EPA May Have Suppressed Report Skeptical Of Global Warming

CBS News:

The Environmental Protection Agency may have suppressed an internal report that was skeptical of claims about global warming, including whether carbon dioxide must be strictly regulated by the federal government, according to a series of newly disclosed e-mail messages.

Read the whole story: CBS News

Comments

[TimberGhost]

--
One reason why the process might have been highly charged politically is the unusual speed of the regulatory process. Lisa Jackson, the new EPA administrator, had said that she wanted her agency to reach a decision about regulating carbon dioxide under the Clean Air Act by April 2 -- the second anniversary of a related U.S. Supreme Court decision. --

Well that's how it is when trying to make up for the wasted time of the last administration in dealing with this crisis issue. No more dinging around and mollifying the holoca...e­r, I mean, global climate change deniers.

It's nice to have the adults back in charge.

[LinkSync]

Not knowing for sure about global warming seems a non-issue to me.
What I mean is the ability to controll co2 or any other emmision is in the long run a good thing either way, and independant of the global warming issue.

One thing I have seen is this giant effort to say that if there is any global warming it is not due to Mans activities.
So what?

The things we will do to combat Gobal Warming need doing for other less dubious reasons, like national security and economics and other environmental and health issues. The fact that those changes also address any global warming (if any) is wonderful, but ultimately not very relivent.

As to any malfeasence within the EPA (it seems far less onerous than the BUSH version of supression) from the article I can only gather that the one guy did the suppression and that probably was due to his own political judgement and not any instruction from his boss(s). But maybe. So fire him and lets more on. If any others DID instruct or inform the supression of valid information then they too should be fired. Somehow I doubt this happened in the new super sensative Transparency era.

[ReedYoung]

The liar who wrote the report should be fired, not the EPA director who correctly "quashed" it. EPA was absolutely right to refuse to allow Carlin's deception to masquerade as science.

[Amunaka]

Mars Warming Due to Dust Storms, Study Finds

Kate Ravilious
for National Geographic News

April 4, 2007

Lori Fenton at the NASA Ames Research Center in Moffett Field, California, and colleagues used a computer model to study the effect that winds have had on Mars's climate.

The team's results, published in this week's issue of the journal Nature, show that the decrease in Mars's reflectivity has caused a warming of 1.17 degree Fahrenheit (0.65 degree Celsius) between 1975 and 1995.

(Read related story: "Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Says" [February 28, 2007].)


The link between dust movement and global warming is likely to be unique to Mars and not something that could affect Earth, the scientists added.

Don Grainger is an atmospheric physicist at Oxford University who was not affiliated with the study.

"Unlike [on] Mars," he said, "the albedo of the Earth is governed by the occurrence of cloud and to a lesser extent by the presence of atmospheric aerosols [particles] and snow/ice cover."

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/04/070404-mars-warming.html

[research]

We should not suppress scientific papers.

[Sepulchre]

No we shouldn't and I won't defend them on that point. Papers need to be put up for peer review even if no one agrees with them. That is part of the system of science for a very good reason.

[johndtuttle]

It was not remotely a scientific paper. It was a Report written by an Economists filled with errors that commented on the science of Climatology. Something the author had absolutely no qualifications to do.

[Sepulchre]

If they had let it out though the scientific community would have at least had the opportunity to shred it apart which is exactly what would have happened, and should have. Now we have all these conspiracy nuts thinking they have some sudden grounds for their claims.

[ReedYoung]

Alan Carlin did not produce a scientific paper.

[Sepulchre]

No he didn't and if the scientific community had, had access to it, it would have been torn apart. Since it was squashed instead it gives conspiracy theorists the false impression it backs their claims. It was a bad move. The paper is pure BS and not science at all, but putting to light as BS would have been a better move. Though I often wonder how much science the average person understands at all. It is disheartening.

[Sensiblebg]

This is really not surprising­.. The environmental zealots always try to suppress claims that question their outrageous claims..

[Sepulchre]

Please site outrageous claims being made by resputable science about global warming.

[rattler99]

what is resputable science?

[johndtuttle]

It actually is really not surprising that a Scientific report decided to not include non-Science debunked BS in its report.

That's how science works.

