Canadian Leader Shuts Down Parliament In Desperate Attempt To Stay In Power

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ROB GILLIES | December 4, 2008 07:00 PM EST | AP

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Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper announces, during a snowstorm, that Governor General Michaelle Jean approved his recommendation to suspend Parliament, at Rideau Hall in Ottawa, Thursday, Dec 4 , 2008. (AP Photo/Tom Hanson, The Canadian Press)

OTTAWA — Prime Minister Stephen Harper suspended Parliament on Thursday to avoid almost certain defeat in a confidence vote _ an unprecedented move allowing him to retain power and confront Canada's flagging economy.

The Conservative leader won the approval of the unelected representative of the head of state for the power to shut down Parliament until Jan. 26, hoping to buy enough time to develop a stimulus package.

"Today's decision will give us an opportunity _ I'm talking about all the parties _ to focus on the economy and work together," Harper said.

Harper, whose party won re-election just two months ago, said a budget will be the first order of business when Parliament resumes.

Three opposition parties have united against Harper, charging he has failed to insulate Canada from the global financial crisis. The credit crisis and a global sell off of commodities have slowed Canada's resource-rich economy, and the finance minister said last week he expects a recession.

The parties, which control the majority of seats in Parliament, had scheduled a confidence vote for Monday in which Harper was virtually certain to lose _ a defeat that would have forced his government from power.

Liberal leader Stephane Dion said the opposition would continue to seek Harper's ouster unless he makes a "monumental change" in dealing with the economy and other parties.

"For the first time in the history of Canada the prime minister is running away from the Parliament of Canada," Dion said.

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The opposition was also outraged by a government proposal to scrap public subsidies for political parties, something the opposition groups rely on more than the Conservatives. Although that proposal was withdrawn, the opposition has continued to seek Harper's ouster, saying he has lost the trust and confidence of parliament.

Governor General Michaelle Jean, who represents Britain's Queen Elizabeth II as head of state, had the power to grant the unusual request to suspend parliament. Had she refused, Harper would have had two choices: step down or face the no-confidence vote.

Both Harper and Jean's spokeswoman declined to comment on the leaders' two-and-a-half hour meeting Thursday.

Robert Bothwell, director of the international relations program at the University of Toronto, criticized the move to suspend parliament.

"Canada looks terrible. It looks ridiculous. It makes nonsense of our constitution," he said, adding that the move set a dangerous precedent, paving the way for any prime minister facing defeat to follow suit.

Opposition politicians also blasted Harper's methods.

"I frankly don't regard his government as legitimate any more," said Liberal Bob Rae, comparing the move to something more commonly expected from a Third World country. "His government is there because he avoided the will of Parliament."

Opposition New Democrat leader Jack Layton called it a sad day.

"He's trying to lock the door of Parliament so that the elected people cannot speak," Layton said. "He's trying to save his job."

Analysts said a governor general has never been asked to suspend parliament to delay an ouster vote when it was clear the government didn't have the confidence of a majority of legislators.

Harper's Conservative Party was re-elected Oct. 14 with a strengthened minority government, but still must rely on the opposition to pass legislation.

The Liberals, New Democrats and Bloc Quebecois, which together control a majority of parliament's 308 seats, signed a pact agreeing to vote this coming Monday to oust Harper and setting the structure for their proposed coalition government.

But infighting among the Liberals is casting doubt on whether the coalition will hold. Liberal Jim Karygiannis called his party's leader a disaster and said Dion should step down.

The opposition was embarrassed by Dion's televised response to Harper on Wednesday. Dion's English is awkward and his address was beset by technical woes. It was delivered almost an hour late and the fuzzy quality of the production had Canadian Broadcasting Corp. anchor Peter Mansbridge cracking: "It kind of looked like they shot it with a cell phone."

Harper needs the support of 12 opposition lawmakers to avoid being toppled in a confidence vote next month and some lawmakers will consider breaking ranks with their party after hearing from angry constituents.

"The issue," Wiseman said, "is whether can the Liberals hang together."

OTTAWA — Prime Minister Stephen Harper suspended Parliament on Thursday to avoid almost certain defeat in a confidence vote _ an unprecedented move allowing him to retain power and confront Cana...
OTTAWA — Prime Minister Stephen Harper suspended Parliament on Thursday to avoid almost certain defeat in a confidence vote _ an unprecedented move allowing him to retain power and confront Cana...
 
