Franken Camp: We're Down 73 Votes, May Pursue Legal Action

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First Posted: 12- 1-08 03:04 PM   |   Updated: 01- 1-09 05:12 AM

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The Minnesota Senate recount is getting incredibly tight. According to officials from the Al Franken campaign, the margin separating the Democratic challenger and Sen. Norm Coleman is now down to 73 votes out of approximately 2.9 million cast.

Several weeks into the recount, 88.6% of the ballots have been counted, a slight majority of which came from Coleman supporters. As noted by Franken campaign lawyer Marc Elias, in the counties whose ballots have been counted, Al Franken won 49.6% of the vote on Election Day. In the counties who have not finished counting, Al Franken won 52.8% of the vote on Election Day.

The number is not based on the Secretary of State website or other sources (where the difference is listed at more than 250) but rather the findings of neutral election observers who are on the ground in state counties. In these counts, it should be noted, Coleman has challenged more ballots -- accounting for the larger deficit that Franken faces in the official count.

Even with the narrowing margin, there may not be enough room for Franken to take a lead. That's because, as the Franken camp has argued, the state has declined to publicize rejected absentee ballots. Elias, while claiming that the majority of these 12,000 ballots were rightly thrown out, estimated that "as many as 1,000," could end up being legitimate votes that were wrongfully uncounted.

On a conference call with reporters, Elias said the campaign would now "pursue all other avenues open to us," in regards to making these absentee ballots public, "including legal action." He even noted (as has been recently reported) that the United States Senate could take up the issue, a development that the Coleman campaign has called "troubling."

"If ultimately there is no remedy before the canvassing boards and before the courts, that ultimately remains an option," said Elias.

Also on the call, the Franken camp, as it has done for the past two weeks, raised concerns over missing ballots, a problematic development which has been reported in several counties. Elias called on counties to redouble their efforts to ensure that every vote that was cast would end up counted.

"[The final number] simply cannot be relevant if it does not include the total number of the votes cast," he said.

Without making progress in the missing ballot and absentee ballot field, the Franken campaign stands a much longer shot of passing Coleman. But the numbers -- if their math is to be believed -- should tighten even further. The campaign provided two other data points that show a blue-tilt to the remaining recount.

In Hennepin County. there are over 74,000 ballots yet to be counted. Among the ballots yet to be counted, Al Franken got 79.2% of the two-way vote on Election Day.

In Ramsey County, there are over 43,000 ballots yet to be counted. Among the ballots yet to be counted, Al Franken got 51.7% of the two-way vote on Election Day.

The Minnesota Senate recount is getting incredibly tight. According to officials from the Al Franken campaign, the margin separating the Democratic challenger and Sen. Norm Coleman is now down to 73 v...
The Minnesota Senate recount is getting incredibly tight. According to officials from the Al Franken campaign, the margin separating the Democratic challenger and Sen. Norm Coleman is now down to 73 v...
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- spinns17 I'm a Fan of spinns17 51 fans permalink

call for a run off

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:12 PM on 12/01/2008
- smag I'm a Fan of smag 4 fans permalink

Why runoff when you can steal in the Senate? Come to think of it Franken pretty much epitomizes a Democratic Senator.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:26 PM on 12/01/2008
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It's called "gander sauce".

Hope you enjoy it. :-)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:43 PM on 12/01/2008
- browndog2 I'm a Fan of browndog2 6 fans permalink

If you can't fill out a ballot correctly, then my guess is that you are not capable of an informed decision.

If you do not take the time to make sure the ballot is filled out correctly, then you probably haven't taken the time to examine the candidates.

At some point you have to draw the line.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:04 PM on 12/01/2008
- rzan1 I'm a Fan of rzan1 58 fans permalink

Americans have a right to vote. So your "guess" is wrong.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:18 PM on 12/01/2008

and i sure you beleive that two illegals come here. a couple, the women is pregnant, and the baby is born here. boom an american citizen. genious!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:44 PM on 12/01/2008

I would venture to say he never claimed they did not have the right, merely that some people are not capable of making informed decisions. All Americans are entitled to a vote, they are discussing whether or not that hurts or helps the country.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:53 PM on 12/01/2008
- guajiro I'm a Fan of guajiro 69 fans permalink

It's logical to you and me. We both have an education. The argument you make is the same one made during the drawing up of the Constitution, namely that only landowners should be able to vote. The reasoning? Same as yours. Landowners could be considered capabe of making "informed decisions". But alas, the system we currently have includes the votes of the illiterate, the poorly informed, the gullible, the woman who originally wasn't allowed to vote, and those whose functioning skills put them at the illiterate level. Hispanic and Black minorities have a high school dropout rate of 50% (America's future leaders). Our Constitution's founders decided that they should all be allowed to vote although the enforcement is at the state level, not the Federal level. It's my guess that it is these people along with an abundance of the elderly who are technology un-proficient are those whom have filled out the forms incorrectly. All told I take it the number of incorrect ballots is no more than 5% of votes cast. Not bad.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:20 PM on 12/01/2008

Well my line is that if you state that you talk to God personally to receive guidance in voting that means you are mentally ill and incapable of an informed decision. Or if you state that Fox is your primary source of news, or Rush Limbaugh influences your decisions. Clearly those people or either deranged or mentally incapacitated.

