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(UPDATED) 'Bankslaughter': Should Execs Be Held Liable For Killing Banks?

The Huffington Post   First Posted: 08/08/09 06:12 AM ET Updated: 05/25/11 02:35 PM ET

Ye Meltdown Lehman

UPDATED: Jul. 9, 11:20 p.m.

If you're driving and happen to kill a pedestrian, you may, of course, be slapped with manslaughter charges. On the other hand, if you're running a huge financial company and your management decisions remove billions of dollars of wealth from the economy and you threaten the entire financial system, you'll receive a multimillion pay package. (See Dick Fuld, Angelo Mozilo, et al.)

Paul Collier of the Guardian has put forth a novel, if slightly gruesome-sounding, concept that's making its way through the financial blogosphere: 'bankslaughter.' The term appears to have been originated in May by Collier's fellow Guardian writer Timothy Garton Ash, who suggested "a crime of bankslaughter, comparable to manslaughter in the sense that you don't have to prove malice aforethought." In other words, the thinking goes, corporate criminal law isn't sufficient when it comes to abject recklessness and risk-taking in the financial sector. Here's Collier:

"With bankslaughter, when the bank blows up -- even if it is a decade later -- a criminal investigation traces back to determine whether crucial decisions were reckless. If a reasonable banker faced with the information available at the time would not have taken those risks, the person responsible is dragged off the golf course and jailed.


Once bankslaughter was on the books, bonuses would be less dangerous. Managers would have to weigh the balance between risk and return and take defensible decisions. I doubt hyper-caution would be a problem: the overly cautious would not get bonuses. Surely we can rely on our bankers to exhibit the necessary degree of greed."

The idea of holding executives criminally liable for bad management -- especially companies that are essentially "too big to fail" - has caused somewhat of a stir in the financial blogosphere. John Carney of Clusterstock called bankslaughter, "The Worst Idea Of The Week":

"In the first place, Collier doesn't seem to have given much thought to the costs of over-deterrence. Bank executives faced with the prospect of a criminal investigation and possible conviction would likely be overly cautious. We'd lose a lot of socially beneficially risk taking by criminalizing bank failure.


There's also a serious fairness issue. Only those executives whose risky bets blow up get investigated, prosecuted and punished. Those whose bets pay off are untouched. This means that being unlucky in the markets becomes a criminal matter. Criminality becomes a kind of lottery."

Carney brings up a good point: the criminal system isn't necessarily structured to investigate highly complex financial institutions and their myriad counter-parties (Enron appears to be an exception to this). Here's more from Carney: "Unless the crime required bankers to know they were being reckless--in which case it would deter almost no-one and result in approximately zero convictions--it would wind up punishing bankers for just being wrong."

Today, Carney, also suggested that shareholders have little or no interest in protecting themselves from risk-taking bankers -- that's the reason they invested in bank stocks in the first place. Carney's definition of a bank seems a bit out of step with most the ideas of most Main Street investors, who likely viewed banks as stable, conservative institutions prior to the financial crisis.

Reuters' Felix Salmon sees potential in the idea, however: "Is it reasonable to hold professionals criminally liable if they take reckless risks with other people's money? I don't see why not. Especially if they work at a leveraged and systemically-important institution. After all, people can be jailed for insider trading, which is far more of a victimless crime than bankslaughter."

James Kwak at The Baseline Scenario chimes in on the matter, arguing that the world financial system needs more "over-deterrence." He suggests that large financial institutions should have a way to "internalize the risk of failure in some way," but says that bankslaughter should be left to civil tort cases. Still, he's in agreement with much of Collier's argument: "In an environment where it’s very clear that managers were taking too many risks, because there was no way they would suffer the potential consequences of those risks, one very logical and sensible solution is to turn the dial partially back the other way and increase liability, which I see as Collier’s basic point."

What do you think? VOTE:

Quick Poll

Should U.S. Criminal Law Include A 'Bankslaughter' Provison For Financial Execs?

