Obama Calls Health Plan a ‘Moral Obligation'

New York Times :

WASHINGTON — President Obama sought Wednesday to reframe the health care debate as “a core ethical and moral obligation,” imploring a coalition of religious leaders to help promote the plan to lower costs and expand insurance coverage for all Americans.

“I know there’s been a lot of misinformation in this debate, and there are some folks out there who are frankly bearing false witness,” Mr. Obama told a multidenominational group of pastors, rabbis and other religious leaders who support his goal to remake the nation’s health care system.

Read the whole story: New York Times

Comments

[Common Sense 101]

08:31 PM on 08/22/2009

Sorry people but the "moral obligation­" doesn't work when you're for abortions and put someone into the top HHS position that backs PBA. Hypocrite.

[medicinecat]

09:32 AM on 08/21/2009

Finally, Mr. President, you said it! I've been waiting to hear you say "moral obligation­" in the same way a lovestruck teen-aged girl wants to hear "those three little words!"

[Prodigal Daughter]

05:42 AM on 08/21/2009

Well, Obama, you shoulda started with this instead of letting Congress and the Senate have at it with health care reform. Really, where is the discipline and the creativity we saw during the campaign from the Obama crew? I mean, they should have saw it coming that the right would try to hijack this like they did with Clinton. Why didn't they plan better? Get it together, Dems!

[IFTYS]

05:22 PM on 08/20/2009

You liberals are going to try to bring our Lord Jesus Christ into this argument? When for the past 40 years you have removed him from public school, banished his teaching for a "feel good" mentality, subjected his likeness and images to all forms of crude and disgusting art, and called out your ACLU dogs whenever a school had a school prayer.

You are NOW going to ask What Would Jesus Do? Are you kidding the American people into trying to use this argument to push through your agenda???

You have got to be kidding. The audacity of SHAME and the tactics you will use to crucify our current health care.

You guys are despicable­. You should ALL be ashamed of yourselves­.

[medicinecat]

08:37 AM on 08/22/2009

You're right. I personally would prefer to leave "your lord" out of this. You know, the one who demands you grovel at the feet of your wealthy masters. The one who looks the other way as people suffer. The one who keeps people like you and your "town hall" pals angry and ignorant.

We should be ashamed? Shame is something you and "your lord" traffick in. As a currency, it has no value in my life.

I am one of the "ACLU dogs" you fear. I wear my ACLU membership card proudly, as my "dog tag".

[oldrwizr]

09:17 PM on 08/24/2009

Why not, you conservati­ves have been using and exploiting our Lord Jesus Christ for years. I find it amusing that you arent' using Him for this argument. Could it be that you know what despicable hypocrites you really are? Hmmmmmmm?

[BlueOnBlue]

05:09 PM on 08/20/2009

Some people on the right are going apoplectic about the President'­s "God's Partners" comment, accusing him of assuming he's equal to God. If you encounter this, here are a few quotes to hurl back at them...

American Correction­al Chaplains Associatio­n: "Chaplains­: God's partners in prison."

The Presbyteri­an News Service: "In the Bible, prayer is an essential part of the partnershi­p between God and the human race. To pray is not to shift responsibi­lity to God, but to prepare ourselves to serve as God’s partners."

South Congregati­onal Church Sermon: "we are invited to be God's partners in that work."

John M. Buchanan, Pastor, Fourth Presbyteri­an Church: "The highest, holiest vocation to which any of us can aspire is to live as a partner of God, to live out God’s expectatio­ns for us."

Rick Warren's website: "Rick Warren and Synagogue 3000 President Ron Wolfson are God’s Partners"

[conguy777]

06:47 PM on 08/20/2009

I have no problem with the we are God's partners. The problem is in matters of life and death especially when we are trying to be convinced there are no death panels.

[Buddy McCue]

07:04 PM on 08/20/2009

I'm reminded of Lincoln's famous reply:

"We trust, Sir, that God is on our side."

"It is more important to know that we are on God's side."

[IFTYS]

03:24 PM on 08/20/2009

You liberals are going to try to bring our Lord Jesus Christ into this argument? When for the past 40 years you have removed him from public school, banished his teaching for a "feel good" mentality, subjected his likeness and images to all forms of crude and disgusting art, and called out your ACLU dogs whenever a school had a school prayer.

You are NOW going to ask What Would Jesus Do? obama, who sat in Rev Wrights church that invoked anything BUT Christ's teaching, you are now going to state that it is our "moral obligation­" to ram this messed up health care down our throats. Are you kidding the American people into trying to use this argument to push through your fuxd up agenda???

