Sen. Feinstein On "Milk": "It's Very Painful For Me"

New York Times:

Dianne Feinstein is not sure she'll ever be able to watch the movie "Milk," even though she's in it.

...

I asked Senator Feinstein, who became mayor after the tragedy, if she would see the movie.

"It's very painful for me," she replied. "It took me seven years before I could sit in George Moscone's chair. It took me a long time to talk about it. I was only recently able to talk about it."

Read the whole story: New York Times

Comments

[MiDemFem]

Enough with the black bashing. Enough with comparing the strife of being gay with the strife of being black. This is plain ridiculous. I'll leave you fools to your circular firing squad.

[antaeus]

I agree. Let's be more positive! I foresee a gay president in the White House in 8 years! hahaha

[nicolemon]

Its not for the straight people to decide if gays can get married. (: (: (: Kay?
Stupid c*nts.
http://www.myspace.com/NicoleAnnLemon

[Hare]

What adult people do behind closed doors is no body else's business. Not mine not yours so live and let live people. The only proposition that should be fix is the one giving longer jail time and worst punishment to adults who sexually abuse children. This is my take on all the proposition nonsense going around. Send the mormon adults who force marriage to thirteen yr olds to jail.

[Ducky12]

You're exactly right! What people do behind closed doors is their business. That is why they have the absolute RIGHT to do said things in their own homes without fear of condemnation. The answer's simple; get the civil unions and leave religion aka marriage out of it.

[antaeus]

Religion is already "left out of it." A Catholic church already has the right to tell an atheist or a protestant to take a hike should they ask for a marriage in a Catholic church. Pastors already turn away applicants for marriage in their houses of worship for a number of reasons. So this nonsense about protecting religion from same-sex marriage is just that: nonsense.

[Kevins]

Ducky, you've said in a few posts that marriage is a religious issue. You do know marriages are granted not by churches but by the states.
In California marriage requires no religious ceremony nor any religious avowal. Marriage is civil, and is ONLY granted by the state through each county's County Clerk's office. Religious groups have religious ceremonies and celebrations that are important and meaningful to their members, but many people in California get married with no religious ceremony at all.
If a couple has a church 'marriage' but doesn't file with the state, the couple is not married. No church, synagog, temple, or other organization in California grants the rights and responsibilites of marriage, only the state does.

On the flip side, no church or other religious group is required to perform 'marrying' ceremonies of any kind for anyone--even their own members--if they do not wish to. But if one DOES want to, ANYONE can perform a 'marriage' in California--without being connected to any religious group. California law permits anyone to apply for permission to become a Deputy Commissioner of Marriages -- the grant of authority is valid for one day -- and thus officiate at the wedding of family or friends on that one day. Again, the actual marriage is granted by the state, not the officiant, and is completed through state license.

[Kevins]

It's hard to see why anyone thinks this story--Harvey Milk and George Moscone being killed--is an opportunity to add hateful comments about gay and lesbian people--or an opportunity to argue that prop 8 denying same-sex Americans the right to marry is 'good' because gays haven't suffered as much as African-Americans. As if either idea follows.

Do I hear from some (certainly not all) African-Americans that gays haven't suffered enough to have rights? In my town a black gay man was lynched--tell me, which part of that man deserved no rights?

No person is 'illigitimate' in claiming equal rights. In terms of rights, black people should be equal to gay people. And black and gay should be equal to others.

Many of the posts try to make historical or religious arguments why gay people should be hated.... It seems extraordinarily bigoted, especially in connection with this movie about this piece of history. The first gay American elected official was shot. Attacking or killing gay people was not (and still is not) unusual, the police literally congratulated the killer, his scanty 'defense' was successful, and the response was riots followed by police rampage. Is there anything in that which invites kicking the victim? Why do YOU need someone it's alright to hate?

