US Soldier Kills Fellow Troops In Iraq UPDATED

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  |   05/12/09 11:35 AM

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***UPDATE*** The Associated Press reveals more details about the shooter:

The suspect had been disarmed after an earlier incident at the center but returned with another weapon, according to a senior military official in Washington, who spoke on condition of anonymity because the investigation into the shootings was ongoing.

***UPDATE*** The American soldier who shot dead five fellow soldiers at a U.S. base in Baghdad is in custody.

"The shooter is a US soldier and he is in custody," US marine corps lieutenant Tom Garnett, a US military spokesman in Iraq, told reporters.

The New York Times adds some perspective to the tragedy:

The killings appeared to be the worst case of soldier-on-soldier violence among the American forces based in Iraq since the invasion more than six years ago.

The shootings, which took place at a stress clinic, highlight the problem of post-traumatic stress disorder among U.S. soldiers, notes the Guardian:

Stress is one of the biggest killers of US soldiers in Iraq. About a fifth of all US troops are thought to be suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, contributing to high divorce and suicide rates. An estimated one fifth of the 4,292 members of the US force in Iraq have died from non-combat causes, either in accidents or from suicide.

***UPDATE*** According to Fox News, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs Monday relayed President Obama's response to the tragedy. Obama expressed shock and sadness and is promising to fully investigate what exactly transpired at Camp Liberty, so as to prevent such incidents in the future.


***UPDATE*** AP has another update. The shooting was at a 'stress clinic':

Pentagon officials say five Americans are dead after a U.S. soldier opened fire at a U.S. base in Baghdad. They say the attacker is in custody.


The officials say the shootings happened on Camp Liberty at a stress clinic, where troops can go for help with the stresses of combat or stress from personal issues.

Story continues below
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One senior military official in Washington says it's unclear whether those killed are workers at the clinic or were there for counseling. He says officials also are unsure whether all the dead are members of the military.

***UPDATE*** ABC News reports that the U.S. soldier who attacked fellow troops on a U.S, base in Iraq has killed five of them and is now in custody. Initial reports suggested that he had turned the gun on himself after his rampage.

***UPDATE*** AP now reports that the U.S. soldier who went on a rampage against his fellow troops in Iraq may have survived the incident:

Pentagon officials say five U.S. soldiers are dead after an American soldier opened fire at a U.S. base in Baghdad.


The officials say the shootings happened Monday at Camp Liberty near Baghdad's airport.

One senior military official in Washington said it was not yet clear whether the shooter was among the dead. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because the circumstances surrounding the deaths are under investigation.

Initial reports indicated the Army soldier shot several others, then turned the gun on himself. But it was unclear whether he, too, had died.

***UPDATE*** CNN reports that 3 other U.S. soldiers were wounded during the friendly fire incident that has left 5 U.S. troops dead. An American soldier killed 4 of his fellow troops before killing himself.

According to the Washington Post, it is the single greatest loss of life in a single incident involving U.S. soldiers since a truck bomb last month took the lives of 5 American soldiers.

***UPDATE*** CNN has just sent out a breaking news alert reporting that senior defense officials have told the network that a US soldier killed 4 of his fellow troops before killing himself. Check back for more information.

McClatchy is reporting that a shooting at a U.S. base in Baghdad has left 5 soldiers dead. The shooting occurred at Camp Liberty, a base near the Baghdad airport.

Check back for more information.

***UPDATE*** The Associated Press reveals more details about the shooter: The suspect had been disarmed after an earlier incident at the center but returned with another weapon, according to a senior...
***UPDATE*** The Associated Press reveals more details about the shooter: The suspect had been disarmed after an earlier incident at the center but returned with another weapon, according to a senior...
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- owiseone I'm a Fan of owiseone 11 fans permalink

Following the Ky. trial of the young former soldier convicted of murder and rape in Iraq, what has stuck in my mind is the convicted young man's saying:

"George W Bush and Dick Cheney should be on trial instead of me".

This says it all.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:30 AM on 05/12/2009
- ccwguy I'm a Fan of ccwguy 10 fans permalink

Right, because GWB and Cheney were responsible for that young man's actions.