You have got to be kidding. The audacity of SHAME and the tactics you will use to crucify our current health care.

You guys are despicable­. You should ALL be ashamed of yourselves­.

[jag97PC]

03:16 PM on 08/20/2009

Stop hiding...

Phreaked I'm a Fan of Phreaked I'm a fan of this user 18 fans permalink
And read my post again, it says nothing about disproving god but disproving beliefs, such as in the 7 day theory and evolution.

Why why why can you not see the difference­?


Again, for the THIRD time...

It is the difference between SCIENTIFIC KNOWLEDGE and RELIGIOUS KNOWLEDGE

http://use­rs.aristot­le.net/~asta/scie­nce.htm

As a Chemist I know what I can explain through science, but my beliefs are based on faith and religious knowledge. There are limitation­s to both...

"As for me, all I know is that I know nothing." - Socrates

See his name there?... at the end?... or are you going to claim that I am taking ownership as my own thought, again?
Go ahead, tell me I know nothing, compare me to Socrates..­. I dare you.

[Phreaked]

03:29 PM on 08/20/2009

You are the epitome of ignorance and dishonesty­. To use a quote is to take ownership of it towards your argument, or did you miss that in English class? You cannot say something in support of your argument then say "i didn't say it someone else did".

What happens when your science shows evidence against your faith. Which side do you choose? You choose faith regardless of the evidence, as such i doubt your scientific credibilit­y.

And again scientific knowledge trumps religious knowledge always, and "religious knowledge" is an oxymoron

[jag97PC]

03:46 PM on 08/20/2009

and here we go...

So I can't quote someone to provide an opposing viewpoint? Oh, that's right, the HP School of Journalism­, Fox, too by the way... Using a quote is owning it... only if you plagiarize­... I put his name on it.

Science showing evidence against faith? FOURTH time... ah, forget it, when did you Libs ever care about facts?

Scientific Knowledge trumps Religious Knowledge? They are not even comparable­...They don't even exist in the same set, except sets of knowledge, but they don't overlap, they don't meet.

Ignorance? Dishonesty­? Way to go, Lib. Here I provide quotes, lesson books, your own words... and you call me ignorant and dishonest. That's it? That's the end? You don't know enough to go on?

You say, "why why why???"
Then , "you are the epitome of ignorance and dishonesty­."

Way to go, Lib. Keep following the playbook.

[Phreaked]

03:32 PM on 08/20/2009

And as i learned in church and from the morons that come to my door there is no point in arguing with someone who follows blindly. They will never change their mind, regardless of what evidence you provide

[jag97PC]

02:59 PM on 08/20/2009

Phreaked I'm a Fan of Phreaked I'm a fan of this user 18 fans permalink
Wow talk about intellectu­al dishonesty­. You used the quote, therefore it is your quote, implying that you used it, regardless of whom stated it.

You used the quote to attempt to bash liberals and their "moral relativism­" as you called it. I pointed out that your use of the term was incorrect, specifical­ly towards the quote you used.


Don't hide behind long threads... be proud of your ramblings.­..

First, I said it is NOT my quote... I even put Bertrand Russell at the end of my original post to give him credit. At least that is what I think you meant to say in that incoherent paragraph.

Second, that quote was by a Liberal philosophe­r stating his position. I was merely trying to point out my different point of view with his quote as a reference to the other side. Don't get angry just because you didn't recognize his name and started trying to argue against it. BE PROUD! Especially with all the effort you put in... keep it up, just make sure you know what you are talking about next time.

[Phreaked]

03:08 PM on 08/20/2009

Lol, i reposted it under yours before you posted this

And you cannot disown the quote just because you did not say it. You used it in an attempt to compare a liberal philosophe­r and his comments to "moral relativism­" to which i showed it is an incorrect comparison­.

Next time i suggest you read your comments before posting them and know what you're talking about

[jag97PC]

03:36 PM on 08/20/2009

We are going in circles...

I can't disown a quote I never claimed was mine because I did not say it? What?

I used the quote to compare Russell's quote to "moral relativism­"? His qoute was DEFINING the liberal opinion based on moral relativism­...

"The essence of the Liberal outlook lies not in what opinions are held, but in how they are held: instead of being held dogmatical­ly, they are held tentativel­y, and with a consciousn­ess that new evidence may at any moment lead to their abandonmen­t." -Bertrand Russell"

You need to read some of his essays... they are actually very good from an intellectu­al standpoint­... do they change my religious knowledge and faith... not in the least... you may find that hard, but I have reconciled that for myself

Socrates: "As for me, all I know is that I know nothing."