[Ducky12]

WTF? Nobody is condoning violence against anyone; gay, straight, black, white or otherwise! But to remotely imply gays have suffered even a fraction as much as blacks is insulting, period! And I'm not even black! You are comparing people who have suffered for hundreds of years and have been lynched in mass, deprived of ANY rights versus people who are pi.ssing in their pants over the inability to be "married." PLEASE! Last I checked marriage was a religious ceremony and civil unions are not! What's wrong with civil unions if equal rights and protection is all that is necessary?

[StephenDedalus82]

Not that it's a contest, but the only reason gays haven't suffered as much in recent history is because they could go undetected. That is, we were so oppressed we couldn't even be ourselves for most of history. The status quo refused to even acknowledge our existence, at best treating us as mental patients.

Marriage is a civil contract. Matrimony is the term used for a holy union.

[aspertame2]

"PLEASE! Last I checked marriage was a religious ceremony and civil unions are not! What's wrong with civil unions if equal rights and protection is all that is necessary?"

Some nations do just that. Churches officiate over and recognize marriage; government officiates over and recognizes civil union. The one ceremony is about your beliefs; the other about your equal rights and income taxes. In these countries, government is simply not in the business of deciding what deserves a "holy" appellation.

[Lisa-G]

Each Lesbian or Gay man that has been murdered for the sin of existence has suffered as much as each African-american that has been murdered for that same sin.

Each Lesbian or Gay man that has been demeaned has felt as much humiliation as each African-american that has been demeaned.

You obviously have some serious emotional problems. The absolute lack of empathy you have is astounding. You clearly are over-compensating...

[Kevins]

people do not have equal rights because they suffer, they have equal rights because they are people.
That is, groups don't have equal rights because they are separated by their special suffering. All groups have equal rights because we share our condition of being human.

The question of why civil unions are not an adequate subsitution for marriage is a good question. One answer is that 'separate but equal' treatment is not equal. The term for giving the minority something 'equal' but 'separate' is 'segregation'. The landmark was when the Supreme Court rightly prohibited treating African Americans 'equally' but 'separately' from other US racial groups. For example, it is not lawful to insist black patrons must sit separately in an equally nice 'black only' section of the restaurant--segregation is not lawful even if everything is 'equal'. That decision is right even though many people at the time couldn't understand why blacks weren't satisfied with 'their side' of the fence even though it was 'just as good'.

The core of discrimination is the majority forcing on the minority what it would not accept for itself. If you think civil unions and marriage are really the same, I invite you to take civil union and give gays marriage.

[aspertame2]

...bleh - my "on the other hand" was the same hand! D*mn HuffP for no editing functions, for idiots like me!

Okay. Um, on the third hand, the community where I live has a much higher standard of living for homosexuals (all three of them, she quipped semi-facetiously), than for African Americans, on average.

[aspertame2]

I am disheartened by the black-vs.-gay angle on Prop 8. That was one of the (many) less delightful aspects of the Clinton/Obama race - heads, you're vote is for racism, tails, it's for sexism. Who could have guessed that a black man would break the 200+ year anglo male streak, as opposed to a woman? It certainly, easily, could have gone the other way.

It will take longer, for homosexuality, and it's complicated. On the one hand, there are a lot of folks who are at least partially "past" gender and race issues, but still have social or religious taboos that keep them very uncomfortable with homosexuality, even if they are not emotionally hostile. On the other hand, I live in one of many communities across this country where overt racism is stigmatized, sure, but anti-gay proselytizers still proclaim loud and proud.

The question we keep returning to is: Why does one group that knows so much of prejudice and suffering, not have more empathy for and solidarity with another? Virtually every group in this country that has been marginalized and castigated, then finally assimilated, has turned and inflicted the same on the next, almost as a rite of passage. Twisted, but human, and to single one group out as singularly unsympathetic is to forget history.

[Ducky12]

Say it with me: "Race and sexual orientation are not the same!" The dynamics are not remotely similar, that is why people had no problem voting for Barry and for the proposition. And it wasn't just blacks...10% of the population wasn't enough to pass the bill even if every black in the state voted for it! Take the civil unions and leave marriage alone!

