The National Journal:
Founded in the decade before the Civil War as the Northern voice of union, the Republican Party today is more electorally dependent on the South than at any point in its past.
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LOL. I've never seen so many typos in my life.
It's careless desperation in the age of spell check
Major, I've had the dubious pleasure of being inside the hallowed "Petroleum Club" in Houston. You hear a lot of right-wing, bigoted, nonsensical political opinions from the folks who hang out there.
Pardon me for slamming the South, but they are definitely the sickest part of our nation, as far as their society goes. Nothing but racism and hatred for the most part. The last 8 years was an example of what happens when they get hold of power. There are good southerners too, just as many. We'll see if they can win out against the old guard. The South will change, but it make take a few more generations before that kind of hatred and racism can die down.
Lou, are your comments on the south and southerners accurate, or just another form of the bigotry you claim to deplore?
You tell me, you live there. See any racists anywhere?
Honestly, maybe it's ignorance. I live in California, and we've got our past too. Seems, though, that the South is a bible thumping, backward part of our nation. We've had to force them to adopt some of our civil rights laws at gunpoint. Most of them keep voting Republican. We've got parts like that here in California, so I guess maybe I am being unfair. Didn't mean to piss you off.
Remember the comments about Barack Obama in West Virginia during the primaries last year (just Google it if you don't)?
-I rest my case.
Your remarks seem somewhat contradictory. You say southerners are racist and haters for the most part then say there are just as many good as bad ones. Yet, as a native of the "South", I can understand such sentiment-- The south is certainly largely responsible for the way it is often stereotypically portrayed. Hard core southern racists comprise a small minority, just as in all parts of the country--The south has changed, but there is an old guard of conservatism which is defensive about change.
You sure it's a minority? The majority of the people in the South still vote Republican. That's pretty racist IMO. They're all freaked about immigration in every poll I've seen. Abortion. One party issues. OK, I've bashed you guys enough. i know most people there are good people, and that it's possible the people just vote GOP out of their own ignorance. As I said, we've got our problems in California. They voted for Arnold twice.
You are aware that change is not always a good thing?
The "Dixiecrats" who opposed desegregation became republicans in protest. So the marginalized repub party are a lot of the same people who were the marginalized democratic party.
That's it in a nutshell. You don't see us claiming to be the party of Andrew Jackson, they need to stop invoking Lincoln - who was a central government, nationalizing, progressive fellow.
They are merely Dixiecrats 2.0. More like Woodrow Wilson than Teddy Roosevelt.
And ironically, I've hear the Limbaugh, Hannity, and Mark Levin try to make the argument that it is the democratic party that has always been opposed to civil rights, as if what you just described never happened.
"What they don't realize is that everyone's left the plantation, and no one's comming back."
“As always, it's a conservative who refers to Obama as the Messiah. We dems just call him Mr. President. We know he doesn't walk on water, but we are proud of him and our country.
Sorry, stark, your racism is showing.”
Please Explain to me how that makes me racist. You people throw that word around like it’s “hello”. I call him "The Messiah" because of the way you liberals and the far-left media treated him during the election and now into his presidency. He apparently can do no wrong. No one questioned his experience, they just all swooned and fainted at his rallies. He had questionable (putting it mildly) associates (including a racist) and everyone just gave him a free pass and railroaded Clinton (who would be a FAR better president). Let me see if I understand this, I’m a racist because I don’t approve of President Obama’s policies (I couldn’t care less if he’s black; I would feel the same way if he was white) but Reverend Wright is perfectly fine. Your hypocrisy is mind-boggling. You think it’s ok to assault Bush for 8 years (I didn’t like him either but he was still the president and deserved respect) but if I disapprove of Obama I’m a racist?
"and railroaded Clinton (who would be a FAR better president)"
Gee, it's nice to know you guys are all about supporting Hillary Clinton these days. Back in the 90's I would have thought she was the Antichrist the way you all talked about her.
That religious theme never goes away. All the Republicans refer to President Obama as either the anti-Christ or the Messiah.
I wouldn't say I'm her biggest fan but at least she has some experience.
Why don't you actually respond to all of my comments instead of picking and choosing which statements you want to attack? It makes you seem desperate (which you, of course, are).
You consider it respectful to refer to President Obama as the messiah? He is still the president and deserves respect but that only applies to the Bush years doesn't it?
He deserves respect too. Calling him the "messiah" is not an insult to him, it's a crack at the media and people that blindly follow him regardless of what he does. He doesn't think he's infallible, other people do. Besides, making a joke about how people worship him is a tad less disrespectful than calling someone a criminal.
Do you realize that ' and " are two different things, mensa boy?
I've already said this 3 times. The site is doing the replacement when I submit the comment so it's not my doing. How about actually trying to make a counter-argument instead of making cheap, petty attacks? Perhaps it's because you lack the intelligence to do so.
"Yes, you do need some esl lessons, what is your primary language? GOPese?"
Wow, your humor is staggering.