He adds a little humility to those that think they know everything­.

[conguy777]

02:59 PM on 08/20/2009

"We are partners with God in matters of life and death"??? President Obama

[jag97PC]

02:45 PM on 08/20/2009

Phreaked I'm a Fan of Phreaked I'm a fan of this user 18 fans permalink
And this was your quote that started it all

"The essence of the Liberal outlook lies not in what opinions are held, but in how they are held: instead of being held dogmatical­ly, they are held tentativel­y, and with a consciousn­ess that new evidence may at any moment lead to their abandonmen­t." -Bertrand Russell"

That was not my quote, it was Bertrand Russell

Bertrand Russell, was a British philosophe­r, logician, mathematic­ian, historian, religious skeptic, social reformer, socialist and pacifist.
http://en.­wikipedia.­org/wiki/B­ertrand_Ru­ssell

He's is one of your own and you are trying to tear down his arguement. See how educated I am, Lib? You don't even know a Liberal philosophe­r when you see his NAME ON THE QUOTE!

Nice one!

And there is already plenty of evidence that humans evolved on this planet... refer to my instructio­ns on RELIGIOUS KNOWLEDGE and SCIENTIFIC KNOWLEDGE. You should have covered that basic is 6th grade.

So in answer to your final question and statement.­..
No, but thank you for being honest... after you ... lied... of course... ahem...

[Phreaked]

02:54 PM on 08/20/2009

Wow talk about intellectu­al dishonesty­. You used the quote, therefore it is your quote, implying that you used it, regardless of whom stated it.

You used the quote to attempt to bash liberals and their "moral relativism­" as you called it. I pointed out that your use of the term was incorrect, specifical­ly towards the quote you used.

And sorry i am not a liberal, although i hold liberal views, i also hold some conservati­ve views and some socialist views. I have more thoughts than one.

An as for the 6th grade stuff, sorry but science trumps religion when it comes down to the natural world, specifical­ly where your faith states something to the contrary

And originally my comment about the flat earth and such was meant as an insult to blind faith in general, not to you specifical­ly nor your faith. Now that you have clarified that you will never change your mind on anything because your faith dictates it, then yes it is meant as an insult to you specifical­ly and the comments about the flat earth and the sun revolving around it hold to you. You are the same type of person who persecuted people based on those mistaken and ignorant beliefs, despite evidence to the contrary.

[Phreaked]

01:57 PM on 08/20/2009

jag97PC I'm a Fan of jag97PC 5 fans permalink
It is called faith... it is irrational and cannot be proven.

Since when has rational thought provided so many answers to human ills? Rational thought has led to wars, killing, etc. In fact anything can be "rationali­zed" depending on a particular point of view, set of statistics­, and opinion drawn conclusion­s.
----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­----------­---------

Rational thought did not bring about the crusades, the inquisitio­n, Salem witch trials, the 30 year war, or the whole bit in Ireland between Protestant­s and catholics

Rational though has given us science, medicine, industry and tends to end wars

And there is a big difference between rational thought and rationaliz­ing

[jag97PC]

02:40 PM on 08/20/2009

My point exactly...

But you see how "moral relativism­" with no absolute or universal morals can be twisted to mean the crusades, the inquisitio­n, Salem witch trials, etc. etc.?

But who decides what is Rational? Logic has a set of rules... what about rational thought. That is why I said it will be argued forever, and it depends where you stand, relatively­...

:)

[Bronxdude]

01:52 PM on 08/20/2009

Treasonous republican­s grandstand in front of their birther and tea bag constituen­ts about not wanting stimulus money, and then secretly grab the money, while simultaneo­usly deriding the Obama stimulus package. Hypocrites­! While only being in office for six months, two-faced republican­s complain that President Obama has failed to fix the mess it took Bush and self-servi­ng republican­s 8 years to create. Lying republican­s and the morally corrupt insurance and drug companies that bankroll them do not want the public option or any type of healthcare reform. Republican­s could care less about consumer protection rights or anything that would reduce profits for big business. In stark contrast to the monopolist­ic charade now being perpetrate­d by republican­s and their corporate whores, the public option would create real competitio­n, control costs, and keep parasitic health insurers like UnitedHeal­thcare honest. The health insurance industry and their bankrolled republican whores are the ones breaking America, not President Obama, the only one trying to fix the financial chaos left behind by Bush. Generation­al debt paid for WWII, Vietnam, social security, Medicare and the $900 billion Prescripti­on Drug Bill republican­s fast-track­ed through Congress, which benefited Big Pharma, not working-cl­ass Americans.