The liberal masses obsession with taking the least amount of individual responsibility possible is truly amazing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:36 AM on 05/12/2009
- Cye I'm a Fan of Cye 23 fans permalink
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I agree with the jist of your point - individuals must take responsiblity for their actions. There is nothing more desructive to me than to blame murderous, violent or destructive behaviour on false collectives, such as "society", etc. In very few cases - extreme - is this excuse actually credible.

But at the same time, because war is so awful, painful and so destructive to societies and individuals both, governments ought to use it as an intrument of last resort - after all other reasonable measures in the prevailing circumstances have been exhausted. Whether you or I like it or not, many people around the world did not (and still don't) see Iraq as a war of necessity or last resort - but a war of choice.

It does not - and should not - excuse this soldiers behaviour but it is easy to point the finger of blame for whateve tragedies - over and above war itself - on the Bush Administration itself.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:35 AM on 05/13/2009
- SirReal1 I'm a Fan of SirReal1 64 fans permalink

It's a pretty tough sell to lay "taking the least amount of individual responsibility" on the "liberal masses" when the conservative right is arguing against Bush and Cheney being held accountable for the crimes committed during their administration.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:16 AM on 05/14/2009
- ccwguy I'm a Fan of ccwguy 10 fans permalink

The only thing that "says" is that you, like all liberals, completely turn your back to personal responsibility.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:42 AM on 05/12/2009
- Buddy McCue I'm a Fan of Buddy McCue 136 fans permalink
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It's our personal responsibility to care about warcrimes, and to be concerned about culpability.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:49 AM on 05/12/2009
- cinesimon I'm a Fan of cinesimon 58 fans permalink

That's just rot.

Get a grip you sad little person.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:01 AM on 05/12/2009
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Says the 21%er who still thinks the past 8 years were wonderful, and there is nothing wrong with torture. Please, get back to your argument of "Pelosi knew about it", and then try your "personal responsibility" argument again.

It's hilliarious to see you guys loudly proclaim personal responsibility, but then blame everyone else when you do something wrong...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:06 AM on 05/12/2009
- SirReal1 I'm a Fan of SirReal1 64 fans permalink

Doesn't it strike you as just a little bit hypocritical to accuse "all liberals" of "turning their backs on personal responsibility" when the vast majority of conservatives are arguing against holding Bush and Cheney accountable for policies that they ordered, regardless of whether they committed crimes?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:19 AM on 05/14/2009
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...and George Bush's war continues to reap big dividends.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:26 AM on 05/12/2009
- ICorpsDoc I'm a Fan of ICorpsDoc 18 fans permalink

After. When the studies are done a few things are going to be interesting to see.

How do those that sign up for the Reserves or the Guard fare as opposed to those that join with the knowledge that they will be deployed to combat?

How do the Marine Corps folks preform in an extended combat environment vs the Army folks? Who is better trained and suited for this type of work?

How do those who joined to learn a trade or work as supply clerks normally safe in the rear fare as opposed to those who joined to be grunts or rangers etc?

I do think I have an idea. But it will be interesting to see what the study folks say.

Being a warrior is something you should want to do if you are going to be good at it. You should want to do it. You should be properly trained to do it. its not a gig for the reluctant or the weak.

Sometimes a Ford Pinto just has no business being placed into the Indy 500. No matter how short of race cars you might think you are.

S/F

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:05 AM on 05/12/2009
- kesmarn I'm a Fan of kesmarn 76 fans permalink

I agree that it was a dirty trick to send people who signed up for the National Guard, thinking that they would be helping with sand-bagging along flooded rivers, etc. to Iraq for combat. But I wonder if it's entirely fair use the term "weak" or to make the comparison to a Ford Pinto in regard to people who develop PTSD or other mental health problems. Virtually any human--trained Marine or not--can snap under the right combination of circumstances. Weakness doesn't necessarily factor in.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:04 AM on 05/12/2009
- MJinCanada I'm a Fan of MJinCanada 106 fans permalink

You have good points. Another is the type of conflict they've been sent to. I'm sure the stress is bad enough when you're sure you're doing the right thing. But if you have strong doubts about why you're putting your life on the line and if you suspect you're persecuting innocent people because the higher ups have lied -- I tried to wrap my head around it and I got horribly angry on behalf of the soldiers. And I'm here safe at home and they're not.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 PM on 05/12/2009
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When one joins the National Guard or Reserve, you know that there is a possibility that you will deploy. If not, you have no business joining in the first place.

