Plea Deal Offered To 8-Year-Old Charged With Murdering His Father

PHOENIX — Prosecutors have offered a plea deal to an 8-year-old boy charged with murder in the shooting deaths of his father and another man in their eastern Arizona home, court records show.

Complete details of the offer weren't spelled out in a court filing posted Saturday on the Apache County Superior Court's Web site.

But County Attorney Criss Candelaria wrote that he has "tendered a plea offer to the juvenile's attorneys that would resolve all the charges in the juvenile court contingent on the results of the mental health evaluations."

Candelaria was responding to a defense motion seeking to block him from dropping one of two first-degree murder charges the boy faces in the deaths of his father, Vincent Romero, 29, and Timothy Romans, 39, earlier this month.

Defense attorney Benjamin Brewer argued in a filing Tuesday that prosecutors wanted the charge dismissed so they could refile it when the boy was older and pursue case in adult court.

Brewer said Saturday that the deal would resolve the case without it being transferred to adult court, but he declined to provide additional details. Although he is considering the offer, Brewer said he is unsure of his client's ability to understand the proceedings. At least two mental health evaluations are yet to be completed.

The prosecutor explained in his response to Brewer's opposition filing that he wasn't trying to obtain an unfair advantage, but he pressed for the dismissal because the judicial system isn't equipped to deal with an 8-year-old charged with murder.

"It is done to ensure that the juvenile and the two murder victims in this case do not fall through the cracks in the system that might occur if both charges remain in the pending delinquency petition," Candelaria wrote.

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Candelaria explained that the boy could be found incompetent to stand trial, and if that happened, the court's options would be limited.

The court would be required to order efforts to restore the boy to competency, but if that couldn't be done within about eight months, the judge would be required by law to dismiss the criminal case and bar it from being refiled.

The court would then be required to initiate civil commitment proceedings, Candelaria wrote. If the boy is found incompetent because of his age, he wouldn't fit the definition of a mentally disordered person and no treatment would be available.

"Such a result denies the victims and public of any sense of justice for these heinous murders," Candelaria wrote. "It also denies the juvenile the rehabilitative services that he apparently needs to both deal with why he was capable of committing these murders and to assist him with the grief and remorse that he is probably feeling."

Police in St. Johns found Romero and Romans shot to death after the boy ran to a neighbor's house on Nov. 5. The boy was questioned after Romans' wife raised suspicions about him the next day, and in a videotape released by prosecutors, he admits pulling the trigger. Both men were shot several times with a .22-caliber rifle.

Romans worked with Romero and rented a room in his home.

Police reports say the boy told a state Child Protective Services worker that his 1,000th spanking would be his last.

The boy is being held in a county juvenile facility, although he was allowed to spend Thanksgiving with his mother.

Brewer said the boy is back in custody. The next court hearing is set for Dec. 8.

Comments

[javaz]

Lesson learned : Lock all guns in a place where children cannot have access and lock all bullets in another secure area away from the guns.

[NotMcCain]

Another lesson?

Don't beat up your kids..

[bobbysgurl]

A better lesson--don't teach an 8-year-old child how to use a gun. An 8-year-old child cannot possibly understand the consequences of his behavior, but will have a double homicide tied to him for the rest of his life.

[Jenlv]

Beating someone 1000 times is the equivalent of almost 3 years of constant abuse. 3 years out of an 8 year olds life....

[javaz]

Children are not always truthful and it is very possible the child is exaggerating the number of spankings.
Plus, the father had sole custody and the court at the time of that hearing decided the father was the better custodial parent.
The mother lived in Mississippi, I think, and had very little to do with her son until this tragedy.
The father should have been a responsible gun owner and locked his guns in a place where the child could not have access and locked the bullets in a separate secure area.
Guns and children are never a good idea.

[MsLiz]

There is so much wrong with this case. First, juvenile proceedings are supposed to be private. None of this stuff about plea bargains being offered should be in the press. The prosecutor should be disciplined by the state bar for divulging this information. The press does not have access to the file, so how does the press know that the defense filed a motion to prevent the prosecutor from dismissing a charge? Some attorney or staffer told the press.

