Progressive Jews See Potential Conflict With Obama Over Gaza

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First Posted: 12-29-08 12:24 PM   |   Updated: 01-29-09 05:12 AM

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Gaza

The flaring of tensions and violence in the Gaza Strip has created more than just another sensitive foreign policy crisis for Barack Obama to juggle. It has sparked the beginnings of a debate over what role progressive Jewish groups will play in the upcoming administration.

Obama's election was interpreted as a potential break from the Bush administration's approach to the Israel-Palestinian conflict, both in the level of engagement and the open-mindedness in pursuing a resolution.

Weeks before he assumes office, that image is being put to its first test. Even as Obama and his staff demur -- insisting that there is only one president at a time -- the Jewish community is addressing the topic as if he were in office.

Progressive groups in particular are being forced to walk a delicate line: accommodating Obama's prior statements in which he seemingly validated retaliatory Israeli strikes with their own agenda of promoting diplomacy over violence.

"At this moment of extreme crisis, J Street wants to demonstrate that, among those who care about Israel and its security, there is a constituency for sanity and moderation," read a carefully worded action alert from the J Street, a pro-Israel, pro-peace organization. "There are many who recognize elements of truth on both sides of this gaping divide and who know that closing it requires strong American engagement and leadership."

Already, others in that community can see a potential conflict ahead. Over the course of the election, Obama hardened his line on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, culminating in a visit to the Gaza border in July. In the town of Sderot, the Democratic candidate told reporters: "If somebody was sending rockets into my house, where my two daughters sleep at night, I'm going to do everything in my power to stop that... And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing."

Supporting Israel's right to retaliation makes for smart electoral politics. But it is also a touchy issue for some in the progressive Jewish community; certainly when the casualty rates are so disproportionate. Eventually, these organizations will have to reconcile two priorities: a president they support and their own policy agenda

"You talk a progressive game but what do you say when Obama isn't signaling a direction on the Middle East?" said a progressive Jewish official. "Is him being president a good enough sign of change? Or are you going hold him to certain policies?

At this juncture, such choices are still a bit distant. Obama has steadfastly remained an engaged-observer as the Bush administration handles the regional violence. And once he takes office, he is likely to pursue his own agenda whether or not coincides with the interests of his progressive Jewish supporters.

"The progressive element will not determine the views and identity of the pro-Israel views in America," said Aaron David Miller, a public policy scholar at the Woodrow Wilson Center and author of 'The Much Too Promised Land.' "[Obama] has those voices already. When presidents lead, lobbies follow."

"It really, in the end, is not consequential," Miller added. "What matters is whether or not a president decides to make a pursuit of Arab-Israeli peace a top priority, and whether that president further decides that in an effort to reach that agreement he has to be fair, tough and smart."

And yet, even if the influence of Jewish lobbies are overstated, they are fascinating to watch. The Obama foreign policy team has insisted that the roots of Middle East peace begin on the Israeli-Palestine frontlines. Who he listens to, and what groups have better access (the transition team recently met with 29 ideologically disparate Israeli/Jewish organizations) could have strong implications for his approach.

The flaring of tensions and violence in the Gaza Strip has created more than just another sensitive foreign policy crisis for Barack Obama to juggle. It has sparked the beginnings of a debate over wha...
The flaring of tensions and violence in the Gaza Strip has created more than just another sensitive foreign policy crisis for Barack Obama to juggle. It has sparked the beginnings of a debate over wha...
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I am a "progressive" pro-Israel Jew and I am optimistic that Obama's policies will be good for Israel. You have to look at the larger picture. The Republicans have not really been all that good for Israel. The prolonged support for oil as the primary fuel source in the world has empowered militant Islamist regions and has made many European countries dependent on either the Arab states or the Russians. Though finally, I think, many conservatives realize that we must move away from oil, Obama will push more energy diversity than Republicans would have done. That in itself will help stabilize the Middle East.