[Robert2664]

What happend to Mr. Mosconi and Mr. Milk was horrible but the real injustice was that dan white blamed twinkies for him commiting the murders. I would like to see the movie be cause i was just a teenager at the time. Had there been a hate crime provision i think the dan white would have died in prison in which in my opinon should have happend anyway. with that said where all the polititations who were against prop8 both black and white? If the govener was so against it why didn't he open his mouth untill after?

[antaeus]

The guv was too busy campaigning for McCain.

[aznhvd]

Those who believe that the popular vote can override the constitution in democracy would have had Al Gore as the President in 2001 despite of the supreme court ruling, kept the slavery and that "men" only have the right to vote; our country has been all about social progress and advancement of freedom via minority voice of the time.

[jacqmac]

WOW!! You people are ALL OVER the place about Prop.8 and Gay Rights! First of all, let me tell y'all that I'm as QUEER as a THREE DOLLAR BILL and really don't care who knows it. I was tossed out of Graduate School for being queer (and also for having PRINCIPLES), and I've lost two jobs for being QUEER, not to mention the numerous jobs that I've applied to and lost a chance at because I just DON'T HIDE WHO I AM!
A BOYCOTT is a wonderful idea. So is a 'tax holiday'. So is a review by the Supreme Court of the State of California. What I cannot and WILL NOT tolerate any longer in my life is BIGOTRY--of any sort.
I probably will NOT be going to see 'Milk' in the theatre. Why? Because I've seen 'The Life and Times of Harvey Milk' from beginning to end about eighty times. Despite literally FORCING a dialogue of some sort on HIV/AIDS and winning several key decisions regarding OTHER CIVIL RIGHTS-we've tended to sit back and say that 'Of course we'll win on this. Nobody could possibly believe that being QUEER is bad any more." And we've been proven WRONG EVERY TIME WE SAY THAT. So, enough sitting back and coasting along until March or whenever the Prop.8 gets reviewed by the Cali. Supreme Court. We need action. We need ORGANIZATION and we NEED TO REMEMBER EXACTLY WHAT HARVEY MILK STOOD FOR.

[vippy]

Good for you - you have some guts!

[wisdom101]

I have had enough of you guys blaming black folks for prop 8. The Blacks get blamed for everything. Obama is not in office yet and he's being blame for the down turn of the economy.

Another things that p&&$$ me off is that the gays always use the black experience and the civil right movement as a weapon to ligitimise their cause.

I can't recall doing the civil right movement where Gays marched with blacks and said we are in this together. As a matter of fact, you have gays that don't like blacks, although they are gay. There are some gays that are just as prejudice as so called straights when it coes to being black.

Blacks marched for racial equality and not for gay rights. Also, what if you are black and gay? You get a double dose.

If I was gay back in the 60's , I could hide my gayness at times, but it's hard as h$$@# to hide your blacknes.

ENOUGH !!!

[Ducky12]

LMAO my point exactly! There's no way in h3ll gay plight compares to black plight in America! To compare the two should insult anyone with any sense of history.

300 years of Slavery, Jim Crow, Public Lynchings vs. Gay "Marriage"......Pathetic!

[antaeus]

Almost as pathetic as the shockingly disproportionate rate of HIV among African Americans. What's up with that?

[jacqmac]

A gay man WROTE Dr. King's "I Have a Dream" speech. And I'm sure that a lot of gay and lesbian people marched to Selma, Birmingham, sat in at lunch counters, participated in Freedom Schools, rode in Freedom Rides, etc., etc. However, if I recall, it wasn't exactly Cool to be Black in 1962, 64, and 65--TRY to imagine how it would have been to have been both BLACK and GAY back then. I'm also not going to play 'I'm more oppressed than you are" with you. President Obama believes in CIVIL RIGHTS for ALL Americans, and marriage has been called a FUNDAMENTAL CIVIL RIGHT. Without a challenge to the interracial marriage laws in 16 states in 1967, PRESIDENT Obama would NOT exist. That is a plain and SIMPLE fact. And, unfortunately, we are being told the same things about our rights to MARRY as Black folk were told about all manner of things having to do with civil rights, INCLUDING their right to marry whomever they wanted to. Note that I am putting civil rights in NON capital letters. THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT will always BE that.
If you would like to put the blame on exactly WHO is 'blaming Blacks for the Prop.8 vote', call up CNN, who 'broke' the story the day after the election and has been capitalizing on it ever since.

