Prop. 8 Sponsors Seek To Nullify 18,000 Gay Marriages

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LISA LEFF | 12/20/08 09:36 AM | AP

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SAN FRANCISCO — The sponsors of Proposition 8 asked the California Supreme Court on Friday to nullify the marriages of the estimated 18,000 same-sex couples who exchanged vows before voters approved the ballot initiative that outlawed gay unions.

The Yes on 8 campaign filed a brief arguing that because the new law holds that only marriages between a man and a woman are recognized or valid in California, the state can no longer recognize the existing same-sex unions. The document reveals for the first time that opponents of same-sex marriage will fight in court to undo those unions that already exist.

"Proposition 8's brevity is matched by its clarity. There are no conditional clauses, exceptions, exemptions or exclusions," reads the brief co-written by Kenneth Starr, dean of Pepperdine University's law school and the former independent counsel who investigated President Bill Clinton.

The campaign submitted the document in response to three lawsuits seeking to invalidate Proposition 8, the constitutional amendment adopted last month that overruled the court's decision in May that had legalized gay marriage in the nation's most populous state.

Both Attorney General Jerry Brown, whose office is scheduled to submit its own brief to the court Friday, and gay rights groups maintain that the gay marriage ban may not be applied retroactively.

The Supreme Court could hear arguments in the litigation as soon as March. The measure's backers announced Friday that Starr, a former federal judge and U.S. solicitor general, had signed on as their lead counsel and would argue the cases.

Proposition 8's supporters assert that the Supreme Court lacks the authority or historical precedent to throw out the amendment.

"For this court to rule otherwise would be to tear asunder a lavish body of jurisprudence," the court papers state. "That body of decisional law commands judges _ as servants of the people _ to bow to the will of those whom they serve _ even if the substantive result of what people have wrought in constitution-amending is deemed unenlightened."

The cases are Strauss v. Horton, S168047; City and County of San Francisco v. Horton, S168078; and Tyler v. State of California, S168066.

SAN FRANCISCO — The sponsors of Proposition 8 asked the California Supreme Court on Friday to nullify the marriages of the estimated 18,000 same-sex couples who exchanged vows before voters appr...
SAN FRANCISCO — The sponsors of Proposition 8 asked the California Supreme Court on Friday to nullify the marriages of the estimated 18,000 same-sex couples who exchanged vows before voters appr...
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- chaos4700 I'm a Fan of chaos4700 85 fans permalink
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You know? A lot of us /knew/ this was going to happen. And of course it's being spearheaded by that notorious right-wing shill, Kenneth Starr -- who provide is incompetence in matter of legality by turning the Clinton impeachment into a partisan circus. /This/ sort of crap is why bipartisanship is pointless, I'd like to point out.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:07 AM on 12/20/2008
- lafrance I'm a Fan of lafrance 43 fans permalink

pointless? Not really. Yes, there will always be some on the fringe of both sides who will never try to understand things and listen to the other side.
But, many would if they had the opportunity or chance to be face to face and listen. Some are just confused or instilled with misinformation and when they are given the truth or see the other side is not all 'evil' they are apt to soften and open their minds.
Alot depends on approach.
People like Starr do things like this for publicity and to be relevant as well as their pocketbook.
They make their living on feeding off those who are gullible and ignorant of the facts.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:17 AM on 12/20/2008

Who tipped over the rock Starr had been under? The man's sanctimonious idiocy makes me twitch.

And I agree with you, Lafrance...those afraid of gay marriage do come across as silly and scared...and ignorant. The more they argue, the sillier they look. Just another example of the type of people who think everyone's business is theirs...hey does that mean I can get in their business and protest their behavior, too? Turnabout.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:06 AM on 12/20/2008
- lafrance I'm a Fan of lafrance 43 fans permalink

I always thought republicans, and the religious fanatics are republicans, were about less government and keeping it out of people's lives and the bedroom.
Silly me.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:13 AM on 12/20/2008
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Only when it applies to everyone but their particular interests!! Screw 'em!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:32 AM on 12/20/2008
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I'm so confused about the legalities with Prop 8. First, I thought the courts ruled over popular vote. Second, I thought that when an amendment was ratified, it had to win by a 2/3 majority. I guess this isn't true on state amendments, only federal?