I believe the defense is correct when they describe the prosecution as planning to refile a charge later when the kid is older. Since the prosecution thinks due process of law means the case "slips through the cracks" of the system, it is apparent the prosecutor wants to manipulate the system so that he can get a bigger trophy.

As for you armchair jurists -- you don't know squat about this case. Even in adult prosecutions, the press does a poor job of conveying what happens at trial. This case is still in the preliminary phase, and the press is so ignorant of juvenile procedure they are using the wrong terminology. I looked at the state law, and found that this kid clearly belongs in juvenile court. I don't know how anyone can seriously discuss charging him as an adult-- he must be fourteen.

I just hope this child has a modern day Clarence Darrow as a lawyer. The prosecutor is out to advance his career on this kid's back.

[smoovejef]

Agreed. Not to mention that the Arizona statute that covers charging individuals as adults would have made him (theoretically) eligible for the death penalty.

Tell me as a nation that we are ready to conceivably put a child on death row, and I will show you the epitome of moral decay. Prosecuting an 8 yr. old, for Christ's sake...

[adey]

I'll bet he'd have appreciated some attention when he was getting "spanked." The true outrage is that this child was left in a position that he thought that this was his only option. The truth is that "spankings" are too often beatings, and that, too often, outsiders give the benefit of the doubt to the parent. Eight year olds have no sophistication and no frame of reference for problem solving. I can see how he thought this was his only option. Let's be careful not to expect him to use mental, emotional and social resources we have as adults but did not have at his age.

[ChristiB]

Don't take it! What is the rush - they need to look at this with different experts. I think this boy was coerced into confessing.

[payos]

The boy was questioned after Romans' wife raised suspicions about him the next day, and in a videotape released by prosecutors, he admits pulling the trigger. Both men were shot several times with a .22-caliber rifle.

What "suspicions" were raised? I agree that the case needs more investigation. There are many loose ends. I'm not saying that one of the spouses did it but usually spouses are the first suspects in murder cases. The boy's natural mother had said earlier that he told her he got in trouble with the stepmother for telling his mother about what's going on in the father's house, that is, being beaten.

[javaz]

Actually, the boy's grandmother spoke to police shortly after he was detained and she said that she knew this would happen and if anyone was capable of committing this crime, her grandson was because they were just too hard on the boy.

The two men who were killed have outstanding reputations in the small community and were loved by neighbors and coworkers. The father of the boy was active in his church.
The man who was renting a room had just asked his girlfriend to marry him the day before he was murdered.

I only mention these things because I live in Arizona and we are getting more details on this story than what is appearing in national news.

It's a horrible tragedy, but ultimately the father is to blame for not securing his guns and locking the bullets in a separate area in which the child could not have obtained either.
Guns and children do not mix.

[S1m0n]

It's outrageous that this child was criminally charged at all.

[rockyb26]

i really do feel for this young boy but this story deserves a closer look before people rush to judgment. true, he is 8 and it is possible that he cannot comprehend the severity of his actions and that he was a victim of some degree of @buse. but on the flip side, i think it's a bit ignorant to assume that an 8 year old cannot understand that shooting someone could result in their demise. if he really said his 1,000th spanking would be his last, he fully understood the consequences of his actions and the motivations behind them. whether he knew that his actions were wrong or right is another discussion.

and finally, it is true that some of the most notorious criminals of our time were 8 year olds once. many of them exhibited dangerous behavior at that age. the trench coat m@fi@ kids of the world were all 8 once. there's nothing to say that he won't continue this behavior in the future now that his dad is out of the picture. if you don't believe me, google conduct disorder and its association with adult antisocial personality disorder. you won't be disappointed.

[zamerdee]

The boy was spanked a 1,000 times and he documented it.
I never spanked any of my children, ages 18, 13 and 10 yrs old, and they are well behaved kids. I was never spanked as a child. I am really starting to think spanking is not the solution for any type of childhood punishment.

[rockyb26]

spanking is fine when used in moderation. i was never spanked, but my older brother was and it was effective, trust me. he learned from the spanking, and i learned not to do anything that warranted a spanking. it was a win-win in our household. 1,000 times is clearly excessive though.

[disgusted48]

the term spanking is used to describe a variety of actions which may include but are not limited to, using an object such as a hair brush, electric cord, coat hanger, tree branch, hand or shoe on the buttocks, head, face, legs or back of a child. This happened to this child 1000 times. Oh it was effective alright.

