Washington Post:
Six months into his presidency, Barack Obama may have no greater test of his ability to translate personal popularity into a successful legislative agenda than the upcoming two weeks.
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A Conservative Case for Universal Health Coverage
By Randall Hoven
We already have socialized medicine and we are already paying for it -- twice: once in taxes and once privately. What we are not getting is universal coverage.
But if universal care (via emergency rooms) is already mandated, what's the problem? First, it is not the best way to get treatment. For one thing, the condition has to be regarded as a medical emergency. Also, the law does not relieve you of having to pay for that treatment. In fact, medical bills are the leading cause of bankruptcies in the U.S., accounting for half of them.
So while you might not die, the U.S. health care system does give you the age-old offer of "your money or your life".
It's "your money AND your life" for these greedy so-and-sos. They will not be denied, unless we deny them.
Their Own Medicine
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124786946165760369.html
A Conservative Case for Universal Health Coverage
By Randall Hoven
We already have socialized medicine and we are already paying for it -- twice: once in taxes and once privately. What we are not getting is universal coverage.
But if universal care (via emergency rooms) is already mandated, what's the problem? First, it is not the best way to get treatment. For one thing, the condition has to be regarded as a medical emergency. Also, the law does not relieve you of having to pay for that treatment. In fact, medical bills are the leading cause of bankruptcies in the U.S., accounting for half of them.
So while you might not die, the U.S. health care system does give you the age-old offer of "your money or your life".
As small-government conservatives or libertarians, we could say, "That is the individual's choice: get the insurance or suffer the consequences." But if that is our policy, then why is our government paying over $2,100 per person per year and regulating health care at a cost of $1,500 per household? What are we getting for that money?
Stunning how the pr0paganda campaign persuades people to continue this failed policy to keep insurance companies f at. It's good to see that even some cons can see the light when it comes down to money.
Exactly. They've had such success with it, but I think this time we can make the difference, particularly since we have the past failure to learn from. It amazes how sociopathic corporations are, but they aren't human, after all.
Obamageddon is just getting started. This fall will be legendary.
You seem to have the reasoning power of a tic-tac
There you go insulting tic-tacs again.
It has been six months since he took office. He must have made some great strides to make this "fall" you are talking about so epic.
If by great strides you mean massive debt that will burden our nation for decades then he has certainly made great strides.
if you really thought that, you would be on repubs lying sites, not this one.
I can multitask giggles, I have the amazing ability to open multiple windows at the same time.
Are you amazed??
Reading your drivel only goes to prove how really desperate you are.
The demise of the Republican Party will be legendary. They'll be in the history books with the whigs.
rich misty :
Why aren't big businesses paying any taxes???
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
The same reason why a proprietor who makes no profit pays no income tax.
You have never owned a business before. That explains why you do not understand the way this world works. Business pays income tax on profits only. So if a corporation earns $100,000 in a year and spends $999,999 then they pay tax on only $1. And that's how you run a profitable non tax paying business.
And they dont show profits because they use ENRON style shell companies to eat them up....
So you are saying that:
100,000
-999,000
=$1
OK... thanks.
typo
Wow. That's some very creative accounting! I wonder how long I personally would be in business if I earned $100,000 and SPENT $999,999. Sounds like Wall Street to me. So THAT's hoe they run a profitable non tax paying business. And I thought they were just swindlers....
Excessive executive compensation left shells of the companies and I had to bail them out.
The companies and managers walked away with everything.
Now come on, if YOU know anything about running a business, you know d@mn well that profits can be deferred to future tax years via various investment strategies. And if you have a very good accountant, you can defer sufficiently to write off enough paper losses to stay marginal for years.
Deferment and depreciation are two of the most abused tax avoidance methods their are. Close those loophole, and it could fund a huge chunk of healthcare on its own.
One would think that between 1993 when HilBill proposed a National Healthcare plan and today ~~~~~ That they might have had something already before the public, that we could have read years ago and would now be able to shout a simple Yay or Nay to Congress on.
One would think....
Unless they're hiding something, of course?
