Obama Birth-Certificate Suits Discussed On MSNBC

Yesterday, we mentioned how insane lawsuits about Barack Obama's natural live birth were creeping like cracked-out, pissed-off kudzu through our court system. One of them is headed to the Supreme Court today. We used words like "clown car," and "macadamia nuts" to discuss the matter, because we wanted to conjure up the appropriate metaphor to describe the ongoing craziness. But hey! We wouldn't want any of our readers to think that Serious Newsmen weren't taking this matter Deadly Seriously. So here's David Shuster and Peter Williams, talking about the matter, breathlessly. Here's my favorite part:

WILLIAMS: The question is what is a natural-born citizen? That's never been legally defined.

Yes! That's because the founders didn't envision the totally batshit citizens we have now! It goes on:

WILLIAMS: The Supreme Court seemed to say a couple of decades ago if you were native born that meant you were a natural born citizen. It's never been conclusively determined. So it's a close question, I guess. You could say it's ambiguous. Most scholars agree that the Supreme Court is not going to weigh in and overturn the votes of 44 million Americans unless it was absolutely crystal clear.

Emphasis mine. Because: Really?

Comments

[forseti]

I tried to post but was denied because of its length. Limiting each post to 250 words reduces the response posts to not much more than an exercise in cursory analysis. Anyone interested may read my full post at www.vibe.us . Thank you.

[AntonioSosa]

Why is it that no hospital in Hawaii has records of Obama being born there? Why has Obama spent more than $800,000 on three law firms (and thousands of tax payers" money) to fight the birth certificate issue rather than just show the certificate that indicates the hospital in which he was born?

Americans were FOOLED. Almost everything about Obama is FAKE, including possibly his birth certificate. The Obama image was manufactured by a very expensive campaign, financed with hundreds of millions of dollars, donated largely by U.S. enemies such as George Soros.

Brainwashed by the media, Americans became as foolish as the most ignorant Venezuelans, Bolivians and Ecuadorians who believed in CHANGE and YES WE CAN and now see that CHANGE means change toward Marxism, loss of freedom and rights, and greater poverty, despair and corruption. And YES WE CAN means Marxists like Castro, Chavez and Obama CAN fool people

It seems Soviet defector Yuri Bezmenov was right when he warned that, through media manipulation, Americans would be brainwashed and would allow their country to be taken over by Marxists: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k6KUDv1wzraWhwlBt1

If Obama does not meet Constitutional requirements to hold the office of President, the Court must decertify the election. Americans have the right to be protected from Marxists planted by U.S. enemies to destroy us.

[ObamasAFake]

Thank you AntonioSosa, atleast somebody can see there's something wrong here.
Let me put it to you this way all those who are still for this fake, unqualified president-elect. When I played Little League baseball years ago, my mother had to show my actual birth certificate. Not a print out, the actual document. Now, all Obama has to do is show the actual document, not a print out, how hard is it to go to your bank and retrieve it from your safety deposit box or wherever you keep that very important document? He is a fake, he's not fit to be president of this country, and those who oppose that statement are just ignorant or naieve. Why anyone would be so inspired by this man is beyond me, what has he done that qualifies him for the presidency anyway?

[LazyT]

INDONESIAN CITIZENSHIP:

Obama is not a citizen of Indonesia; nor does he have dual citizenship . Indonesia does not recognize dual citizenship.

Indonesian citizenship is given to:
A child born of the marriage of an Indonesian couple;
A child born of the marriage of an Indonesian man and foreign woman " the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born of the marriage of a foreign man and Indonesian woman, both of whom request Indonesian citizenship for their child " the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born to an unmarried Indonesian woman, the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born in Indonesian territory that is not provided with citizenship by his or her parents;
A child born in Indonesian territory whose parents are unknown;
A child born in Indonesian territory whose parents have no citizenship.
you can verify that here:
http://www.expat.or.id/info/revisiontocitizenshiplaw.html
and here
http://www.indonesiamatters.com/733/citizenship-law/

So as you can see it does not matter that he was adopted and went by his adopted name Barry Soetoro.

[LazyT]

BIRTH CERTIFICATE MATTERS:

There is nothing wrong with what Obama has provided. He does not need to supply a vaulted birth certificate. In Hawaii, a short form certificate is all that is necessary for any legal purposes. Finally, to put an end to all this foolishness: The State of Hawaii has declared that:
"There"s no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. Health Department Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama"s original birth certificate." Fukino says that no state official, including Republican Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama"s certificate be handled differently."

You can find the form that he had to use to get a verification of birth directly from the state of Hawaii right here: http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/pdf/birth.pdf

If you use your eyes, you will notice that the request for validation of birth looks suspiciously like the birth certificate that is provided

here: http://www.politifact.com:80/media/img/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg
or here: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

[LazyT]

U.S. SUPREME COURT FILINGS:

The U.S. Supreme court has better things to do then to give any validity to crazy conspiricies and are not based on any factual information. They will NEVER hear any of those cases because they are foolish.