This is not the first time the National Guard and Reserves have been called on to deploy. Ever heard of the "Bloody Bucket"? It's the patch of the 28th Infantry Division, the PA National Guard. They were so destructive to the Germans in WWII that they gave them the name the "Bloody Bucket" (the patch is a red keystone).

And in Iraq, there is no "rear". It's called "Kuwait".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:36 PM on 05/14/2009
- ericmiami I'm a Fan of ericmiami 50 fans permalink
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There is no such thing as an unwounded combat vet.
Eric
Vietnam Class of '67

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:50 AM on 05/12/2009
- steamboat I'm a Fan of steamboat 44 fans permalink

Welcome, home ! .....Mysel­f, VietNam (67-68). US Army, 11th Armored Cavalry Regt. (Blackhorse). Platoon medic, Purple Heart recipient. PTSD clinic participant for the past 24 years. All you Ronald Reagan haters, myself I'm grateful to him the 'Gipper funded Vet Centers because he knew we were messed-up due to VietNam and the way the liberals harrassed and treated us when we came home......­..Eric, after my little speel, all I have to say what I notice about the comments from everybody is, "yes, the war circumstances could have and probably contributed to this guy going off. But whats lacking on this blog is any sympathy, any emphathy for the 5 victims. Somebody needs to remember they are the victims."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:29 AM on 05/12/2009
- MJinCanada I'm a Fan of MJinCanada 106 fans permalink

True. Although I'd say every soldier serving in Iraq has been a victim.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:11 PM on 05/12/2009
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Thank you for that reminder. Sending you warm and fuzzy thoughts..­..

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:32 AM on 05/12/2009
- FranklinS I'm a Fan of FranklinS 13 fans permalink
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Yup.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:53 AM on 05/12/2009
- hollybork I'm a Fan of hollybork 65 fans permalink

Eric - I am of your generation. You are exactly right. How do you feel about this - We need to become like Switzerland.

We are human beings and so much more than born killers. We can use rational, diplomatic and financial means to influence the world rather than training our young people as brick bats and battering rams to be broken and tossed away when they are crippled in the field from what they do and what they see. They are traumatized and terrorized. They and their families will be futher injured as they carry this home in post traumatic stress. It follows one way or the other in the wake of soldiering in war. We make these young people become bullies and killers. We hold them up as examples of honor and courage, and then ruin them. We de sensitize their better instincts to make them better "soldiers.­" It is a communal guilt we carry for the destruction of the mental health of these young people when they return from the field of slaugher. Why don't we learn? WHY?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:53 AM on 05/12/2009

This is so sad.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:07 AM on 05/12/2009
- v eyepete I'm a Fan of v eyepete 31 fans permalink

These young men don't believe in the battle they were commanded to tackle, and with very good reason. Please lets us just call them home and enlist them into rebuilding America.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:16 AM on 05/12/2009
- devans00 I'm a Fan of devans00 17 fans permalink
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See what happens when we keep sending people back to the same meat grinder, AKA war in Iraq?

American policy has failed the soldier who shot his comrades as well as the soldiers who were shot.

My condolences to all co-workers, families and friends involved directly and indirectly.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:57 AM on 05/12/2009

And no one stood up to Bush on the extended rotations; you either get enough soldiers or you walk away, instead of being cruel to your own soldiers and forcing them to do the impossible.
And yet, what has Obama learned? Isn't he poised to send a surge into Afghanistan? More boots on the ground in a place where that has proven to be a hopeless strategy?
There's more similarity to Bush than "change" in the war strategy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:12 AM on 05/12/2009

True. And it would seem that these guys have had more rotations to combat than WW2 vets. They keep saying they "understand" the stress of constant deployments but there is no end in sight to this madness. In one more year we will surpass the length of the Vietnam War, with no end in sight. The GIs will come home broken and will get discarded to the veterans heap and forgotten. A typical enlistment in the Army or Marines today will get you two combat tours at a minimum. Thank your worthless congressman for that.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:13 AM on 05/12/2009
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Actually, there was no such thing as a "rotation" in WWII. Once you were sent to fight, you were in the military until you died, were wounded, or the war ended. No joke. Check out an excellent book by John C. McManus called "The Deadly Brotherhood: The American Combat Soldier in World War II". An awesome read.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:40 PM on 05/14/2009
- The Ghost I'm a Fan of The Ghost 47 fans permalink
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"No nation has ever benefited from a prolonged war." Sun Tzu