Yes

No

Yes, but only if reckless intent is proven

Yes, but only if the exec spent millions in remodeling his office

Yes, but only for 'Too Big To Fail' Institutions


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UPDATED: Jul. 9, 11:20 p.m. If you're driving and happen to kill a pedestrian, you may, of course, be slapped with manslaughter charges. On the other hand, if you're running a huge financial compan...
UPDATED: Jul. 9, 11:20 p.m. If you're driving and happen to kill a pedestrian, you may, of course, be slapped with manslaughter charges. On the other hand, if you're running a huge financial compan...
 
 
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09:25 PM on 07/10/2009
Sue all Golden Stacks employees, starting with Paulson. Give these banks the Teddy treatment.
09:23 PM on 07/10/2009
Every cent should be returned, every American with a 401k or a pension plan should be repayed by these corporate banking thieves.
Ivar
Ivar
09:21 PM on 07/10/2009
YES!
01:36 PM on 07/10/2009
Corporation = Legalized Crime (just like Andrew Jackson warned about)
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
sposton
right to tell what they don't want to hear
10:29 AM on 07/10/2009
Of course they ought to be punished but more importantly we should reform our system in a such a way that anything like what had been perpetrated cannot happen. It is time to redesign our financial system away from the phantom wealth towards the real wealth.

Read "Agenda for a New Economy: From Phantom Wealth to Real Wealth" by David C Korten
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
munki
Global to Local now Local to Global
10:14 PM on 07/09/2009
in addition... they really lost global confidence of America...

totally disappointing...
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
09:20 PM on 07/09/2009
Funny.

It's about limited liability and its effect on incentives. In other words, the ugly face of capitalism.

So it's not new. It's a rediscovery of the 'gamble for resurrection', the mother of all perverse incentives.
To say that nothing can be done about it without imposing 'social costs', like John Carney claims, has the ugly smell of myth making.
schatsie
Wall Street is Worse than Vegas
08:49 PM on 07/09/2009
They nailed Charles Keating with RACKETEERING, it is not that difficult.... There just has to be the will power.
03:18 PM on 07/09/2009
Please don't append "Updated" to a post if it isn't actually updated. I read this one yesterday, and came back today since I saw the tag. Lo and behold, NOTHING CHANGED FROM YESTERDAY!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
JustJoy7
Give your best, expect the best from others.
02:37 PM on 07/09/2009
If I kill someone for $2.00 to get a loaf of bread from the local supermarket, would I be held responsible? If I would, then they should be responsible for killing the banks. Sadly, it is more likely that I'd be held responsible and prosecuted than these goons. That's the American way.
02:22 PM on 07/09/2009
Stimulus is a joke of a concept; it doesn't end up with real economic growth in the long
tem. Even the New Deal failed to increase private investment. It wasn't until 1941 that
domestic private investment reached 1929 levels. The fact that the first stimulus has failed
to stop the bleeding yet isn't surprising. Our government deficit for the year which is over
20% of GDP (when the omnibus bill, first stimulus, bailouts, and on-budget deficit are
summed) is unsustainable and something's gotta give, whether it be the lenders or the
interest rates.

hat tip to http://www.iamned.com
03:38 PM on 07/09/2009
By first stimulus, you mean the one Bush passed last year? Remember getting the check?
Or do you mean the TARP program that was pushed by Bush and Paulsen?
Or the first stimulus that Bush gave in his first term?
Or his bailout of the airline industry?
Or the nationalization of airport security?

Your name should really be partisanfromthepast instead...
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
PhilipTaylor
Legalized Bribery is an Oxymoron - must END
01:07 PM on 07/09/2009
Thanks to the Morgan Stanley evidence today this argument is even more relevant:

This argument is counterproductive as their is MASSIVE Evidence the Scheme used was premeditated and therefore HIGH CR!MES were committed!

This was not WELL EDUCATED MEN (mostly) making mistakes except one - They thought they would get away with it! To assume that Masters and PhD level managers simply made some mistakes is naive and irrational.