[Quaoar]

There's nothing stopping Alan Carlin from posting an opposing viewpoint on his website as long as he includes a disclaimer that his views do not represent those of the EPA.

[montestruc]

Their is a lot to this, check these also;

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124597505076157449.html

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/02/25/jstor_climate_report_translation/

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2009/02/25/japanese-commission-challenges-un-global-warming-not-man-made

The science is actually not "decided", and those who say it is mostly have an axe to grind.

[Sepulchre]

As an actual scientist, it is decided by the majority of scientists. Most scientists believe that the current global warming is tied to human activity. Then there are those in the minority that agree global warming is happening but thing it may be a natural cycle of the earth, but many will not commit completely to that. It is absolutely happening the only conjecture and that is limited, among scientists is why.

[fumes]

''Most scientists believe that the current global warming is tied to human activity.'­'

believe???

[StevieRae]

The reaction to your counter is stupefying? Apparently, these cynics and doubters of science have not heard of the "tipping point."

They fail to understand that if we're approaching an tipping point in affecting the earth's climate because of our human activity/behavior, there's no turning back on this one. Blaming anyone in the future for not doing something will be too late.

While many of us wouldn't be around to experience the manifestations of global changes, our great, great grandchildren will and it is unimaginable today.

[montestruc]

Majority from where and paid by whom?

One of the references I cited above showed a majority of Japanese scientists dispute the human origin hypothesis. FYI Japan has no oil to sell, or even for domestic uses, and Japan has nuclear wind and wave energy out the wazoo.

American scientists who are in favor of this are mostly on the government gravy train and know which side of the bread is buttered by the Obama Administration.

I spent enough time in graduate school to know quite a bit about academic politics and how often tenured professors will ignore or minimize scientific facts that do not get them federal grant money.

[johndtuttle]

NASA Global Warming Page:

http://www.nasa.gov/worldbook/global_warming_worldbook.html

National Academy of Sciences Global Warming page:

http://dels.nas.edu/climatechange/

Lawrence Livermore National Laboratoy report on Climate Change:

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-06/dlnl-rpa061609.php

SOoooo, instead of quoting foreign right wing comspiracy theorists why don't you try quoting your Nation's own scientists?

[montestruc]

All of those people are paid by the US government in the control of the Obama Administration and Democratic congress, who it seems (like you) have no problem at all cutting funding or firing people for disagreeing with them especially when they have scientific evidence to back them up. And FYI, like you do not understand what science is all about, as in it is a process by which you learn which includes questioning authority.

[ReedYoung]

From the 98-page report in question, page iii, quote:
Global temperatures have declined -- extending the current downtrend to 11 years with a particularly rapid decline in 1907-8
/quote

Wrong by 100 years! That piece of "work" was not suppressed, it was withheld, for gross incompetence. More to follow.

[ppp1604]

I have concluded that there are some people who simply will not be convinced there is a climate change problem, until it is simply too late to do any thing about it.

when the oceans have swamped Florida, the east coast and California slides off into the deep. And there are no vacation flights to Hawaii.

Then and only then will some people concede that we have to do something.

[fumes]

the fossil records along coastal areas do not concur with your scenerio..

were it true what you say said areas should be treasure troves of ancient sea fossils.

[johndtuttle]

what the hell are you talking about?

[TimberGhost]

Are you aware they have found sea fossils beneath modern deserts?

What you say doesn't make sense.

[classicalgeek]

I myself have found plenty of ancient sea fossils in Dallas, Texas. Quite a ways inland.

[rattler99]

correct

[johndtuttle]

The rapture is coming before then don't cha know?

jeebus would never let good christians and tin foil hat wearers get flooded in Florida!

[starkcr31]

You tin foil hat joke is getting a tad old.

[montestruc]

So to heck with facts do it your way cause you say so?

I don't think so.

[BrighterStar]

There is no human caused global warming. When ever challanged global warming alarmests do not turn to science, but rather bold and unfounded statements about what will happen as a result. The sad thing is that we are in the process of destroying our economy in a silly attemt to fix a nonexistant problem. It would be funny if it weren't so sad.

[johndtuttle]

If more American's had an education in science instead of conspiracy theories and "reality TV" garbage then we would be better off. Don't you think?

