Dems Fuming Over White House Plan To Make Vets Pay For Service Injuries

Democrats in Congress are organizing to squash a White House proposal that would require veterans to use private insurance to pay for treatment of their combat and service-related injuries.

In a letter being sent to the White House, a group of House Democrats, led by Rep. Glenn Nye (D-VA), warned that such a proposal "could harm our veterans and their families in unintended, yet very serious ways, jeopardizing their families' health care and even negatively affecting veterans' employment opportunities."

"While we strongly support your plans to increase funding for the VA by $25 billion over the next five years," the letter reads, "it is with equal conviction that we oppose the proposal to bill veterans' private health insurance plans for care and treatment of service-connected injuries or disabilities."

Rep. Ann Kirkpatrick (D-Ariz.) is leading a similar effort in coordination with Nye. Her letter is even more forcefully worded, calling the White House proposal "deeply troubling" and charging that it "ignores the mission of the VA."

"We cannot compromise on the promise we have made to those who serve our Nation," Kirkpatrick states.

Additionally, in a statement to the Huffington Post, Virginia Sen. Jim Webb, one of the foremost champions of veterans' concerns in the Senate, called the issue of outsourcing health coverage from the VA a non-starter.

"Treatment for service-connected injuries is clearly within the responsibility of the U.S. government through the Department of Veterans Affairs -- period," Webb said.

The Obama administration has insisted that they are non-committal when it comes to a final decision on the actual policy, and White House officials will meet for the second time with veterans groups on Wednesday.

During his press conference on Tuesday, spokesman Robert Gibbs pointed out the president has pledged an "11 percent increase in the discretionary spending" in the VA budget.

Veterans "can have confidence that the budget the president has proposed represents an historic increase in discretionary spending to take care of our wounded warriors," said Gibbs. "[T]his president takes very seriously the needs of our wounded warriors that have given so much to protect our freedom on battlefields throughout the world."

Veterans groups say they're concerned that the Obama proposal could ultimately lead to the privatization of health care for returning soldiers, and note that third-party billing for war-related injuries could result in ballooning insurance costs.

While giving the administration the benefit of the doubt that they may dismiss the proposal, Jon Soltz, executive director of VoteVets, nevertheless offered preemptive disappointment.

"We don't know if this is going to be the proposal, or if it is a serious consideration or not," he told the Huffington Post. "So, it's premature to go to the White House with pitchforks at this point. That having been said, if it is proposed, we would be opposed, and can't imagine any veterans group that would be for it. There's no appetite for it on the Hill, either. There are ways to eliminate waste at every level of government, though, including the VA. I think we'd all like to sit down with the administration and find areas of the VA budget that are redundant or wasteful, to make sure every dollar spent there is necessary."

Here is the full letter being circulated by Rep. Nye:

March 17, 2009 The Honorable Barack Obama President of the United States The White House Washington, DC

Dear Mr. President,

We first want to take this opportunity to thank you for the clear commitment your administration's budget outline makes to our nation's veterans. The proposed 10 percent increase in discretionary funding for the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) for next fiscal year is truly historic. We believe the 2010 budget will ensure the VA never again faces the chronic under-funding that prevented countless veterans from receiving the health benefits they have earned.

While we strongly support your plans to increase funding for the VA by $25 billion over the next five years, it is with equal conviction that we oppose the proposal to bill veterans' private health insurance plans for care and treatment of service-connected injuries or disabilities.

We do not give our veterans health care - they earn it - and it would be unacceptable for the VA to ask our veterans to pay for the treatment of injuries received while serving our nation in uniform. That responsibility belongs to the VA, and it would be wrong to outsource the responsibility of covering the care of those veterans to private insurance companies.

Additionally, this proposal could harm our veterans and their families in unintended, yet very serious ways, jeopardizing their families' health care and even negatively affecting veterans' employment opportunities. Billing a veteran's private health insurance for the treatment of service-connected injuries could lead to increased health care premiums, and could potentially discourage employers from hiring veterans.

