'Cash For Clunkers': Obama To Sign $4,500 New Car Credit

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KEN THOMAS | 06/19/09 02:17 PM | AP

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WASHINGTON — Car shoppers could take advantage of government incentives worth up to $4,500 this summer to send their old gas guzzler to the scrap heap in favor of a more fuel-efficient new vehicle.

President Barack Obama is expected to sign into law the "cash for clunkers" program, which was approved by the Senate on Thursday. For owners of low-mileage models such as the 1994 Ford Bronco, 1998 Nissan Pathfinder or the 1995 Chevrolet Blazer, the plan could give them a reason to visit their local car dealer during an economic downturn.

"I've been sitting on the fence for about a year," said Jim Seegraves, 44, of East Lansing, Mich., who has been looking to replace his 2000 GMC Sierra pickup truck. "This legislation will help me get over the hump and get the car that I want."

The bill provides $1 billion for the auto sales program from July through November and the Congressional Budget Office expects that with a total of $4 billion, about 1 million new vehicles could be purchased. The government is expected to implement the program by early August.

Automakers and their unions have lobbied heavily for the incentives to help the auto industry boost sales and stabilize General Motors Corp. and Chrysler Group LLC, which have received billions of dollars for government-led bankruptcies. In May, U.S. auto sales were 34 percent lower than a year ago and the industry expects to sell less than 10 million vehicles in the U.S. in 2009, compared to more than 16 million in 2007.

Here's how the plan works: Car owners could get a voucher worth $3,500 if they traded in a vehicle getting 18 miles per gallon or less for one getting at least 22 mpg. The voucher would grow to $4,500 if the new car's mileage was 10 mpg higher than the old vehicle. The mpg figures are listed on the car's window sticker.

Owners of sport utility vehicles, pickup trucks or minivans getting 18 mpg or less could receive a voucher for $3,500 if their new truck or SUV got at least 2 mpg higher than their old vehicle. The voucher would increase to $4,500 if the mileage of the new truck or SUV was at least 5 mpg higher than the older vehicle.

The program was aimed at replacing older vehicles _ built in model year 1984 or later _ and would not make financial sense for someone owning a vehicle with a trade-in value greater than $3,500 or $4,500.

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A 1998 Jeep Cherokee 4-wheel-drive with about 150,000 miles, for example, might only get $1,000 to $1,500 as a trade-in vehicle, according to estimates by Kelley Blue Book. Since the 1998 Cherokee gets about 17 mpg, an owner could parlay it into a new Ford Escape Hybrid _ 2009 versions get 28-to-32 mpg _ and maximize their trade-in to $4,500.

Dealers would apply the vouchers to the purchase or lease of a qualifying vehicle and ensure that the older vehicles are crushed or shredded. The new vehicle can be U.S. or foreign-built and must have a manufacturer's suggested retail price of less than $45,000.

The program is not without critics.

Jeremy Anwyl, chief executive of Edmunds.com, a Web site for car shoppers, said it would struggle to provide 250,000 new vehicle sales. Most of the qualifying vehicles would be at least 10 years old and many owners would be less inclined to take on a new car payment or unable to afford a new vehicle.

"You've got to consider the profile of consumers who drive these vehicles," Anwyl said.

Budget-conscious Republicans in the Senate opposed it, along with environmental-leaning lawmakers who said it failed to encourage the purchase of high-mileage cars and didn't apply to used vehicles. Someone could receive a voucher for buying a new Hummer, they noted, pointing to analysts who said it would primarily benefit owners of older-model pickup trucks, SUVs and minivans.

Dealers say it will be a valuable tool to lure more shoppers to their showrooms. Many intend to advertise heavily and combine the government plan with other incentives, providing some help at a time when the industry is struggling to sell cars.

"Anything to jump-start the economy," said Jason Robinson, a car salesman with AutoServ of Tilton, N.H. "There's not much sense of urgency out in the market right now."

WASHINGTON — Car shoppers could take advantage of government incentives worth up to $4,500 this summer to send their old gas guzzler to the scrap heap in favor of a more fuel-efficient new vehicle. ...
WASHINGTON — Car shoppers could take advantage of government incentives worth up to $4,500 this summer to send their old gas guzzler to the scrap heap in favor of a more fuel-efficient new vehicle. ...
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- Jude55807 I'm a Fan of Jude55807 5 fans permalink
    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:42 PM on 07/17/2009
- ejhickey I'm a Fan of ejhickey 9 fans permalink

This bill has the potential for fraud. Under the terms of the bill , eligible cars have to be owned and insured for one year prior to being traded in. The goal of this program is get 1 million cars traded in and crushed With car sales down, i submit that there is a powerful incentive for car dealers to overlook this requirement or to simply alter the documents. Who is going to audit this program? Similar programs under the New Deal had the same problem and were subject to abuse.