[dwright]

hmmm. . . read what you just wrong. The child was smart enough or let us say, calculating enough to document his spankings. If he would have put this industry into seeking help do you think this would have turned out different? Sounds like a really smart kid to me not a hopeless child looking for a way out.

[BarackMan]

Ever keep a journal or diary? O, you really are a cold calculating dude aren't you!

[southernsepia]

You obviously don't have or come into contact with children. I don't care how smart they are an 8yo is not sufficiently equipped to understand the consequences of murder.

Lets say he planned it for what ever reason - isn't it the fathers responsibility to keep the guns away from the child?

Your post is ridiculous in an enlightened society - the possibility of prosecuting a child is a draconian line our culture should not cross.

[Waitaminute]

The boy told the social worker about the 999 whippings he'd had. If the social worker the person thats suppose to help didn't, what does an 8 yearold think? All the little boy, and that's what he is, wanted was for the beatings to stop.

If you as an adult were beaten over and over and over again by a person probably 3 times your size, what would you do (if you knew, because you are an adult) do if you just wanted the beatings to stop? I know, i'd want to do just what this kid did.

[NotMcCain]

I'll bet the father called it "spanking" but we would call it "beating".

The boy did not cause trouble at school and his grandmother thought the parents were so excessive with him that it didn't even surprise her he finally killed his father.

Who beats their child 1000 times by the age of 8? (And that's just the number of times since he started counting. You can imagine there were MANY before he decided to start writing them down).

There's a lot to this story that we haven't heard. I think the prosecutor is trying to avoid court because he wants the boy to be sentenced--and feels no jury will agree to convict.

[redheaded1]

Little baby sociopath. Sociopaths form early and cannot really be rehabilitated.

Needs to be locked up. Forever.

[disgusted48]

hey! people that beat their kids as a form of abuse, and abuse them mentally and sexually should be locked up forever and then maybe society would not have problems with sociopathic kids and sociopathic adults. Abuse of children should not be tolerated.

[redheaded1]

I passionately and totally agree, Disgusted.

This is a tragic situation. I don't know how it came about. But the kid is damaged and dangerous. He should get a lot of compassionate and aggressive counseling. And not be a danger to other people or himself.

[Metoyer]

Thank Jehosophat for the voice of reason, at last, in this den of vicious librulism. His father tried...and died. 'Nuff said. Case closed. Everyone just go on about your business, which is shopping.

[redheaded1]

I'm not happy about what I've said, Metoyer. And I'm as liberal as they come.

But knowing what I do know (I'm not a professional) about mental illness, I think this kid is very damaged and dangerous.

[glesslib]

His teachers said he was not bad in school, had no history of violence. Glad you didn't rush to judgement, though. If someone hit you every couple of days for your entire life, I'd bet you'd be a mess too. Here's hoping it's not too late for this child to have a life. Writing a child off at 8 years of age is a horrible thing.

[Grannyover70]

Why has his testimony not been thrown out? I listened to this questioning (televised) by the police and I was horrified! After first pleading innocent he was continually asked why he had shot the two men. It is conceivable an eight-year-old would begin to be confused and think he must have killed them. The questioning by the police without his Mother and an attorney present was unforgivable. Why have the police involved not been suspended? The whole thing is sickening.

[chemistrydoc]

I'm beginning to think that police should never be allowed to question anyone under 18...under any circumstances....never. The risk of false or coerced confession is far too high. Or, there should be some sort of dire consequences for both police and prosecutors - false imprisonment means YOU LOSE YOUR JOB FOREVER, NO EXCEPTIONS. It's just too important to leave to egomaniacs (police) and career animals (prosecutors). Nobody even thinks about what false accusation, let alone false imprisonment does to a person, and that person's family. In some ways, it is worse than death. And, after the fact, the cops and the DA's are so cavalier about it - never really sorry, just sorry that the real truth came out.

[tyger]

I don't believe the kid did it. Juveniles are easy to get a confession out of. Not only was the father killed, a friend of the father also killed. I can't see an eight year old wheeling a rifle and getting the jump on two adult males. And as far as this plea deal, this is ludicrous, the child just made the age where one is thought to know right from wrong. He can't be charged as an adult. The cops questioned the child without any counsel or guardian, the confession would not be admissible in court.