L O L. "Brighter star". which rethug are you doing an internship for?

[fumes]

CO2 doesn't just trap heat..

it reflects it back! it's a miracle gas!

that's why it's used in all ''keeling windows'', those CO2 filled, double-pane thermal windows.

just imagine how much energy we would all save and how much warmer we would all be..

if only we all had ''keeling windows'' in our homes!!

[Sepulchre]

Wow, just, wow. How about methane and HCFCs and HFCs. Do you understand the function of the different layers of our atmosphere and the presence of elevated carbon dioxide in the lower atmosphere as opposed to the upper atmosphere? It really is far more complex.

We as a country really need to work on making our population capable of understanding at least the rudimentary basics of science. I get tired of regurgitated talking points.

[fumes]

''I get tired of regurgitated talking points.''

you should be more convincing maybe..

[rattler99]

how about trying to find some facts?

[montestruc]

The reason some insulating windows use CO2 are that 1) CO2 is cheap. 2) CO2 is a big molecule and so does not escape as easy as smaller ones, 3) as a sales gimmick.

The radiation effects of less than a meter thickness of CO2 at reasonable temperatures are negligable in the extreame.

[fumes]

''..neglig­able in the extreame.'­'

if you meant: ''negligible in the extreme''

i agree!

[october2009]

This Cap and Trade law that was just passed yesterday will be a HUGE money-making opportunity for the big politically connected corporations.

The big marketing push to scare the population into believing that man is warming the earth was done so that they can pass the very lucrative Cap and Trade bill... It has nothing to do with saving the planet.

It's one big scam.

According to NASA's own website, Mars is heating up:
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/odyssey/newsroom/pressreleases/20031208a.html

Here's another NASA article from NASA's own website about Mars heating up:
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/mgs/newsroom/20050920a.html

Here's an article from a Berkeley engineer who claims that Jupiter is warming up:
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v428/n6985/abs/nature02470.html

Here's an article from a team of astronomers from Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), Williams College, the University of Hawaii, Lowell Observatory and Cornell University, who claim that Pluto is undergoing global warming:
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2002/pluto.html

According to Russian scientists, It all has to do with the strengthening of the sun:
http://www.livescience.com/environment/070312_solarsys_warming.html

This is a scam to scare the people into a global carbon tax system that will line the pockets of a small group of people and screw over the majority.

[johndtuttle]

L O L.

Mars is warming up? Just what does that have to do with earth's climate again?

LOL Russian Scientists:

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-06/dlnl-rpa061609.php

If you actually read the article that you originally linked ( i know, try it) it completely debunks the Russians claims and others.

come on, do you actually read the links you post or just hope people with the attention span of gnats think you're cool?

[october2009]

Humans don't live on Mars... Yet it's still warming. That's the point I wanted to make.

This man-made global warming is a hoax.

[johndtuttle]

LOL the Berkeley paper ties it to a recurring cycle of Jupiter's and Jupiter's alone with zero correlation to Earth's climate.

[Sepulchre]

Shhhhhh...­.. don't confuse him with actual astronomy, facts make conspiracy nuts lose it.

[Sepulchre]

Shhhhhh...­.. don't confuse him with actual astronomy, facts make conspiracy n.uts lose it.

[johndtuttle]

Reply from the MIT boys again *your* link:

http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2002/pluto.html

Jay Pasachoff, an astronomy professor at Williams College, said that Pluto's global warming was "likely not connected with that of the Earth. The major way they could be connected is if the warming was caused by a large increase in sunlight. But the solar constant--the amount of sunlight received each second--is carefully monitored by spacecraft, and we know the sun's output is much too steady to be changing the temperature of Pluto."

Absolutely not connected.

Do you read these or what?

[WonderingAloud]

Wow! Considering we all KNOW that global warming is man-made, we are having effects outside our earth!!

Or maybe, just maybe, the sun is having something to do with the warming of both our planet and the other planets.

[johndtuttle]

Or MAYBE....w­ait.....tr­y READING THOSE LINKS in full and see how every single one of them explains how it is utterly unconnected to the Sun and Earth's own climate.

Go ahead, try it.