There was a similar problem with undocumented mortgages and so called "liar loams" and NINJA loans even though mortgage fraud is a federal crime with stiff penalties. What makes anyone think this program will be better?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:22 PM on 06/23/2009

I was a bit skeptical myself. I found the website:

http://www.cars.gov/

Anyone can find out if their car qualifies at this website.

The website is still being put together as more info becomes available. There are safeguards being built in so that the dealer must register for the program and the voucher will not be paid for ten days after the transaction to ensure all eligibility requirements are verified, all the way down to the destruction of the vehicle.

The potential for fraud is in everything in life, but after reading the site and the bill (which you can download) I felt a lot better about it. The more I thought about the overall picture, I believe that this bill would benefit the consumer who would not be able to afford to get a better car, it would benefit the auto industry, the economy and a little benefit for the environment.

Again, I feel a little less skeptical.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:04 AM on 06/25/2009

Too bad!!! The only thing any charitable organization will do with that car is turn around and sell it, which then keeps that clunker on the road, guzzling more gas.

Also if I donate the car to you, what benefit does it have for me? You are not going to give me $3500 to $4500 for a car whose book value is worth $1500, are you? What will you give me, a percentage of $1500? I will then have to save up for a down payment.

In one of your other posts you said many of the cars are recycled. With this program, all the cars are recycled.

One final thought, with a donation, I get a tax deduction. With this program, I get a higher mpg car.

I can't drive a tax deduction to work.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:23 AM on 06/25/2009

Most vehicle donated to charity are now eligible for a voucher under the cash for clunkers program. Since the voucher is much greater than the tax deduction, charities will be out millions of dollars. the government should just increase the tax deduction and not spend $billions on vouchers.
http://www.cars4charities.org

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:35 PM on 06/23/2009

Too bad!!! The only thing any charitable organization will do with that car is turn around and sell it, which then keeps that clunker on the road, guzzling more gas.

Also if I donate the car to you, what benefit does it have for me? You are not going to give me $3500 to $4500 for a car whose book value is worth $1500, are you? What will you give me, a percentage of $1500? I will then have to save up for a down payment.

In one of your other posts you said many of the cars are recycled. With this program, all the cars are recycled.

One final thought, with a donation, I get a tax deduction. With this program, I get a higher mpg car.

I can't drive a tax deduction to work.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:46 AM on 06/25/2009

Many of the cars that are donated to charity will be eligible for a voucher under cash for clunkers. The tax deduction for donating a car to charity is much less than the voucher. Therefore, charities will lose many donations and the money they generate. A better idea is to go back to allowing the donor to claim the book value for their car donation. This way all vehicles are eligible, the government doesn't have to spend $4 million on vouchers and administer a program with rules which are not enforceable! Since many of the cars that are donated are recycled there is an environmental benefit as well!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:31 PM on 06/23/2009
- blood1 I'm a Fan of blood1 12 fans permalink

What this article fails to mention is that this Bill has passed the House and is not sitting around waiting for a signature...it still has to go thru the Senate.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:04 AM on 06/22/2009
- twogunmojo I'm a Fan of twogunmojo 28 fans permalink

how is this going to help anyone....and why not let me or anyone else get a voucher for 4500 dollars and go buy a new motorcycle...or used motorcycle...most bikes i know get atleast 37 mpg....the klr 650 will get 50 or better....

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:47 AM on 06/22/2009
- yakmeat I'm a Fan of yakmeat 9 fans permalink

If you don't have a job and have to chose between paying for housing or health insurance, the last thing you need is a car payment, regardless of a government subsidized trade-in value. The idea of moving to more efficient vehicles is great, but if this only applies toward the purchase of new cars, many who might like to take advantage of the program simply cannot afford to. Give someone 4 grand to trade in their $1,200 guzzler for a $4,000 Honda, VW, etc. and you'll get their "clunker" off the road. Of course, this does nothing for GM, but...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:17 AM on 06/22/2009
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If you dont have a job, you cannot buy a new car.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:14 AM on 06/25/2009
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I have a 12-year-old Honda that gets over 30 miles to a gallon. I can't tell you how immensely satisfying it is that my tax dollars are helping pay for people who made stupid car decisions in the past while people like me get nothing. Next up, please take some more of my money and give it to people who bought houses they couldn't afford.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:06 PM on 06/21/2009

Gop= I got mine-----"­..S.C..R.E­.W.. ...Y.O.U........

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:21 AM on 06/22/2009
- twogunmojo I'm a Fan of twogunmojo 28 fans permalink

i am sure obama is working on that....

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:41 AM on 06/22/2009
- Roguer I'm a Fan of Roguer 25 fans permalink
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Should not our efforts be directed to upgrading current vehicles on the road, would not that be more cost effective. Building all new cars seems like a waste of all those perfectly good frames, chassis, braking systems, seats, etc.

