More Minnesota Absentee Ballots Found; Franken Makes Major Push

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First Posted: 12-11-08 01:23 PM   |   Updated: 01-11-09 05:12 AM

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The Minnesota Senate recount campaign has firmly entered its legal stages, with Al Franken's chief counsel sending a lengthy and sharply argued memorandum to the Secretary of State's office on Thursday making the case for counting a group of contested absentee ballots.

The newsworthy thrust of David Lillehaug's 39-page brief for Secretary of State Mark Ritchie was the direct highlighting of 62 individual cases where voters were either "erroneously rejected by election officials for not being registered," or their absentee ballots were wrongfully rejected.

Around the same time that this memo was made public, local reports emerged that put the number of potentially wrongfully rejected absentee ballots at approximately 2,000 -- far greater than the 500 to 1,000 range that has been previously cited.

"Ballots that were not rejected by local or county officials for one of the four statutory reasons are not 'rejected' ballots under Minnesota law, but rather are 'uncounted' ballots," wrote Lillehaug. Later he added, "State procedure and past practice plainly require that all uncounted ballots that have not been rejected be counted, even if they were previously left uncounted at an earlier stage of the process. Counties are responsible for locating such ballots and counting them."

Whether or not the state decides to count the group of absentee ballots that didn't meet any of the four established criteria for rejection will likely determine the election's outcome. All other ballots are known as belonging to "Pile 5."

Franken's campaign contends that, following the hand recount and assuming that no challenges will be upheld, they will end the process up by a mere four votes. The campaign is still, nevertheless, pushing for Ritchie to count the contested group of absentee ballots, noting that many came from Democratic strongholds.

"In recent days, Minneapolis has conceded 171 ballots belong in so-called 'Pile 5,' and the Ramsey County elections official has stated publicly that 100 ballots were erroneously rejected in that county," wrote Lillehaug.

"Once a state has created the right to vote by absentee ballot and established certain governing rules for the process, it cannot retroactively deprive those voters who have substantially complied with the process of their right to have their ballots counted," Lillehaug concludes.

To get a sense of just how hotly contested the legal arguments surrounding this issue have become, Lillehaug referenced, in his memo, court rules and legislative actions that stemmed from the mid-19th Century.

A state decision in 1887, he writes, "recodified the election laws and imposed a duty on the state canvassing board to certify a 'correct' report." Earlier he dismissed court decisions from 1858 (O'Ferrall v Colby) and another from 1865 (Taylor v. Taylor), which have been used to argue against counting the rejected absentee ballots.

On Friday, Minnesota's state canvassing boards will ultimately decided on whether this group of ballots will be counted in the final recount tally.

The Minnesota Senate recount campaign has firmly entered its legal stages, with Al Franken's chief counsel sending a lengthy and sharply argued memorandum to the Secretary of State's office on Thursda...
The Minnesota Senate recount campaign has firmly entered its legal stages, with Al Franken's chief counsel sending a lengthy and sharply argued memorandum to the Secretary of State's office on Thursda...
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- ron071 I'm a Fan of ron071 11 fans permalink

It is a sad comentary to realize that in 2008 in America a simple counting of votes cannot be reliably achieved. The hypcrisy is that WE go and scrutinize fair voting in other countries. This has now become a joke.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:14 PM on 12/11/2008
- Durango I'm a Fan of Durango 147 fans permalink

Ever worked an election?

Do you have any idea how to handle disputes?

This has all been fair and above board. Both sides are exercising their rights to make challenges and arguments on disputes regarding the election.

And courts will ultimately make some of the decisions. As well as the responsible officials.

You did read the article? You do realize that election law precedents in Minnesota date back to at least 1858?

This is how you do things in the civilized world.

It may not be fast. It may not be pretty.

But it sure looks above board and fair to me.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:23 PM on 12/11/2008
- cjgnew I'm a Fan of cjgnew 6 fans permalink

Due-process is being adhered to, to the letter. The i's are being dotted and the t's are being crossed. We should have a winner soon based on a totally fair process. Despite that, those who have absolutely no idea what elections are like in other countries will still find something to complain about, for it's in their nature to complain about everything, especially if they feel that their candidate may end up on the losing end. The Minnesota election is so close that the difference between the two candidates comes down to less than .03 percent out of a total of approximately two million five hundred thousand votes. Therefore, the system not only works but it is almost perfect.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:31 PM on 12/11/2008

What's unreliable about this recount? Each and every vote is being scrutinized. They may have a disagreement, but each vote is present and accounted for. Your comment is the joke.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:03 PM on 12/11/2008
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American needs Senator FRANKEN !