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So Canada, how does it feel to become a third world country?

Zimbabwe's Robert Mugabe can give Harper more lessons I'm quite sure.

The question is, will Canadians be compliant and just email their outrage, or will they act?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:32 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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So, U.San (?) how does it feel to be about to stop being a third world country? After January 21st. Maybe.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:48 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Sitting in my office with my broadband internet connection publicly expressing my displeasure with the current government I can honestly say I don't feel like I'm in the third world at all. While I agree with you that Harper's moves all seem to head towards and favour a dictatorship, let's not get carried away here.

I certainly hope the electorate will get upset and take action. I've personally responded by donating to the NDP as a show of support, signed a petition, joined the facebook group, joined the Liberal's mailing list and blogged in detail about the subject. I am considering taking further action as well.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:35 PM on 12/04/2008
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I have never felt such a disparity between what I hoped my country was, and what it really is.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:26 PM on 12/04/2008

Demonstrations are already being organized prior to the GG's decision in support of the coalition in cities across Canada by the the Canadian Labour Congress.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:39 AM on 12/05/2008
- S1m0n I'm a Fan of S1m0n 93 fans permalink
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Canada's Governor General represets the Queen *in theory*. Yes, that's what the constitution says, but as a practical matter, the GG's role is to represent the people of Canada, not a foreign queen. Hers is the hand on the kill-switch: she has the power to call or dismiss a parliament, must assent to the appointment of the prime minister and government, and must sign any bill before it can become law. The GG almost always does the government's bidding in these things, but she *can* refuse, at the cost of an instant constitutional crisis.

In other words, the GG is a defense against tryanny. If a government began to go rogue, she has the power to dissolve parliament and call an election in which the people of Canada would make their desires known.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:16 PM on 12/04/2008

The article said that the Queen granted his request to suspend Parliament. Either she has the power to do so, or she doesn't. If she does, then Canada is not independent. Would she have granted the request if he was a Liberal? It's good to know that the Canadians have a Monarch in place to prevent tyranny.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:32 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

But the GG was appointed by a Liberal!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:37 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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Might want to wire her in series on that switch, S1mon, at 220v. To discourage her from casually doing the 'right' thing for the Neocons. Only in extremis would be good, if she knew that she would be making the ultimate sacrifice for the good of the nation at the same time. Electrical humour. Sorry.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:45 PM on 12/04/2008
- ZoeK I'm a Fan of ZoeK permalink

Her job is to keep Parliament functionin­g.......wh­en she had a united opposition, representing the majority of Canada, tell her they had the confidence of the house, it should have been a no-brainer - allow the coalition to prevail.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:26 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

If she's a defense against tyranny why did she silence the MPs right to vote against the government?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:36 PM on 12/04/2008

Governor General Michaelle Jean does not represent Britain's Queen Elizabeth II, as the post claims. The Governor General represents Canada's Queen Elizabeth II as head of state. Yes, it's the same Elizabeth, but the Governor General of Canada does not speak for Britain, and Britain does not speak for Canada. Canada and Britain are independent countries that share a tradition. We count them among our closest allies, and there is no excuse not to get it right.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:48 PM on 12/04/2008
- RobBob I'm a Fan of RobBob 7 fans permalink
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...Thus putting Canada right on par with some other top nations of the world, like Venezuela, Malawi, Nigeria, and Russia.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:40 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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And the U.S.A., RB, lest we forget the last eight years in the U.S.A. "I'm saying it never happened. Albert Gore won the 2000 election. John Kerry won it in 2004, but it was stolen from him in Ohio. And Congressman Conyers wrote the book on how it was done." Gore Vidal incensed Google Gore Vidal Channel 4. Select Full Interview. http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/politics/international_politics/gore+vidal+ready+to+kill/2238447

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:55 PM on 12/04/2008

...and Venezuela should not be included in the list.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:40 AM on 12/05/2008

Maybe the Canadians should think about actually becoming an independent nation - instead of allowing the Prime Minister to hide behind the Queen's skirt.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:39 PM on 12/04/2008
- Daksian I'm a Fan of Daksian 3 fans permalink

Thanks, we ARE an independent nation. Like your Supreme Court, we have our appointed members of government as part of a checks and balance system. The Governor General is mostly a symbolic position..­.except in this case.