TWO SIMPLE CHARGES:

1. Premeditated Manufactured Insider Trading
a. Make a lot of Sure Fail Product knowing it will fail
b. Buy Massive A1G Credit Default Swaps which is Betting the SURE FAIL Products will fail!
Make it to fail and then bet it will fail: "Manufactured Insider Trading" 100% sure BET!

2. Misrepresentation of Hugh Risk "FAKE Rated" products as Safe Low Risk "AAA" and sold to victims all over the world!

Both Cr!mes are Felony Fraud and are well documented! They provide evidence for decade or longer terms in Pr!son!

Ask Chef Martha who did next to nothing compared to the $Trillion Scams these Banksters committed yet served years!
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Donnat
Remember when teachers, public employees, Planned
11:05 AM on 07/09/2009
Yes they should. How could anyone argue differently? Banks perpetrated theft by deception and these were the eyes, ears, arms and brains of the banks that did so.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
sueinmn
11:01 AM on 07/09/2009
The latest bank schemes are out for public review. Packing the most toxic assets and selling them with AAA ratings. We will give them all the money they need when they fail again because we are not bold enough to break them up.

Is anyone else tired of this? We are sacrificed - our homes-our jobs-our assets lost in the market games.

Is anyone else tired of the lip service we are still getting from a super majority in power? We could have 80 Dems in office and they still would not do whats right for the public! They are all owned by corporates! Obama himself has backpeddled on almost EVERYTHING. Im following Ohio in saying Obama has not lived up to his promises. Until we all tell him that, he will do little. He has changed greatly from when he ran. His talk has changed greatly. His actions even worse!

It is time that Obama wakes up to the very people who elected him and brings his senate to his side of the table and tell the corporates to take a hike! Will he?? He prefers to satisfy all sides with little crumbs of change!
11:49 AM on 07/09/2009
And which bank was it I read about yesterday that is packaging up another multimillion dollar CDO just like the ones that got us in this mess, as though nothing has happened?

Well, nothing has happened--To them!

And more and more we see that Obama intends that is stay that way.
11:56 AM on 07/09/2009
Ah, here it is--Morgan Stanley--why am I not surprised?

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aeTzfvEedKpQ
10:56 PM on 07/08/2009
We've had numerous cases in where American corporations hired paramilitary groups and assassins to murder protesters and union organizers, and countless cases of companies that knowingly sold contaminated products to American consumers that resulted in death or debilitating illness. The worst they ever get is a light fine.

The question is...when faced with actual homicide and manslaughter, why are we so much more upset about the banks?
HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
TeeLolly
11:44 PM on 07/08/2009
Through the banks under their control, a relatively small group of extremely wealthy players who did not need another penny to live out their lives in luxury turned the world's financial system on its head solely to satisfy their personal greed, wiping out millions of people who needed their relatively small investments to put their kids through college or to avoid having to retire in poverty, and causing thousands of workers to lose jobs on which they and their families depended. After the government stepped in to prevent a further financial meltdown, the same players showed up with their hands out, taking multimillion-dollar bonuses for themselves out of the taxpayer money intended to stabilize the financial system. These were not crimes of passion, nor were they motivated by any need to provide for their families. These guys demonstrated an unparalleled level of selfishness and an absolutely reckless disregard for the consequences of their actions.
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SteveDenver
Progressive and liberal, just like Jesus Christ.
03:12 AM on 07/09/2009
Meanwhile, the same banks axed lines of credit, sending businesses into financial turmoil and causing many to close. REGULATION and consumer protection are absolutely in order, it's clear banks play with much more than "their" money. They play with the livelihood of depositors and the financial future of businesses that support those depositors.

Trash the Bush tax cuts for the rich, where's the benefit? Trickle down doesn't work, trickle-up (when the working class and middle class are making financial headway) has already been proven to lift the entire economy. The rich can already afford anything they desire.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
PhilipTaylor
Legalized Bribery is an Oxymoron - must END
02:29 AM on 07/09/2009
Because we entrusted them to do the Honest thing with our money but instead they SCAMMED US with their schemes and technology and frankly ruined tens or hundreds of millions of peoples' retirements, education plans, lives, and other plans!