We know you are committed to expanding employment opportunities for veterans. Already this year, your administration and Congress have worked to create countless jobs for veterans returning from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but this proposal would undermine our efforts.

We urge you to take this proposal off the table, and let us instead focus on ensuring that our veterans receive the full care and benefits they have earned. The moral obligation our nation has to our veterans demands nothing less. We are happy to discuss these issues with you further as we move toward a final budget for the VA.

We would like to thank you again for your commitment to improving care for the men and women who have borne the battle, and who have sacrificed their health and well-being in serving their country. Thank you for your service to our nation.

Comments

[realpolitic]

01:46 PM on 03/20/2009

Case closed!

"The White House announced late today that it has dropped a proposal -- strongly objected to by veterans groups -- to bill vets' private insurance for treatment of service-related injuries and disabilities."

"The proposal was designed to generate more than $540 million a year for the Department of Veterans Affairs, but opponents said it broke faith with service members and threatened to use up insurance benefits that their families also use."

Today, they met again with White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel.

"The President has consistently stated that he is committed to working with veterans on the details of the 2010 VA budget proposal," the White House said later. "In considering the third party billing issue, the administration was seeking to maximize the resources available for veterans; however, the President listened to concerns raised by the VSOs that this might, under certain circumstances, affect veterans and their families’ ability to access health care. Therefore, the President has instructed that its consideration be dropped."

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2009/03/obama_drops_vet.html

[whosyourdaddy]

08:27 AM on 03/21/2009

Sorry, not closed.

What Obama says and what he tried to do, don't jibe.
As a veteran, I can tell you, veterans will not trust him now.

[realpolitic]

07:38 PM on 03/21/2009

Well, I get the feeling you never trusted him. Believe me, you do not speak for all veterans, although you may arrogantly believe you do. Obama just ended the stop-loss policy and that is far more important to vets than reconsidering this policy of reimbursement for a couple days. He also reduced combat tours from 16 months to one year, like it was before Bush extended them. These actions are far more important than any temporary policy consideration such as the one mentioned here. But I am sure since you are a confirmed far righty you will believe what you like.

[realpolitic]

01:16 PM on 03/20/2009

According to Jon Soltz, Iraqi war veteran:

"We went into Iraq with not enough forces, and a shortage of quality protection and equipment. That led not just to thousands of Americans killed, but many, many more coming home with injuries that most Americans never even heard of or considered, like Traumatic Brain Injuries (TBI). The lack of planning, or clear exit strategy, resulted in policies like Stop Loss, which kept troops on active duty involuntarily....Those extended and multiple deployments played a role in the thousands coming home with PTSD, and those who sent the Army suicide rate to a new record."

"So why do I look ahead with some optimism? Because we finally have a president who gets it."

"President Obama's administration has increased the veterans budget by $25 billion over five years, and by $1.2 billion more than even recommended by the Independent Budget (the VA budget suggested by the nation's veterans organizations). His VA is announcing construction of new veterans hospitals and medical centers, providing more convenient and better care to veterans around the country. For all the brouhaha this past week over a proposal on VA health care which actually was never proposed by the administration, this administration already is one of the most pro-veteran ones we've ever had."

"For troops, just this week, President Obama announced the end to Stop Loss."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jon-soltz/another-year-in-iraq-look_b_176963.html

[mama26]

02:04 PM on 03/19/2009

I apologize for the long post...the first part is the one at the bottom and the end is the one under this.

[mama26]

02:03 PM on 03/19/2009

I sat for FOUR HOURS (waiting for another appointment) with an elderly WWII vet and his son, who traveled for more than three hours, while they were given the run around by several personnel about repairing the gentleman’s wheelchair. In the end they were told the VA would not pay to repair it (even though they bought it) and the trip was a waste after being told to come there in the first place. If you have to go to the VA you might as well clear your day, because you are lucky if your are out of there in three-four hours. I could go on and on, but I won't. I don't really get into politics and the whole right wing/left wing thing...but before someone decides that something works "fairly well" and all vets have to complain about is long commutes they should probably try to gain some first hand knowledge. The VA system is under funded and overwhelmed. It is no wonder facilities are run down and personnel are short tempered. There are thousands waiting for their benefit status to even be reviewed. And do you really think the government will do much better with insuring the entire nation when they can't even adequately care for those that fought for the nation? Just some food for thought...