FINALLY...

If there was one red spot on Obama's record ANY PLACE TO BE FOUND..........

HILLARY CLINTON WOULD HAVE FOUND IT

That woman is Brilliant and she wanted the position of President BAD. If it was dirt to be found. . . then you can bet your bottom dollar she would have found it.....used it...and would be President Elect today.

[LazyT]

I would like to address some issues because I am so tired of you people beating this dead horse.

KENYA

(1) Obama is not a citizen of Kenya; nor does he have dual citizenship there any longer. Kenya Constitution Section 97 (1) (6) (a) states that:

97. Dual citizenship
A person who, upon the attainment of the age of twenty-one years, is a citizen of Kenya and also a citizen of some country other than Kenya shall, subject to subsection (7), cease to be a citizen of Kenya upon the specified date unless he has renounced his citizenship of that other country, taken the oath of allegiance and, in the case of a person who was born outside Kenya. made and registered such declaration of his intentions concerning residence as may be prescribed by or under an Act of Parliament.

You can verify that here: http://kenya.rcbowen.com/constitution/chap6.html
or here:
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html
ay be prescribed by or under an Act of Parliament.

[LazyT]

OBAMA WENT TO A MADRASSA

No Obama went to a CATHOLIC School when he was in Indonesia

You can verify that here:

http://blog.changeandexperience.com/2008/08/barack-obamas-indonesian-registration.html

[kidflash]

I hate to say this but there is something implicitly racist about this whole line of attack by the conservatives. They are saying in a very subtle way that African-American are not quite as American as the rest of "us." There is a certain mindset that is willing to always accept that hateful and ignorant premise. Out of panic conservatives have resorted to the line of attack they are most familiar with - bigotry. (Although I mention conservatives one of the challengers of Obama's birth certificate is a Philip Berg who was a former Hillary Clinton supporter.)

[k4obama]

No one should be giving this ridiculous claim a moment of press time, print, blog or tv.

[JR-Vette]

Where's MikeFull(of s%it)??? SCOTUS dismissed the case!!!

[keepemhonest]

Mr. Williams, 63 Million people voted for Obama ... not just 44 million.

[bungalow]

All this craziness is a prelude to the right wing insisting that the Austrian-born Schwarzennegger, who managed to act his way into the governorship of California, is somehow qualified to run for president. They think he's Reaganesque, he's the only star they have, and it makes them nuts that he cannot run because of his birthplace.

[BryantG]

The more the right goes off the deep end the more irrevalent they become. Expect them to go form one contrived hairbrained issue to the next over the next four years.

[Newsmonger]

If you are born in the USA you are a Natural Born US citizen even both of you parents are illigal immigrates - we see that everyday with some illegal immigrates being forcefully separated from their US citizen children.

The requirement for at aleast one parent to be a US citizen is only applicable if one is borned outside the US.

Anyone that acquires his/her citizen from birth or by birth is a natural born citizen, if you acquired it via naturalization then you are not a natural born citizen.

The distinction between both is very clear and it has been very clear for a very very long time. The only problem is that, each election cycle, some people uses the publicity and attention given to the election to gain their own 15 minutes of fame. Going to Court Obama and McCain natural born status is all part of that 15 minutes of fame that will be over very soon.

The most important question is, what will these 15 minute fame seeker do for the next 4 or 8 years?

[emcd]

You are exactly right. And is it not also true that even if he were born outside the U.S. the fact that his mother was a US citizen would also make him one, no matter where he was born?

[eden4barack08]

No, unless it was on US territory, such as a military base or islands, otherwise one is just a US citizen, but not natural born.

[Flagrantlover]

In my opinion, Barack is so much better than the other candidates, that I wouldn't be against having him as President even if he were born in Saudi Arabia.

[Nikola Tesla]

At least someone born in Saudi Arabia would have a clue.

[Badfickle]

I thought this was all just right wing nutjobs but look! Here's a copy of Obama's Kenyan birth records!

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/4918/colmkbtwluu9.gif

[armadillious2002]

You were correct the first time - it is just right wing batshit nutjobs.

[BryantG]

Man, a lot of hate goes into spending the time to whip up that document. Have you ever thought about seing a therapist?

[skunky93]

i thought it was hysterical! lol

It's called sarcastic humor people...geez.

[LeftRight]

That's HILARIOUS!!!

[harriettubman]

This is asinine if you ask me. You're born on American soil and just because one of your parent's is foreign born, your citizenship is challenged? They need to go after illegal aliens for this, not Americans.

[drock973]

I read up a lot about this case that the Court is conferencing on in the past few hours, not because I believe it but because I find it interesting.

This is no the Berg case alleging that he was born in Africa and that his BC is a fake that there's some grand conspiracy to cover it all up. The case that the Court is considering alleges none of that. In fact, they admit he was born in Hawaii. What it alleges is that because his father was a citizen of Kenya and Kenya was still at the time a British colony, that the laws at the time would have made him a dual citizen of both the US and UK/Kenya and therefore he is not a natural born American citizen.

