Saudi Women Train To Sell Lingerie

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DONNA ABU-NASR | June 24, 2009 12:02 PM EST | AP

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RIYADH, Saudi Arabia — Using colorful bras donated by employees at Victoria's Secret, a group of 26 mostly Saudi women completed the first course of its kind to be offered in the kingdom _ how to fit, stock and sell underwear _ a training organizers hope will help boost a campaign to lift the ban on women selling underwear in the kingdom.

The graduates held a small ceremony at a college in the western seaport of Jiddah on Tuesday, capping 40 hours of instruction during which they learned to overcome their embarrassment at doing bra fittings, deal with customer complaints and display the stock in an appealing manner.

"It was a beautiful experience," said Faten Abdo, a 32-year-old coordinator in the offices of a lingerie company.

"The most shocking thing for me was the bra sizes," she added. "We didn't know how to get proper measurements before."

The 10-day course comes three months after a group of Saudi women launched a campaign to boycott lingerie stores until they employ women. Almost all the stores in the kingdom are staffed by men. The only exceptions are a few women-only boutiques, some of them inside popular shopping centers.

The restrictions are ironic in a country that goes to great lengths to segregate the sexes. Men and women, for instance, who are not close relatives cannot stand in the same line at fast-food outlets or even be in the same car together. Conservative clerics have strong influence on government and society, and they ban anything they believe might lead to women's emancipation, such as driving or voting.

But those pushing for saleswomen in lingerie stores say they were tired of discussing intimate details with male staff and enduring their scrutiny when they ask for a particular cup size.

Their aim is to push for implementation of a law that has been on the books since 2006 which says only female staff can be employed in women's apparel stores. The law has never been put into effect, partly due to hard-liners in the religious establishment who oppose employing women in mixed environments like malls.

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Because of the mortification many women feel ordering bras, thongs and negligees, the lack of trained sales staff and the absence of fitting rooms _ they're banned because the idea of a woman undressing in a public place is unthinkable _ many women end up with the wrong underwear size.

The training was the idea of Suhair al-Qurashi, head of the private Dar al-Hekma College, according to Reem Asaad, a finance lecturer at the college and the main force behind the boycott campaign.

"She wanted the training to be a part of the solution because the industry was complaining that there's a lack of qualified (women) in the market who can run and manage lingerie stores," said Asaad. "So we covered fitting and technical issues, we covered selling and handling customer complaints."

The trainer was an Australian woman who had heard about the boycott campaign online and then offered to give the course.

A group of Victoria's Secret employees who also heard about the campaign on Facebook sent a box filled with colorful cotton bras to be used in the training, according to Asaad.

Suzanne al-Hindi, 33, one of 26 graduates, said she and the other women were "shy at first to play-role and do fittings on each other, but we got over it."

British consul-general in Jiddah Kate Rudd said she attended Tuesday's ceremony to show support for the idea that women should be allowed to play a more active role. "It was a small step, but perhaps from this little drop there will be bigger ripples," said Rudd.

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia — Using colorful bras donated by employees at Victoria's Secret, a group of 26 mostly Saudi women completed the first course of its kind to be offered in the kingdom _ how t...
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia — Using colorful bras donated by employees at Victoria's Secret, a group of 26 mostly Saudi women completed the first course of its kind to be offered in the kingdom _ how t...
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Please note that the bras were not donated by corporate Victoria's Secret, but by employees only.

As an advocate of this campaign I felt like I should clarify this on corporates behalf that yes indeed bras were donated by employees, but it was NOT in conjunction with the corporate office. Employees did this as a volunteer effort to support the women in Saudi Arabia.
Thank you for your time.

-Kaitlyn Thomas

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:04 PM on 06/26/2009

And then they are quickly dispatched.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:05 PM on 06/26/2009
- Bashley I'm a Fan of Bashley 14 fans permalink
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Seriously, does anyone know who makes the shiny number in the picture accompanying the link? That was CUTE......

