Franken Scores: More Ballots Found In Democratic Stronghold

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First Posted: 12- 5-08 12:40 PM   |   Updated: 01- 5-09 05:12 AM

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Days after it was reported that 133 ballots were missing in the Minneapolis portion of the Minnesota Senate recount, local officials in the city said they had discovered a misplaced stack of ballots. Democratic sources in the state, meanwhile, say that this group of votes were not counted on the day of the election, meaning they will have a larger effect on the outcome of the recount.

By mid-day Friday a spokesperson for the city, Matt Laible, said that the envelope contained about 10 absentee ballots -- a small number compared to the total number of votes casts in the state, but potentially very significant. An hour or so later, Marc Elias, Franken's lawyer, declared that with all precincts recounted the campaign's internal numbers had them ahead by a mere four votes.

"We are moving on to the next stage of the process," said Elias. "We are not declaring victory."

As such, the findings of the missing absentee ballots -- which Laible said would not be tallied immediately -- are being cheered by Al Franken's campaign not merely because they come from a deeply Democratic area of the city and promise to bolster the vote total of the Democratic challenger. But over the past few weeks, the Franken team has been arguing that the recount process must be more comprehensive and thorough. Indeed, on a conference call with reporters, Elias announced that the campaign was sending a letter to officials in the state's 87 counties, urging them to redouble their efforts to look into missing ballots, including improperly rejected absentee ballots.

Earlier in the week, election officials discovered more than 170 ballots in Ramsey County that, once counted, added 37 votes to Franken's total. The disappearance of 133 ballots from Minneapolis, however, has thrust both campaigns into full-on political hysteria. During a conference call on Thursday, aides to Franken argued that the disappearance of these votes would effectively throw the election to Sen. Norm Coleman.

The Coleman camp's response, meanwhile, was a bit more confused. The Senator's lawyer, Fritz Knaak, declared on Thursday that they did "not know that there are any ballots missing, and it is premature and simply irresponsible to suggest that they are."

At the same time, the local press was reporting that instead of accidentally counting 133 ballots twice on Election Day (the alternative explanation for why those votes had gone missing) local officials had determined a single envelope of ballots was in fact missing.

This was the second time Knaak had misstated a recount-related issue. Four days after the election, he declared that a Minneapolis elections director had ridden around the city with 32 ballots in her car -- raising questions of her integrity -- when she discovered them after the election. It turned out, however, that the ballots had been transported properly back to Minneapolis City Hall from a precinct, before briefly being misplaced.

UPDATE: Talking Points Memo quotes a local election official saying that, if the state can't find the 133 ballots that are missing in Minneapolis, they may simply include the Election Night total for the precinct in place of a recount total. This would be a big victory for Franken as well, as he would "avoid losing a net 46 votes if [the ballots] were disregarded."

Days after it was reported that 133 ballots were missing in the Minneapolis portion of the Minnesota Senate recount, local officials in the city said they had discovered a misplaced stack of ballots. ...
Days after it was reported that 133 ballots were missing in the Minneapolis portion of the Minnesota Senate recount, local officials in the city said they had discovered a misplaced stack of ballots. ...
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- GravitonX I'm a Fan of GravitonX 70 fans permalink
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Deeply Democratic? Um, Black? LOL!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:33 AM on 12/08/2008
- spiffarino I'm a Fan of spiffarino 10 fans permalink

You got a problem with that?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:32 AM on 12/08/2008

This is so incredible... look at what the ATM
machines can do and give you a reciept for it?? Why can't we vote and get a reciept for it......... Why is this so hard???

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:05 AM on 12/08/2008

Check out www.truvote.com

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:57 AM on 12/08/2008
- booboo111 I'm a Fan of booboo111 85 fans permalink
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I've been saying that forever!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:07 PM on 12/08/2008

It's past time for Congress to pass some election laws that would apply to every State.

#1-Require every County in every State use optical scanning ballots so that a "paper trail"
exists after the election.

#2-Require descriptive posters be posted at every precinct describing how the block or circle should be filled in. No arrows, no circling the name, fill in the block or circle with your choice.

#3-Require all political parties that have a candidate in a race to designate a representative to ride with the person or persons delivering the ballots to the facility where they are to be counted.

With our technology, why is it so hard in this Country to have an election and count the votes?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:29 AM on 12/08/2008
- spiffarino I'm a Fan of spiffarino 10 fans permalink

Better yet, hand-count all ballots with verification by all affected political parties plus a neutral observer (BoE professional, judge, etc.).

