One-Fourth Of Overseas Votes Go Uncounted: Report

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JIM ABRAMS | May 13, 2009 05:31 PM EST | AP

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WASHINGTON — One out of every four military personnel and other Americans living abroad may have been thwarted in their efforts to vote in the 2008 election because of communications and bureaucratic problems, according to a congressional report released Wednesday.

"Registration deadlines, notary requirements, lack of communication, mail delays, poor address information and state laws that put in place untenable mailing dates are all severe problems," Sen. Charles Schumer, chairman of the Senate Rules and Administration Committee, said at a hearing.

Schumer, D-N.Y., said the study prepared by the committee and the Congressional Research Service, while providing only a snapshot of voting patterns, "is enough to show that the balloting process for service members is clearly in need of an overhaul." He plans to work with Sen. Saxby Chambliss, R-Ga., in crafting legislation dealing with the issue.

The study surveyed election offices in seven states with high numbers of military personnel: California, Florida, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Texas, Washington and West Virginia.

It said that of 441,000 absentee ballots requested by eligible voters living abroad _ mainly active-duty and reserve troops _ more than 98,000 were "lost" ballots that were mailed out but never received by election officials. Taking into account 13,500 ballots that were rejected for such reasons as a missing signature or failure to notarize, one-quarter of those requesting a ballot were disenfranchised.

The study found that an additional 11,000 ballots were returned as undeliverable.

Gail McGinn, the Defense Department's acting undersecretary for personnel and readiness, told the committee that the Pentagon "has taken extraordinary steps to ensure that members of the uniformed services, their family members and overseas citizens have an opportunity to vote."

She said the department will issue a report to Congress in December on the results of the 2008 election and said other surveys, while providing useful information, should be viewed with caution if their results are based on non-random populations.

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Schumer later provided data from his home state of New York concluding that two out of every five military absentee ballots go uncounted. It takes as much as 82 days for New York State troops stationed overseas to go through the absentee voting process, he said.

Schumer's office said that because a person living abroad must request the absentee ballot and show a clear intention to vote, voter negligence is not thought to be a major factor.

Rather, Schumer said in a statement, there is a chronic problem of military voters being sent a ballot without sufficient time to complete it and send it back.

Among the states surveyed, California had 30,000 "lost" votes out of 103,000 ballots mailed out. An additional 3,000 ballots were returned as undeliverable and 4,000 were rejected.

The hearing took up possible problems in the Pentagon's Federal Voting Assistance Program, which handles the election process for military personnel and other overseas voters.

___

On the Net:

Senate Rules and Administration Committee: http://rules.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseActionCommitteeSchedule.Hearing&Hearing_id4bbecb7a-f4b9-487b-a1e6-47065a293ccf

WASHINGTON — One out of every four military personnel and other Americans living abroad may have been thwarted in their efforts to vote in the 2008 election because of communications and bureauc...
WASHINGTON — One out of every four military personnel and other Americans living abroad may have been thwarted in their efforts to vote in the 2008 election because of communications and bureauc...
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- Artemis34 I'm a Fan of Artemis34 228 fans permalink
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Disenfranchisement is a plank in the Republican party. Some local Republican groups were even sending letters to the homes of people they knew were active duty military specifically so that they could challenge their right to vote.

We need universal suffrages so that conservatives and Republicans cannot disenfranchise those likely to disagree with them.

Don't know why people think active duty military votes Republican. Many come from poor and working class families, more likely to be Democrats.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:03 PM on 05/14/2009
- Gumby123 I'm a Fan of Gumby123 15 fans permalink
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I guess the new mantra for this political age is "We Support Our Troops As Long As Their Ballots Are Not Counted."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:23 PM on 05/13/2009
- Artemis34 I'm a Fan of Artemis34 228 fans permalink
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Yes, when everyone votes and all votes are counted progressives and Democrats win.

Here is an example of Republican caging:

http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2008/sep/20/caging-letter-are-republicans-trying-disqualify-co/

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:45 PM on 05/14/2009
- JulieSA I'm a Fan of JulieSA 165 fans permalink
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This is in today's news:

"WASHINGTON—U.S. Sen. John Cornyn, a member of the Senate Republican leadership, and U.S. Rep. Kevin McCarthy, R-Calif., a member of the House Republican leadership and the Ranking Member of the Committee on House Administration’s Elections Subcommittee, today re-introduced the Military Voting Protection (MVP) Act.
This legislation is designed to protect the voting rights of our troops serving abroad by ensuring their absentee ballots are delivered back home in time to be counted and do not get lost on the way. Numerous military support organizations and veterans’ service organizations supported the MVP Act last Congress."