YeeHaw Nashville for Capital .
I think the transformation of the gop into a primarily southern party is a direct result of the "southern strategy" initiated by John Mitchell (Nixon's campaign manager) in 1968. The republicans consciously pursued this strategy over the past 40 years and are now reaping its results. They have nobody to blame but themselves.
It's a direct result of the Dem party veering way to the left in the late sixties.
Thank goodness! We veered to the left by supporting civil liberties. Johnson knew we were losing the South when he signed civil rights legislation.
White Southern voters have never gotten over black people working for wages. Now they are the lowest people on the totem-pole. It must be awful when that clap of reality becomes the way of life in the southern, rusty-tractor, farm belt.
That's not true.
However, Senator Webb has written about how he resents that poor white Appalachians don't receive affirmative action consideration in admittance to universities, where a black from an affluent background would.
Oh yes. It is true. I have relatives in the South and the only reason they are Republican is their prejudice against African Americans. They vote Republican, cheat on their taxes, but are the first to take advantage of unemployment, welfare, social security, medicare, medicaid, etc.
I HOPE HEY AREN'T BETTING ON THE SOUTH FOR SURVIVAL. THEY WOULD LOSE.
"Apparently that swell government service you claim to have didn't teach you how to use a reply based format to continue a thread."
What does that even mean?
It means, that Starkcr31 has nothing to say or do but to make a personal attack. How Republican. If you cannot win on facts or rationale or logic, then attack someone personally. Get over yourself. Have enough confidence in your own opinions to not attack other people.
That's much different than the barrage of attacks I'm getting hurled at me simply because I'm not a liberal. What happened to your liberal "tolerance"?
they don't have opinions.. As reactionaries, they don't trust scientific method or thought, and have to be told what to think by the institutions. there are only two institutions, the church and the Government. the GOP seeing this way back use this to control them, thell them what to think and say. It kinda means they are ignorant (ignore the facts), no just plain stupid.
Ironically, you just proved the point that was being made.
If you want to reply to something that someone else has posted, click on "reply", there is no need to qoute the comment you are replying to, because if you reply correctly, your comment will appear below the original.
I don't think he understands irony.
What does that even mean?
It means that you have proved the point.
Have you not noticed that replies to your comments are directly under them?
The 11 confederate states are 'welfare states'.
Alabama gave foreign auto makers MORE THAN ONE BILLION IN TAX INCENTIVES, THAT'S OUR FEDERAL TAX DOLLARS, the ones you & I pay in.
Then they have the gall to say anything, including succession talk. Well, Texas succeed and take all the rest of the ignorant welfare recipient's with you, PLEASE SUCCEED. That way we don't need to spend $11 million fixing the governor's mansion. And we will get rid of at least 18-22 Rethugnican senators!
It's a win, win situation!
Secede, not succeed.
The Texas economy is doing better than the US on average. We refuse to adopt the failed policies that bankrupted California, and destroyed the Michigan economy. This is why so many people are moving here.
And yet, Texas has 16 of the poorest counties in the country. We in New York have none. Supposedly our economy is worse. Additionally, Texas gets back from the federal government about what it pays in federal taxes. California and New York only get back .75 on the dollar. We are subsidizing most of the South. You can keep Texas and its economy if you secede and take the rest of the Southern welfare with you. You pay for them.
So why is conservative-paradise South Carolina in the same boat as California and Michigan?
How well would it be doing if we moved the Johnson Space Center and several military bases out of secession country?
That's really not saying much.
I just looked up the poorest counties in the US, and wow, Texas and Kentucky are neck and neck.
Number of counties by state in the 100 poorest counties: Texas, 17; Kentucky, 16; Mississippi, 14; South Dakota, 10; Louisiana, 5; Alabama, 4; Georgia, 4; Montana, 4; New Mexico, 4; North Dakota, 3; Arizona, 2; Idaho, 2; Nebraska, 2; Tennessee, 2; West Virginia, 2; Alaska, 1; Arkansas, 1; Colorado, 1; Florida, 1; Missouri, 1; Oklahoma, 1; South Carolina, 1; Utah, 1; Wisconsin, 1. Twenty-six states do not have any counties in the 100 poorest counties.
Per JulieSA, 'The Texas economy is doing better than the US on average.'
Yeah, I see that, clearly.
Average income in Texas is 49K. I was looking at a non-sortable list of states but by glancing through it looks like only the Southern and a couple of mid-western states are lower. Certainly all the Northern and Western states are higher. And before we get into the "cost of living" discussion that also depends where you live. Typically, cities have a higher cost of living as we all know, even in Texas. But those of us in Northern states who do not live in big cities, have the best income/cost of living ratios in the country.
I find interesting that these very same Republicans/Southerner's who preach about "self-relience" and spout off about "socialism" come from a region which actually lives off the government. The Southern states recieve , as a whole , $1.23 from the government in benefits for every $1 they pay in taxes. The supposedly free laoding liberal states like California and NJ, NY, recieve only $0.80 for every dollar they pay into to the feds. ( The worst offender is Alaska at $1.83 per $1.00). So who is living off of whom ?