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:13 PM on 12/11/2008

Even if Senator Franken and his troupe are stealing the election?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:18 PM on 12/11/2008
- WriterGuy I'm a Fan of WriterGuy 10 fans permalink

No one is stealing anything. This is just a matter of counting. Fairly and accurately.
Don't know why it's so hard to do that if you're a Republican.

The only stealing of elections that's been going on has been by the GOP through the systematic purges of voter rolls of people with names SIMILAR to those of convicted felons. That's stealing!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:30 PM on 12/11/2008
- jbeach I'm a Fan of jbeach 16 fans permalink

"Even if Senator Coleman and his troupe are stealing the election?"

Fixed your comment for you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:30 PM on 12/11/2008

What's your objection to counting all the votes? I don't see the reasoning beyond "but my guy might not win".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:32 PM on 12/11/2008
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Funny thing about dumb azzed tro lls like needshuntingdown. They are just typical of the GOP and all of it's supporters

They just LIE all the time.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:36 PM on 12/11/2008

Coleman has challenged more ballots than Franken, How is a state law that forces a recount in this situation stealing?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:36 PM on 12/11/2008

Oh gee... more ballots! Imaging that! And there absentee (again). Familiar ACORN move.. create more absentee ballots to try to get to that magic number. Ony problem is that now with all these absentee ballots "found" , there's more than were sent out.

Give it up Al. The nation is on to your voter fraud.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:13 PM on 12/11/2008
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Read the damn article. It says nothing about "more ballots". Sheesh, what is wrong with you people when you can't even be bothered to read the article before posting?

There is nothing nefarious about the absentee ballots, even though you would like to think there is.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:21 PM on 12/11/2008
- StellaRay I'm a Fan of StellaRay 220 fans permalink

Reading articles spoils a troll's party. They are happiest when they don't know what they're talking about. They jump up and down on their squat, fat little legs, they whistle through the holes where their teeth should be, and drool and spit with glee. Throw a couple of facts at them and they get all moody and pouty and whine that you're a party pooper.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:33 PM on 12/11/2008
- Durango I'm a Fan of Durango 147 fans permalink

ACORN?

You really need to quit listening to talk radio.

And turn off Fox.

I'll bet your community has a nice library. Go there. Do some reading.

You need it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:24 PM on 12/11/2008
- Lion24 I'm a Fan of Lion24 161 fans permalink
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Is it getting chilly in your mother's basement? Just wondering.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:27 PM on 12/11/2008

For the record...

If YOU voted absentee and you found out that YOUR ballot was valid but was rejected by mistake, would YOU be fine with it not being counted, even after it was discovered that it was wrongly rejected.

Please answer, I'm dying to hear what you have to say.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:30 PM on 12/11/2008
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Don't hold your breath. Tr00ls like this don't answer questions. They just make dumb statements and expect everyone to believe them. It's an ego thing for them.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:53 PM on 12/11/2008
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Try reading the article before posting. Then you won't sound like an i d i o t. No one has created any new absentee ballots. They have just discovered that more than they thought of the 6,000 discarded absentee ballots are really valid votes.

What is wrong with you right wingers that you can't be bothered to read a post before replying?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:31 PM on 12/11/2008
- nick1936 I'm a Fan of nick1936 17 fans permalink

Norm is going to get indited

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:06 PM on 12/11/2008
- dannneeboy I'm a Fan of dannneeboy 3 fans permalink

I love Al Franken.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:05 PM on 12/11/2008
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Ditto

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:08 PM on 12/11/2008
- Wildofski I'm a Fan of Wildofski 15 fans permalink
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Mega-Dittos

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:19 PM on 12/11/2008
- JGatsby I'm a Fan of JGatsby 31 fans permalink
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I think he's a great comedian. And I loved the HBO special he did highlighting what an a** Oreilley made of himself trying to take Franken to court. But I always felt that it was a bit presumptuous of Franken to try and transition from comic to Senator, especially Senator from Minnesota. I think if someone more mainstream had run they would have won easily on Obama's coat tails. Having said that I love the way Franken is pushing this. If only Gore or Kerry had done this. Franken's biggest contribution may be to highlight how the GOP try to steal elections, not just through fraud but by disenfranchising dems. Go Al.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:35 PM on 12/11/2008
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Franken would have won easily if it wasn't for the third party candidate who pulled votes away from him.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:54 PM on 12/11/2008
- Tulka2 I'm a Fan of Tulka2 289 fans permalink
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Both parties should let the generally decent volunteers who run the "on the ground" elections in Minnisota figure it out.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:01 PM on 12/11/2008
- Durango I'm a Fan of Durango 147 fans permalink

"Figuring it out" is what the courts are for.