Why use any computers at all? There is nothing in the Constitution that requires us to have instant results. If you need to know who likely won, check the exit polls. With about a 1% margin of error, that'll give impatient people a pacifier while their votes are being counted.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:36 AM on 12/08/2008
- shanefish I'm a Fan of shanefish 10 fans permalink
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That would be great but for the fact that for some odd reason (like maybe a stolen election or two) the exit polls have been way off in the last few presidential elections. I think the repubs have been "stashing" votes since Nixon.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:18 PM on 12/08/2008

Don't like missing ballots all of a sudden turning up AFTER the election. Doesn't matter which politician/what political party is involved, things aint looking kosher.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:40 AM on 12/08/2008
- WSAY I'm a Fan of WSAY 38 fans permalink
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Yeah! Lets not elect people based on the vote. Lets "elect" whoever was mistakenly announced. You must be a Republican. This is what we did in Iraq, too. We made a mistake, but damn it, we are sticking to that mistake!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:17 AM on 12/08/2008

Does anyone really believe they count "all " the votes anywhere?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:12 AM on 12/08/2008
- WSAY I'm a Fan of WSAY 38 fans permalink
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So we should do what? They are trying to count all the votes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:18 AM on 12/08/2008
- Sparty1 I'm a Fan of Sparty1 19 fans permalink

Ugh. This is just draining. I need to know how they keep 'discovering' ballots a full month after the election.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:26 AM on 12/08/2008
- WSAY I'm a Fan of WSAY 38 fans permalink
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Through recount.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:18 AM on 12/08/2008
- spiffarino I'm a Fan of spiffarino 10 fans permalink

It's simple. The whole process is a mess. There need to be national standards for elections, hand-counts, pure paper. No more computers.

I have worked in IT for over twenty years. Any computer program can be compromised. You do not want computers counting your votes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:39 AM on 12/08/2008
- shanefish I'm a Fan of shanefish 10 fans permalink
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I am in agreement, there must be a better way. There's more security when getting a dang driver's license.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:20 PM on 12/08/2008
- mtracy9 I'm a Fan of mtracy9 242 fans permalink

We can't let the Republicans steal another election, as they did with Bush in Florida in 2000, and with Bush in Ohio in 2004.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:57 AM on 12/08/2008
- joocee102 I'm a Fan of joocee102 3 fans permalink
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I swear I saw a box of ballets in car with a bumper sticker that said McCain Palin 08

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:43 AM on 12/08/2008
- huffyjive I'm a Fan of huffyjive 6 fans permalink
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Funny how these ballots seem to keep turning up...
MN=corruption...Al will fit right in.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:52 PM on 12/07/2008

Yeah, who can trust that Frankin -- what with his history of stealing all his jokes from Bill O'Reilly?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:20 AM on 12/08/2008
- WSAY I'm a Fan of WSAY 38 fans permalink
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Funny how you just say things you can't support. Just how is MN corrupt? Corruption would be if they said "to hell with all the votes that were not counted properly." Corruption would be eight years of Bush.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:20 AM on 12/08/2008
- flatus I'm a Fan of flatus 37 fans permalink
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Just another post from someone who greatly appreciates living in a country that allows him to vote against his own best interests.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:42 PM on 12/08/2008
- brantl I'm a Fan of brantl 6 fans permalink

Nah, Coleman already fits right in. Ask about that money that the Colemans got from that out of state company.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:52 PM on 12/08/2008
- Hydra8 I'm a Fan of Hydra8 11 fans permalink
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Do you think perhaps they may have these votes counted by the next election? I have never heard of such a slow state that has taken over 1 month now to complete its job. I am surprised they even discovered the ballots were missing. How totally inept are they? Buy some machines next time instead of holding up the whole country waiting for a final count. I hope Franklin wins in the end.

Buy some machines, think A U T O M A T I O N.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:26 PM on 12/07/2008

With a machine -- this would be over and whomever had better relationship with the polling machine company would win.

The good thing about looking for missing ballots, is that they aren't a bunch of digits on a hard drive that got flipped with no trace.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:20 AM on 12/08/2008
- spiffarino I'm a Fan of spiffarino 10 fans permalink

You have no idea what you are asking for.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:40 AM on 12/08/2008

yes, there's been flawless counting of votes with automated machines, right?

They had over 2 million votes to recount and not all counties started on the same day. Plus, they counted for six hours a day. All and all, this process worked fine and found irregularities so ordinary, it's laughable that people are claiming Al is trying to steal this election. The mistakes made in elections nationwide are simply amplified here because the total is so close.

I hope Al wins in the end, but if he doesn't, I am confident MN did a superb job in following the law in this recount.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:38 PM on 12/08/2008
- brantl I'm a Fan of brantl 6 fans permalink

Sorry, the machines have been a train wreck. Go to www.blackboxvoting.org and get an education on the voting machine blunders. (If they were mistakes, and maybe they weren't.)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:57 PM on 12/08/2008
- groot I'm a Fan of groot 3 fans permalink

more ballots found in a democratic stronghold? i am shocked, SHOCKED!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:26 PM on 12/07/2008
- WSAY I'm a Fan of WSAY 38 fans permalink
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What are you suggesting? Support it, Republican! You are all talk and propaganda.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:21 AM on 12/08/2008

The Repubs have nothing to report. Just like the phony ballots found in the trunk of a car story, they're desperate to make normal errors seem like dirty politics.

