Dems: Opportunity As Gay Marriage Acceptance Grows

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LIZ SIDOTI | May 2, 2009 06:57 PM EST | AP

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FILE - This April 28, 2009 file photo shows gay rights advocate Matthew Arnold-Lloyd of Albany, N.Y., right, meeting nose to nose with an unidentified man opposed to gay marriage during a rally outside the Capitol in Albany, N.Y. Gay marriage legalization in several states and the public's growing acceptance of same-sex unions have Democrats sensing political opportunity and some Republicans re-evaluating their party's hard-line opposition to an issue that long has rallied its base. (AP Photo/Mike Groll, File)

WASHINGTON — Gay marriage legalization in several states and the public's growing acceptance of same-sex unions have Democrats sensing political opportunity and some Republicans re-evaluating their party's hard-line opposition to an issue that long has rallied its base.

In recent weeks, Vermont and Iowa have legalized same-sex marriage, while New York, Maine and New Hampshire have taken steps in that direction. Polls show younger Americans are far are more tolerant on the issue than are older generations. For now at least, the public is much more focused on the troubled economy and two wars than on social issues.

In addition, over the past decade, public acceptance of gay marriage has changed dramatically.

A Quinnipiac University poll released last week found that a majority of people questioned, by a 55-38 percent margin, oppose gay marriage. But it also found that people, by a 57-38 percent margin, support civil unions that would provide marriage-like rights for same-sex couples, indicating a shift toward more acceptance.

With congressional elections next year, Republicans, Democrats and nonpartisan analysts say the changes benefit Democrats, whose bedrock liberals favor gay unions, and disadvantage Republicans, whose conservative base insists that marriage be solely between a man and a woman.

"This is not a sea change. This is a tide that is slowly rising in favor of gay marriage," creating a favorable political situation for Democrats and ever-more difficulty for Republicans, said David McCuan, a political scientist at Sonoma State University in California.

Democrats have a broader base filled with more accepting younger voters, as well as flexibility on the issue. Hard-core liberals support gay marriage, while others, including President Barack Obama, take a more moderate position of civil unions and defer to states on gay marriage.

Conversely, the GOP base is older, smaller and more conservative. Republicans have no place to shift on the issue but to the left, because the party has been identified largely with its rock-solid opposition to gay marriage and civil unions. Also, the GOP has no titular head setting the tone on this or other issues.

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In recent months, proponents have used state legislatures and court challenges to legalize gay marriage, mindful that the majority of the public still isn't supportive and successful ballot measures would be less likely.

Because of high court rulings, gay marriage now is legal in Iowa, Massachusetts and Connecticut. A Vermont law allowing gay marriage will take effect in September. New Hampshire and New Jersey, where same-sex couples can enter into civil unions, are considering gay marriage legislation. So are Maine and New York.

Political insiders no doubt will pay close attention to developments in Iowa and New Hampshire, early presidential voting states, to see how the issue plays out in the run-up to the 2012 presidential election.

Despite the changes, gay-marriage opponents are buoyed by a voter initiative in California that blocked the state from allowing gay marriage, and by the 29 states where voters have approved state constitutional amendments banning gay marriage.

For years, the GOP and its conservative base has used its opposition to gay marriage to drive Republican turnout in elections and marginalize party moderates. Measures defining marriage between a man and a woman that were on ballots in a slew of states in 2004 were widely credited with boosting the number of conservative voters, giving Republican George W. Bush an edge over Democrat John Kerry.

But there's been conflicting evidence since then over just how much that contributed to Bush's victory.

What's certain is that opposition to gay marriage for decades has been a potent tool for the GOP in rallying social conservatives. They are critical to the party's grass-roots organizing and small-dollar fundraising.

But as more states accept gay and lesbian unions, there is a debate inside the party over how it should position itself on the issue. The dispute is just one part of a broader struggle within the out-of-power GOP over its identity and whether it should focus on rallying conservatives or attracting supporters from across the political spectrum.

Some prominent Republicans are backing away from cut-and-dried opposition, and some party operatives say it's only a matter of time before others follow suit because the country is changing.

Republican Gov. Jon Huntsman of Utah, a Mormon who is a potential presidential candidate, backed a 2004 constitutional amendment defining marriage as between a man and a woman. But he says he favors civil unions and extending some legal rights to gay couples.