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:40 PM on 05/13/2009
- JulieSA I'm a Fan of JulieSA 165 fans permalink
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A more recent example if the NY special congressional election, where the Dems on the election board refused to allow absentee military voters more time to get their ballots in. The Republicans on the board tired to get the time extended, but the Dems vetoed it. That may have won the election for the Dem. It was very close.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:38 PM on 05/13/2009
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Polls don't count as we learned in 2004! Why do some still rely on polls?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:04 PM on 05/13/2009
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and in 2000 the supreme point was the court...now what else u got, that was never urs...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:25 PM on 05/13/2009
- tippydog11 I'm a Fan of tippydog11 9 fans permalink

chicken hawks at work again...military spoke loud and clear---and Bush even said they could not about election among themselves why Bush? Did not want McCain to look real bad? Open them see who voted for who then? Do you really think this has not been going on for years?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:03 PM on 05/13/2009
- -0013 I'm a Fan of -0013 11 fans permalink

English please.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:43 PM on 05/13/2009
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republican flotilla heads out to sea...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:02 PM on 05/13/2009
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One suspects they went uncounted if they were for McCain--but to make up, possibly counted twice if for Obama!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:35 PM on 05/13/2009
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Nice try, but polls of military personnel showed that Obama got a huge majority, which may seem shocking because McCain is ex-military.

But McCain is not popular with military personnel and families because of his stance on the G.I. Bill.

So--sorry---if anything---counting those votes would have helped Obama.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:46 PM on 05/13/2009
- JulieSA I'm a Fan of JulieSA 165 fans permalink
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Do you have a link to those polls, because the ones I've seen say the opposite.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:35 PM on 05/13/2009
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and we all suspect a lobotomy in ur case...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:52 PM on 05/13/2009
- blairtone I'm a Fan of blairtone 11 fans permalink

Right on, BB - they probably had Acorn personnel there doing the counting after all their voter(?) registrations were cleared, Mickey Mouse included. Oh well, they were trained by Obama to fudge the system so I guess they owe him some loyalty

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:04 PM on 05/13/2009
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 143 fans permalink

Hey, you forgot to say the magic word -- ACORN!

Hold it up to your forehead and it spells "LACORN".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:06 PM on 05/13/2009
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and the underseas votes ?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:35 PM on 05/13/2009
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 143 fans permalink

They were undercounted.

And wet.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:50 PM on 05/13/2009
- blairtone I'm a Fan of blairtone 11 fans permalink

They go uncounted because the dems manage to manipulate the system to exclude them - ref Coleman - since they believe, and probably rightly so, that there will be more Republican votes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:34 PM on 05/13/2009
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All polls showed Obama with a huge lead with military personnel.

McCain tanked with military families because of his insane stance on G.I. Bill.

Sorry----counting votes would have benefited Dems/Obama.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:48 PM on 05/13/2009

Yah, I don't recall seeing those polls...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:54 PM on 05/13/2009
- JulieSA I'm a Fan of JulieSA 165 fans permalink
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No. When they can, Dems ALWAYS try to discourage the military to vote, and encourage felons to vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:47 PM on 05/13/2009
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SSSSHHHHH! That's supposed to be a secret...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:49 PM on 05/13/2009
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its not tho, ur holding ur ankles and blair behind u, well...is what it is..

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 PM on 05/13/2009
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 143 fans permalink

SSSSSHHHHH! Republicans own the voting machine companies, and their software hooked up with servers controlled by Karl Rove and the RNC. Don't worry, they'll work out all the bugs by 2010 so the 2008 "anomaly" doesn't happen again.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:57 PM on 05/13/2009
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One recalls Al Gore's attempt to exclude or disqualify military votes in Florida 2000...

EVERY VOTE SHOULD COUNT! Unless it's for a Republican...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:50 PM on 05/13/2009
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we all recall a certain nov. 4, 08....whiner.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:55 PM on 05/13/2009

That was because many of them were postmarked past the due date.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:30 PM on 05/14/2009
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gonna have to ask again, can we have some of your smoke...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:53 PM on 05/13/2009
- lejman I'm a Fan of lejman 5 fans permalink

no wonder norm coleman lost; he'll claim all the votes would have been for him.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:31 PM on 05/13/2009
- Wombaticus I'm a Fan of Wombaticus 39 fans permalink
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I can swipe a card and securely access all my financial (and its ENORMOUS) accounts. But I cannot vote that way.
Why can we not have instant voting from anywhere using bank atms or other dedicated kiosks?

- swipe ID card
- input password
- input special 1 time use code that was generated specially for me to use in this particular voting occasion.
- indicate votes per issue
- review summary of votes, edit as needed
- submit vote.
- get printout showing submitted votes.
- internal printout stays inside machine as a paper based reconciliation process to audit the results.

