Turkey: Rising Islamist Movements Challenge Secularism (VIDEO)

Almost all of 77 million people in Turkey are Muslim, but signs of Islamic faith are noticeably divorced from everyday life. But a growing number of Turks are joining conservative movements that believe religion should play a greater role in the country's ethical and moral values. Secular critics brand these religious groups as fundamentalist.

Correspondent Gizem Yarbil and producer Bryan Myers report on how traditional religion and modern democracy are trying to coexist in Turkey today.

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Comments

[popart]

good ole' "old time religion". you gotta give people what they want....good or bad...smart or dumb....then let them stew in it....just too bad you cant move them all to another planet somewhere far away.

[Albert Amato]

There is nothing inherently wrong with religion.....just extremists without tolerance for others.
Muslims in Turkey have been tolerant of Jews there after they were expelled from Spain in 1492.
People are both good and bad in all walks of life and within all religions.
An atheist can be good or bad as well if tolerant, open and living by the rule of law.

[ampersand59]

Sounds like they are taking a chapter from the Republican Party's Religious Right playbook. The religious right denounces theocracy everywhere-- except in America.

[lightningbolt]

This is Islamic imperialism in action.

[MarcusT]

"This" ??

[lightningbolt]

Have you read the article, or did you just skip to the comments section?

[MosheDayanHero]

"Islam is in its origins an Arab religion. Everyone not an Arab who is a Muslim is a convert. Islam is not simply a matter of conscience or private belief. It makes imperial demands. A convert's worldview alters. His holy places are in Arab lands; his sacred language is Arabic. His idea of history alters. He rejects his own; he becomes, whether he likes it or not, a part of the Arab story...
The disturbance for societies is immense, and even after a thousand years can remain unresolved; the turning away has to be done again and again. People develop fantasies about who and what they are; and in the Islam of the converted countries there is an element of neurosis and nihilism. These countries can be easily set on the boil."

Sir V.S Naipaul, Nobel Prize winner

http://www.indianexpress.com/oldStory/83734/

[MarcusT]

About 20% of Muslims live in Arab countries, 30% in the Indian subcontinent and 15.6% in Indonesia, the largest Muslim country by population. Approximately 50 of countries are Muslim-majority. Around 62% of the world's Muslims live in Asia, with over 683 million adherents in Bangladesh, India, Indonesia, and Pakistan. According to U.S. government figures, in 2006 there were 20 million Muslims in China. In the Middle East, the non-Arab countries of Turkey and Iran are the largest Muslim-majority countries; in Africa, Egypt and Nigeria have the most populous Muslim communities

[MosheDayanHero]

ALL the countries mentioned above are disrupted by isalmcisit neo-Jihadist sentiment. ALL of the countries above have a problem with Militant islamic intolerance. ALL...
Read history.

[Naville]

It is not surprising to many of us, that you, as an Israeli, quote a casteist, hindutva supporter.

Mr. Naipaul has publicly boasted of his Brahmin high caste Hindu heritage, and how it is acceptable to have a society with caste system- basically, an apartheid society ( Guest! what country that reminds you of ).

Mr. Naipaul has No credibility whatsoever in denouncing anybody while he is proud of supporting the segregation of certain people and the social inequality of the "untouchables" ; maybe you share your views with him.

Another reason you quote this guy is, Hindu nationalist's support for the Israeli occupation of Palestine.

as for the contents of the quote; it is biased, spiteful and false impression.

If we follow his logic , we could conclude that Christianity is a Jewish religion and every christian is a convert.
Islam is not an Arab religion or origin, but a continuation of abrahamic religions before it.

[MosheDayanHero]

You know nothing about Sir Naipaul, obviously. He is not Indian.
He’s from Trinidad—A West Indian. No connection whatsoever with Indian politics. Become acquainted with basic facts before spinning these webs of misinformed piffle.

[arvay]

This is like characterizing Roman Catholicism as an arm of the Roman Imperium, overlooking the evolution that has taken place over the centuries and ignoring the impact of converted people.