During the age of battleships, most were built during prior to or just after WW1 (they ran on coal). Rather than build all new ones for WW2, most countries upgraded their old ones to new more efficient power plants (diesel fire generators for electric propulsion).

Every new car produced is still using resources, a lot of plastics and composites (oil products).

Has anyone figured out what to do with old tires?.... All these new wonder cars still come with 4 tires and a spare... This program is no better than farm subsidies or any other government hand out.

I do not see how this is improving things. I would think the goal would be to figure out how to get rid of as many automobiles as possible. Maybe people could live in the same building they work in? Rather than expanding suburbia and destroying farmland and natural areas, cities should build up instead of out. In the US, especially, our land use is more inefficient than our cars.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:28 PM on 06/21/2009
- ncmom54 I'm a Fan of ncmom54 56 fans permalink
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I have a 96 van and am of the opinion that you can buy a lot of gas for the cost of a car payment. In this economy and from what I've seen in the past year... I'll use any extra funds to pay my home mortgage ahead & my business' mortgage ahead at least 1 year before I spend money on a vehicle.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:29 PM on 06/21/2009
- adelita01 I'm a Fan of adelita01 6 fans permalink

Another wasteful government program.

Leave it to Obama and far-left Dems to buy support with cash giveaways.

Can someone tell me WHO is going to pay for this on top of the trillions in debt we already have???

Bush was a miser compared to Obama.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:15 PM on 06/21/2009
- Madmac I'm a Fan of Madmac 17 fans permalink
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Trading mine in once everything gets going...my inefficient SUV for either a Chevy Malibu or New Equinox, plus other incentives

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:46 PM on 06/21/2009
- nomorefed I'm a Fan of nomorefed 3 fans permalink


Your house is worth $125,000 but you paid $250,000 don"t worry with "Mark-To-Market" Neutered you can say whatever you want to about your home value and no one can refute you!
Now when you go in for a loan, simply declare the house is worth $300,000 and along with your clean "ON-THE-BOOKS Balance Sheet" with no visible other debts means you get money from the FED at 1% interest or maybe less!
Why can"t this world be true for ALL AMERICANS like it is for Wall Street?
We do not own Congress and they DO using ill-gotten FUNDS!
Are the Wall Street Banks really healthy? With "OFF-THE-BOOKS" accounting and "MARK-TO-MARKET" Neutered who knows what the truth is!

good articles: href=".http://kl.am/tsc> recommended website

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:18 PM on 06/21/2009
- jadeba I'm a Fan of jadeba 8 fans permalink

Well, I will haul my '97 Pathfinder down and get a Prius. Too bad we can't seem to get diesel cars here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:21 AM on 06/21/2009
- BigBagel I'm a Fan of BigBagel 21 fans permalink

Vw has one.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:07 PM on 06/21/2009
- BigBagel I'm a Fan of BigBagel 21 fans permalink

So I can go on Craigslist. Find a beat up old Caddie for 400$. Buy it and trade it in for 4,500$ towards a new car. Am I missing something or do I pick up 4100$ at the taxpayers expense.?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:37 AM on 06/21/2009
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What you are missing is that the dealer picks up $4500 at our expense while they refuse to apply that credit back into the actual sale price of the new vehicle after 'markup'.

No, I'm not being cynical. I've just purchased enough new cars to know that this is a game that many dealers will attempt to play.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:50 AM on 06/21/2009
- LeftRight I'm a Fan of LeftRight 104 fans permalink
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And most of the time they will get away with it, since most people don't know how to buy cars!

Reminds me of those Carmax commercials from a couple years ago when the customer was SHOCKED that Carmax had the price on the window! Go to ANY other dealer in the world and offer to pay the sticker price. They will KISS you!!!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:58 AM on 06/21/2009
- jadeba I'm a Fan of jadeba 8 fans permalink

What's wrong with that? The seller on Craigslist gets his 400, then the Caddie is used to buy a new car - it seems like a win-win to me. Still have to pay for the new car, it's not as if you're pocketing the 4100.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:27 AM on 06/21/2009
- BigBagel I'm a Fan of BigBagel 21 fans permalink

OK then give me a car worth 4100$. I'll take it. It's not like I'm pocketing the money.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:07 PM on 06/21/2009
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The vehicle has to be registered and insured in your name for one year.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:34 AM on 06/21/2009
- ejhickey I'm a Fan of ejhickey 9 fans permalink

Probably but not yet certain as well as the method to determine MPG of older cars. For example , what if the original mpg was 18 but your car now gets 14, because it is a clunker. it is not yet clear whether the original or current mpg will apply

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:48 AM on 06/21/2009

I think you have to have had it registered in your name for at least the past year...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:27 PM on 06/21/2009
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