Despite pro-Israeli rhetoric, I do not think that Bush's policies have been very good for Israel. With better American policies, perhaps Israel will not have to fight so many battles. We'll see.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:16 PM on 01/19/2009

bottom line is....only 2 states in the world claming 2 b built on an ideology, one created through the power of vote, the other through illegal operssion, blood shed, fraud and occupation­...inshort artificial­ly......on­ly one worried day and night about its existance! i make you the judge.......its an established fact that when you try 2 press a spring, it presses 2 the ground level, but when you let go, its bounces back with an uncontrollable momentum.

you blame hammas for starting it but you quite forget what these israelis have done.
During the same year of the so-called Annapolis peace process, Israel killed 546 Palestinians, including 76 children, more than half of them in the West Bank.

During the same year of the so-called Annapolis peace process, Israel killed 546 Palestinians, including 76 children, more than half of them in the West Bank

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:13 PM on 01/07/2009
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With evidence of violence on both sides of this conflict and in an attempt to be objective does "Revelation1118" see any wrongdoing on the side of Israeli government?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:36 AM on 12/30/2008
- dykalg I'm a Fan of dykalg 2 fans permalink

Robert Fisk writes today at independent.co.uk about why the Israelis cannot admit any wrong on their side.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:16 AM on 12/30/2008
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"Revelation1118" is a centrist and a liberal.

It is my position to criticize the political extremes and not my own base on this issue. I have a 3+ year record here for strong criticism of the rightwing, neocons and conservatives, AS WELL as the far-left, or the antiFasicist Left (see Euston Manifesto).

The far or extreme left is easily identified by their ant-Isreal BIAS. Their voices are many on this site. Why should I join the pack? Why should I be one of the mob, when it is a lot more interesting to deconstruct the far left's position? And I find little need to condemn neocons who dare post here, as their voices are few and the left quickly gangs up on them, and they are quickly banned.

First, the left needs to accept that Isreal has a right to exist, to defend herself and to wage w_arfare with her enemies, sworn or not. The Hamas charter specifically calls for the destruction of the J_ewish state; Hamas is recognized by many nations to be a terrorist organization; so the left's apologist position for Hamas is unacceptable.

The point is that, in w_arfare, people dye and property is destroyed. This is normal, as is the waging of w_arfare itself. Yet Hamas has chosen that path instead of the path of PEACE and the far left cheers as if they have a h_ate on for the state.

So the w_ar continues.­..........­..........

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:44 PM on 12/31/2008
- dykalg I'm a Fan of dykalg 2 fans permalink

If President Obama wants "to do everything in his power" to stop Palestinian violence I can only hope he imagines the brilliant idea of sharing Jerusalem as joint capitol of both states, and the right of return to their lands for the 3 million descendents of exiled ethnically cleansed inhabitants of the land now called Israel.
Robert Fisk writes brilliantly in today's independent.co.uk

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:15 AM on 12/30/2008

Ok, this blog does not seem very fair and balanced. First of all....why is everyone automatically lining up all Jewish people & ready to take them down! I feel for the the Palestinian people & understand both perspectives, but the provocation of extremist organizations has to stop. What is their agenda-to take back the state of of Israel? Well, let's face it, this is never going to happen & I don't think it is in the World's best interest if that did happen. Now, let's turn to solutions. Violence is not the answer. We are all brothers and sisters, Muslim, Christian, and Jew....we all have a place in that territory. The roots of history of deep. I wish people on this blog would stop taking an an attack line against Jewish people! Jewish people come in all races and creeds. Judiasm is a religion! Israel is made up of many different people. You should learn more about Jewish Diaspora....much of it called on by the prejudices of people who kicked Jewish people out of their countries....from the Middle East to Russia and from Spain to Africa...Germany to South America....Jewish people have been forced from their homelands...that is why the Israeli people will not give up. The Israeli's have just as strong a case as the Palestinians...for making a place their home. It has been 50 years already!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:38 AM on 12/30/2008

Of greater concern should be the decisive role played by m.0 $ $ad in the orchestration of 9. 11