[ReedYoung]

From the Pluto article:

[
Jay Pasachoff, an astronomy professor at Williams College, said that Pluto's global warming was "likely not connected with that of the Earth. The major way they could be connected is if the warming was caused by a large increase in sunlight. But the solar constant--the amount of sunlight received each second--is carefully monitored by spacecraft, and we know the sun's output is much too steady to be changing the temperature of Pluto."

Pluto's orbit is much more elliptical than that of the other planets, and its rotational axis is tipped by a large angle relative to its orbit. Both factors could contribute to drastic seasonal changes.
]

October 2009's comment should be removed for being off-topic and dishonest. Taking this reply down with it as well, is fine with me.

[quidam56]

E N D MOUNTAINTOP REMOVAL ! http://www.wisecountyissues.com/?p=138

[AuntSally]

Uh.... EPA "suprresses" unsolicited, nonscientific report by nonscientist using unpublished, debunked arguments to refute findings of an entire scientific community. Have a read, folks...

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2009/06/bubkes/

[Amunaka]

Guess Who's Funding the Global Warming Doubt Shops?

Posted on: 10/26/2005

Climate Skeptics Funding for Climate Disinformation

In 1998, Exxon devised a plan to stall action on global warming. The plan was outlined in an internal memo that promised, "Victory will be achieved when uncertainties in climate science become part of the conventional wisdom" for "average citizens" and "the media." (Read the memo [PDF].)
The company would recruit and train new scientists who lack a "history of visibility in the climate debate" and develop materials depicting supporters of action to cut greenhouse gas emissions as "out of touch with reality."


http://www.environmentaldefense.org/article.cfm?contentid=3804&CFID=21084385&CFTOKEN=29888831



Global Warming Skeptics
—Prominent Skeptics Organizations

http://www.ucsusa.org/global_warming/science/skeptic-organizations.html

[SoDoSomething]

When was he hired?
Who hired him?
What did he do before coming to the EPA?

There is always someone in every agency that disagrees with the policy of the agency. It is a good idea to multiple viewpoints, etc. Doesn't really mean all viewpoints are right.

In any case release the report and lets have at it. One more global warming denier isn't going to make much difference.

[ReedYoung]

""I was told for probably the first time in I don't know how many years exactly what I was to work on," said Carlin, a 38-year veteran of the EPA. "And it was not to work on climate change." One e-mail orders him to update a grants database instead."

2009 - 38 = 1971

Richard "If the President does it, it's not illegal" Milhouse Nixon's administration got Carlin into the EPA. Shocking!

[JulieSA]

Nixon's administration established the EPA.

[Amunaka]

Global Warming Skeptics: A Primer

Guess Who's Funding the Global Warming Doubt Shops?

Posted on: 10/26/2005

Climate Skeptics Funding for Climate Disinformation

In 1998, Exxon devised a plan to stall action on global warming. The plan was outlined in an internal memo that promised, "Victory will be achieved when uncertainties in climate science become part of the conventional wisdom" for "average citizens" and "the media." (Read the memo [PDF].)
The company would recruit and train new scientists who lack a "history of visibility in the climate debate" and develop materials depicting supporters of action to cut greenhouse gas emissions as "out of touch with reality."


http://www.environmentaldefense.org/article.cfm?contentid=3804&CFID=21084385&CFTOKEN=29888831



Global Warming Skeptics
—Prominent Skeptics Organizations

http://www.ucsusa.org/global_warming/science/skeptic-organizations.html

[TestAndVerify]

Hmm, why does this sound to me like like Freeman Dyson was recruited for something like this? Its hard to argue against a "well regarded" scientist to some in the public, even if he seems to repeat the standard GW denier arguments. In any case Dyson is a physicist, not a climatologist, and has been a bit of a rock star type pie in the sky physicist as well, Orion Project anyone? I would question the amount of training and knowledge Dyson has in the area, I'm not sure that it is very much. In any case, while climatology uses some material from physics to explain the climate, statistics and geology are important and many other branches of science and math are used as well in climatology.

[RomeoMD25]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/20/the-top-10-lobbyists-on-t_n_205868.html
its funny how huff -post
writes an article
that Exxon,Monsanto, JP Morgan
supported this bill