Deseret News :
A "kiss-in" drew about 60 people sporting pink paper hearts to the sidewalk just off of LDS Church property near Main Street and South Temple Sunday to protest actions taken by church security late last week.
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I wish I'd been there. If some security pig had approached me, I would have said "If you want a kiss too, you'll just have to wait your turn!""
Just a quick comment here, if anyone sees this. I see the racial comparisons have been brought up (again!) and while there may or may not be a comparison between blacks and gays (although I've met black gays who say the comparison is fair), as a disabled man (as well as gay) I can say for certain that the discrimination I have felt due to my disability is identical to the discrimination I have witnessed as a gay man
all internet arguments devolve into
1) Na.zi's
2) Blacks
3) Your mom
Generalize much?
Hey! Leave my mom out of this! :)
Your point is?
All the gays in this country should move to Utah and vote in gay marriage.
Only problem is, then we'd all have to move to Rome and take over the vatican to diminish their iron fisted grip on society, and I don't think we have those kinds of resources at the moment, unlike LDS who have millions of dollars of disposable income, even after their 20% tithe to contibute to the ignorance and hatred behind PRop8
catholics have far less pull in the majority of the country than you think.
is it hypocritical much to complain about others ignorance while you espouse your own. Tithe is dictionary definition 10%.
The plaza in question is private property it is not a place of public accommodation and so they can do what they want there. I don't like it, but it's well within their legal rights. It's hypocritical to seek for legal rights for a group and take away those of another just cause you don't agree with what they believe.
When I talk to my friends and family that are LDS, one thing I DID to convince them to lay off gay marriage was that it didn't mean gay people would start demanding use of their churches and such. However with acts like this I won't be able to convince them. If you want to kiss do it on public property, at a place of public accommodation or your own property and let private property rights continue, cause it'd be harder to squash those than to get gay marriage legal.
How do you have a "Kiss-In" outside?
Why do we allow religious extremists to own a street like this? Would you be comfortable if the Taliban set up shop and bought the street you used to walk home from the store/school/work on? How about when they station security guards all over it?
We "allow" them because they have the $$$ to fight for whatever discriminatory policies they deem proper in order to please their particular invisible-
In other words, "money talks, b.s walks".
Yeah I'd like to see you try to pull off a stunt like this at Taliban HQ.
Is it possible for a protest to have a negative number of people?
You don't think the Mormons would do the same if they could? The only reason they haven't is because of the laws of this country. If this was say, Iran with LDS being the government faith or a country like Somalia with no functioning government, they would have already begun their bloody crusade.
Actually, Afghan women did pull off a rather decent and effective protest at the Afghan HQ when the parliament attempted to implement a policy of consensual r a p e.
Hmmm....I wonder if the LDS and Taliban are exchanging notes??
Let's see... when they started the move West, colonized the desert that was Utah, I think it's fair they own whatever the heck they want. Comparing TaIiban to the LDS church is not only full of fallacies, but incredibly childish.
I disagree. Without the protections of the law of this country the LDS would be free to continue out their most violent desires. Their doctrine is very threatening to non-Mormons.
Well, one's a desert dwelling people with strong theocratic tendencies and the other one's in Afghanistan.
Well Salt Lake City sold it to them. They saw benefit in it. It is no longer public property or a street and the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals agrees that the public easement is gone. The plaza is not a place of public accommodation and so they are free to do as they please.
or would you rather try and eliminate private property rights? Not be able to call the cops if a couple of Mormons come to your door and won't leave your property?
The Mormon Church should strike back and take all their mulitple wives to Castro Street in San Francisco and kiss them in front of the LGBT's. That will show them.
Oh, yeah, that'll really show'em. We'd just turn it into a giant pride parade down main street and play into their fears that we all want to "turn" them
Again, why do you feel the need to prance up and down the street regarding your sexuality?
I don't think they would care. That's the difference.
Should buy up the Castro and turn it into a homosexual outreach ministry!!
