New York Times:
People on the government's terrorist watch list tried to buy guns nearly 1,000 times in the last five years, and federal authorities cleared the purchases 9 times out of 10 because they had no legal way to stop them, according to a new government report.
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You can't purchase an airline ticket but we have no problem with you buying as many guns as you want.
That's what theGOP wants. Let everyone have a gun, no questions asked. Bring back the Wild West and screw responsiblity. I D I O T S.
You mean the old west wear rapes and mass murders were almost unheard of?
These people are on a government list but have not committed any crimes. How many people with the same names would be stopped. Isn't this profiling?
Suspected terrorists can be incarcerated and tortured irrespective of the US Constitution and Bill of Rights in order to protect the well being of the population. But Article Two of the Bill of Rights [the Right to Bear Arms] is exempted. You can't have it both ways. So are the NRA Types advocating that we stop incarcerating suspected terrorists?
Suspects captured on a foreign battlefield and kept outside of the United States have never before been subject to the protections of the constitution.
Democats raise the gun issue at their own peril. If I'm *convicted* of being a terrorist on the "watch list", then my guns can be taken away. Not until, without a fight.
Thank God for the NRA! You know damned well that the protesters in Iran wish they had an NRA-- they would at least be able to shoot back now!
well said
Beelzebufo
Democats raise the gun issue at their own peril. If I'm *convicted* of being a terrorist on the "watch list", then my guns can be taken away. Not until, without a fight.
"without a fight" Why fight when you can shoot right? Why are Republicans so willing to put guns in the hands of suspect terrorist? Seems to me a law abiding citizen would gladly wait until his/her name could be removed from the "watch list" as most real Americans errr Democrats understand that it is a matter of national security.
You are kidding right? Seems to me under that premise, a law abiding citizen shouldn't mind the government recording their phone conversations and reading their mail either.
Either you support the concept of due process or not. Increasingly, it is clear democrats are no better than republicans. They have wrapped themselves in red, white and blue BS just like the republicans while playing the same games - and even using the exact same arguments to justify them.
I guess you're right. If England had an NRA just think how many more Englishmen would be dead or Canadians or French. In fact Dusty Springfield could have changed the words to her song to "What the world needs now are guns, sweet guns, no not just for some but for everyone." Or to coin another phrase, "when all you've got is a gun, every problem must be solved with a bullet."
Or the Iranian version: "When the opponent has bullets - your butt gets shot if you don't do what they say."
The NRA appreciates your support. Please send us your money now. If you don't the boogies will come get your guns. Send us your mother's money, too, and your daddy's, and your kids. You must send the money or boogies will take your guns. It's the $$$$$$$$$$$$, $tupid.
Here's why your Iran example is STUPID. So the protesters have some hand guns and rifles. The republican guard, army and police have heavy machine guns, RPGs, mortars etc etc. So where do those weapons get you? Instead of a few dead now they number in the thousands and by shooting at them you gave them the excuse they were looking for to do it.
You suffer from that idiotic hallucination that comes from watching Red Dawn and Invasion USA too many times.
I guess it's a good thing that you weren't advising the Mujahadeen against the Russians isn't it?
You seem to suffer from the pissinurpants syndrome when violently confronted.
Guns don't kill people it people that kill people.
Governments tend to do the overwhelming majority of the killing.
Just wondering if anyone of the Progressives out there have changed there mind about the Second Amendment after watching the Iranian citizens get shoved around by the State Brownshirts? As one of the Liberal commentators on MSNBC said without realizing it, when asked if the people in the streets will be able to fight back against the thugs, "Not without guns they won't" Now maybe you Huffies remember why the Founding Fathers thought it might be a good idea to allow honest citizens to be armed to protect themselves from tyranical Government.
When only the Government has arms there is tyranny, when the people are armed there is Liberty.
got that summer job at the national parks, ehh deputydog.
there you go again with the name calling and personal attacks...
I voted for Barak Obama and support gun ownership and support allot of what the NRA stands for.
The reason is simple sometimes a countrys leaders become dangerous and begin to break laws and revoking laws that out forfathers fought for. Our freedom is very important and politics aside i vote for Bush and that dangerous idiot Cheny and yes we were loosing our freedoms fast. I was leaving America had Palin Mc Cain won the elction and closing my business.
We were comming close to a dictatorship in America and there is proof laws were being put into use that were aganist the law. Yes under the Nut House of Cheny Bush our feedom was being taken away and a dictatorship was being formed. The extreme right wing leans toward a dictatorship and many believe in the end of times because of their church teaching..