You're almost as bad as Alex Jones.
Minus the conspiracy theories...
Wouldn't you think that some (any) coherent plan could have been placed before us to read and discuss in a rational manner, rather than having to listen to Tiffany and richmisty
Go ahead and keep thinking you have the President on the mat, GOPers. Ask the Democratic candidates who were left in the dust. Ask McCain/Palin. You underestimate this man and his ideas, and you make a big mistake. We will have health care reform.
No, unfortunately we were pretty much right all along...not saying McCain would have been any better though.
It's only been six months, Pinchy....no man ever made can fix thirty years of incompetence in six months. This job will get done, and done correctly.
wishing your life away
You continue to underestimate President Obama. Like he said "don't bet against him".
Oh there is not doubt we will have reform.
Whether it is what we want is a different question altogether.
Nobody will get exactly what they want, except the GOP if this goes down to defeat. But that is not going to happen.
If I have ta pee in a cup to get the public option or a subsidy, I ain't showing up........,
LOL!
No problem.
I'm sure Fox will organize Pee-Cup parties.
tee-hee.
pffffffffffft, hilarious
lol
LOL
I predicted to friends that Obama's fall was going to take two years. I said in two years he will be so far down in the polls and so obviously incapable that he would make Carter look like a master statesman and leader.
I was off a bit in my prediction, Obama is on the precipice already, his fall in the polls will be biblical and he will be unable to govern.
His preacherly rhetorical style is wearing thin and the empty suit is becoming more apparent by the day. Thankfully you can't keep all or even most of the people fo oled most of the time.
America is waking up to this farcical candidate, his snakoil promises and brazen socialist overeaching.
As things get much worse because of his policies and inability to do more than offer a placebo rhetorical tonic America will simply tune him out and endure the rest of his one term presidency.
Congress will pay the price starting in 2010.
"Hoop there it is", game over Obama, go back to Chicago and sit down.
This from a Bush voter. Heh.
Not once in three elections but keep up the du mb accusations they're amusing.
Bradley Effect
Wake up already. It's not about Obama failing. It's about Americans being ripped off, disenfranchised, disregarded, and silenced. We need health care reform, whether you're for or against the president. We need to stop the health insurance industry from effectively taking the lives of everyday Americans for the sake of their profits. President Obama is trying to stop them and he's asking for our help. Keep your bs prognostications out of the discussion.
One correction. His speeches aren't 'preacherly", they're "lawyerly". Lawyerly speeches can go on for hours sounding intelligent and substantative without really saying anything at all.
It's obvious, to most of us here, that you aren't listening.
American Thinker;
December 12, 2007
A Conservative Case for Universal Health Coverage
By Randall Hoven
I am a small-government conservative/libertarian and have hated the concept of socialized medicine almost all my life. But now, I could live with universal health coverage in the U.S.. Here's why.
We now have the worst of both worlds: we are paying for universal health coverage, but not getting it. In fact, we pay more for health care in taxes than countries that provide universal coverage. Then we pay more than that amount again in private coverage. Additionally, what we have now in the U.S. is nowhere near a free market in health care. Defending the status quo is not defending a free market. And if socialized medicine is your fear, we already have it.
Cont.
I've heard no one, on either side of the political spectrum, play up the fact that the government in the U.S. already spends more on health care than almost every other country on earth. I'm talking government spending, not private spending. According to the U.S. Statistical Abstract, government spending on health care in the U.S was $2,168 per person in 2001 (the last year for which comparison data are available). Here were the top 10 government spenders on health care in 2001.
Norway: $2,550
U.S.: $2,168
Denmark: $2,098
Iceland: $2,025
Sweden: $1,832
Germany: $1,803
France: $1,599
Canada: $1,531
UK: $1,518
Belgium: $1,417.
If we add in private spending as well, it's not even close.
U.S.: $4,887
Switzerland: $3,690
Norway: $2,982
Denmark: $2,545
Iceland: $2,441
Germany: $2,407
Canada: $2,161
Sweden: $2,149
Netherlands: $2,134
France: $2,104.