That said, I agree with the sentiment about the PM hiding. Bloody coward.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:52 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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The disregard of Canada's national interest in having a democratic government that will take action on the economic catastrophe looming over us all is what get's me. An avalanche is either started or may start and Harper picks up his toys and goes home and tells the other kids that they can take what comes, but he won't let them act ... Lovely. What a great example of selflessness, morality and courage.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:02 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

It hasn't really happened before, certainly not in recent memory. Before today the GG had been a powerless figurehead for decades.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:38 PM on 12/04/2008

Mr. Harper is like Mr. Bush minus the incompetence and ignorance. He's a smart policy wonk not great at making friends and influencing people.
What's troubling about this is the rhetoric - that what the opposition has done is "unpatriotic" or "anti-demo­cratic."
I'm not sure the opposition made a wise move, but they are certainly within their rights and the law, and it is unbecoming of our democracy to throw around exaggerated accusations.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:38 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Countdown to Harper having all BQ members put on the no-fly list?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:39 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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>"unpatriotic"
Well at least you can say that the Neocon playbook is consistant, north or south of the border.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:58 PM on 12/04/2008
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Yes, I've heard a lot about the coalition being "anti-Canada". It's the talking point of the decade.

When in doubt, call your detractors freedom-haters and country-haters, and the ignorant take it up as a war cry.

But I live in Alberta. It's willful ignorance here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:58 PM on 12/05/2008

As an American who has moved north of the border, partly for political reasons, I can say it amazes me that many I meet don't see Harper as the Neocon he is. Selling off Canadian assets? Welcome to the Shock Doctrine. I applaud the Dion-Layton-Quebec Coalition and sure wish we in America had been able to get rid of George W before he completely crippled the country and killed thousands in an unjust, illegal war. Stephen Harper is NOT your friend, fellow Canadians. The entire Neocon philosophy needs to be repudiated and better it should happen in Canada before this country is sold off to the highest bidder too, or certainly what has not already been sold. I also was impressed by Layton, although I am not a Canadian citizen yet so I can't vote here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:32 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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Margaret Thatcher said that Tony Blair and 'New Labour' were her greatest achievement. Harper looks like a clone AND the present situation of Canada looks like a clone of the past in Britain, with a stunned majority hijacked by a leader who mysteriously won power, Harper with a minority of the vote. Ditto Sarkozy in France.

Don't tell me that it all happened 'purely by chance.' I too prefer to believe Naomi Klein and The Shock Doctrine, with a little assistance from foreign powers. One foreign power to be precise, from whose mold these jokers were cast.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:03 PM on 12/04/2008

this man has no shame.

he's an embarrassment.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:20 PM on 12/04/2008
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 114 fans permalink

A good friend and ally of Dubya, I'm told.

Maybe they can both escape to Paraguay.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:27 PM on 12/04/2008
- ljkcan I'm a Fan of ljkcan 20 fans permalink

Prorogued imagine if we all did this in our professional life. We would be canned. Now there are going to have unity rallies. I lived in Quebec the Harper Govt has awakened an ugly sleeping giant in his attempts to cling to power.

Mr. Harper has had two consecutive minority governments the likely hood of holding on to power are slim at best. In the meantime he has shut down the Parliament until Jan 26th. How many people will loose their jobs in that time? How much lower will the dollar fall ? How about the markets?.

It is shameful and irresponsible on so many levels. And to think they still get paid and have lovely indexed pensions.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:15 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Actually we wouldn't get canned because no one could convene to can us, the company we worked for would just end up going out of business because nothing would get done as we all prorogued everything to save our jobs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:21 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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A worse scenario is whether Harper is deliberately risking Canada's meeting the same fate as Iceland, by this piece of monumental contempt for Canada's interests. And does he care? Or can it in some way benefit the Neocon Nutcases? Just asking. If I were Canadian I'd be getting answers ...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:29 PM on 12/04/2008

Imagine that Harper's wish was granted by a Governor General who did not think that he wasted seven weeks doing nothing since the election of October 2008 and still needs another seven weeks of extended christmas holidays..­..

Hey Ijkcan, Harper and his cronies might suspend their salaries too ...you never know.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:29 PM on 12/04/2008

Harper's actions are unfortunate but not unprecedent. parliament has been prorogued previously. It's not an unconstitutional act; nor is it illegal and given the time of season he's only effectively shut down the House for 13 days.