Let me guess, your definition of homosexual outreach ministry is one that conducts conversion therapy
Anyone find it ironic that the disciples of a man who outright fornicated with unwilling young 'uns object to a peck on the cheek between consenting adults? Maybe anything goes in private.
You kidding?
Of course you're allowed to do things in private that you aren't allowed to do in public!!!
You mean Bring 'Em Young? Or Joe the Treasure Hunter?
The LDS church has a problem with love?
no, they have a problem with 2 people of the same gender showing love, because they believe it is a "love that dare not speak its name" or some such indoctrinated propogandist crap
Exactly.
As an ex-Mormon, gay person, I can tell you that the Mormon church is scared of this and sexuality in general. Have you ever noticed that once people are liberated sexually, that all other kinds of pregjudices and bigotry are also eliminated and people are more prone to be "live and let live and love"? This is about CONTROL pure and simple. If you can control people's sexuallity, you can CONTROL them period.
Certainly not Big Love.
I love that show.
I said it earlier, and I'll say it again, A for effort for at least trying to make a statement, C- for follow through. We, the LGBT community and our supporters need better organizational skills in distributing information and rallying the troops for things like this. When hundreds, or even thousands of people gather in protest of these acts of blatant homophobia, then I'll be impressed. Until then, we need to keep trying.
This is just the beginning, folks. Hold onto your hats. You ain't seen nothing yet! (I hope!)
Maybe it's time to start an "agenda". We've been denying one ever existed and it's been used against us for years so maybe it's time we had one. The LDS certainly has one.
Ironically, we HAVE an agenda. To repeal DADT and DOMA, enact ENDA, UAFA and Hate Crimes legislation. But our methods of writing and calling our elected officials has not worked, so we need to step up our efforts to disseminate information and educate people as to why these laws are so vitally important to the LGBT community
Mormons can dictate the lifestyles and relationships of those who willingly embrace Mormonism, but they have no right to dictate the lifestyles and relationships of the rest of society that is not Mormon.
"The easement became private property, allowing the church to ban protesting, smoking, sunbathing and other "offensive, indecent, obscene, lewd or disorderly speech, dress or conduct," church officials said at the time. In exchange, the city got church property for a west-side community center."
http://www
In other words, the church and city agreed that they both have no problem with rights, such as the first ammendment, freedom of speech and expression such as open displays of affection can be bought and sold to the highest bidder
A peck on the cheek and holding hands is not lewd. If it is in your book - you are the sicko!
And yet, just last week the city council declared it legal to buy alcohol in eating joints...b
Just plain disrespectful and intentionally provocative. What ever happened to class in this country.
Kissing is intentionally provacative? You're icon should be your picture with WRONG under it. Hate isn't classy either.
Some of us think it takes a lot of class to stand up for what is right and fight against blatant discrimination
You're absolutely right! It is horribly disrespectful and intentionally provocative for the LDS to have a security force to repel people they deem unworthy to get near their house of worship. What a beautiful message to share - "We are the Church of Jesus Christ but he doesn't like your kind". Who the hell do they think they are? The vatican?
Church of JC is such a bogus claim.
Mormons just hate laughter!
Mo.rmo.ns are *not* Chri.stian
Do we really care how Christians classify LDS or do we care how US law classifies LDS?
Many posts blames Christians for this incident. Most likely they don't realize Mormons aren't Christian
Here is a legal ruling: http://www
What about kiss-ins in front of the Apostles' homes?
It appears that there are quite a few rational and progressive folks here tonight to defend others eyes from hateful ranting and ensure homophobic remarks get challenged.
Later!
Too bad you don't include the LDS as being worthy of protection from hateful ranting.
They are you know, whether you agree with them or not!
well, as Matthew Shepard would put it, "They started it."
Again with the "being tolerant of intolerance". I don't think so! Homie don't play that game!
In Utah, they are not hated. These remarks are somewhat crass, but there is no question that a non straight very white person is suspect in that state and treated differently. To your face they are nice, but don't expect it to be carried out behind your back.
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First Posted: 07-12-09 06:08 PM | Updated: 07-12-09 06:11 PM