At least in civilized society. That is how you settle disputes.

"What we lawyers want to do is to substitute courts for carnage, dockets for rockets, briefs for bombs, warrants for warheads, mandates for missiles."
Charles Ryne

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:29 PM on 12/11/2008
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Minnesota: The NEW Florida!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:00 PM on 12/11/2008
- minnelusa I'm a Fan of minnelusa 2 fans permalink

new Florida ? Not by any stretch of your imagination.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:05 PM on 12/11/2008
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No way, Minnesota is a great state. Been there done that. Florida is disgusting.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:09 PM on 12/11/2008

Only on HUFFPO can you find this many people who can look at this circus and deduce that it's the Republicans who are trying to "steal" this election. It's the Franken camp who seems to "find" all the votes and amazingly enough, they seem to benefit him. Why don't they just tell them how many it will take and let em find that many. This is getting tiresome.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:59 PM on 12/11/2008

Not so amazing when you think about it. The Republican's are the ones LOSING THEM accidently on purpose.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:08 PM on 12/11/2008
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Gee... wonder why that is? No oversight means ballots from Democratic areas being left in envelopes and "misplaced." Scrutiny by the government, the media, members of both campaigns, and the nation at large has them suddenly being found. Do you blame auto theft victims when the police find their cars?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:12 PM on 12/11/2008

No, you leftists usually blame the police and help the car thieves sue the city for profiling

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:19 PM on 12/11/2008

sorry, I don't buy that. You guys (libs) paint conservatives as too stupid to come in out of the rain, but in the next breath say that we are so cunning as to "magically" cause votes to vanish. I guess it's that "vast right-wing conspiracy" thing all over again. I'm amazed at how smart we really must be.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:29 PM on 12/11/2008
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Why don't you bother to read the article before you spout off. It is not about "found" ballots, but about the fact that more absentee ballots seem to be legitimate than originally thought.

The other votes that were really found, were not found by Franken but by poll workers.

You are the one who is getting tiresome. It's pretty funny how none of the right wingers here even bothered to read the article. They just assumed Franken had done something nefarious and then they end up sounding like idiots because they are lazy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:23 PM on 12/11/2008
- jbeach I'm a Fan of jbeach 16 fans permalink

Gee. Maybe that's because Coleman has no interest in finding new ballots, because he knows they'll cause him to lose?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:32 PM on 12/11/2008

they are finding what republicans probably "lost" and Why would Coleman look for lost ballots, he is ahead, he wouldnt want to taint his lead with democratic votes that were placed aside

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:39 PM on 12/11/2008
- max I'm a Fan of max 13 fans permalink
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this is getting stupid

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:57 PM on 12/11/2008
- Indubio I'm a Fan of Indubio 25 fans permalink

The thing is this: There will be no clear winner in this election. End of discussion. Even if Coleman or Franken wins by a few hundred votes, the degree of victory is within the statistical margin of error for the human tabulation of ballots. In other words, a win by by either man with less than ~.05% of the tabulated votes could be demonstrated to be a statistical tie. Any effort by the Secretary of State to declare a winner would thus be challenged and rightful so. In Minnesota guess how ties are resolved? A coin toss. Yes... that it. The future of the state and nation is decided by the toss of a coin. And Minnesota is considered to have one of the more enlightened systems in America. Isn't that nice...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:50 PM on 12/11/2008
- indypete I'm a Fan of indypete 157 fans permalink
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Yike!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:51 PM on 12/11/2008
- donaldw6 I'm a Fan of donaldw6 357 fans permalink
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I believe that would be in an actual, physical tie, not a "statistical" one. If Franken wins by four votes after all this recounting, then after legal challenges are exhausted, he will have won.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:22 PM on 12/11/2008
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Not true. The way the law is written in Minn is that if they are within a certain margin, they must do a hand count. But once the hand count is completed, whomever has the most votes win, even if it is by one vote. I suspect you won't like it, but that is the law in Minn.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:25 PM on 12/11/2008
- WriterGuy I'm a Fan of WriterGuy 10 fans permalink