Guns for freedom and that is how i look at it. There are hunters and others who are safe and respect the laws and know how to respect a weapon. The NRA is not a enemy but a freind to Dems and Reps
Did gun ownership prevent the Japanese from being rounded up and interned during WWII?
If yes, you have a point; if no, you don't!!!
If the U.S. government moves against you your guns are going to be as worthless as your logic. Just ask Randy Weaver, or David Koresh, or any of the bootleggers who died in gunfights with federal agents during the thirties. Sorry this is just plain wacky talk.
You mean the Randy Weaver - who's 13 year old son was shot in the back running away from unidentified officers in the woods; and who's wife was shot dead by a government sniper while she held her baby in her arms? The weaver family won a $2.5 million dollar settlement from the government for wrongful death.
"FBI director Louis Freeh disciplined or proposed discipline for twelve FBI employees over their handling of the incident and the later prosecution of Randy Weaver and Harris. He described it before the U.S. Senate hearing investigating the incident as "synonymous with the exaggerated application of federal law enforcement" and stated "law enforcement overreacted at Ruby Ridge."
One thing to remember, if it weren't for what Clinton/Reno did at Ruby Ridge and Waco - the kids who were killed in the Oklahoma City bombing would be alive today.
You would probably poo your panties if you knew how many "libruls" actually do own guns.
The liberals who own guns is probably a big reason why Congress is leaving gun control alone right now
Frankly, if we stopped using religion and political party affiliations to argue a point, and used common sense, we’d be acceptable.
Ask yourself, why is the NRA fighting to keep those people who were unjustly put on a Watch List?
ANSWER, THE NRA IS NEITHER REPUBLICAN NOR DEMOCRAT -- THEY ARE YOU!
Why does a Democrat Senator want to ban guns for people who were place on a Watch List?
ANSWER, HE HAS ALWAYS BEEN ANTI-GUN AND IS USING THE WATCH LIST THE SAME AS THE REPUBLICAN TO TAKE AWAY YOUR RIGHTS. SO, IS HE A LIBERAL OR A CONSERVATIVE? (THINK)
Why are we not hearing from the Republicans regarding this issue?
THEY WOULD BE EMBARRASSED BECAUSE THEY CREATED THE WATCH LIST AND ARE TRYING TO BROWN-NOSE THE NRA FOR YOUR VOTE.
BOTTOM LINE IS FIX THE PROBLEM, NOT THE BLAME!
"ANSWER, THE NRA IS NEITHER REPUBLICAN NOR DEMOCRAT -- THEY ARE YOU!"
The NRA is a Union Lobby for gun manufacturers, wholesalers, retailers and gun runners. They are a business, and they want to make money. They know fear is the best motivator in marketing. Bang bang send us your money.
This article, by the NY Times, is a travesty as well as the idiot Senator who suggested it. The NRA has nothing at all to do with crime, terrorism, or the TSA.
This is just a story to sell newspapers.
Neocons use the NRA as a weapon against Democrats, but when you think about it, nothing makes sense.
Bottom line: The NRA is neither Republican nor Democrat. The problem was an administration that created the Patriot act simply because they could not find a terrorist to blame for the 911 attacks, so they turned against us.
If you care about constitutional rights, repeal the Patriot act and join together to convict Dick Cheney and his organization that bankrupt our country.
that admin, did no turning, it has always been in the against us column...
Has there ever been an administration who wasn't in the "against us" column?
The NRA will support its friends regardless of party--the California state senator from my district is a liberal Democrat African American who was endorsed by the NRA
the list.
so what?
if they are proven guilty or a danger in court, tale away the right to arms.
Do you really want a secret organization deciding who get to have rights and who doesn't?
have you all completely forgotten what the bill of rights is for?
Where exactly have you been for the last 8 years?
zing...
Dreaming for a day when less reactionary minds would take over leadership ... instead we got people who seek to excuse their own horrible actions by pointing to the behavior of those they replaced and saying "where have you been?" - as if the Bush standard is now the pinnacle of high expectations.
Obviously, the NRA has always held the philosophy of preserving "the right to bear arms and freely gun down abortion doctors and other "sinful" heretics that can be categorized as anything other than that which applies to white, conservative, fundamentalist christians
thats a nice attack....
Yet they condone and encourage the right to bear arms of ANYONE who hasn't committed a felony: regardless of mental state.
That is an extremist stand which will result in continued violence by extremists who believe the hate rhetoric on cable TV and radio - those people who think that a call to stop whichever political movement by any means necessary means violence.
There are plenty out there, and you yourself have lobbied for such people to be able to own any gun on the market right now if they haven't committed a felony(the only caveat you have mentioned) - meaning you agree with mentally unstable people owning automatic weaponry.
Extremism is in nobody's interest, and you seem to be advocating for it.