[crayola 08]

maybe i missed an article but so far i haven't heard any details regarding WHY the kid shot his dad. does anybody know?

[disgusted48]

He apparently beat the boy at least 1000 times in the last eight years. That's probably just the tip of the iceberg.

[crayola 08]

whoa. that poor kid

[isis]

If you hit a kid it can awaken or turn on genes for violence. This kid could be young enough for therapy to get the genes turned off. It should be a crime to spank your kid 1000 times.

[dwright]

I am sorry, but I am sure that the kid doesn't understand the concept of 1000 spankings actually. It is a complete fabrication. My 3 siblings and I got many spankings for things we deserved and things we didn't and we all grew up non-violent, good citizens etc. Years ago, pre-Dr. Spock parents always spanked their kids. If you look back to when all the kids going buck wild and school shootings, check out when his "child-centered" worldview took America by storm. He never had any kids and you can trace the decline in school behavior right to his era of, just have them do time outs etc. I am not saying that I condone beating etc, but spanking is not child abuse in my opinion. This kids shot his dad because there is something really wrong with him, perhaps his dad had a role in his character, perhaps not - sociopaths are born every day and they have no compassion at all and killing is nothing to them.

[MsLiz]

Violence existed before Dr. Spock.

[adey]

A spanking is not the same as a beating. Spankings are to teach lessons. Beatings are a power trip by the parent and have nothing to do with actual misdeeds by the children. Abusive parents beat their children because they WANT to, not because the child's behavior merits it.

[glesslib]

Spoken like a spanker....or a childless person. I spanked my kids, not a lot, but that was 25 years ago. My children never spank, and their kids are great....polite, respectful, good students, happy citizens. People who take the time to talk with their children, go over life and home rules and set standards seldom need to spank. I watch my grandchildren a lot and have never had to resort to physical punishment. Funny how that works when you make up your mind to reach children in other ways.

[samiam4285]

Um. It doesn't quite work like that. It is thought there is a certain gene (or genes) that can confer a predisposition towards violence (the evidence is quite still quite tentative), but you can't turn on a gene by spanking someone. It simply doesn't happen like that.

[Slapmewhenitsover]

HuffPost's Pick

How completely stupid are these people and why does a law exist that allows an 8-year-old to be charged with murder?

This child's life is ruined by an ignorant, abusive father. How can anyone say that it is not abuse to force a child to learn something so violent at such a young age? To call this illogical series of events anything but a result of terrible parenting would be undoubtedly another huge mistake.

If this boy spends 5 seconds in a jail cell, then all of these people should be there with him.

His father DESERVED to die for being such an IDIOT! People should stop acting as if his father had nothing to do with this insanity.

This boy will likely harm himself in the future, once he comprehends the enormity of the act, and I think that is sentence enough, especially for someone WHO NEVER HAD A CHOICE in the matter.

Now, these moral morons want to compound the stupidity by offering him a plea deal for a crime HE WOULD NOT HAVE COMMITTED IF HE HAD NOT BEEN TAUGHT TO SHOOT A GUN AT THE AGE OF 8!!!!!

The child needs to be moved to an environment (like another country) where there are no guns, so he can see that LIFE WITHOUT GUNS is possible!

These are the times I am glad I left the USA and the gun crazies.

[piul05]

Well said.

[nwsun]

How do posts become highlighted as a HuffPost's Pick..Is there a nomination process or does someone on the staff select them? .. I sure hope youre not on the jury as youve already come to a conclusion about who is guilty. What do you suggest the boy be charged with if not murder? Psychopathic behaviours sometimes show up very early.... I heard about a young boy who hung the family cat in the entry way of his family's house.. he did it to watch the expression on his mothers face... how would you like to have the share the house with someone like that?

[rockyb26]

i too am curious about the assignment of huffpost picks. the poster makes some good points (and some rather confusing points), but i'd be interested to know what particular aspect of the post warranted such esteem.

[disgusted48]

The father was abusive, beating a little kid 1000 times in the last eight years. Where is the outrage on your part about that.

[delmy]

YOU ARE ABSOLUTLY RIGHT 100%!!