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:03 PM on 06/25/2009
- mbondr1 I'm a Fan of mbondr1 4 fans permalink
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No pictures. Bah.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:21 AM on 06/25/2009
- JScott I'm a Fan of JScott 20 fans permalink

Now if it could only be extended to managing a whole country not just lingerie stores....but then again baby steps.....baby steps...

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:34 AM on 06/25/2009

i'm looking for a job, but only part time. professional bra fitter, sign me up.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:33 AM on 06/25/2009


Saudi women are beautiful and like other middle eastern countries women wear and design exotic lingerie. Maybe men design it too for all I know. Believe me victorias secret did not start a trend with these women,,,,,

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:16 AM on 06/25/2009
- elcojonu I'm a Fan of elcojonu 28 fans permalink

Arab women are some of the most beautiful women in the world; great, big beautiful eyes, knockout bodies.
Arab men want to keep them all to themselves, they don't want foreign men looking at their women.
An ancient and quaint custom; out of date, sure; but a custom none-the-less.
Let's respect other culture's customs, it makes for a more peaceful world.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:12 AM on 06/25/2009
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Feel free to respect abuse all you want. I guess peace and security matter more to you then feedom and justice for all.

P.S. unless you prefer to lie to yourself, stop reciting the Pledge of Allegience

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:26 AM on 06/25/2009

Quaint, huh? How about if we stop you from working, cover you from head to foot, don't let you drive, don't let you vote, don't let you have any say in you life. Would you still consider it quaint?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:49 PM on 06/25/2009

you = your

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:50 PM on 06/25/2009
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Is there anything in that country that women are permitted to do besides taking care of the household and producing offspring?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:52 AM on 06/25/2009
- Harrier I'm a Fan of Harrier 10 fans permalink

Now we're talking

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:21 AM on 06/25/2009
- mergina I'm a Fan of mergina 82 fans permalink
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Very noble of them to allow women to sell women's clothes. Of course if they try to someone will probably blow them up or douse them in acid, but it is a start.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:36 AM on 06/25/2009

Goodness, with so many women in the US wearing the wrong size -- after all, it took Oprah to bring the issue to the forefront -- I cannot imagine what it would be like to have to buy without a knowledgeable salesperson, much less without the ability to try one on! I never really thought about what a privilege it is to try on an undergarment and have someone courteous who knows how I'm supposed to fit in it!

While I give Victoria's Secret props for doing this, I do hope that they've trained these employees to deal with the more unusual sizes as well as the mainstream. Their bras are good up to a C-cup, but for anyone who is larger, the quality and silhouette are either poor or the sizes simply not carried. I don't know firsthand, but suspect that Saudi women are going to be on the larger side, and hope that the fact that the training was initiated by an Australian, not an American, will result in better coverage for the more voluptuous ladies, too. :-)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:19 AM on 06/25/2009

I've often read that many Saudi and middle eastern women are heavyset, mainly because they are not allowed to exercise or play sports or even wander around or walk alone, so they stay at home, and consequently, gain weight. That would mean they also have larger breasts or frame size.

So yes, Victoria's Secret should make sure that those sizes are on hand. And, their bras are pricey, so I wonder if the less affluent women can even afford the bras.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:12 AM on 06/25/2009
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Pin-heads on parade on this thread. In the ME, women are often very fashionable and feminine under their abayas, shaylas, and niqabs (the burqa is worn in Asia). And for all of the slobs asking for the "tasty" pics--grow up already--sheesh, how embarrassing for you.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:52 PM on 06/24/2009
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To live in a country where only men can sell bras and panties. Sounds as progressive as in classical China where a doctor could not look upon a woman's body, so the woman pointed to the place where it hurt on a doll.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:23 PM on 06/24/2009
- in4success I'm a Fan of in4success 43 fans permalink

man -- this threads full of repugs...that's for certain. sounds like a college republican strategy session over here.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:15 PM on 06/24/2009
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