They condone and support marketing fear because that is how their members, gun manufacturers, wholesalers, retailers and gun runners make money. If you aren't scared enough to buy a gun, the NRA has not done its job. Sucker!
Frankly, if we stopped using religion and political party affiliations to argue a point and used common sense, we’d be acceptable.
Ask yourself, why is the NRA fighting to keep those people who were unjustly put on a Watch List?
Answer, the NRA is neither Republican nor Democrat -- they are YOU!
Why does a Democrat Senator want to ban guns for people who were place on a Watch List?
Answer, he has always been anti-gun and is using the Watch List the same as the Republican to take away your rights.
Why are we not hearing from the Republicans regarding this issue?
They would be embarrassed because they created the Watch List and are trying to kiss ass to the NRA for your vote.
Bottom line is fix the problem, not the blame!
To which Democrat Senator do you refer? I don't know any Democrats who take the list seriously.
Guns are our religion ...
Murder, our national blessed sacrament.
That's our history...
So protected by 1st and 2nd amendments, seems a tad redundant.
I thought the GOP would like to put at least one gun (preferably an assault rifle), in the hands of everyone in the U.S. - regardless of sanity, crimes committed, age etc. Then, they can now pack heat into National Parks, public buildings, etc. etc. Way to go NRA!!!
If that were the case then why did The GOP lead shrub send the police and military to forcefully evict Katrina survivors and took their guns from them so they wouldn't be able to protect themselves? They even went so far as to use force to disarm a little old lady from her unloaded gun. Took 3 big burly cops.
Maybe we need to take a closer look as to exactly why the GOP supports people having weapons since at the first opportunity they have they try to take them away?
mayor nagin was the one who ordered the confiscation of guns...and the city of nola was sued and had to return the guns....
When I asked this question of gun nuts their trained reply was that it wasn't Bush admin. that did this but the local authorities in NOLA who did.
Stories like these drive me nutz! If a "bad" guy is looking for trouble, they're rarely going to go through legal channels. These laws are put in place to frustrate law abiding citizens!
Here's an example: My family legally immigrated here from Italy when I was 6 mos old and I became naturalized citizen at 5. I went to school, worked, paid taxes. I am a mother of 3 and grandmother of 2. The most I ever got was a parking ticket. Thanks to the patriot act, I can't get an I.D. without surrendering my citizenship papers. It makes no sense. If I were up to no good would I really go to the local DMV? Now, I can't function or contribute to society in anyway. And the most insane part to this entire story, several years back I had a freak accident that left me with limited ability to walk and am currently receiving SSD benefits, which you MUST be a cit!zen to receive, yet I can't get a lousy state I.D.! How is this keeping us safe? Sometimes I wonder who these "laws" are ment to protect?
People that want to harm society, typically go outside the boundaries of the law. What good is the law then? Well of course without them anarchy would reign but mostly its job justification for the billions that "lawmakers" take from us. Maybe its times for citizens to make some "lists" of useless politicians!
Great example of how the "Patriot Act" is nothing of the sort. Time to scrap it. These laws were meant to protect the rights' ruling class so they can continue to manipulate and exploit us.
And BTW, the 9/11 t errorists did enter the US LEGALLY. And we will continue to be at risk as long as we have a subjective immigration system that values money over security considerations (they had money) and we continue in league with oppressive regimes like Saudi Arabia.
A shorter list may be the politicians who are NOT useless.
Typical citizen on the TSA Watch List:
Honorable discharged, twice decorated, Army officer who has held a Top Secret and Comsec Clearance, no background of criminality, married, two-children sent through college, civic leader, Licensed Federal Firearms Permit holder, and an American name, such as William, which put him on the TSA Watch List.
Yes, I am on the list...
You're obviously a danger to society and need to have your rights curtailed immediately.
If you are paranoid enough to think you are on the list, and own a weapon, you deserve to be on the list.
Show your evidence he's not.
my guess is you are on someones list....ha
I am also a honorably discharged veteran, have held TSC Clearances, and am a law abiding citizen; my wife and I are also, or were, on the TSA Watch List. I would bet many people here are, or were, and just aren't aware of it.
John, it’s easy to get off the list but I will not post it here. The irony of it all is how simple it works. Simple law for simple minds.
gmail.comail.com
Our country was founded by traitors and terrorist who owned guns and I am grateful for it.
From the British and Loyalist point of view. Perspectives matter!
I'm grateful too!
Seems like the real problem might be with the terrorist watch list itself. If it is like the no fly list bushie created, then we understand the problem. Another mess to clean up.
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First Posted: 06-20-09 11:04 AM | Updated: 06-20-09 11:24 AM