This is why we need instant run-offs -- where you indicate your top favorite, second-place and third-place choices. There is no doubt as to the winner, and no need for a run-off election. It works all over the world where it's used (and in select US cities, too).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:33 PM on 12/11/2008
- newshawk14 I'm a Fan of newshawk14 8 fans permalink

I do hope that Al Franken squeaks through, as I feel he is the more qualified candidate, but it also
looks like Senator Coleman could be facing a serious FBI probe into some of his financial dealings.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:46 PM on 12/11/2008

Oh goody!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:09 PM on 12/11/2008
- vegas9999 I'm a Fan of vegas9999 6 fans permalink

MORE QUALIFIED?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:09 PM on 12/11/2008
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He certainly couldn't be more qualified than Coleman who takes free rent and free clothes and then has a buddy funnel him $75,000 through his wife. Yeah right, Franken definitely is less qualified than Coleman.

Coleman is a crook, plain and simple and it looks like he has finally been caught.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:26 PM on 12/11/2008
- teasley I'm a Fan of teasley 7 fans permalink

How is this for an idea?(I fully expect some interesting responses.)No voting by mail, No absentee votes. (except military) You take the time to go to a polling place. You present your picture ID (for those who just can't pull together $15 or $20 the government can supply one.) You then get to dip your finger in indelible ink. (you would no longer need to wear an I voted sticker.) It works in the third world, perhaps it would even work here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:41 PM on 12/11/2008
- Missmn I'm a Fan of Missmn 2 fans permalink

I personally think we should go back to dropping rocks into buckets, and whoever's bucket has the most rocks wins....

What you are proposing still doesn't settle the matter of really close (statistically tied) elections and recounts. That is what we are dealing with here in Minnesota, regardless of what anyone says. This election so far, has been too close to call difinitively, and some process problems (missing votes, incorrectly rejected absentee ballots) have made it even harder. One thing this experience has done is to highlight some areas where Minnesota election law needs clarifying.

Additionally, you cannot discriminate against the infirm, against election judges, or those who must be away from their polling place on election day: this means no getting rid of absentee ballots.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:54 PM on 12/11/2008
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I see and then how are all the people in hospitals and convalescent homes going to vote? How is someone who is bedridden going to vote? How is someone who will be out of the country at the time of the election vote?

Why are you advocating people having to stand in line in the middle of winter for hours simply to exercise their right to vote.

Vote by mail is the answer. It disenfranchises no one and it works.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:27 PM on 12/11/2008
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I just read this on Daily KOS:

:The campaign of Sen. Norm Coleman (R-Minn.) is calling for 133 ballots that apparently went missing in a Minneapolis precinct not to be part of the ongoing recount between Coleman and Democrat Al Franken."

These are the votes that have already been counted. They were packet 1 of 5. Packets 2 of 5, 3 of 5, etc are still there, just the first packet is missing. So Coleman is saying that because some worker misplaced 133 votes that were already counted, they should not be recounted. He wants to disenfranchise another 133 voters.

How the Republicans can't see something wrong with this kind of an attitude is beyond me. I know that they are a "win at all costs" party, but things like this are so obviously wrong and they don't care.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:40 PM on 12/11/2008
- myoungholt I'm a Fan of myoungholt 22 fans permalink

Oh, darn it. They found Packet 1 of 5. I told you to hide it better.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:43 PM on 12/11/2008
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No, they have not found it. But they are going to enter the original vote into the system. That is what Coleman is protesting. He wants all 133 votes to be discarded because some vote worker misplaced the packet.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:29 PM on 12/11/2008
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Why doesn't someone from Chicago go up there and straighten out this mess?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:36 PM on 12/11/2008
- bannorhill I'm a Fan of bannorhill 33 fans permalink

Why doesn't Al just move to Illinois where he could buy a seat for much less than what he spent on this campaign?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:30 PM on 12/11/2008
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Why don't you go stick your head up your a$$ where it belongs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:37 PM on 12/11/2008

You did notice that it didn't work, right?

OR DOES THAT MAKE YOUR JOKE FAIL?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:44 PM on 12/11/2008
- Missmn I'm a Fan of Missmn 2 fans permalink

What exactly has Mr. Franken done wrong here? Please be specific in your accusations, and provide proof of wrongdoing. I'm certain law enforcement would like to know if any laws have been broken. Or, do you just feel better about your own existence by making blanket and unprovable accusations against decent people?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:56 PM on 12/11/2008

It's hard to believe that world civilization ever went through a period called "The Enlightenment."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:12 PM on 12/11/2008
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