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:30 AM on 05/12/2009
- gypsy508 I'm a Fan of gypsy508 9 fans permalink

Combined with the errant bomb in Afghanistan, they are now Obamas wars.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:21 AM on 05/12/2009
- moongal6 I'm a Fan of moongal6 74 fans permalink
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I hope this tragedy is the last one of it's kind. I pray for the families involved. This is not the first incident like this, many have been covered.
I am thankful that this issue of 3 and 4 TOD's is being brought to light. The stress is maybe worse than any other military action because of the civil unrest there and the types of deaths being witnessed by our soldiers.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:19 AM on 05/12/2009
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"Last one of its kind"? Give me a break. This is only the beginning.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:21 AM on 05/12/2009
- demfriend I'm a Fan of demfriend 22 fans permalink
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In the mental health ward where I work the change has happened there to where the suicidal ideations/thoughts now include homicidal ideations in some. The original soldiers who wanted to kill just themselves are now seeing those around them as being people who are keeping them in the stress/hor­ror/trauma and this change has happened very quickly in numbers not being ignored. But how do we treat every single soldier in need of the treatment when possibly 8 maybe 9 out of 10 needs the help? Do we medicate the soldiers and send them out with weapons while on the medication and put the ther soldiers around them in risk of having someone with side effects of the medications backing them up? Do we counsel every one who needs it and where would this happen? We are already seeing the young kids coming in before they even finish boot camp taking whatever is handy and want out because they cannot "deal with" boot camp and the PTSD patients are coming too. Depression and suicidal is everyday homicidal is now adding to it....anyo­ne have the answers?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:00 AM on 05/12/2009
- oakley9 I'm a Fan of oakley9 20 fans permalink

Boot camp is brainwashing. Maybe we should re-brainwash them, give them all intensive therapy for 8 weeks when they come home to come back to some sort of normal.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:37 AM on 05/12/2009
- v eyepete I'm a Fan of v eyepete 31 fans permalink

Maybe we should explore the reasons they enlist to fight in the first place?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:18 AM on 05/12/2009
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No one has the answers...­but you're as close to having them as anyone with the experience and judgment to make such assessments. It's too bad that more people aren't listening to people like you who should be up front and center in making the sort of experienced--based analysis that should be adhered to. Good comments, btw

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:24 AM on 05/12/2009
- probo I'm a Fan of probo 221 fans permalink
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This is so sad and tragic, there are no words of comfort for these poor military families, I just cry at the tragedy, why oh why oh why?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:19 AM on 05/12/2009
- Vr6 I'm a Fan of Vr6 9 fans permalink
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Because of lies, lies, lies - sadly. Now this young Pup will pay for his duty with his life - where is the justice?!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:38 AM on 05/12/2009
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Next, I was sent all over Baghdad to see other psychologist and psychiatrists each a different one, which I counted to be 5 total. Until I was sent to crazy camp (the lovingly given name for the stress camp) for a week. This is the same camp that is in the news today for the shootings. This stress management camp was actually helpful and I learned a lot of ways to cope with various types of stressors and even met my now best friend and "brother from another mother" there. I was starting to feel better and that I was going to be alright, until I left the camp.
For my last few months in country I was ridiculed, mocked, removed from my job that I loved, and basically discarded as a person. I had no friends or people who I felt like I could talk to. I remember crying to help myself go to sleep and I remember taking all the pills they gave me for anxiety, depression, and my sleeping disorder (which helped me gain 45 lbs).