[whosyourdaddy]

02:32 PM on 03/19/2009

I use the VA myself and agree with quite a lot of what you say. However, the wait you described is pretty reasonable when taken into perspective. Our local private hospital can have waits up 15 hours.

As to the wheel chair thing. What happens is that a veteran will have a non-service-connected disability which the VA doesn't cover. They will first try to get a chair from the VA because their insurance denied it. Then they buy one. When it breaks, they bring it to the VA and tell them to fix it.
Although I sympathize with the guy, if the VA got into the business of fixing peoples stuff bought elsewhere, for non service connected disabilities, well, then hell, they'd not be able to afford tongue depressors for guys like you and me.

[mama26]

10:33 PM on 03/19/2009

I would agree with you if we were talking about ER visits. I am talking about being told to be there at 11 am for an appointment that takes maybe 30 mintues and not being seen until 1:30 pm. I have never been to a private doctor for an appointment had to wait longer than 30 minutes past an appt time, which was followed by apologies. I have never recieved an apology for the wait at the VA and have been treated as an annoyance whenever I have asked how much longer I would have to wait. I have been there when vets who traveled to their appointment in the afternoon were told it was to late for them to be seen, only to have go home and try again another day. If you ask me, the VA lacks in the customer service aspect. And as a matter of fact the VA provided the original wheel chair for the vet and told him to travel to the VA center in order to have a repair authorized, which was not honored.

[mama26]

02:02 PM on 03/19/2009

Personally, I don't have a long commute to my VA facility, but the wait and treatment by those in the "customer service" arena are horrible. I have had to wait at the facility for more than TWO HOURS past my appointment time and have had to file several complaints against the front desk personnel for their rude treatment towards me and others. And don't even get me started on the wait to have meds filled. You see numerous older vets in their wheelchairs with their poor spouses in tow waiting for hours only to be told the doc put the script in wrong and they need to go back to the clinic. This starts the hours of waiting all over again. They make appointments for you without notifying you in a timely manner and then are rude when you have to cancel it due to work or child care conflicts. I have even been told that my compensation is at risk of being stopped because I canceled an appointment due to a child care conflict (you try sitting at a VA facility with a three year old for at least six hours and then have to talk to mental health about your mental problems in front of said three year old). On more than one occasion I have received an appointment letter for an appointment I didn't schedule after the appointment and then being accused of being a no-show. To be cont again...

[mama26]

02:01 PM on 03/19/2009

Are you a vet or know any vets? Many of us are not happy with the treatment we receive and the VA system doesn't work "fairly well." For instance, my brother-in-law has been waiting for THREE YEARS to be treated for a life threatening condition. He has had to make several trips (over 2 hours long and missing work) only to be told his appointment was cancelled or moved. When it has been cancelled (on the rare occasion he got a call before traveling) and he was told he would receive a call for reschedule, he doesn't receive any calls. His wife had to contact their state rep just to get him treated properly and the state rep was lied to about what was actually happening. He was finally assigned to a different doctor who was appalled at his treatment. To be cont...

[realpolitic]

11:20 AM on 03/19/2009

Interestly, the same people who decry the slightest possible cut in VA health benefits are the same one who scream "socialism" when President Obama discusses extending health insurance benefits to the entire population. The VA health care system works fairly well, perhaps some patients have too long of a commute. The Medicare system works well. When Obama speaks about expanding insurance too all, these same folks speak of huge government and wasteful bureaucracy. Let's expand insurance to all and remove the burden of providing insurance from corporations so they can compete internationally with corporations from Europe and Asia where health insurance benefits are provided by the government. Industry is in favor of this policy.