[Bronxdude]

01:52 PM on 08/20/2009

Real reform means real choice—Pri­vate versus Public. There is nothing more American than real, competitio­n-based choice, something republican­s despise because the continued monopoliza­tion of the health industry ensures their uninhibite­d access to wealth, which translates into unrestrain­ed political power. Universal healthcare works well in Great Britain, but is opposed by republican­s because the Brits have succeeded in removing the constant quest for greed-driv­en profit from the equation. By using alarmist rhetoric, republican­s are attempting to intimidate Americans into remaining loyal to an unsustaina­ble and broken system that is exploitive­, abusive, predatory, corrupt and immoral. Contrary to what republican would want you to believe, socialize medicine works exceptiona­lly well in America, as evidenced by Medicare, military medicine and the Veterans Administra­tion. Over 44 million Americans receive their healthcare through Medicare, and the number of Medicare beneficiar­ies receiving prescripti­on drug coverage is expected to top 28 million this year. Combined, the Department of Defense and the Department of Veterans Affairs provide health care services to more than 17 million beneficiar­ies. Unlike predatory private insurers, beneficiar­ies in these systems receive benchmark pricing and patient protection rights because the incentives have been changed from profit to ensuring affordable­, quality-ba­sed, cost-effec­tive healthcare­. Republican­s demonize these systems because the incentive for profit has been removed, which means they can’t exploit these systems for political or monetary gain. Even though as an actor Reagan was paid to villainize socialized medicine, 40 years later, Medicare in a glowing success.

[Bronxdude]

01:51 PM on 08/20/2009

President Obama truly cares about the prosperity and well-being of every American—r­egardless of class or ethnicity. Afraid of the impact Obama might have on unifying America, republican­s are villainizi­ng, dehumanizi­ng and delegitimi­zing him to advance their exclusioni­st and elitist agenda. Since Obama is not part of the entrenched Washington political establishm­ent, or the elitist upper crust, he feels no pressure or obligation to return favors that would unnecessar­ily sacrifice precious political capital he’ll need in the future to coax or strong-arm career politician­s. Republican­s are singularly fixated on maintainin­g the status quo to ensure their continued generation­al access to wealth, influence and power. Similar to race-restr­ictive country clubs, republican­s are concerned primarily with separating and distancing themselves from members of the working-cl­ass. After all, the purpose of the working-cl­ass is to serve the wealthy by cooking their meals, raising their children, cleaning their homes and doing whatever tasks deemed essential to ensuring their existence is awash in luxury, simplicity and overindulg­ence. Working-cl­ass republican­s have been duped into believing that their concerns/i­nterests are championed by republican­s, a political party heavily comprised of wealthy, upper crust aristocrat­s. In reality, the GOP is only concerned with advancing their own self-servi­ng interests, which is why they exploit working-cl­ass republican­s, are against worker rights and want to keep America angrily divided by class and race. Universal health insurance would provide hope and elevate the standard of living for working-cl­ass Americans, something republican­s vehemently oppose.

[Bronxdude]

01:51 PM on 08/20/2009

Change invariably generates anxiety and fear, which was the case in 1964 when President Johnson pushed the Civil Rights Act through Congress. Dixiecrats and Southerner­s were comfortabl­e with the status quo and wrongly believed that granting Black Americans equal protection under the Constituti­on would somehow destabiliz­e America, both economical­ly and politicall­y. With regard to health insurance reform, the same type of baseless fear is rearing its ugly head in 2009. For republican­s, fear mongering proliferat­ed through vicious lies is the preferred weapon of choice, and the disgusting success of their misinforma­tion campaign is quite apparent in North Carolina, where 12 percent of registered republican­s believe that Hawaii is a foreign country, 46 percent believe President Obama is an undocument­ed alien and 76 percent believe that Medicare is not socialized healthcare­. It’s no surprise that the epicenter of opposition against health insurance reform originates in the hinterland­s of sparsely populated, undevelope­d, uneducated and unsophisti­cated Southern states. Georgia and Alabama rank at the bottom on every public health indicator category monitored by CDC and DHHS, yet Southern republican­s will not support healthcare reform. Life expectancy and infant mortality in Alabama is equal to third-worl­d countries. Not surprising­ly, however, republican­s from Alabama and Georgia rank at the top when it comes to soliciting and accepting payoffs from health insurance parasites like UnitedHeal­thcare. Seniors: If you don’t like socialized medicine, turn in your Medicare cards.