Last month, John McCain's chief campaign strategist, Steve Schmidt, told the Log Cabin Republicans: "Even though a majority of Republicans remain opposed to it, we must respect dissent on the subject within the party and encourage debate over it, and should not reject out of hand and on specious grounds ... that the party might be in the wrong on the question."

The shifting landscape is emboldening the gay-rights' movement, a pillar of the Democratic Party's left flank.

"We are at a tipping point moment," said Joe Solmonese, president of the Human Rights Campaign, a leading advocate of gay rights. "The lingering minority that continues to think that the way to win is to hold GLBT (gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender) people up as a wedge could not be more out of touch."

___

On the Net:

Log Cabin Republicans: http://online.logcabin.org/

Human Rights Campaign: http://www.hrc.org/

Quinnipiac University Polling Institute: http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x271.xml

WASHINGTON — Gay marriage legalization in several states and the public's growing acceptance of same-sex unions have Democrats sensing political opportunity and some Republicans re-evaluating th...
WASHINGTON — Gay marriage legalization in several states and the public's growing acceptance of same-sex unions have Democrats sensing political opportunity and some Republicans re-evaluating th...
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- EyeDoc007 I'm a Fan of EyeDoc007 5 fans permalink
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To Sepulchre,

First you said, "Now mating is a biological imperative, and a mammal is only going to want to mate with the gender it is attracted to." Then when I pointed out that mating means to bring animals together for breeding you said, "It is theorized that homosexuality may have developed as a way for populations close to their carrying capacity by reducing the number of breeding pairs."

Nice try!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:27 PM on 05/02/2009
- AmandaBC I'm a Fan of AmandaBC 619 fans permalink
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Why am I not surprised it totally flew over your head? I'm still waiting for you to define the word "natural"...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:29 PM on 05/02/2009
- Kubenzi I'm a Fan of Kubenzi 3 fans permalink
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Hitchens has this saying that i see more and more instances where it seems to play out in front of me.

"The never recover from their successes"

I think the prop 8 success set of the recent strong backlash and you have to wonder how the GOP doesn;t see this.When they win these little battles, it turns out to be the win was the final blow that made them lose.

You don't get a certificate of baptism from the US govt for a reason.The US govt doesn;t hand out religious edicts.Your marriage license is not a religious document either.If the GOP wants to keep the "sancitiy" of marriage, they should be the loudest group demanding taking the marriage language out of the process altogether, so they can do with it what they wish.As long on the US is giving out certificates of marriage, the is no "sanctity" because the US govt doesn't deal in "sanctity"..This is not a christian state.As far as I am concerned, the "marriage" the religious people are talking about, and the marriage my Wife and I share, are two different thing entirely.If they would like to lobby for taking the religious language out of state documents, my Wife and I will be one of the first couple's in line to hand in our out dated document for that "certificate of civil union".I won't support gay civil unions though, if that isn't what everyone gets.equality now

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:23 PM on 05/02/2009
- dm10003 I'm a Fan of dm10003 17 fans permalink
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if a sect wants control over "bad" people, you blur religion and government.

until another sect wants power you have or want, then it's a problem.

then maybe they will need government to keep other sects weak.

sigh, it's wearing me out to try to empathize!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:06 PM on 05/02/2009
- goodog I'm a Fan of goodog 154 fans permalink
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"The GOP's conservative base has used its opposition to gay marriage to drive Republican turnout in elections and marginalize party moderates. Measures defining marriage were on ballots in a slew of states in 2004 were widely credited with boosting the number of conservative voters."

Nominating an unapologetically spiritual Democrat neutralized the gaybortion wing of the GOP.

Once Obama established that he's not the GOP's gay, baby-aborting, atheist caricature, the RNC mounted an interdenominational civil war against his faith, his church, his preacher, to literally rip the faith from the man and leave him without his spiritual home.

Obama's easy religiosity baited pure religious persecution from the rightwing fanatics and showed America what the endgame is if the intentionally secular Constitutional infrastructure of America were out of the way.

Were it not for institutional secularism, the constant interdenominational civil war the founding fathers experienced would dominate the political landscape. In their brilliance, they anchored the Constitution on the question of whether religion should play any role at all --- not on the question of which religion.

There would be no religious test, but we saw in the 2009 election a battle about which religion rules, an ugly war of words verging on calls for violence at Palin rallies across the nation.