[whosyourdaddy]

02:36 PM on 03/19/2009

Interestingly enough, veterans span all political parties, races and creeds. We put our lives on the line. Trying to piggy-back your desire for a nanny state is specious.

[realpolitic]

01:49 PM on 03/20/2009

If so ridiculous, why does business favor the plan? By the way, my father fought in WWII and never used a VA hospital facility in his life.

[NobodysPoodle]

08:24 PM on 03/18/2009

Sickening. I volunteer to fight and possibly die for my country and this is what happens.

I worked hard to help with the Obama campaign. Maybe I was wrong.

[AndThenOneDay]

11:20 PM on 03/18/2009

1) The suggestion was badly (successfully) misrepresented.
2) It was cancelled:

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/03/pelosi-obama-has-promised-not-to-charge-veterans-for-service-related-health-care.php

[whosyourdaddy]

10:13 AM on 03/19/2009

1) What part of; veterans with service-connected disabilities will be required to use their private insurance to pay for care at VA healthcare facilities, was misrepresented?

2) You bet it was! Though, not before it made every active duty member and veteran disgusted, distrustful and angry with Obama and his administration.

[TivoliEclipse]

09:36 PM on 03/19/2009

Canceled.

[FZliveson]

04:00 PM on 03/18/2009

The one golden possibility in all this...and it is way far out there...is that Obama may be trying intentionally to stir "stuff" up so people get really active and DEMAND justice. I know, every goose owner wants to see golden eggs! Maybe B.O. is a miracle worker. So far, I don't see much to prove it.

[toobusy]

03:21 PM on 03/18/2009

What happened to the "sacred trust" we have with our veterans. Just another broken Obama promise!

[RedneckDem]

03:50 PM on 03/18/2009

It is not a promise and its intentions were different than what you insinuate, but you'd have to do some research first and that is a little out of your league.

[whosyourdaddy]

03:57 PM on 03/18/2009

It's not? For over 200 years this country has taken care of it's wounded.
Must be nice to sit back and carp about the loss of benefits you lack the courage to earn.

[Roguewolf]

04:30 PM on 03/18/2009

I dare you to walk into the VFW or a VA hospital or an American legion and say that.

[Roguewolf]

02:29 PM on 03/18/2009

From the Daily show

STEWART: You know the veterans? The men and women who risk their lives defending our country? They’re about yay tall, wear green… sometimes tan. They’re this brave. Well, when they get injured, you know who foots the bill? You. The taxpayer. It’s incredibly… fair.
That’s why it struck me as a little odd when I read that one of the money saving proposals from the Obama administration was to remove veterans with private insurance plans from the V.A. rolls. So I guess what the government is saying is that if you still need a little rehab after you got that leg blown off in Iraq, the government will cover you! Unless your wife as a little COBRA left over from her substitute teaching gig. In that case, you’re going to have to go with her and the whole deductible thing. Unless, of course, your spouse is in Congress, and then you can get their sweet, sweet government plan.
I’ve got some other ideas they might want to try out to save a little money in the military. How about sponsored commendations? For your service, I offer you the Frito Lay Medal of Honor. Here’s another one… how about actual Navy seals? People would totally pay to see that! Or how about the Arlington National Cemetery and Water Park?
WHAT THE F*&K ARE YOU GUYS THINKING!!??? Veterans having to use their private insurance to pay for their combat related injuries? THAT CAN’T BE RIGHT.

[FrankenPC]

04:47 PM on 03/18/2009

Post a link. You are either lying or taking information out of context. Like nearly every other incendiary agenda pumper on this thread.

[Roguewolf]

04:49 PM on 03/18/2009

http://www.thedailyshow.com/

[AN2009]

12:26 AM on 03/20/2009

It's episode 38 of season 14 (March 17, 2009).