What is truly unfortunate is this laughable coalition between an incompetent boob in Mr. Dion and a narcissitic socialist in Mr. Layton who will ultimately rely on their authority to govern by turning to the separatist Bloc Quebecois. And what are they doing this for? To preserve federal funding of political parties. There is no other reason. They can harp all they like that they're doing it because the Conservatives have no economic plan but there's been no budget presented so how can they say there's no plan?

What's unconscionable in all this are the actions of Mr. Layton and Mr. Dion. The comments of their surrogates today are what are turning our system into an American style politics of hatred. Shame on them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:56 PM on 12/04/2008
- gfs5541 I'm a Fan of gfs5541 26 fans permalink
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Sounds more like Harper trying to stay in power if you ask this American. Moreover, it's this Layton guy and Dion who sounds more Democratic.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:02 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Indeed, if only Dion was better spoken in English and could stage a press release with some competence­...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:10 PM on 12/04/2008

That is all Harper cares about -- power. No other Prime Minister in our history has held power to the Office of the Prime Minister. He doesn't speak to the press and he has been running his non-stop election campaign out of the Prime Minister's office every day he has been in office. He is doing it again now. He is running ads in the media but won't take questions from the press.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:00 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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Thanks for that Neocon talking point. A bit unfortunate to loose 51 calendar days during a financial crisis when hours may make the difference between economic catrastrophe and survival, though. But purely to preserve the Neocon's Northern representative, so 'we think it's worth it' no doubt. Pity about the Canadian workers, however, don'tcha think?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:03 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Your point is only strengthened by the fact that those 51 days make up the busiest shopping days of the year. If clear relief and better days were clearly ahead we'd be more likely to spend over Christmas and Boxing Day but with things in question consumer confidence will likely drop, along with the value of our dollar, and even if things are fixed in the early spring I don't think we'll rush out and make up for the lack of spending over this crucial period.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:09 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

It is unprecendented in that it's never been done with a vote of confidence on the agenda.

I'll admit Dion has serious failings but I'll take incompetent over dictator.

You're upset about things becoming more American but you're the one throwing accusations of socialism around in the true american spirit of Mcarthyism.

And this economic update of theirs was a plan but they wanted the MPs to vote for it even though it had no specifics! They wanted to sell off $2 Billion in government assets without saying what they were going to sell off!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:04 PM on 12/04/2008

I agree with your statement about Dion and would like to add that while he does have serious failings, he is, by all accounts, a highly intelligent and principled man. I will take that over Harper's dictatorship any day.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:03 PM on 12/04/2008

The Bloc has been in parliament for many years and every minority government has had to rely on them for support. Lets stop buying into the Harper spin on this crisis that he created by his own stupidity. I predicted he would pull this kind of a stunt - I am glad that the opposition parties fought back. Its Harper and his base of Reformers that are dividing the country with hate and ignorance. Please, know your facts and don't let your ignorance blind your opinion. Most Canadian respect each other's political choices and engage in respectful debate. Since the Reformers took over the Conservatives, the climate of division has taken hold. We may now have a true unity crisis as a result of a very stupid man in power. He created this mess.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:56 PM on 12/04/2008
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It was only in 2004 that Stephen Harper himself indicated that he would be willing to form a coalition with the NDP and the Bloc should the Liberal minority fall, going so far as to send the GG a letter of his intent.

For a man that thinks it is undemocratic, he certainly has his fair share of experience with it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:24 PM on 12/05/2008
- Daksian I'm a Fan of Daksian 3 fans permalink

As others have mentioned, proroguing has never been done to stave off a confidence vote. It's an act of cowardice unbecoming the office.

I'll grant that the 'trigger' to this issue was the attempt to turn Canada into a one-party state--or as you put it, ending the preservation of federal funding of political parties. It was a move that certainly fits an authoritarian such as Harper, but it doesn't bode well for Canadian democracy. The larger issue at stake here is trust--and by doing this, Harper foolishly gave the opposition parties a cause to band together over, where they discovered that 'hey, guess what? We don't have to accept his bullying!', which is what he did all last Parliament. He dared them time and time again--only this time, he gambled and lost--or at least, he should have.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:57 PM on 12/04/2008
- pixy242a I'm a Fan of pixy242a 2 fans permalink

When Parliament reconvenes, a law should be passed that there should be no preroguing of parliament if a vote of non-confidence has been put on the floor, but not voted on.