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:01 AM on 05/12/2009
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Thank you for your service and please accept my appreciation for your humanity and the losses you have suffered and continue to grapple with. Telling us about your experiences is a generous act - please stay here and keep us knowing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:29 AM on 05/12/2009
- bmermaid I'm a Fan of bmermaid 18 fans permalink
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You are not alone. My daughter, too, has had her life all but distroyed by her service in Iraq.
I do care about you. I do want to help. I know it is not enough.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:46 AM on 05/12/2009
- steamboat I'm a Fan of steamboat 44 fans permalink

So why did you liberals treat us (I'm a VietNam vet) so horribly when we came home from VietNam? answer, please.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:36 AM on 05/12/2009
- hollybork I'm a Fan of hollybork 65 fans permalink

Thank you for your post and for your military service. Get strong and get well. You have served your country, and now you have to take the best possible care of yourself. Thank God you came back with your arms, legs, eyes and ears. Be well. God Bless, Jordan. You could be my own son.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:00 PM on 05/12/2009
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The ARMY did a good job by setting up the stress management clinic and it was ran buy good caring individuals that tried their hardest to make us laugh, talk, and let go of our stress. The ARMY has done a less than subpar job helping soldiers cope when they are no longer at crazy camp, because they are "weak and worthless individuals, who can no longer hack it" and now they are wondering why something like this incident happened. I am saddened by these events but I am surely not surprised, because who wants to go to a place to get help only to be destroyed when they leave.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:01 AM on 05/12/2009
- cinesimon I'm a Fan of cinesimon 58 fans permalink

Jordan you're a very brave guy who's obviously dealing well with his recovery - props to you, bud.

Thank you for your story - it's good to know that at least the 'stress camp' is a good service, and it's not surprising to see that much of the good work is toirn down by the culture of the army.

Definitely the pro macho attitude and the perception that tough guys don't have trauma or depression issues needs to be addressed. It's dangerous to have hundreds of thousands of people scared to address any issues that may come about due to trauma or depression - not to mention extremely damaging in the long term.

I wonder if a PR-type campaign using high profile guys - a combination of respected celebrities and military heroes telling their stories of depression and mental health issues, that it's natural, not weak, that it needs addressing and can be dealt with if addressed healthily - by the person and by their mates and the guys in their unit might help to increase awareness. I've seen it done in other countries as a national campaign, and the results were amazing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:27 AM on 05/12/2009
- cinesimon I'm a Fan of cinesimon 58 fans permalink

I meant with support from friends and chosen guys in the unit.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:37 AM on 05/12/2009
- wyldthings I'm a Fan of wyldthings 12 fans permalink

cinesimon, I have seen your post and honestly I realize that you concern for the Soldier is real and comes from your heart. I posted earlier and you kind of took me to task. I receive a check each month from the American tax payer and have Medical treatment better than a U.S.Senato­r. This comes from PTSD during Nam. I am very grateful for veterans benefits and all Jordan has to do is go to the V.a and he will receive full compensation for the rest of his life. But before you take the Army culture to task remember in combat you must be able to depend 100% on the other man. If a soldier can not comprehend if his weapon is loaded then he creates a huge risk to the safety of the whole squad. In combat the a simple mistake can kill an entire squad. So try to understand why a sergeants who is responsible for probably 50 men or women might act this way>

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:01 AM on 05/12/2009
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For the people who read this comment I would like to let you know how it really is at the mental health / stress clinic. I served in Iraq in OIF 5 and OIF 6 and was stationed in Baghdad, Iraq. Around my 7th or 8th month there I was starting to notice that I was not getting enough sleep and my "reality" was becoming quite skewed. I think that I realized that I was having a problem when I would forget that my weapon was loaded on the FOB (forward operating base) and that I could not remember waking up or going to sleep, and this was how the ARMY and my peers treated me.
First because of the weapon issue even after I told my commander that I thought that I was having a problem, I was demoted and was sent to the doctor (not psychologist) on our FOB. Then I had to go through the hassle of being called crazy and having my "friends" stop talking to me (because the sergeants told them to). Then I was given pills from the doctor that were supposed to help, they did not help.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:57 PM on 05/11/2009
- AliMB I'm a Fan of AliMB 68 fans permalink
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Thanks for sharing your story

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:24 AM on 05/12/2009
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sorry it is not in order but I was only given 250 words to explain a pain that will take a while to get rid of. Thankfully I am doing better and doing well in school and can sleep well for most of the night and i appreciate your reply.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:29 AM on 05/12/2009
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