[AN2009]

11:11 PM on 03/19/2009

Which day was this monologue broadcast?

[AN2009]

12:25 AM on 03/20/2009

Never mind.

[clarryr]

02:21 PM on 03/18/2009

sounded off a little hastily when I first replied to this article. First let me make it clear, I believe that in repayment for their service we are obligated to provide to our veterans, the best quality we have, free health care, for as long as they live, in a first in line status. I believe we should also provide the best continuing education, as much as they want, for as long as they live. I also believe that we could provide a veterans tax break.
I also, personally believe, that citizenship should be contingent on public service (2 years is about right) in either the military or civil service. I believe that health care is a basic right.
What I don't buy, is that this requires a healthcare delivery system, separate from mainstream America. I believe that there are efficiencies in funding, and improvements in care, that can be gained by combining all the various government provided (or managed) health care systems.
I would hope that those currently under government provided health care, would be willing to listen to ideas to make their care more affordable, more available, and higher quality.

Favorite Flag as abusive Posted 02:18 PM on 03/18/2009

[sonofsamphm1c]

01:36 PM on 03/18/2009

The proposal does not require a veteran who has service-related injuries to buy private health insurance.

Anybody who claims that is lying.

The proposal does not allow the VA to deny treatment to a veteran who has both private health insurance and a service-related disability.

Anybody who claims that is lying.

The proposal would require a private insurer - they never give discounts to veterans who have service-related injuries - tp pay the VA for providing treatment for the service-related injury.

That's it.

The proposal is not disgusting. The proposal does not disrespect veterans like my father:

5 battle Stars
Navy Unit Commendation
Presidential Unit Citation
Silver Star
Purple Heart

In any way, shape, or form.

All the proposal does is require my father's shiftless private insurer to help the United States of America pay to treat my fathers combat wounds in instead of just making an obscene profit on the $13,000 a year he pays the worthless bums for his private insurance.

[FrankenPC]

02:23 PM on 03/18/2009

This makes a heck of a lot of sense. And it's probably the truthiest of all these wild posts.

[Roguewolf]

02:32 PM on 03/18/2009

Commander Rehbein reiterated points made last week in testimony to both House and Senate Veterans' Affairs Committees. It was stated then that The American Legion believes that the reimbursement plan would be inconsistent with the mandate that VA treat service-connected injuries and disabilities given that the United States government sends members of the armed forces into harm's way, and not private insurance companies. The proposed requirement for these companies to reimburse the VA would not only be unfair, says the Legion, but would have an adverse impact on service-connected disabled veterans and their families. The Legion argues that, depending on the severity of the medical conditions involved, maximum insurance coverage limits could be reached through treatment of the veteran's condition alone. That would leave the rest of the family without health care benefits. The Legion also points out that many health insurance companies require deductibles to be paid before any benefits are covered. Additionally, the Legion is concerned that private insurance premiums would be elevated to cover service-connected disabled veterans and their families, especially if the veterans are self-employed or employed in small businesses unable to negotiate more favorable across-the-board insurance policy pricing. The American Legion also believes that some employers, especially small businesses, would be reluctant to hire veterans with service-connected disabilities due to the negative impact their employment might have on obtaining and financing company health care benefits.

[RedneckDem]

03:56 PM on 03/18/2009

Both this post and the one above make great points! Thats why the topic is up for discussion and ultimately, for dismissal or enactment.

[logan9]

01:08 PM on 03/18/2009

HHMMMM,

Sounds like some of you should be on FOX News crying with Glen Beck. As if considering or discussing delicate issues is akin to implementing them. I've heard these same arguments for almost a decade. During Bush II there was little discourse. Now, when it is clearly in abundance certain people begin to opine, which of course is wonderful!

But why wasn't there this much discussion during the instituting of the fraudulent Iraq War, you know, the war which is responsible for the majority of these injuries to begin with, the War that is going to require billions of dollars in health care whether private or public. Obviously even mentioning private insurance to cover these wounds is problematic. But as another commenter said, " let's view the whole entire picture."