FOX Noose LOVED it, but America didn't, and the faction of the GOP that played lip service to the religious fanatics know the hint of religious fascism in 2012 is a disadvantage.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:54 PM on 05/02/2009
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Where did "marrage" come from? The government or religion? Why does a group so set against religion wish to involve themselves with a practice that is rooted in religion?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:50 PM on 05/02/2009
- Anonani I'm a Fan of Anonani 62 fans permalink
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Interesting question but in the scheme of things becoming less and less relevant. The world is changing and this may be very similar to society having adapted to never using the word "gay" to describe anything other than someone's sexual preference. In the future "marriage" may bear no resemblance to anything some in our society are clinging to for dear life.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:55 PM on 05/02/2009
- olephart I'm a Fan of olephart 114 fans permalink

They aren’t clinging to it they’re using it as a weapon. They have no true religious beliefs other than their belief in their own non-introspective and false infallibility. They revel in hate and all of its power. Theirs is the Southern Strategy; to use hundreds of years of hate for their own crass political advantage. Gay basing is a means to an end and that end is power. Reagan and his wife Nancy despised the religious right but pandered for their votes. Those who take up the cause of Gay bashing are the moronic foot soldiers of the Republican Party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:08 PM on 05/02/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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Same sex couples seek equal access to government acknowledged marriage, a civil contract.

There are religions that already perform same sex marriages, and others that don't.

Both are immaterial - or properly should be - to the civil contract.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:55 PM on 05/02/2009
- AmandaBC I'm a Fan of AmandaBC 619 fans permalink
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The oldest marriages in historical records (in ancient Greece and later in ancient Rome) weren't religious at all. Try again...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:55 PM on 05/02/2009
- Anonani I'm a Fan of Anonani 62 fans permalink
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Continue your research...you missed quite a bit.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:02 PM on 05/02/2009
- EyeDoc007 I'm a Fan of EyeDoc007 5 fans permalink
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I'm not sure if it's rooted in religion. The ancient Egyptians, Greeks, and Romans all had marriages. True, they had their own religions but they in no way resemble the religions I'm sure you're thinking of.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:00 PM on 05/02/2009
- AmandaBC I'm a Fan of AmandaBC 619 fans permalink
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"I'm not sure if it's rooted in religion."

It's not. At all. As usual, conservatives know absolutely nothing about history.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:09 PM on 05/02/2009

I believe you're "Bark"ing up the wrong tree.

It is anti-theists, atheists, non-theists, and
some "spiritual" groups which are "against"
religion (in more or less order of intensity).

Gay people are generally heterogeneous
with regards to most other classifications,
including religious membership.

The question you may want to start to ask
is *if* you were correct, how is it the govt,
can be in the marriage business....

...if marriage is RELIGIOUS wouldn't
that be an establishment clause violation?

Since it is not, marriage is a public,
civil institution.

In conclusion, you post is a strawperson
and your question rhetorical.

Try again if you wish.

Warmly,

Pauile Sabol

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:00 PM on 05/02/2009

"Deferring to the states", as President Obama apparently does on this issue, is really just another way of saying, "I'm too big a pus-y to actually say publicly what I think about this." It's a total cop-out stance that politicians use on hot-button issues they don't want to address for fear of alienating voters. Weak... Try growing a pair for a change!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:36 PM on 05/02/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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And yet it's the best route, at this time.

Don't forget, interracial marriage was illegal in some states but legal in others for some time before Loving v Virginia made it broadly legal.

There's not TOO much Obama can do about it anyway.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:43 PM on 05/02/2009
- dm10003 I'm a Fan of dm10003 17 fans permalink
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the fed can't address marriage, that has to be thru the states. obama can and will find a way to at least discourage roadblocks in the party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:33 PM on 05/02/2009
- kcinci I'm a Fan of kcinci 14 fans permalink

dm10003: not completely true. The US congress along with President Clinton' signature gave us DOMA. President Obama can sign legislation repealing DOMA (and DADT while he's at it). Then we can actually start looking at the full faith issues.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:32 PM on 05/02/2009
- olephart I'm a Fan of olephart 114 fans permalink

I’ve never been against Gay marriage. Who am I to stand in the way of, after having worked all week and finally gotten a day off, the bliss of being “asked” to accompany my wife to a shopping mall eighty miles away. No, I am much in favor of spreading the enjoyment of seeing what I have earned invested in clothing that is to be worn at least once before disappearing into a closet that would house an immigrant family of eight. While I would prefer the civil union approach, available to both same and opposite sex couples, I really don’t care.