And, unlike Judaism, both Islam and Christianity are universalist religions, which is a step beyond Judaism's narrow and relatively primitive tribal nature. All religion is nonsense, but some delusions are less harmful than others.

And Naipaul is a shameless racist, as others on this thread have noted.

[lightningbolt]

Roman Catholicism IS a continuation of the Roman Empire. Have you not noticed the church's violent and imperialistic behavior right after the Roman Empire collapsed? You are also wrong about Christianity and Islam. Both of those religions are dogmatic and designed for one thing: imperialism and control. Judaism, on the other hand, is not dogmatic. In fact, Jews are required to question and argue about everything, including the Torah. Your comment clearly shows how little you know about history and religion.

[Albert Amato]

In what universe do you reside Arvay? Bizzaro land?

[MosheDayanHero]

“some delusions are less harmful than others.”
Agreed. It is beyond dispute that Sharia is the most regressive legal delusion in the world today. Bar none.

[MosheDayanHero]

“some delusions are less harmful than others.”
Agreed.
Q.ur'a.n 5:33 "The punishment for those who wage war against Al.l.ah and His Messenger and who do mischief in the land is only that they shall be ki.l.l.ed or cr.uc.iff.ied, or their hands and their feet shall be c.ut off on opposite sides, or they shall be exiled. “
There are millions of your Akbarists who believe in literal interpretation of this statement. Proof—pick up any newspaper and you will find DIRECT manifestation of this delusion acted out all over the world.

[Horst]

Of course Islam is an Arab religion...its prophet was an Arab and its holy book written in Arabic. This makes it all the more fascinating why so many non-Arabs are attracted to it.

[lightningbolt]

Those non-Arabs who converted to Islam were forced to convert. Nobody in their right mind would be attracted to such a ridiculous ideology.

[MosheDayanHero]

Many were converted on the point of the sword. Now the main attraction is for people who glorify in their ownvictimhood and weakness

[SFA]

Does any one realis what Secularism in Turkey did.......................

It wiped away all othere minority cultures.....Like Kurds............Turkey was nation of different cultures......
It copied French.......which only has one culture one rase one society & tried to a make a Muliticularl Turkey in to Mono Cultural..........I am talking about Language..way of living etc.


any reading of Turkish history from 1930's will tell you this.

[MarcusT]

ANKARA, Jan , 2009: Turkey on Thursday launched its first 24-hour Kurdish-language television station while its prime minister uttered a few words in the once-banned tongue, in a marked shift of policy toward the country’s minority Kurds.

RTÜK to extend broadcasting time of private stations in Kurdish
The Radio and Television Supreme Council (RTÜK) is planning to extend the period of time private television and radio stations are allowed to broadcast in Kurdish in a step to support government efforts to meet a demand long sought by the country's Kurdish population.

Yusuf Ziya Ozcan, who heads the country’s higher education board, told reporters following an eight-hour meeting that an institute to teach “Living Languages in Turkey” would be opened at Mardin Artuklu University, in southern Turkey. The institute would teach Kurdish and other regional languages, including Persian, Arabic and Syriac – a language similar to the Aramaic once spoken by Jesus Christ.

TURKEY: KURDISH POLITICAL PARTY SEEKS TO BE MORE COMPETITIVE IN MARCH LOCAL ELECTIONS
Yigal Schleifer 1/14/09

With a stylish headscarf wrapped tightly around her face, Muslise Akgul may not fit the typical profile of a leader in the pro-Kurdish Democratic Society Party (DTP). With its Marxist roots, the DTP has long been viewed as a deeply secular party.

[SFA]

It's because of AKP a democratic Islamic party.....Turkish Secularism destroyed Kurds & other minority culture.

[MarcusT]

Although Kurds form the largest minority they do share the same religion as the Turkish majority which is Islam.

[SFA]

Yes, it the Secularism of France which Turkey adopted which led to the which lead to the atrocities on Kurds & other minorities.

[sysmgr1345]

Okay Turkey, just spit on your founder and get it over with. Open up marriage for 9 year olds, lash your women, and export violence and be-heading.