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:27 AM on 12/30/2008

I believe they warned us 59 times. I think it was more a Bu$h$owdie thing. I believe they do know and pressured them to do this whole bail out thing and much of the money was sent there though. Both the leader of is real and bush are in see re us t rubble and are behind this and want went down in the financial capital of that large south asian country.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:55 AM on 12/30/2008
- JohnDewey I'm a Fan of JohnDewey 23 fans permalink
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I tend to agree with Meesterclean. The big players in the worldwide intel. community saw the same warnings our spies did. Intel. agencies in some countries, I s r a e l chief among them, tried to warn the U.S., but we ignored them. Looking at who we ignored prior to Sept. 11 is a better clue than who knew. It would be a bigger shock if MI5/6, Pakistani ISI, etc. didn't know, since we're all spying on one another as much as on our stated "enemies."

Blaming I s r ae li Intelligence is a red herring to distract from the real power behind the Sept. operation. Of course, it helps that it's a red herring that right-leaning skeptics & members of the truth community traditionally fall for...

The question for Sept. 11 is the same as it always is - Qui Bono? The answer is NOT I s r a e l.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:21 PM on 12/30/2008
- HerbTee I'm a Fan of HerbTee 73 fans permalink
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Revelation1118, your obvious compassion gives me pause as I try to understand it. Your rhetorical bias for the J.e.w.s. is mostly one-sided here. Speaking as a 54-year African American from the Deep South, I know more about the effects of racism, oppression, discrimination and persecution than you'll ever know or will ever experience. In ways I can understand the Pals, although I don't condone violence nor one-sided slaughter to solve differences. However, if I lived as an oppressed person who's hungry, jobless, uneducated, hopeless, forced to live in zoned squalor, and denied my human rights, I'd probably pick up an AK-47 and fight the perceived oppressors...either among my own or perceived outsiders!

If we followed you, slavery would never have been abolished because it wasn't worth fighting against. For all your self-righteousness, there are other examples of oppression and religious-based sl.a.u.g.h.ter for outrage. Were you outraged when Pol Pot was s.l.a.u.g.­h.t.e.r.in­g Cambodians? We you outraged when Blacks were m.u.r.d.e.r.e.d, o.p.p.r.e.s.s.e.d, im.p.r.i.s.o.n.ed and denied basic rights under South African apartheid? Were you outraged about Rwanda or are you as outraged about Dafur? What I find distressing in your posts is you seem to place higher value ONLY on J.e.w.i.s.h lives.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:41 AM on 12/30/2008
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"if I lived as an oppressed person who's hungry, jobless, uneducated, hopeless, forced to live in zoned squalor, and denied my human rights, I'd probably pick up an AK-47 and fight"

---------------
You seem to forgotten another obvious option: SUE FOR PEACE

your usage of the term "J.e.w.s." instead of Isrealis, indicates the antisemitism that is no small part of the south's cultural history, is a part of your history.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:51 PM on 12/31/2008
- HerbTee I'm a Fan of HerbTee 73 fans permalink
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And that seems to be you answer to everyone here. If we disagree with YOU or your line of thinking, or choose not to support or not coddle the Is in their latest unproductive exercise of mass violence, then I and others are labeled by you either as biased against the Is or we're anti-Semites. Just like some Blacks who wish to yell r.a.c.i.s.m when losing an argument or a point, some J.e.w.s wish to play the anti-S.e.m­.i..t.i.sm card when they don't get their way. I noticed you didn't address anything else I said, but only implied I am an anti-S.e.m.i.te. Well, so be it Rev, since you don't know jack about me personally anyway.

Frankly Rev, I am well past caring anymore for either side...the Is or the Pals. If they want to k.i.l.l each other off, I say let them! Many Americans are sick and tired of the fighting, the w.a.r.r.i.ng and the ki.l.l.i.ng and we no longer want to be dragged into it, lose any more innocent American lives over it or spend our tax dollars supporting it. Let both sides k.i.l.l each other since the only thing both sides seem bent on is mutual destruction.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:34 PM on 12/31/2008
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nukemind posted: "clear provocation from I s r a e l from day one as they have broken ceasefires whenever it served their purpose"