I really didn’t care until the Republicans took so much delight in hammering Gays who dared to ask for this right. Now I look forward to impaling these misbegotten (seven letter word maligning their birth) on their own pike of intolerance. All the more to paint these inbred cretins into their shrinking corner. I look forward to seeing them invest what little political capital they have left in a futile effort to turn back the pages of history. Already the younger generation has accepted that Gays are just people and are turned off by Republican knuckle dragging.

They will shortly be a minority confined to the buckle on the Bible Belt. Their future will be limited to a few Confederate holdouts in the backwoods of America living in a past of bigotry, intolerance and ignorance.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:07 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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yeah, they remind me of the Japanese soldiers still fighting WWII

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:11 PM on 05/02/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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And the louder they scream the closer we are to legal equality.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:19 PM on 05/02/2009
- HLL I'm a Fan of HLL 78 fans permalink

Maybe this is the century we finally get over all our hang-ups: skin color, age, gender, the kind of car you drive, religion, the right to choose and marriage to whomever. What on earth does it matter who marries whom? I don't care if someone wants to marry their parakeet and leave it all their money if it makes them happy. Peace to all that. We can't breathe the air or drink the water - now THAT'S something to get worked up about.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:05 PM on 05/02/2009
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Is it just me or are those guys in the picture looking like they are about to kiss?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:03 PM on 05/02/2009
- mydwyf I'm a Fan of mydwyf 22 fans permalink

Read the caption. That picture actually says it all. It's enough to turn one into a homophobe.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:17 PM on 05/02/2009
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Well we know that the most virulent homophobes are closet cases...though I'm sure Mr Arnold-Lloyd has higher standards in men.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:23 PM on 05/02/2009
- scooperss I'm a Fan of scooperss 77 fans permalink
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Can't wait to see which dems knock this one down.
Personally I don't have a problem, but I'm sure the parties of *NO* and *we don't have the votes* will be able to find a way to down this.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:02 PM on 05/02/2009
- grey sells I'm a Fan of grey sells 3 fans permalink
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Love trumpts all. Play with the rules, if you must. But love trumps all. Leave to each other the coice of partner.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:55 PM on 05/02/2009
- helonias I'm a Fan of helonias 269 fans permalink
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But not Donald Trump

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:11 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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LOL- yeah, leave him out. and his combover too.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:43 PM on 05/02/2009

common sense and common decency will win out over ignorance and bigotry because it is the right way. some people get it , some never will.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:45 PM on 05/02/2009

I love your optimism....I hope you are right.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:50 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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he/she is absolutely right. NO doubt about it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:51 PM on 05/02/2009
- EyeDoc007 I'm a Fan of EyeDoc007 5 fans permalink
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Common sense should tell you that two men cannot get married.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:02 PM on 05/02/2009
- kforce I'm a Fan of kforce 18 fans permalink

The law in Massachusetts, Connecticut, Vermont and Iowa should tell you differently.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:12 PM on 05/02/2009

That's not common sense, it's irrational bigotry.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:17 PM on 05/02/2009
- Pyfagorus I'm a Fan of Pyfagorus 166 fans permalink
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"Common sense should tell you that the universe revolves around the Earth." -- pretty much the entire world prior to Copernicus

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:19 PM on 05/02/2009

2 women o.k.? Are you a guy? Just wondering....

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:22 PM on 05/02/2009
- joebloe I'm a Fan of joebloe 38 fans permalink
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Then why do they allow gay priests?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:24 PM on 05/02/2009
- JohnButrus I'm a Fan of JohnButrus 4 fans permalink
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If same sex couples get married they will pay substantially higher income taxes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:42 PM on 05/02/2009

Is this why conservatives are really against gay marriage? They seem to be opposed to all forms of taxation.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:01 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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LOLLLLLLLLLLLL

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:05 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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do you ever listen to yourself?

and how silly you sound?

just curious.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:01 PM on 05/02/2009
- JohnButrus I'm a Fan of JohnButrus 4 fans permalink
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I guarantee I would be a better advocate for SSM than you would.

Do you think I support or oppose Same Sex Marriage?

How about civil unions?

BTW - President Obama and Congress could pass legislation to legalize SSM anytime they want. Since Democrats control both houses of the Congress, there is nothing Republicans could do to stop it.

