Bush's preemptive pardons to protect those involved, ALL be nullified legally ??

Any political Law 'Jurists' in here on Huffingtonpost, hmm?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:28 AM on 11/18/2008
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New favorite.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:34 AM on 11/18/2008
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Presidential pardon power is absolute.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:39 AM on 11/18/2008
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... where it is applicable. He must name the pardoned parties and the crimes which they have committed in order to define any pardons.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:50 AM on 11/18/2008
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Not if the constitutions is amended. Also, the ways they are using pardoning power is not how the founding father's intended at all.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:29 PM on 11/18/2008
- weatherwaxx I'm a Fan of weatherwaxx 259 fans permalink

If the US ignores its own war crimes and lets criminals go free, it reduces our credibility with the rest of the world.

OTOH... if Bush, Cheney, Rumsfelt, Gonzales, et all were extradited to stand trial in teh World Court... I would be very happy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:28 AM on 11/18/2008
- Ramirez I'm a Fan of Ramirez 289 fans permalink
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If a European army invaded our country to arrest our political leadership the Democrats would be throwing flowers in the streets.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:09 PM on 11/18/2008
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I want you to be happy and I would be happy too. So, do whatever you can to make this happen.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:26 PM on 11/18/2008

Of course he won't. You didn't really buy the "change" slogans did you?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:28 AM on 11/18/2008
- Moshe I'm a Fan of Moshe 215 fans permalink
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The U.S. torture program was no simple error.

The people who gave us this evil slap in the face to the Rule of Law and genuine American values were told again and again, from top to bottom and inside and outside the government that what they were doing was illegal, and they knowingly did it anyway.

What they did was evil, contemptious, counterproductive, and greatly cost the U.S. in our world standing, and likely even in U.S. lives because of the powerful effect U.S. torture had on inflaming anti-americanism world-wide.

So if you let those who knowingly broke our laws by commiting these war crimes and clear violations of U.S law walk with absolutely no consequences: 1) What does this do to the Rule of Law in the U.S.; and 2) Do you seriously believe that this creates any deterent to these sorts of acts in the future?

With no accountability there is no justice, and no justice no peace. That is a non-negotiable reality.

The rest of the World will see this as yet another failure of the U.S. to follow even it's own laws, prefering political expedience to justice and the Rule of Law.

This is shameful, and I seriously hope that those that are guilty will be held accountable for their crimes against humanity.

This was state sponsored torture dammit, not a parking ticket.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:27 AM on 11/18/2008
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New favorite.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:36 AM on 11/18/2008
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