"Separate but equal, ain't NEVER been equal."

[robXdion]

A few corrections. . . .Dr. King wrote his own speeches, specifically the "I Have a Dream" speech, unattributed lines notwithstanding. And James Baldwin was gay and marched with King and supported the cause. And interracial marriage had little to do with Obama's conception. That happened regardless. His parents were married after the fact. Sexuality is not analogous to race or ethnicity. No matter how you cut it, just ain't happ'n Captain. Marriage is a religious institution fist defined in scripture of most faiths as being between man and woman. Gays want the title without the God and the laws he brings. That's selfish and arrogant. Their fight should be to get civil unions, a government institution which Obama supports, to reflect the benefits of marriage. And yes, white gays did initially lash out at blacks and CNN, Rachel Maddow and Keith O. stoked the anger while ignoring the fact it was mathematically impossible for blacks to defeat Prop 8 by themselves if every black person voted against it. Blacks are only 6.7% of CA voters. Even Nate Silver proved blacks could not have been responsible either way.

[omeo2013]

They're blaming black people because 69% of black voters voted in favor of Prop 8.

[JDJase]

70% of black people voted for a ban on gay marriage.

70% of black children are born out of wedlock.

coincidence?

[Ducky12]

Sounds like the blacks got it right.

[JDJase]

I'm glad I voted for the affirmative action ban in Nebraska and it passed.

[wisdom101]

I'm glad Barack Obama is your President and he's for affirmative action...

[bighillaryfan]

Is she lactose intolerant?

[frvale007]

one more word" gross perversion" i know i couldnt stop at just one word

[LightningJoe]

This is roughly similar to my own choice never to see "The Passion of The Christ," Mel Gibson's paean to the Christ Messiah myth -- not that I was in THAT movie, mind!

I grew up Catholic, and was steeped in Christ's Suffering, as a guide to my life. It took much time, and devoted attention, to see what that perspective did to my worldview, and much time and effort to surmount its influence in my life.

The LAST thing I wanted, was to revisit and wallow for hours in those same self-blaming sentiments. Lord knows just why Gibson wanted to. I got a used copy of the movie by mistake, but I never will watch it.

[Bitsko]

That was a terrible movie. I went to see what the fuss was about. Never understood why so many people wanted to spend almost three hours watching somebody getting beaten up (not to mention being thrown off a bridge not once, but twice). And the antisemitic stereotypes were right out of the Third Reich handbook. Add to that the old "Pontius Pilate didn't want it to happen" libel, and you've got a flick I never wish to see again.

"Milk" on the other hand looks inspirational and I can't wait to see it. I lived in San Francisco at the time, and Harvey was a true hero.

[jake106]

Give me a break. Antisemitic stereotypes? Whatever.

Nor was there a tilt in Pilate's favor. He was obviously shown as not giving a crap, one way or the other. He just didn't want the Jews to riot. That was made perfectly clear in the movie.

It was definitely a heavy hitter if you are even remotely Christian. It was neither anti-Jewish OR heavily influenced by Catholic doctrine.

[StillIRise]

I agree with your take on the movie. I am a Christian, though not steeped in religiosity, and of course, I got caught up in the frenzy and wanted to see it for myself. It was the longest, most agonizing movie I've ever seen - not agonizing because of what I saw on the screen, but agonizing because I was forced (at the movie with my husband) to sit through it. I kept waiting for the plot to evolve, but the only thing that evolved was the beatings!! Actually, there was no developed plot! I also agree with the stereotypes. My husband and I are movie freaks, and we often watch good movies over and over. "The Passion" is one movie we won't be watching again! It was NOT a good movie! At least IMO.