[MarcusT]

Some perspective for both of you who are interested:

http://dailyatheist.blogspot.com/2009/02/most-and-least-religious-countries-in.html

[Horst]

Cultural relativism is not the issue. Most of the world is sick of Islamic terrorism and its tiresome apologists. The rise of Islamist parties in Turkey certainly is viewed as a retrograde step. Turkey has no chance of joining the EU in part because no one except Turkey recognizes your country the pretentiously named Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus. Stupid legal actions against Orhan Pamuk don't help, nor did the idiotic resistance to appointing the Dane Anders Rasmussen to head NATO (those terrible Mohammed cartoons, you know).

[MarcusT]

Quite an overnight evolution: From an expert tourist (good beer-YO!) to them damn Islamic terrorists in 12 hours.

[TXfemmom]

Any move toward Islam being incorporated into the public or government will doom Turkey's entrance into the EU, and rightfully so.

[blutigeroo]

Yes, whilst no EU member nation will openly admit that the EU is a Christians-only club, the truth is that religion plays big role in Europe's rejection of Turkey. Oh well, the loss is the EU's, Turkey is better off without them.
But Europe will continue to play the accession card with Turkey to get what it wants. The question is how long the Turkish government and the Turkish people will continue to play.
America will also continue to play the accession card with Turkey by dangling the EU membership carrot in front of them to influence Turkey's power in NATO.

[MarcusT]

There are religious/cultural issues but they are simply being exploited by politicians to pander to their base-Germany, France. The biggest issue is size, population. Turkey would be the biggest country in the EU-more reps. more power.

[raaf]

Worldfocus, I saw one of their reports on Israel, it was all positive, almost like it was made by the Israeli department of tourism.

[MajorKong]

It's not well publicized, but Turkey is a military ally of Israel. They both figure they're living in a tough neighborhood.

[MarcusT]

This just must be the reason Turkey canceled those military exercises with Israel-Going Islamic.

[MadridFrank]

This will result in the de facto end to Turkey's E.U. ambitions!

[junaidnoori]

What complete & utter drivel. When Muslims demand rights in their OWN country, western media ring sirens and alerm bells about an impending takeover by "radical Islamic zealots." This is a challenge to a militiary dictatorship that forbids women from wearing the obligatory hijab on school campuses and government office buildings. The only genuine concern is that the people of Turkey are being subdued in reclaiming their voice the same way the people of Afghanistan, Palestine and Iraq.

But I guess you can just bomb them and it'll all be over. Right?

[NeoConsAreFinished]

No this is about religious fanaticism period. Any religious cult involved in government is against the basic tenets of freedom.

[SFA]

Do not interfere in other countries business.

[MarcusT]

Like Dobson?

[junaidnoori]

You're so stupid, it's not even funny.

[blutigeroo]

Personally, I have a problem with using words like "fanatacism" and "extremism". It's as if one is trying to justify "fanatical"/"extremist" behaivour by labelling them a part of a religion. Since these words are usually used to describe Muslims, they are actually quite insulting as they give Islam attributes that it does not posses. There are Muslims that practice Islam and then there are people who mould Islam to suit their own ulterior motives.

The use of these propaganda-esque words is to blame for much of the knee-jerk fear and Islamophobia that the West wrangles with.

But that is jut my opinion and, from the conversations I have had with Muslims about this topic, it seems that the majority agree with me.

[bismillah001]

I also agree :)

[NeoConsAreFinished]

I use the word fanaticism to describe the American Taliban aka the Repube Party.

[OldSchoolLiberal]

"obligitory"? Says who. If not the woman herself than no way. That is the problem.

[darthmaul]

I like your sentence. "forbids women from wearing the obligatory hijab on school campuses and government office buildings." Perhaps I don't understand, but it took a constitutional amendment in 2008 to allow women to wear the hijab at universities. The fact that you have used the word "obligatory" is what the secular Turk's fear. In short that it will not be the freedom to wear the hijab, but will become a requirement or as you put it "obligatory."