So they should not vote?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:28 PM on 12/01/2008
- smag I'm a Fan of smag 4 fans permalink

Would that be a yes or no?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:04 AM on 12/02/2008
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I'm no Franken fan, but this close a vote tally demands intense examination and reexamination. If that fails, then the election has to go the Senate for a decision, and I would think that then Franken gets the seat.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:02 PM on 12/01/2008

If the shenanigans continue in MN, then let Senate history and precedent decide the course. Everyone interested in this situation should read http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/minute/Closest_election_in_Senate_history.htm
which was about the Wyman- Durkin US Senate Race in New Hampshire in the 70's. The bottomline is the Senate can declare the MN Senate Seat vacant and require another election, which could happen. Coleman should not think this is over. The results are too close and there are too many contested ballots that if unresolved will force this outcome -- a do over election.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:57 PM on 12/01/2008
- nellie I'm a Fan of nellie 502 fans permalink
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This makes sense to me, too. Declare the seat empty, and either hold another election or do a run-off between Coleman and Franken. A run-off is seems like the better solution.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:20 PM on 12/01/2008
- smag I'm a Fan of smag 4 fans permalink

These ridiculous missing ballots found in someone’s car or trying to decipher chads or peoples' intent is dumb. Election ballot should be the same in all states i.e. draw the line between the two arrows next to the candidates’ name. Really, folks, is that too difficult? A third grader should be able to do that. The problem is we have a large number of illiterate voters who have the right to vote but not the mental ability or capacity so they depend on a party or a group to give them “spoon fed” information in the form of sample ballots already completed and they simply copy the information when inside the polling place. That is not individual representative government. Its group voting; i.e. Union choices, Dem choices, GOP choices, white choices, black choices. Our elections are becoming almost as laughable as third world countries elections.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:23 AM on 12/02/2008

Why couldn't we have done this for President in 2000? A re-vote may have changed things - especially if it was considered a runoff between Bush and Gore, with Nader and Buchanan left off. Things may have ended a bit differently...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:30 PM on 12/01/2008
- guajiro I'm a Fan of guajiro 69 fans permalink

If the 12,000 who voted are not going to have their votes counted (and I don't see Lou Dobbs, Hannity, O'Reilly, or Bimbaugh championing the people's right to a vote) the Senate absolutely needs to step in and have a do-over election.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:30 PM on 12/01/2008

No vote should be thrown out, but we Americans tend to buy the pretext that somebody's vote is spoiled. Whenever there is doubt about whom someone voted for, we should have some way to call the voter and ask him who he intended to vote for. This seems so simple to me, and I have no doubt we could devise such a system if we have the will to do it. We Americans seem satisfied with trashing people's votes, and when it is done, few of us mount a protest. We therefore get what we deserve, and our own ignorance plays an important role in whether or not we count "all" votes cast.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:48 PM on 12/01/2008
- guajiro I'm a Fan of guajiro 69 fans permalink

To get a referendum passed in every state requires money, and that's where the problem lies. They (the wealthy) like the status quo just fine. According to many different studies, politicians who received the lion's share of funding ended up winning in over 90% of the races. That means the wealthy control who ends up in office. Since it takes a lot of money to get the referendums started who will fund it if the wealthy won't? No one is who. Were the people to pass a referendum stating that we want a constitution added to the constitution stating it is a FEDERAL RIGHT to the vote, then we wouldn't have any more voting problems.
" The Supreme Court majority concluded: "the individual citizen has no federal constitutional right to vote for electors for the President of the United States." (Bush v. Gore, 531 U.S. 98, 104 (2000))

Voting in the United States is based on the constitutional principle of states' rights. The 10th Amendment to the Constitution states: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the State, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." Since the word "vote" appears in the Constitution only with respect to non-discrimination, the so-called right to vote is a "state right." Only a constitutional amendment would give every American an individual affirmative citizenship right to vote."
http://www.house.gov/jackson/VotingAmendment.htm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:07 PM on 12/01/2008
- tbrnotb I'm a Fan of tbrnotb 19 fans permalink

Need money to get your vote on a cause? Just ask the Mormon Church!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:33 PM on 12/01/2008
- In A World I'm a Fan of In A World 3 fans permalink
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"we should have some way to call the voter and ask him who he intended to vote for"

The only problem is that voting absolutely MUST remain 100% anonymous, otherwise the door is opened to extortion and vote-buying.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:28 PM on 12/01/2008

Why not make it like a raffle ticket? Each vote has a serial number, and each voter receives this number on a "stub" when they vote.

If there is an election problem or the vote is contested, they can publish the number and the voter can come forward if they choose. There would never be a reason to connect the serial number or vote to a name....