It's all they have left - crying and whining.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:39 PM on 12/08/2008
- Hobay I'm a Fan of Hobay 4 fans permalink

Franken is no clown. He is a brilliant thinker who decided to move from complaining about government to participating in it. He is an American in the truest sense of the word. He took on the evil Rush Limbaugh when others would not. His candidacy is a tribute to the great Wellstone--no less. I fitting tribute. Well done, Mr. Franken.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:55 PM on 12/07/2008

+Hobay

no point in trying to have an honest discussion with the republican trolls

the republican trolls are the biggest hypocrites -- they pretend to shun "celebrity," yet it there are more republicans who have been actors, comediens, beauty contestants ... et. cet. to go into politics than Democratic politicians

the republicans loved to boast about Sarah Palin "oh now we have our own celebrity," "oh now we have someone who is popular and can draw big crowds,"

republicans are full of crap and their brand of dog food just ain't gonna sell ... Americans are not buying the republicans fake moral values, and the idiotic republican rhetoric that "only republicans can be strong on the economy and keep America safe," crap anymore

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:33 PM on 12/07/2008
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Minnesota is strange. They elected Paul Wellstone (brilliant choice--the most progressive Senator in recent times) and they elected Jesse Ventura (who made the state a national joke). Now they can't decide between two different kinds of clowns, both with Texas size egos. If there are missing ballots, the reasonable solution is to have a new election. And maybe add a couple of reasonable candidates.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:44 PM on 12/07/2008

I don't know who is more inept: MN state officials for not knowing how to properly count votes, the GOP for failing to put away the election for Norm, or the Dems for always seeming to lose votes at crucial times.
http://democralypsenow.blogspot.com/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:46 PM on 12/07/2008

Dems lost Dem votes????

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:56 PM on 12/07/2008

No -- the election officials are misplacing votes. No "Dem" or Republican should be running around with them in a shoe box.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:22 AM on 12/08/2008
- nick1936 I'm a Fan of nick1936 17 fans permalink

It appears that the one that is most inept here HP they keep posting different results first Al is behind then Al is ahead why don't we just turn this whole thing over to the new Senate

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:03 PM on 12/07/2008
- madtom I'm a Fan of madtom 40 fans permalink
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Is a revote possible?

This is too close for either candidate to claim the Senate seat with full legitimacy.

This is even too close for a recount, arguably.

Elections have always been slightly, very slightly, inaccurate -- there are miscounts, lost ballots, human errors -- if not worse -- but usually it doesn't matter because the error is many times smaller than the difference in vote totals.

But this is so close that no one will be able to say, honestly, with reasonable certainty, who won on November 4th.

I'm a Franken partisan, but I'm not sure I want him to win this seat in, say, a partisan Senate vote.

Revote, as in New Hampshire about 35 years ago?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:39 PM on 12/07/2008
- Pragmatus I'm a Fan of Pragmatus 3 fans permalink
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Unfortunately, the revote in New Hampshire in the 1970s was just short of a disaster.

It can be argued, persuasively, for my money, that in order to end the controversy, the US Senate should simply vote to seat whomever they choose. It would be no different that 2000, when the US Supreme Court, in the face of all precedent and law, reached into Florida's legal system to yank out a victory for George Bush and put an end to that squabbling. The GOP will cry and scream "Foul!", and weep and gnash their teeth--so what's new? They will anyway, if not over this issue then some other one.

Looked at objectively, this Senate race is essentially a tie, and no matter what the canvassing board says regarding who the winner is, it will end up in court. If I read the Constitution correctly, the MN court will have no choice but to pass the issue along to the US Senate to decide.

Al Franken will then have six years to prove himself, and if the people aren't satisfied with him, they can vote him out. There is a single Senate seat at stake, not a determination regarding how, when and where the world will end.
.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:20 PM on 12/07/2008

So your argument is since one department of the government cant properly count votes, we should have another section of government decide who should represent the voters? Are you kidding me?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:59 PM on 12/07/2008

Let's get the whole story. Al Gore campaign sued Florida counties for not "properly" counting ballots. Gore campaign also tried to invalidate absentee ballots from military personnel. The Florida Supreme Court was an embarrassment, changing the rules and and then changing them again. The U.S. Senate did not want to nor did it ever get involved.

Bush has been a disaster, but let's not conveniently forget that our ox also gets gored by THE TRUTH, and rightfully so.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:00 AM on 12/08/2008
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