[Ducky12]

What is the big deal over Prop 8, really? People voted for Prop 8 and it passed! Now people are whining over it. There are many more people (democrat, republican, and independent) which agree with Prop 8 than disagree...h3ll it passed in CA of all places! Culturally conservative people across this country don't agree with gay marriage, period! Leave marriage alone and the gay community can have the civil unions, problem solved!

[luvobama]

Two words.

Civil Rights.

[Ducky12]

One word:

Democracy

[ByersL]

You don't get it. There are things we call civil rights. Crazy concept, I know. If you don't want to marry a same sex person as yourself, then don't. Churches can do whatever they want. But the govt must recognize same sex unions, also known as marriage. Don't like it? Go elsewhere.

[Ducky12]

Why should I go elsewhere when I am in the majority? LOL You are in the minority so if you don't like it leave and go to a less culturally conservative country! Otherwise, shut up and accept civil unions, which is not and never will be the same as marriage!

[kotipup]

For those with conservative values, a couple of years ago, I read in our newpaper about a middle school student with Cerebral Palsy who could not speak or walk, but was excelling in college level courses. She'd been adopted. Her birth mother was a teenager, who had lined up an adoption, but she'd given birth early and the girl suffered severe brain injury. The couple who'd originally planned to adopt her backed out, not wanting to raise a child with such severe handicap. The couple who adopted her didn't know if the girl could see, so they placed braille all around the house to signify "refrigerator", "closet" etc. One of them left her nursing job to attend classes with the girl, who used assistive technology to communicate. The couple who adopted the girl were a lesbian couple, who under Delaware state law, were not able to legally marry. Who would be hurt by having these womens' union recognized under the law?? How many conservative, "family values" people would make such efforts?

[Ducky12]

Very heartwarming story about the love of two individuals for a disabled child, however this does NOTHING to establish reasoning for gay "marriage." They were able to care and love this child without marriage, and from your statements love each other so what exactly is your point? Their rights haven't been taken away, anymore than any other citizen of the state.

[realityczech4u]

Nice little story. The moment I reached the word "adoption", I knew that I was reading a "homosexuals to the rescue" tale. To answer your question, many special-needs children are adopted by heterosexual couples. Far more than by homosexuals.

[sws3030]

I am no doubt certain, having read all your posts, that you cried before you freed your slaves as well.

[Crozier]

There is no doubt that SFO Supervisor President Diane Feinstein was tragically shaken to her core on that day that Mayor Moscone and Supervisor Milk was killed by the former supervisor. I remember reading about it. It was a dangerous conversation for me as an army JAG officer, age 32 years old then in 1978.

As mayor of SFO, Dianne Feinstein was a liberal. She was pragmatic since CA was initially liberal. Then came Ronald Reagan's presidency, and her ambition to the US Senate meant to her that she should carve a moderate centrist pragmatic and neoliberal Democratic brand. This reality contrasted to her junior senator, Barbara Boxer, who has adopted a more progressive record and D brand.

Dianne has always feared that a conservative neocon or moderate neocon would defeat her. Diane Feinstein always believed that the majority of gays and lesbians were partygoers who had no real stake in their own civil rights and were the most loyal but subservient part of her base.

Senator Feinstein may be right...in more ways than one pun.

[bascombe]

her hubby is a war profiteer. I remember her walking hand-in-hand with Wubba after some supposed 'disaster', helping him photo op on someone's sorrow. whatever happened, she deserves no sympathy. tragedy? eh!

[JackNasty]

Sen. Dianne Feinstein may have abandoned principles on more than a few occasions, but she has never supported anti-gay legislation. Along with 16 other Democrats in the Senate, Sen. Feinstein voted against the grotesquely misnamed Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) in 1996 when the cowardly Clintonistas in her own were falling over each other to support it. Sen. Feinstein campaigned against Ballot Measure 8 this year.

I would prefer to have more Democrats like current Mayor Gavin Newsom who campaign unashamedly for the freedom to marry for everyone, but Sen. Feinstein has never betrayed gay Americans with the same abandon that many others in her party, particularly the Clintons and their sheep, have.