I don't get this, at all.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:04 AM on 12/20/2008
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Thats exactly the arguement that will be made to overturn it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:17 AM on 12/20/2008
- woodcut I'm a Fan of woodcut 20 fans permalink
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I'm in San Francisco & I'm as confused as you are!
CA has things called Propositions. With enough signatures, you can get practically anything on the ballot to be voted on "by the people".
(People are often paid to collect signatures.)
It worked in our favor for medicinal marijuana, & against us re: 8.

The diff is pot was not opposed by religious groups.
Now = is marriage is a right that can be taken away by voters?
====
I think we gays have lost our focus. It's become a battle over marriage, when we should be concerned with housing, jobs, HIV.
Lots of kids are killing themselves because they're gay & confused.
Having marriage rights should be PART of our list.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:18 AM on 12/20/2008
- XCITIZEN I'm a Fan of XCITIZEN 93 fans permalink
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Google helps when I'm confused. Just surf around a bit and you should find something that makes it clear. I'm confused too, by the way, because there is too much information bouncing around on this sometimes for me to sort.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:27 AM on 12/20/2008
- XCITIZEN I'm a Fan of XCITIZEN 93 fans permalink
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Another good source might be the Bay Area Reporter - they're following this very closely.

http://ebar.com/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:30 AM on 12/20/2008

What this really means is that a marriage license from the State of California may or may not be worth the paper it is printed on. Why is this issue so important - has anyone else's marriage been impacted? Are these people trying to destroy the institution of marriage? Are they anti-marriage? Are they pro-hate? There is a song that goes "and they'll know we are Christians by our love, by our love..." In this case, it is clear that they are not Christians because of their lack of love...

Love to all...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:02 AM on 12/20/2008
- ricland I'm a Fan of ricland 2 fans permalink
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It's on.

ricland

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:58 AM on 12/20/2008
- XCITIZEN I'm a Fan of XCITIZEN 93 fans permalink
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You said it! I second it!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:28 AM on 12/20/2008
- lafrance I'm a Fan of lafrance 43 fans permalink

I don't understand why these people are so scared of gays being married.
While I find the whole brohaha over Warren overblown and people wasting their time and energy on something that is so minor, a 2 or 3 minute prayer that in the long run will diminish the power of protest when it really matters, I also find those who are so against gay marriage silly and scared.
What does it matter if someone who is gay is married or not. It doesn't threaten my marriage nor diminish it's importance. What it does do is bring happiness and a sense of community and stability to the gay community and the larger community as a whole.
Shouldn't someone who is gay be allowed to live with happiness and sense of community and normalcy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:58 AM on 12/20/2008
- Thurber I'm a Fan of Thurber 16 fans permalink

Hope you see the light now, giving these people a national stage for their hate only emboldens them. If you think they will stop at gay marriage, or even outlawing the very state of being homosexual, you underestimate their hate. If when they've won there, you think heterosexual minorities are safe, then you underestimate their hate. If you think they'll stop at female reproductive rights you underestimate their hate. Nobody is safe from them.

It's this, "they only want a 2-3 minute prayer at the inauguration" attitude that got us into world war II. At the time Germany "only wanted Czechoslovakia."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:23 AM on 12/20/2008
- LMT I'm a Fan of LMT 13 fans permalink
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Sorry, but those marriages were constitutional at the time they took place. You void them now and you have a REAL constitutional issue on your hands.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:55 AM on 12/20/2008
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Sure doesn't make sense to me. How can the popular vote override the constitution?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:09 AM on 12/20/2008
- Jtt I'm a Fan of Jtt 45 fans permalink
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Its Rule by the Mob. They can do it because we let them, they have funds and power in their communities. If they think they are going to lose they lie and spread hate. People in power support them by giving them access and lending them credibility by including them in important affairs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:20 AM on 12/20/2008
- julia23 I'm a Fan of julia23 26 fans permalink
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It can't. For the record, Californias vote on things they aren't supposed to all the time. Its a funny thing, we vote and courts tell us we couldn't vote on that. And then we vote for things (medical marijuana) and the Feds tell us we can't.

I personally find it rather offensive to think of fat people making love and I think we should have a proposition outlawing fat people from getting married. I'm pretty sure I can find biblical verse saying that normal people are thin and fat people are hateful to God. Gluttony and sloth and all that.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:24 AM on 12/20/2008
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