The lawsuit also challenges the natural born status of John McCain and Roger Calero, who was the Socialist Worker's Party candidate. The challenge against McCain is that he was born in the Panama Canal Zone and the one against Calero is that he was born in Nicaragua and is not even a citizen but a green card holder.

I hope people find this useful because there's a lot of confusion here about what this case is all about.

[harriettubman]

It was VERY useful, thanks.

[eden4barack08]

First of all dual citizenship does not cancel out the "natural born" citizenship. Second, if that's the case, then that would have ruled out almost all our forefathers, whose parents were British, but they were born on US soil. So, thanks for the clarification, but it's still nonsense, maybe even more so.

[LiberalBuzz]

I realize the actual court case but the thing about it, is that the SCOTUS settled this issue back in 1898

United States v. Wong Kim Ark

In it the SCOTUS determined that it made NO difference to PARENTAGE, only to GEOGRAPHY and that anyone

ANYONE

Born in the USA was an American Citizen.

[care4mypeeps]

This Matter has Nothing to do with Barack being a Natural born citizen it has Everything to do with a Black Man being President of the United States of America.

Let's just call it what it is. Racism is so Nausiating to me because I just don't get it.
Why is the color of anyone's skin a basis to Hate and Keep them Down.

Why is it so hard to call people on their bigotry? Lets not allow them to get away with
this without putting in back on them and Challenging them to do better.

Chris, Keith and Rachel where are you at on this one?

ENOUGH ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[iamapatriot]

This issue is about the possiblity of Barack Obama being born in Kenya, not Hawaii. To my knowledge he has been asked to deny that he was born in Kenya, and he has not denied it. Please correct me if I'm wrong. The buzz on the blogosphere is that the "Hawaiian" birth certificate could well be a photoshop mock-up. Of course if he was born in Hawaii, he is natural born! But if he was born in Kenya............

[hortonhearsawho]

Real Patriots don't use "if"....gop fake.

[LadyS]

Buzz in the blogosphere? That is what you are basing your opinion on? I could post anything on my blog and it does not necessarily mean that it is true.
As for all the lawsuits: It is not up to Obama to prove them wrong. The people that initiated the lawsuits are the ones with the burden of proof.
Berg is the one that has to prove his assertions. Donofrio is the one that has to prove his arguments. They are the ones that are charged with the burden of proof, the the accused.

[snarkopolitan]

That's called "Not dignifying it with a comment." Getting drawn into kwazy kwicksand of the sort you're shoveling is worthless. The man's your president, God help him.

[Badfickle]

factcheck.org and a couple other neutral fact checking organizations have SEEN the ACTUAL document and have touched it and seen the seals and have compared it to other documents form the time.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

But facts don't matter once people get a conspiracy theroy stuck in their craw.

[Onpage17]

You are so smart....So the whole state of Hawaii is lying. The FBI and CIA is lying. You sitting at your computer must have the answers to EVERYTHING cause you obviously know EVERYTHING. Please do tell...1. the powerball numbers for this week and 2. where is Bin Laden???

[hortonhearsawho]

exactly,pure and simple racism.

[BygonesGone]

We have no idea who Barack Obama is. The Supreme Court asked him to produce a valid birth certificate by December 1st. He didn't do it. He just showed up, from nowhere. Who is he?

[avicenna]

the messiah?

[RainDance33]

He's your new President come 20 January. And if you need more information than that you should have been paying attention during the last 18 months. Heck, I know more about Obama than I know about my next door neighbour. Anyway, who are you? Rip Van Winkle?

[LadyS]

Obama was not asked to produce anything on December 1st. The only thing that date signifies was the last day for any filings.

[snarkopolitan]

That looks about exactly like my birth certificate. I got a passport with mine, but none of us have the security clearance Obama does--the highest in the land. That should tell you that the CIA, FBI, NIA and Secret Service have seen all the documents they need to. That would be considered a gold standard by anybody who doesn't go in for tinfoil millinary.

Obama has no obligation to show anything to hostile flat-earthers such as you.

[truthynesslover]

Did you take your medication today?

[Nikola Tesla]

Its NOT racism. The problem is that he is a DEMOCRAT!

The thugs believe they have a natural born right to the white house. They would have NO PROBLEM if the seat were held by a black republican. Quit living in the past. America has moved on, you should too.

[LadyS]

This has been so beaten to death.
First: Only two cases were granted cert on Friday. Neither one was Donofrio's case. The full USSC orders will be published on Monday. The disposition of his petition will be known then.
According to the 14th Amendment and USSC case law (US v Wong Kim Ark) anyone born in the United States and it's territories is a native (read: natural) born ciitzen.
Obama was born in Hawai'i, ergo he is a natural born citizen.
US Codes and statues do address the dual citizenship issue. If a child acquired dual citizenship at birth, it does not affect natural born status if he or she was born in the US.
So unless British and Kenyan law now supersede US law, there is no case to be found.