Note that the countries frequently cited as models of universal health care, Canada and the U.K., spent less on public health than the U.S. did. Sweden, the notorious welfare state, spent 15% less than the U.S.. The only country to spend more, Norway, has about the size and population of Colorado, with oil exports over 3 million barrels per day.
Fanned. Faved.
This is an awfully long thread, so I'm guessing some folks have mentioned it somewhere in there, but regardless, you said it. That's enough.
Damm straight.
Yes, we spend more than twice as much as per capita as any other country but we have 47 million uninsured are rated only 37th. The efficiency of the free market.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritage_foundation
RSU, offering me two links to the HF articles doesn't prove JACK! They want tax cuts! Of course they'll say they work using THEIR OWN spin! Do they fund you? Is that why you post here?
"The foundation took a leading role in the conservative movement during the presidency of Ronald Reagan, whose policies drew significantly from Heritage's policy study Mandate for Leadership. Heritage has since continued to have a significant influence in U.S. public policy making, and is widely considered to be one of the most influential research organizations in the United States, especially during the Republican administration of President George W. Bush."
Don't give me that BS!
Their research has yet to be proven false . . . unlike wikipedia and your links.
Yeah, right, I work for the Heritage Foundation.
ha . . .
I told you why I post here.
You're not helping anyone that's for sure! The Heritage Foundation's whole purpose is to make Reagan conservatives look good! So don't give me that bull.
Your writing skills aren't good enough to qualify you for a job at the Heritage Foundation.
The Heritage Foundation is right wing religious extremism, like Focus on the Family, and the Family Research Institute.
I can smell your fear.
They're pro-Intelligent Design Creationism; it's safe to ignore whatever other positions they hold.
I wish there was more than one person in the D party who could speak like an intelligent person, from a position of strength, that would not cower immediately when confronted by one of the idiotic R talking (fera-mongering) points. I have never seen a group so scared and so unwilling to talk straight when confronted with the bluster from the right.
Why not focus solely on the uninsured - the plan is expensive because we have so many un- and under-insured, for the most part due to pro-business legislation and governance form the right (with an assist from weak Dems).
It kills me to watch the news and the only forceful speakers are the wackos
Get a good health care bill through dems, and we will be done with repubs once and for all.
Amen !
Absolutely true......
they will do anything to stop it. and as potus said, it's not about politics , it's about saving our economy and people's lives. repubs could care less about that
They know the stakes, but I'm concerned that what will result is some watered-down limp work that will ultimately leave the health insurance industry off the hook--and the Republicans will live to befoul another day. We need to *reform* the industry. Serious reform, then you can watch them float away like just so much detritus down the river.
If someone would just include free weed and pizza, in this bill, it would pass with flying colors......,There wouldn't even be a need for debate......,
Yes, a "munchies" provision must also be included.....
heh....,
It would pass if they called it the Ronald Reagan Memorial War on the Poor Tax Cut Act with Freedom Fries.
lol
I mean...well.......I could even get by without the pizza...........just setweedfree, man...
lol
Aramos (rhymes with smells the most) says:
"Make no mistake about it...OBAMACARE will cost us hundreds of billions of jobs, and not create any jobs"
"ITS STILL THE ECONOMY S*TUPID!", he says....adding additional luster to his previous brilliant proclamation.
Hmmm, last time I checked, there were only 5.5 billion people, give or take a few million, on this planet. So, Aramos, unless you're talking about employing men and woman from the Planets Zepton, Cruton, and Ur-a*nus, then we're looking at every last man, woman, and child on this c*razy little thing called Earth losing about a million jobs apiece. Now, that's something to write home to mom about....provided you can write.
LOL...
Hyperbole is the single greatest way ever invented in the universe to make a point.
Last time I checked, it was you Republicans who bankrupted this country! We've had enough of your lies.
read the whole thing d*ummy. It was making fun of some d*ummy Repub who made a d*umba** comment
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First Posted: 07-19-09 08:21 PM | Updated: 07-19-09 09:40 PM