It's seems so funny to me that people (like my folks & in-laws) whom receive socialized medicine via the VA are the first to scream socialism (and how bad it is) when the idea of universal health care is mentioned. When in reality they are satisfied with the care they receive... except for the commute many of them incur. Oh the irony. What we should discuss is an affordable, universal health care system that would trump a myriad of issues, including this one!

[JulieSA]

01:25 PM on 03/18/2009

What does Fox news have to do with this? Do you think they have mind control devices? These are Democratic legislators opposing this, in real life, in our nation's capitol.

[Acidicscold]

02:02 PM on 03/18/2009

Those dems, bless em are idiots who dont read or think and are trying to score political points at expense of veterans and our president--their only hope since McCain showed his real feelings by voting against the GI bill last year. Give Barack time. He has he nation's needs at heart.

[unprofor]

01:45 PM on 03/18/2009

This is a typical blog that can be written by anyone who believes that they are owed entitlements by their government simply because they pay taxes. Paying taxes does provide the right to an entitlement like universal health care. Getting an injury or service related medical condition while under contract serving your country does entitle you to health care related benefits from the employer (ie, government) for those injuries or conditions that were incurred while under that employment. It's called benefits, which I am sure you are aware of since you probably have some under your current employer. The government as an employer is not known for paying civilian industry type salaries with bonuses and other fringe benefits. The government does provide a fairly decent medical benefits package for its' employees and added benefits for those employees wearing the uniform of the country to ensure that it takes care of those employees for service related injuries. Universal Health Coverage should come with strings attached that are more than just paying taxes. Perhaps government service time as a citizen. Means lower pay, but better benefits. Veterans did their time, they had the courage to enter the arena, the medical benefits they get from the VA is nothing more than delayed compensation for their service.

[Paralogos]

12:45 PM on 03/18/2009

Does ANYONE have a transcript of what Obama actually said, in context?

I see a lot of knee-jerk sky-is-falling blathering here that may or may not turn out to be really silly. The closest thing that I've seen to this is a pointer to a veterans blog saying that Obama "told groups that the government could save $540 million by making verans use their private insurance for all medical care". That sounds bad, but it also sounds out-of-context and misleading. The US has, as Obama well knows, a formal obligation to wounded veterans. The 2009 VA budget for veteran medical care is $38.7 billion. If the government was actually going to dump all health care for veterans on the veterans private insurance, the savings would be 80 times greater, so plainly, that's not what was being talked about. And saying that the governnment *could* save money in such and such a way is completely ambiguous as to whether it was part of a list of options or an actual proposal. Until someone comes up with a transcript, we can't know for sure, but clearly it's more complex than the polemicists here are letting on.

[Roguewolf]

12:54 PM on 03/18/2009

The leader of the nation’s largest veterans organization says he is “deeply disappointed and concerned” after a meeting with President Obama today to discuss a proposal to force private insurance companies to pay for the treatment of military veterans who have suffered service-connected disabilities and injuries. The Obama administration recently revealed a plan to require private insurance carriers to reimburse the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) in such cases.
“It became apparent during our discussion today that the President intends to move forward with this unreasonable plan,” said Commander David K. Rehbein of The American Legion. “He says he is looking to generate $540-million by this method, but refused to hear arguments about the moral and government-avowed obligations that would be compromised by it.”
The Commander, clearly angered as he emerged from the session said, “This reimbursement plan would be inconsistent with the mandate ‘ to care for him who shall have borne the battle’ given that the United States government sent members of the armed forces into harm’s way, and not private insurance companies. I say again that The American Legion does not and will not support any plan that seeks to bill a veteran for treatment of a service connected disability at the very agency that was created to treat the unique need of America’s veterans!”

[JulieSA]

12:58 PM on 03/18/2009

Well, a whole lot of Democratic legislators are up in arms over this. Do you think they're ly ing? They heard Shinseki testify to them that this is what Obama wants.