[mommamia526]

Well, I can understand that Islamist become alarmed by secularists. It is only normal. Just as christians and others in the West become alarmed by the increasing influence and demands for sharia law by Islamists there. However, faith is a personal journey; it is not a government issue, nor is it a matter of one person to force on another. Individuals can pray over it. They can vote for leadership which represent their opinions. To demonstrate, force, argue, and twist another's arms to make the other person follow your rules and beliefs, however, is ill advised. In Western nations we have separation of government and faith, for the most part, and we strive to respects others' beliefs and cultures.

[MajorKong]

I've always wondered why so many people seem to require validation of the faith from the government.

[dogman44]

I don't think it as much validation they seek as it is seeking to impose
their will on the political and legal systems.

[Nicholas Roy]

Perhaps Turkey sees how every Islamic country in the world as been plagued with atleast some kind of instability or authoritarianism and uses secularism to safe gaurd their society fromthe same problems.

[SFA]

Why nobody is ask what is the source of this video, and why now????

Washington Institute for Near East Policy........

1. Obama Taps Neocons to Run Middle East Policy
http://www.infowars.com/obama-taps-neocons-to-run-middle-east-policy/

2. Neocon Middle East Policy: The "Clean Break" Plan Damage Assessment (Paperback)(Amazon)
http://www.amazon.com/Neocon-Middle-East-Policy-Assessment/dp/0976443732

[Naville]

Under the microscope of Turkey's military-guided secular system, American democracy is very religious and therefore, semi-theocracy.

The only way you could describe Turkey's secular constitution is "Secular Dictatorship" , in other words, Turkey's citizens have no right or authority to democratically choose what they want ( remember, democracy is, "by the people, for the people, of the people").

If the Turkey's secularism is implemented in the U.S, all the right-wing and religious figures and their allied politicians in Washington would break the constitution for their open religious advocacy in governance, and will be a candidate for criminal charges.in addition, the pentagon would, from time to time overthrow the government and pure secular who has their blessing.

The key point in here is, Can citizens choose what or who they want, even if it means amending the constitution in order to conform their aspirations?

if agree with that, then turkey's military use to govern undermines democracy and therefore is Dictatorship.

if you do not agree with that point, then your view of democracy is not in accord with, by the people for the people and so on and on..

[SFA]

Fanned..........Keep up the work.

I was fighting a lonely battle on this page.Great to have someone who supports you.

[MarcusT]

For how many years in American democracy would the overwhelming majority have voted to deport all non-white persons?

[Naville]

I see the point you are making, in which a majority who are nuts or racists by vote dictate and infringe the rights of minorities. And that is the "flaw" of democracy.

But, I presume from your unwritten-down intuition that a combination of dictatorship and democracy is necessary for the welfare of humanity. Is that it ?

[GZLives]

"f the Turkey's secularism is implemented in the U.S, all the right-wing and religious figures and their allied politicians in Washington would break the constitution for their open religious advocacy in governance, and will be a candidate for criminal charges.in addition, the pentagon would, from time to time overthrow the government and pure secular who has their blessing."

Nonsense ...
Your point is refuted by the election of Obama
Our religious extreme may be loud and may be influential but they can't "break" our Constitution and our military isn't about to overthrow our government.
That notion is just completely silly ...

[Naville]

It seems you don't get my point , re-read my comment.

And for your knowledge read about what Laïcité means in different countries.

[MajorKong]

Keep in mind that the last time there was a theocratic Turkey, there were some - ahem - problems.

[Naville]

"Keep in mind that the last time there was a theocratic Turkey, there were some - ahem - problems"

Yes, there have, and they were not democratically elected.
The question, will a democratically elected theocracy acceptable, if they allow fair elections, and would step down if lost in an election?

[MarcusT]

When was that, prey tell. :))

[UncleJimbo]

Here's the Difference: Republicans view Islamist Movements=Bad.....Chr!st!an Fund@mentalist Movements=Good! Progressives and most Democrats view BOTH=Bad! Get It? Got It? Good!