Harper has not shown any regret or compunction for trying to goad the parties into this action and leaving the country without parliament sitting. As it is we complain that they don't spend enough time with doing the country's business.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:46 PM on 12/04/2008

That may be the second thing they need to do when they get a majority. The first is to get rid of the treason clause. It is an archaic law was not too bad when there were only two parties. Now we have four main with a few fringe it does not work. Did you not notice all the protests against this hostile takeover.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:00 AM on 12/05/2008
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It's not "hostile" if it is perfectly legal and fits the very definition of democratic in that it would be the rule of the majority.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:03 PM on 12/05/2008
- liseworks I'm a Fan of liseworks 143 fans permalink
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I'm really pissed off about this !! It looked like Canada had a chance to get pro-active immed. & all this j.erk has done is force Canadians to sit in limbo - booooo !!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:45 PM on 12/04/2008
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This all sounds very saddening.­..and very GOP-ish. Turning Canadian against Canadian, breaking promises to groups you courted during the election..­.but suspending Parliament to make sure you didn't get a vote of no confidence?! Abysmal. I hope our neighbors to the North get their own version of Obama soon...may­be he/she will be a Quebecer!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:44 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Layton's been stepping up during this crisis IMO. Frankly I thought all the leaders were poor choices during the election but this seems to have brought out the best in Jack.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:56 PM on 12/04/2008
- liseworks I'm a Fan of liseworks 143 fans permalink
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I agree - Layton looks like the future, to me, just like Obama !

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:58 PM on 12/04/2008
- Daksian I'm a Fan of Daksian 3 fans permalink

I disagree. While as a left-wing Liberal I have no real complaint about the NDP, Layton is far too much a political opportunist. That said, I'm very glad Dion is leaving, win or lose. I'd like a real leader for my party, thanks.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:59 PM on 12/04/2008

you do, of course, realize that canada has been governed by prime ministers from quebec for 27 out of the past 30 years?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:02 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Kinda takes the unconventionality and irony out of the idea.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:23 PM on 12/04/2008
- MJinCanada I'm a Fan of MJinCanada 106 fans permalink

One of the young politicians with the appeal and charisma of Obama is Justin Trudeau. However, he's smart enough to know that he hasn't the experience yet to lead a party, and he probably needs to wait until a few more people who are still ticked at his late father have passed on.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:06 AM on 12/05/2008

What the Governor General has done is allow the Prime Minister to shrug off his responsibilities to the elected House and hide out while he tries to figure out what to do. I am so embarrassed to live in a country where our head of government is legally allowed to run away from the people but still govern us.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:42 PM on 12/04/2008
- cowman I'm a Fan of cowman 6 fans permalink

Indeed. I suppose we should have seen his run-and-hide tendencies a little sooner when he ran and hid from the press.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:57 PM on 12/04/2008
- NoahVail I'm a Fan of NoahVail 56 fans permalink
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They should dump Her Majesty's tea into Lake Erie and send her representative back to the UK.

I imagine that they will have an easier time of it than George Washington did. Of course if they are complete geldings they can put up with this and sing "God Save the Queen." Oh, I forgot, Canadians are complete geldings.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:41 PM on 12/04/2008
- PSM42 I'm a Fan of PSM42 20 fans permalink
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Well that might be true, if unkind. But not if you are talking from south of the border. The Canadians may have been geldings for a day or two. But the USans have been well and truly gelded for eight years. If stereotypes are true we hope the Canadians will 'oh so politely' stuff Harper to use an Aussie term. :-)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:12 PM on 12/04/2008
- NoahVail I'm a Fan of NoahVail 56 fans permalink
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Just "yanking" your chains.... Usually you folks are way smarter than us Yanks.

So why did you swing to the right in the first place?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:47 PM on 12/04/2008
- Daksian I'm a Fan of Daksian 3 fans permalink

*snorts* You speak as if the Queen of England actually has power in Canada. The GG position is mostly symbolic, and is a Canadian citizen, not a British citizen. The GG does not do the bidding of the Queen.

And we 'complete geldings' burned down your precious White House when your country tried to inflict tyranny upon us. A bit more dramatic than dumping tea, I think.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:05 PM on 12/04/2008
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