Senate Votes To Allow Guns On Amtrak

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ANDREW TAYLOR | 09/16/09 06:30 PM | AP

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WASHINGTON — The Senate voted Wednesday to permit passengers on the Amtrak passenger railroad to transport handguns in their checked baggage.

The proposal, approved by a 68-30 vote, seeks to give Amtrak riders rights comparable to those enjoyed by airline passengers, who are permitted to transport firearms provided that they declare they are doing so and that the arms are unloaded and in a securely locked container.

"Americans should not have their Second Amendment rights restricted for any reason, particularly if they choose to travel on America's federally subsidized rail line," said Sen. Roger Wicker, R-Miss., who made the proposal.

Wicker's amendment would deny the railroad its $1.6 billion taxpayer subsidy unless it changes the gun policy.

Current Amtrak policy, put in place after the bombings of passenger trains in Madrid five years ago, prohibits weapons, including firearms, from being carried on its trains.

Prior to the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, Amtrak permitted firearms to be carried on its trains so long as they were separately secured in locked baggage or carrying cases. But it added restrictions on carrying weapons after 9/11 and imposed a total ban on all weapons after the Madrid bombings.

Wednesday's vote was the latest in a string of victories for gun rights activists in the Senate despite Democrats' sizable majority. Some 27 Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada, voted for the amendment, many from Western or Southern states. Independent Bernie Sanders of Vermont, who aligns with Democrats and is one of the chamber's most liberal members, also voted on the pro-gun rights side.

"Law-abiding people who choose to travel by rail should be able to carry their firearms as they would on an airplane – in checked baggage," National Rifle Association spokesman Andrew Arulanandam said.

Opponents of changing the policy back, such as Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., say it would be too costly and burdensome to return to the old policy. Durbin said that "Amtrak doesn't have the security infrastructure, the processes or the trained personnel in place to ensure that checked firearms would not be lost, damaged, stolen or misused."

The chief author of the underlying transportation appropriations bill, Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., said implementing the policy would be too costly.

"Amtrak would have six months to build a process for checking and tracking firearms. It would have to find the manpower necessary to screen and guard firearms and it would have to purchase the equipment necessary," Murray said. "If they do not comply, Amtrak will shut down."

Paul Helmke, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, said he "doesn't have problems with people transporting guns on trains so long as steps are taken to make sure they're secured and properly stowed."

He added that some senators are eager to get back in good stead with the National Rifle Association after crossing the group by voting to confirm Sonia Sotomayor to the Supreme Court and to defeat a proposal to permit people with concealed weapons permits to carry hidden guns outside their home states.

The legislation still must be reconciled with a House-passed measure than does not contain the gun rights provision.

WASHINGTON — The Senate voted Wednesday to permit passengers on the Amtrak passenger railroad to transport handguns in their checked baggage. The proposal, approved by a 68-30 vote, seeks to gi...
WASHINGTON — The Senate voted Wednesday to permit passengers on the Amtrak passenger railroad to transport handguns in their checked baggage. The proposal, approved by a 68-30 vote, seeks to gi...
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- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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Hmmm.... It sure got quiet in here.... Maybe people have started to actually read the proposed law or the article.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:00 PM on 09/18/2009
- raker I'm a Fan of raker 78 fans permalink

The idea to allow guns on Amtrak must have been promoted by the airline industry. What better way to shore up business than to make taking the train even less safe than flying.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:27 AM on 09/18/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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How is this going to make trains less safe than flying?

BTW, firearms were allowed to be checked in on Amtrak until around 2004/2005.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 10:19 AM on 09/18/2009

Carrying guns on the Amtrak will just cause more chaos, like if theres not enough trouble in the world already. People are going to be more defensive and alert. Instead of helping us in some way, it will harm us.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:04 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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No one will be carrying firearms.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:48 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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I have posted the actual text of the proposed law twice now, but it seems to be stuck in the moderation queue.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:18 PM on 09/17/2009
- mike102 I'm a Fan of mike102 14 fans permalink

They won't read it, just as they haven't read the article. If they did, they'd have nothing to whine like little girls about.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:47 AM on 09/19/2009

For those who are worried about allowing unloaded guns in checked luggage, you may be interested to know that the Virginia Railway Express (affiliated with Amtrak) allows people to carry loaded guns on their person. Yet, there have been no reports of shootings on the VRE.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:54 PM on 09/17/2009
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8 Pages of comments? Why?