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:35 PM on 12/01/2008
- kae I'm a Fan of kae 4 fans permalink

Don't puss out Al - that's what the dems always do -our uninformative informers can't look away from Mumbai -- one of the last seats that will give us a dem majority and our corporate media has moved on, of course not before convincing us to swallow the LIEberman-BS for this vey reason- the F-ing majority!....do not let Coleman steal it!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:48 PM on 12/01/2008
- BartLA I'm a Fan of BartLA 19 fans permalink
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Keep fighting Al. Don't give up. Because the Republicans will do everything they can to steal it otherwise.

And remember, Nate Silver says you will win by 27 votes. That's right, not 26 or 28, but 27. And Yoda Silver seems to know something.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:47 PM on 12/01/2008
- tomas0808 I'm a Fan of tomas0808 12 fans permalink

Whatever happens I hope Al knocks Coleman's teeth out. Those things are repugnant

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:43 PM on 12/01/2008
- OregonGary I'm a Fan of OregonGary 9 fans permalink
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If Al loses this he will be Okay. He is a young man and if he is really serious about serving his (our) country, he will be back.

If this was frivolous on his part, he will write another book.

If Al loses this, we will be Okay too. PE Obama has a strong agenda and a healthy Congressional majority.

I do hope it will be Sen. Franken, but I will not flail in anguish if he loses.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:41 PM on 12/01/2008
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Frankly :) - I wouldn't be surprised if he did both. His experience as an articulate outsider in the insular environs of a Senate run would be a fascinating read and an opportunity to do his own "Audacity of Something or other." Nothing frivolous about that.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:54 PM on 12/01/2008

Well, of course I'm pulling for brother Al.......

A couple of thoughts....

1:)74,000 yet to be counted in Hennepin Co......that's twin cities......BOUND to be Franken country no?......some hope there

2:) I haven't heard a coherent explanation of why 12,000 absentee ballots can be said to have been "rightfully" thrown out without a count. Is it just me or does that not make sense?? Any intrepid fellow Huffposters know more? A link maybe?

Responses welcome..(requested actually)
Regards
tm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:39 PM on 12/01/2008
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I wish there was a site to learn more. Have you signed the petition?

ga0.org/campaign/protectthevote

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:00 PM on 12/01/2008

I have now.....Thx for the link "Mustang_Sally" (1965?....great screen name)
Regards
tm

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:15 PM on 12/01/2008

I think that's why Frankern wants them to publicize these votes to clarify what is wrong with them? Was it because someone signed the ballot rather than the envelope? Or was it because the ballot was RECEIVED after election day but sent beforehand? 12,000 seems like a massive number....and the rationale for rejecting them needs to be known and then each on inspected for whether they are legitimately being held out?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:34 PM on 12/01/2008

Don't give up Al!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:35 PM on 12/01/2008
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One's vote does indeed count, so to speak.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:33 PM on 12/01/2008
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Truth is he lost and he won't admit it, just like Forest Gore.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:30 PM on 12/01/2008
- BillZBubb I'm a Fan of BillZBubb 54 fans permalink
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And you know this because Coleman told you so? Or Limbaugh?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:39 PM on 12/01/2008
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O'Lie ly

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:59 PM on 12/01/2008
- BartLA I'm a Fan of BartLA 19 fans permalink
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Sorry Cheshire, Gore actually won. The recount should have never been shut down. Bush and the Republicans stole the election with the help of their buddies on the Supreme Court. This is a fact.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:43 PM on 12/01/2008
- demrepub I'm a Fan of demrepub 51 fans permalink
    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:48 PM on 12/01/2008
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After 7 recounts and Forest still lost so he asked the courts to intervene and he learned what everyone else knew except the tin foil folks. He lost.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:55 PM on 12/01/2008
- GreyWolfSC I'm a Fan of GreyWolfSC 9 fans permalink

You could say the same of his opponent.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:58 PM on 12/01/2008
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The GOP really should just stop cheating up there.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:26 PM on 12/01/2008
- SinisterK9 I'm a Fan of SinisterK9 6 fans permalink
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Funny, I haven't seen the GOP candidate go to jail for voter fraud.

How about we just have a fair recount, and may the person with the most votes win.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:49 PM on 12/01/2008
- Johnbo I'm a Fan of Johnbo 4 fans permalink

You're not paying attention then. Two in Ohio were sentenced and one in New Hampshire in the past few years. There would have been many more but the Re THUG LIE CONS controlled the Justice Department, the people most responsible for enforcing election irregularities.

Not only did the Justice Department ignore countless irregularities all over the country - but especially in Florida in 2000 and Ohio in 2004, but it was used to pursue specious charges against Democrats and ACORN. U.S. Attorneys who failed to go along with this were fired (see the testimony before Congress about the firing of U.S. Attorneys, the Siegleman case in Alabama, etc. etc.).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:18 PM on 12/01/2008
- Maezeppa I'm a Fan of Maezeppa 26 fans permalink

Recounts seldom change the outcome of an election but for everybody's peace of mind I hope every vote is counted in this case because this is extrordinarially close and could tip to Franken.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:25 PM on 12/01/2008
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