1)-THERE WAS A TRUCE.
2)-Hamas attempted to dig a tunnel into Isreal, perhaps to a_ttack and k_idnap more Isreali citizens.
3)-Isreal detected the tunnel and destroyed it and kllled 3 militants defending the tunnel. Isreal has the right to defend itself, especially considering that the last tunnel caused casualties and the kidnapping of a soldier that Gaza still holds.
4)-Hamas responded with the launching of over 200 rockets into its neighboring state, exclusively targeting civilian targets. Gaza has the right to retaliate.
5)-Isreal responded with a massive air attack on militant t_argets. Isreal has the right to both escalate and retaliate.
6)-Hamas said even before this escalation that they would explode suicide bombers amongst Isreali citizens, proving their t_errorist role.
7)-the W A R continues.....
8)-no one sues for PEACE

And what does the far left see? #3, and #5 while ignoring the rest. Leftists, please do try a more balanced and nuanced viewpoint.

The chauvinistic prejudices of the far-left only add to the problem

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:52 AM on 12/30/2008
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Hamas did this , Hamas did that....I'm glad you mentioned Hamas did all those things on your #2, 4, 6. The results? Gaza retaliate! and with such impressive, glorious success!

I guess you should give thanks on our knees they didn't use the nukes to wipe out the whole region....

Human casualties mean nothing with your "balanced" viewpoint I presume?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 AM on 12/30/2008
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WTF???

if there was bias or an inaccurate accounting of the history leading up to this crisis in my post. I CHALLENGE YOU TO PROVIDE SUPPORTING EVIDENCE

Your chauvinistic prejudices have blinded you to even the most even-handed accounting of history. This renders your opinions suspect, and without ant supporting arguments, useless p_ropaganda

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:57 PM on 12/31/2008
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The only thing you can deduce from this act by Israel which retaliates by murdering civilians is that they have planned this brutal show of force for some time, as they did the attack on Lebanon in 2006, and will use anything as an excuse to launch the retaliation.

It is apparent that those prosecuting this fire storm of a beating upon Gaza, using as their ostensible target a duly elected democratic government, think they are entitled to do whatever they want to Palestinians. The underlying premise is that Jewish lives and security are more valuable than those of Palestinians or A R A B S. They telegraph that A R A B lives, suffering, hunger, homelessness or penury are unreal, insignificant or unimportant in their grand schemes. They don't really believe they can make peace with Palestinians, so they do not intend to ever get to the point of obeying the UN charter that set aside a separate Palestinian state. It has been 60 years after all. They intend a slow war of attrition against the "others." Too bad this strategic course insures continued brutal warfare, and means eventually there are 7 million displaced Palestinians they will have to kill to be safe on their beloved and "blessed land."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:34 PM on 12/30/2008
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Your BIAS slip is showing dear.

"Israel retaliates by m_urdering civilians"

please read the news reports. You will see that most of the d_ead are militants. many of the pictures of the d_ead that I saw had uniforms.

In the normal course of w_arfare, civilian d_eaths can and do occur. The difference is that, where the Palestinians and Hamas SPECIFICALLY and PURPOSEFULLY target CIVILIANS, Isreal targets militants.

Did you get that?
Hamas: targets civilians
Isreal: civilian casualties are incidental.

And, and, ..........­.......thi­s is the incredible part......­..........­...YOU CONDEMN ISREAL !!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:04 PM on 12/31/2008
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Your BIAS slip is showing dear.

"Israel retaliates by m_urdering civilians"

please read the news reports. You will see that most of the d_ead are militants. many of the pictures of the d_ead that I saw had uniforms.

In the normal course of w_arfare, civilian d_eaths can and do occur. The difference is that, where the P_alestinians and Hamas SPECIFICALLY and PURPOSEFULLY target CIVILIANS, Isreal targets militants.

Did you get that?
Hamas: targets civilians
Isreal: civilian casualties are incidental.

And, and, ..........­.......thi­s is the incredible part......­..........­...YOU CONDEMN ISREAL !!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:18 PM on 12/31/2008
- courtb I'm a Fan of courtb 19 fans permalink

Of course Israel has been planning this for some time! Since Israel’s disengagement in 2005, more than 6,300 rockets and mortars have been fired from Gaza toward Israeli civilian centers in the south. More than 3,000 were fired in 2008 alone.