This is a non issue. Paul Helmke, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, said he "doesn't have problems with people transporting guns on trains so long as steps are taken to make sure they're secured and properly stowed."

When the NRA AND Brady can agree on something concerning guns, there is little reason for anyone else to argue about it.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:33 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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"8 Pages of comments? Why?"

Hoplophobic selective illiteracy.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:58 PM on 09/17/2009
- dfranz I'm a Fan of dfranz 76 fans permalink
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Why stop there NRA? I think they should be able to carry side arms on board just like they did in the wild west. And by all means deny them subsidy because gun rights for gun owners trumps the public good as a whole.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:21 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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How is the public good threatened by unloaded firearms in locked hard-sided cases and being transported in a separate baggage car?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:36 PM on 09/17/2009
- SvrWx I'm a Fan of SvrWx 10 fans permalink
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It isn't, but knee jerk reactions are always more fun.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:53 PM on 09/17/2009
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My neighbor was just complaining this a.m. about the price of ammo going up down here in S.C. Of course he said it is because of Obama. I would not know about such things, I hate guns. And of course, he blames Obama for it.

Hey, by the way, they have announced on local S.C. news that Joe Wilson's website has crashed, too much traffic. Yipppeee Hope it was the right kind of traffic, not congrat messages.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:01 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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Obama did have more gun control as a campaign platform.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:10 PM on 09/17/2009
- SvrWx I'm a Fan of SvrWx 10 fans permalink
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Ya'll realize that this has nothing to do with open or conceal and carry on-board Amtrak? This is to take the weapons (rifles, etc) to a new location? So, if I wanted to go hunting in Montana and wanted to travel from Maryland and take Amtrak, I can finally do it!! Good for The Senate and Amtrak!!

The airlines let people check weapons for travel aka hunters. I don't understand why Amtrak was any different. At least they are back in the real world with some sensible rules.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:59 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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Many posters here have mental vapor lock as soon as they read the word "gun".

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:04 PM on 09/17/2009
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Odin wrote: "Many posters here have mental vapor lock as soon as they read the word "gun".

Agreed, LOL.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:42 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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Here is what the bill actually says:

(1) if an Amtrak station accepts CHECKED baggage for a specific Amtrak route, Amtrak passengers holding a ticket for such route are allowed to place an UNLOADED firearm or starter pistol in a CHECKED bag on such route IF--

(A) before checking the bag or boarding the train, the passenger declares to Amtrak, either orally or in writing, that the firearm is in his or her bag and is unloaded;

(B) the firearm is carried in a hard-sided container;

(C) such container is locked; and

(D) only the passenger has the key or combination for such container

Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/16/senate-amtrak-gun-law-us_n_288764.html

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:50 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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Well, at least one made it through

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:08 PM on 09/17/2009
- MeinNH I'm a Fan of MeinNH 10 fans permalink
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Senate Votes To Allow Guns On Amtrak
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ANDREW TAYLOR | 09/16/09 06:30 PM | AP
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Read More: Amtrak, Dick Durbin, Patty Murray, Roger Wicker, Second Amendment, Senate Vote, Politics News
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WASHINGTON — The Senate voted Wednesday to permit passengers on the Amtrak passenger railroad to transport handguns in their checked baggage.**­**********­**********­*********

"Americans should not have their Second Amendment rights restricted for any reason, particularly if they choose to travel on America's federally subsidized rail line," said Sen. Roger Wicker, R-Miss., who made the proposal.

Are you seriously kidding me? You can't take toothpaste on a plane but a gun on a train is A-Ok? What about the Americans who have a right to travel safely? How about Americans who don't want guns on a train? Who are these people and why on this green earth are we letting them get away with this crap????