Why do you think the president and congress have not taken this opportunity to legalize SSM?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:19 PM on 05/02/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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If you put your hand in water, your hand will get wet.

Got any more useless observations?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:02 PM on 05/02/2009

You won't pay that much more.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:04 PM on 05/02/2009
- klandish I'm a Fan of klandish 83 fans permalink
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Not if they have children which many Gay couples do have now. This is about inheritance and many other legal issues that surround non-married mates.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:11 PM on 05/02/2009
- JohnButrus I'm a Fan of JohnButrus 4 fans permalink
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A non-married same sex couple that each make $250,000 per year ($500,000 total) will pay more federal income tax than a married same sex couple with the identical income (Goodbye Schedule-A Deductions including deductions for having children). From you comment, I would guess you know how this works.

Estate issues related to non-married same sex couples definitely seem unfair. For now, the best thing for a same sex couple to do is get a will. This does not solve the marital deduction issue though.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:09 PM on 05/02/2009

Alone, we are in bad company. Together, we enrich each other's lives. Sex or other conditions is irrelevant and nobody else's concern. A dynamic society is an experimenting, diverse, tolerant and enlightened society. Our right to be what we must be is a natural right, as long as that right does not trample on the rights of others. And always do in to others as you would require them to do into you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:33 PM on 05/02/2009
- dm10003 I'm a Fan of dm10003 17 fans permalink
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we're in a unique historical moment when we need the help of people who don't want to be in our business just as we don't want to be in theirs. we need them to support equality just long enough to achieve it, then t they we can get back out of each other's business!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:58 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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good point!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:59 PM on 05/02/2009
- ronnie423 I'm a Fan of ronnie423 5 fans permalink
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both sides of this fight has been going on for 30 years. lots of money and time on both sides and now with republicans loosing support this battle should be over. I hope most republicans will change their ways and try to open their door for a more diverse party.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:32 PM on 05/02/2009
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You mean open their CLOSET doors, right?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:28 PM on 05/02/2009
- rejoyce5 I'm a Fan of rejoyce5 14 fans permalink

As a Republican I oppose gay marriage but endorse civil unions. I am pro -life but realize Roe v Wade will never be overturned so our focus should be on preventing unwanted pregnancies. Our party needs to adapt to the 21st century without compromising all our beliefs.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:23 PM on 05/02/2009
- AmandaBC I'm a Fan of AmandaBC 619 fans permalink
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Your party is incompatible with the XXI century...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:25 PM on 05/02/2009
- lizr I'm a Fan of lizr 263 fans permalink
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LOL!!!! love it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:29 PM on 05/02/2009
- rejoyce5 I'm a Fan of rejoyce5 14 fans permalink

You are on a roll tonight aren't you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:00 AM on 05/03/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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These positions are more rational than those held by most of the remaining people who identify with the Republican party, so you're ahead of them.

You might as well understand that civil unions will be a stepping stone to full legal equality, as segregated schools and buses once were.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:29 PM on 05/02/2009
- EyeDoc007 I'm a Fan of EyeDoc007 5 fans permalink
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Roe v. Wade will never be overturned because it's too big a cash cow for both parties. Republicans get a ton of campaign donations from pro-life groups, and the Democrats get the same from pro-choice groups. Neither side wants to cut this money supply.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:30 PM on 05/02/2009
- joemondo I'm a Fan of joemondo 23 fans permalink
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Republican dominated every branch of federal government for most of the last 8 years and didn't outlaw abortion.

You're right in that it's their cash machine.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:37 PM on 05/02/2009
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Better clean up your own house first, citizen:

http://www.armchairsubversive.org

"Party of conservative Christian family values?" In a pig's eye.

Then there's the matter of a war for oil and empire launched and sustained by over 900+ *documented* lies about WMDs and debunked claims of connections between Saddam Hussein and 9/11 that's costing We The People circa $10 billion per month, officially sanctioned torture, ad nauseum.

"Adapt to the 21st century?" I happen to be an independent. From where I'm sitting, the GOP had best atone for the mess it has made first, before there can be any talk of "adapting" to anything except perhaps *life behind bars.*

Leland R. Erickson

Citizen

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:34 PM on 05/02/2009

well I am for gay marriage and I am pro choice but you make a reasonable statement and you do have a right to your beliefs as I do and you are very correct in saying the party needs to adapt to the 21st century. It's nice to hear an opposing point of view spoken so well as yours.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:35 PM on 05/02/2009
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