This is not a surprise. The headlines in Israeli newspapers have been saying for weeks that Israel is preparing to respond to Hamas in Gaza if the rockets don't stop. Do you think anyone who follows events in the Middle East was surprised? Least of all Hamas?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:14 AM on 01/04/2009
- yorkville7 I'm a Fan of yorkville7 3 fans permalink

iz/rel broke truce because it never wanted one

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:52 PM on 01/03/2009

Really getting tired of all progressive and conservative Jewish groups.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:41 AM on 12/30/2008
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Stop sending Billion$ of US tax payer dollars to Israel and watch how fast they jump to the Peace table.

Send the UN in, they started this mess they can clean it up

Obama can send Hillary if he wants, but only to make Peace, nothing more.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:21 AM on 12/30/2008
- wml209 I'm a Fan of wml209 5 fans permalink

THE UN CANNOT FIX ANYTHING IF ISRAEL WILL NOT LET THEM IN... AND THEY WILL NOT, WHY IS THAT?

END ALL U.S. AID TO ISRAEL NOW!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:22 AM on 12/30/2008

I'm sure they at least got a trillion or two from our bail out. They don't need us anymore.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:59 AM on 12/30/2008
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hardybear posted: “The far left has an anti-I s r a e l bias?”

Revelation1118 posted:
I have argued up and down and all around (chewing through several monikers) that the far left can be easily identified by their anti-I s r a e l bias.

So far NO ONE has taken up that argument to prove me wrong, so that argument stands unassailable.

Folks at Huffington with such a BIAS have attacked me solely on a personal level, and as we know, ad hominem attacks are fallacies and do nothing to displace my argument.

Therefore my position that the far left can be identified by an anti-I s r a e l bias stands as truth.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:11 AM on 12/30/2008
- Heru1 I'm a Fan of Heru1 24 fans permalink
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The fact that no one takes your argument seriously does not give your argument weight. All you have is an opinion.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:34 AM on 12/30/2008

Funny that you quote debate buzz-words like ad hominen fallacies but fail to realize that the burden of proof falls on the person making the argument.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:43 AM on 12/30/2008
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My arguments here are many times argued. The above was only a synopsis. Please do try to read further, or post your evidence that I have failed to make my point, if you do think that i have indeed failed.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:20 PM on 12/31/2008

To people like you anything short of extreme anti-Palestinian is automatically anti-Israeli. Grow up.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 AM on 12/30/2008
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You are fully entitled to your opinions, but remember that opinions are a dime a dozen. So yours are worth a little less than $0.01. $0.008 to be exact. You are confused as any clown who thinks empty assertions are arguments.

Anyone can have an opinion, but are yours informed? Prove it with a substantiating argument.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:16 PM on 12/31/2008

I have an anti-bully bias.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:10 AM on 12/30/2008
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so then you do not support Palestinian suicide bombers targeting buses of children, celebrants at a wedding party, and kids in a disco?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:16 PM on 12/31/2008
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so then you do not support P_alestinian s_uicide b_ombers targeting buses of children, celebrants at a wedding party, and kids in a disco?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:17 PM on 12/31/2008
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Your position is absurd. The "far" left includes many members of the Jewish community, and as such, is certainly not anti-Israel.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:35 AM on 12/30/2008
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There are aspects within the J_ewish community which for religious or other reasons DO NOT support the existence of the state of Isreal. This fact renders your argument false.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:14 PM on 12/31/2008
- UncleHomer I'm a Fan of UncleHomer 9 fans permalink

I think that if Americans knew the truth, that Israel resorted to terrorism to drive the Palestinians out of Israel, that Israel was planning to take over the West Bank and Gaza as early as the 1950's and that the constant threat of annihilation by their Arab neighbors is a carefully constructed and maintained myth, they might be less sympathy and more determination to force Israel to seek peaceful resolutions if they want to continue to receive US aid.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:05 AM on 12/30/2008

i agree with you, but I wish I had more information, proof about it, links, articles etc.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:31 AM on 12/30/2008
- hollybork I'm a Fan of hollybork 64 fans permalink

Yes, well said. The revisionist history which establishes what Uncle Homer is saying is not well known and not taught in schools or widely discussed because of fear of offending someone. For every one voice speaking for balance and giving space to the Palestinian arguments there are 5,000 voices raised in protest that everyone is an anti semite.