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:29 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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"Are you seriously kidding me? You can't take toothpaste on a plane but a gun on a train is A-Ok? "

Please, read the proposed law.

It affects CHECKED baggage only, the same place your toothpaste is on planes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 02:48 PM on 09/17/2009
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"He added that some senators are eager to get back in good stead with the National Rifle Association after crossing the group by voting to confirm Sonia Sotomayor to the Supreme Court and to defeat a proposal to permit people with concealed weapons permits to carry hidden guns outside their home states."

Oh great! Let's make sure they get in "good" with the NRA and to hell with the people riding Amtrak who want a safe haven from violence! As long as the corporation can get their wants fulfilled, and these Senators can fill their coffers with NRA contributions, we will never be the country our founding fathers envisioned.

Our country is headed for absolute disaster!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:38 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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How is allowing unloaded firearms packed in locked, hard-sided cases in separate baggage cars going to make anyone less safe?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:27 AM on 09/19/2009
- Ramus I'm a Fan of Ramus 27 fans permalink

There's checked luggage on trains? Who knew? Unfortunately the guns , um, war is a lost cause. Americans love their guns. It is not worth the battle just now.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:11 PM on 09/17/2009
- Rojellio I'm a Fan of Rojellio 2 fans permalink

All in favor of 'Gun Control' raise your right hand!!!!!!!!!!

You seriously need to visit www.jpfo.org and get the facts about 'Gun Control'..­.....with the level of hatred & bigotry that exists on the far left, gun control would be a very bad thing to add to the classic recipe for genocide. Hatred + Government + Gun Control = Genocide. FACT.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:27 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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"Guidelines for Checked Baggage

Amtrak offers checked baggage service at many stations and on many trains and Amtrak Thruway motorcoaches throughout the country. Not all trains and stations offer checked baggage services." - Source : http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Amtrak/am2Copy/Title_Image_Copy_Page&c=am2Copy&cid=1080080553878&ssid=43

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:55 PM on 09/17/2009
- kimbutgar I'm a Fan of kimbutgar 7 fans permalink

So now I won't be going to Arizona, Texas or Florida anymore because one can carry firearms in public and go to bars with guns. I won't be going to National Parks because some crazy might accidentally shoot me and now I won't be taking a Amtrak train because some crazy can carry a gun on them. These gun laws are insane and out of control. Ironically I'm more afraid of the gun nuts in the US than the terrorists from the Middle East. (which I have never been afraid of)

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:01 PM on 09/17/2009
- mike102 I'm a Fan of mike102 14 fans permalink

"So now I won't be going to Arizona, Texas or Florida anymore because one can carry firearms in public"

People can carry guns in public in 48 states. So, you better plan on spending your whole life in Wisconsin or Illinois.

"I won't be going to National Parks because some crazy might accidentally shoot me"

Doubtful. But, two women were found beheaded in Yosemite a couple of years ago. Yosemite was a 'gun free zone' at the time.

"and now I won't be taking a Amtrak train because some crazy can carry a gun on them."

No, they can't.

Did any of you people even read the first paragraph of the article? MeinNH cut and pasted it, but apparently didn't read it either!

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:31 AM on 09/19/2009
- mike102 I'm a Fan of mike102 14 fans permalink

"Ironically I'm more afraid of the gun nuts in the US than the terrorists from the Middle East. (which I have never been afraid of)"

Sure. That makes sense. It was 'gun nuts' who destroyed the World Trade Center.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:34 AM on 09/19/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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48 states allow concealed carry.

More than 30 states allow open carry.

At least 19 states allow concealed carry in establishments which serve alcohol.

Firearms have been allowed in other national lands and in state parks for decades with very few problems.

No one will be carrying on Amtrak. This is about firearms in CHECKED baggage, just like with airplanes.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:49 AM on 09/19/2009
- fya I'm a Fan of fya 19 fans permalink

WTF?

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:57 PM on 09/17/2009
- OdinsEye I'm a Fan of OdinsEye 66 fans permalink
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How to check in firearms on airplanes:

http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/assistant/editorial_1666.shtm

These are the same rules that they want to use for trains.

    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:10 PM on 09/17/2009
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