I make software for a living. Creating this system is a big job, but poses no tech risk, only political risk of interference by those with vested interests in the current system.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:16 PM on 05/13/2009
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i wear soft underware...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:31 PM on 05/13/2009
- roald I'm a Fan of roald 18 fans permalink

Did you see the IEEE magazine article on secure voting systems? The key is voting systems rather than voting machines. I have only skimmed it so far. The creators plan to make it freely available as soon as they have completed vetting.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:36 PM on 05/13/2009
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Check out the Canadian system--they have zero problems every year.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:49 PM on 05/13/2009
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 143 fans permalink

They have a working health care system, too. D*mn Canucks!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:01 PM on 05/13/2009
- sandpiper1 I'm a Fan of sandpiper1 14 fans permalink

BluesDogLefty...could be because we actually practise real democracy unlike the US that the talk but doesn't walk the walk. Yeah, our health care system is great also, not perfect but great none the less. Hope the Dems can sort out your voting system to prevent more Republican fraud ie 2000 Fla and 2004 Ohio. It's a shame that young men and women serving/dying for their country overseas are being denied the right to vote.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:22 PM on 05/13/2009

2 issues I have with this:

1) given the high risk of software tampering, NO votes should be cast in any digital format- paper ballots and felt-tip pens are the least susceptible to fraud

2) swipe an ID and vote would enable the tracking of who a voter casts their ballot for. This is profoundly unacceptable.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:04 PM on 05/13/2009

Not necessarily. I used to write software, too. Swiping the ID just gives you access to the system, which would not track IDs. Simple enough to put in place.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:33 PM on 05/13/2009
- Mahi Joe I'm a Fan of Mahi Joe 49 fans permalink

Won't work if Diebold has anything to do with it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:27 PM on 05/13/2009
- Mar23 I'm a Fan of Mar23 5 fans permalink

I wish the article had gone into more detail. How could a pre-printed ballot form be returned as `undeliverable`? How could tens of thousands of them be?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:08 PM on 05/13/2009
- roald I'm a Fan of roald 18 fans permalink

Inadequate postage, bad or unreadable delivery address.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:37 PM on 05/13/2009
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Duh?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:45 PM on 05/13/2009
- Telemachus I'm a Fan of Telemachus 143 fans permalink

I suspect because they needed some odd amount of extra postage -- 54 cents or something. And who knows what the international rate is?

Just a guess.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:02 PM on 05/13/2009
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If postage were the case, then absentee ballots should be pre-posted by the state or county elections boards. The 54 cents, to use your example, is a small price to pay for accountable democracy. In the great scheme of things, the cumulative cost us minimal.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:47 PM on 05/13/2009
- Gatormouth I'm a Fan of Gatormouth 24 fans permalink
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So, a fourth of our service men and women overseas basically have the same voting rights as jailed felons? This goes beyond unacceptable. Could congress find out, please, who has been responsible for such lack of support for our troops? Maybe they were deemed to be likely not to vote the right way? Once in my life I would have been appalled to even think that such a thing could happen. I am no longer so gullible.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:07 PM on 05/13/2009
- JulieSA I'm a Fan of JulieSA 165 fans permalink
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In Virginia (IIRC), the Dem admin tried to knock out a bunch of military votes on a minor technicality, but backed down after the people heard about it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:43 PM on 05/13/2009
- destruct1 I'm a Fan of destruct1 7 fans permalink

They certainly will not move quickly on correcting this. Military votes largely republican, knowing full well what it means to have a strong national defense. How unfortunate.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:01 PM on 05/13/2009
- MRb1000 I'm a Fan of MRb1000 10 fans permalink

Yeah in the pass years. Not this election! I think you are living in the pass! I live next to a large Army post that do not like the GOP! They will not say it in the open, but the say with their votes!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:14 PM on 05/13/2009
- destruct1 I'm a Fan of destruct1 7 fans permalink

ok...watch how quick the dem leadership moves on this. keep dreaming.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:49 PM on 05/13/2009
- mcantwell I'm a Fan of mcantwell 542 fans permalink
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Democrats enlist in the Military as well.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:15 PM on 05/13/2009
- Shavano I'm a Fan of Shavano 6 fans permalink

Another Republican myth.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:24 PM on 05/13/2009
- stunsitfel I'm a Fan of stunsitfel 42 fans permalink
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As a former military man....you are totally off base.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:50 PM on 05/13/2009
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typing in brail, ehh...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:30 PM on 05/13/2009
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and the non-white military, have them stats aswell?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:31 PM on 05/13/2009
- destruct1 I'm a Fan of destruct1 7 fans permalink

why do you inject race into this? wow...you libs...amazing.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:48 PM on 05/13/2009
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