The recent more balanced studies and stories are being published by liberal jewish scholars. When Jimmy Carter spoke up in his book "Peace Not Apartheid", the Jewish members of his Library Board quit in show of force. They wanted to bury him. The truth will out eventually although the victor (Israel in this case) generally controls the flow of information for historians for up to a century or so. But much is being translated now and historical and land records are being investigated on this subject.

A good book on this subject is "The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine" by Ilan Pappe. Here is a link:

http://www.amazon.com/Ethnic-Cleansing-Palestine-Ilan-Pappe/dp/1851685553/ref=pd_cp_b_1?pf_rd_p=413864201&pf_rd_s=center-41&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0521699347&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1MSZQKHPC9G6FGPKAFJ2

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:47 PM on 12/30/2008
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Israel is attacking a democraticly elected government because that government does not give in under duress.

I cannot believe what I saw in the US Senate today! Shamefiul.­Palestinea­ns are human beings and have as much right to go home to a safe neighborhood as do the Jews.

This sure is a hornets nest. A long time in the making, and will not be fixed any time soon.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:28 PM on 12/29/2008
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This is a "Watershed Moment" in our relationship with IS:

Americans have to decide if "Blind Support" of IS makes sense with what has happened in Gaza and on Wall Street.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:15 PM on 12/29/2008
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What does G.aza have to do with Wall Street? Your b i g o t r y is showing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:37 PM on 12/29/2008
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agreed!
Obama is the "Watershed Moment," not Isreal.
Obama will define the new paradigm, not Isreal.

And all are invited to the debate on the parameters of this movement if they are willing to abandon their extreme positions, be they left or right.

With some luck, prayers and hard work perhaps Obama's negotiating talents will find some time away from our economic headaches to bring all players to the table and hammer out a long term solution to this problem.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:51 PM on 12/29/2008

There are reports that much of the money for the banking problems was electronically sent to Is real. We will see in further investigations if that is true. I don't understand why, when there is a stereotype, people keep acting in that way to enforce it. Also, if there are any criminals there that we need to prosecute, you will not extra diet. This is wrong on every level. What does this say to other countries that agree to bring their people to just ice? Why are is real lees exempted?

The question is Do Is real lees think they are better than everybody else?

Why can't we even mention the country's name?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:23 AM on 12/30/2008
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and one more thing and then I'm done. there are some bloggers who suggest that the powers that be as we know them, congress, etc., don't really run this country, the money does. if we stop sending money and we stop giving up weapons, it occurs to me that folks will be real quick to get at that table and start some genuine negotiating, short and simple. as for our powers that be, WE elect congress an WE just proved that we can and will make changes and we can do it again!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:41 PM on 12/29/2008
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I partially answered your position below. Folks who make similar arguments to yours are generally naive. You seem to think that allies and international relationships are minor inconveniences to your personal chauvinisms.

Think, if the USA abandoned Isreal as an ally what would happen?
" All ME problems would be solved," perhaps would be the kneejerk reaction of your chavinisms, but I invite you think deeper, broader and longer on this.

Aid to:
Israel $5-Billion/yr
Egypt $3-Billion/yr
Lebanon $1.5-Billion/yr
etc..etc..

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:59 PM on 12/29/2008
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you can hardly have a debate with someone if all you are doing is insulting them personally. i would invite you to review your posts here and reflect as a person.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:18 AM on 12/30/2008
- UncleHomer I'm a Fan of UncleHomer 9 fans permalink

I agree with this completely and would add that I think we may be looking at an Administration that is willing to buck Israel and tie continued aid to continued progress towards peace.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:07 AM on 12/30/2008
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