Haley Barbour's comment about Republican governor's in the Northeast and California made me laugh. These are types, not unlike Arlen Specter, that most of his Southern Republicans are saying good ridence to. Wasn't Tom Ridge, former governor of Pennsylvania "vetoed" as VP for McCain by these very same Republicans ? The Republican party has truely become this country's first religious regional party.
I think your data might be old. When I looked it up, Alaska was getting more that twice what it paid. We in California and New York were only getting back around .75 on the dollar.
States with a lot of federal and agricultural land tend to have low per capita incomes. No one gets rich farming, or working as a park ranger or soldier. These are the people who raise your food, produce your gasoline, defend our country, and maintain the open space that produces your drinking water and recreational space. I you don't like this, then don't buy food and don't use water.
Hedge funders who live in NYC and earn $10 mill/year pay a lot of tax into the system. So do movie stars making $20 mill per picture. If you think that's bad, then you should be calling for lower taxes.
Obama is raising taxes on the wealthy, who disproportionately live in these blue coastal states. Why aren't you protesting this if it bothers you so much?
It doesn't bother us. It is your hypocrisy that does. You in the South who pay so little in taxes and take our money, constantly complain that we are taking money from you. If you don't like it, secede. Turn it down. Personally, I live in New York and I have a good salary and I am willing to pay higher taxes for the greater good. If the South doesn't want the benefit of those things, fine by me.
Again you over-simplify and over-generalize. California and New York are two of the largest States in the Union and we have many different kind of industries. Of the millions of people, very few are hedge fund managers or movies stars.
P.S. We have farming and water in New York and people here also join the military. And if other states don't buy your food what will the farmers live on?
Julie, I've lived in Texas. Don't try to tell me that everyone in Texas is a poor dirt-farmer.
Go hang out at the Petroleum Club in Houston (assuming they'd let you in the door) and you'll think you're on Park Avenue or Rodeo Drive.
Excuse me! If you think California is Los Angeles and San Francisco, you know neither your geography nor demographics. California is THE BIG VALLEY, which generates 12.9% of total national agricultural production and is home to (if you like country music) the Bakersfield Sound. There are eight national parks in California, three national preserves, and a half dozen or so national monuments -- so hurry on in with your concealed weapons and surprise a bear! Whoopee! National forests, state parks -- lots of rangers. Lost of military bases. Also home to Orange County (that Republican enclave referred to locally as "behind the Orange Curtain"); it was the first county in California to go bankrupt.
I'll let someone from New York fill you in on how that great state is more than NYC (in fact, completely different from NYC -- I wouldn't recommend getting lost in the Adirondacks; but then again, you'll have your trusty concealed handgun, so everything will be a-okay).
what region of america has the most ignorant (and proud of it) people?
what region of america has the most god-jobs?
whichever region has the most h8ful ignorants who think the old man in the sky is judging them (and you!) will always be the base of the republican party.
Boistrous intolerance might seem to them like a good cover for hypocrisy and paper-thin religion. Southern states also have extremely high rates of domestic violence, drug-related crime and abortion.
Don't forget teen pregnancy!
The majority of people in the country identify themselves as independents not as Republicans or Democrats. A decade ago the Dems were in decline and the Reps were, according to the media, the permanent majority party. They now say the same thing now about the Dems.
The same thing will happen again as the Dems get arrogant and corrupt and the American people of Independent political persuasion will switch sides and the Repubs will again gain power. The same scenario has played out time and time again in American politics. I guess this shows the state of the US education system when the people posting on here do not know history of our own nation but they think they know how the future will unfold.
Honey, i'd bet my intelligence and education against yours anytime, but that's not the point - The more independents, the stronger and more fair is the system. I've always been an Independent. Show me who's best at taking care of us, and that's how i vote. Hate, bias and party allegiance has no place in my vote except to make me run screaming for the opposition at the voting booth. As i did in November. I don't see evidence of dems being corrupt as a whole,nor do i see arrogance - i do see it from the dwindling opposition-almost-non-party. And their heroes Limpy and Cheney. Independents are important. Both parties know it full well. And the smaller the republican party gets, they can thank us for putting them on the fast-track. And yes, the same would happen if the hate and religious zeal shoe were on the other foot.
Yes, that's true, and both parties are losing membership.
According to Pew, for the first time there are more people now who say they're independent than Dem or Repub. This is pretty significant. Independents tend to be fairly liberal socially, but conservative on fiscal and national security issues.
And yet, 75% of the American people are for a public universal health care system which so-called "fiscal conservatives" are against. There is a lot more to the underlying trends than just independents being liberally social and fiscally conservative. Those are merely labels.
I know a lot of "independents" who are just Republicans who for some strange reason don't want to admit it.
They always say they vote for "the most qualified candidate" who just so happens to ALWAYS be the Republican.
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Posted: 05-22-09 02:00 PM