AMA Faces Revolt After Humiliating Senate Defeat

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JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS | 10/28/09 12:27 PM | AP

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WASHINGTON — Does the AMA matter in the health care debate? Congress is beginning to have its doubts, despite the medical association's deep pockets and platoons of lobbyists.

It's lost its principles, some lawmakers and physicians say. Perhaps more damaging: It can't produce votes.

After a humiliating defeat in the Senate, the venerable American Medical Association faces a revolt from both its member doctors and one-time political allies as it struggles to influence an overhaul of the nation's health system.

The group had pinned its hopes on winning a $247 billion, 10-year reprieve from scheduled reimbursement cuts for physicians who treat Medicare patients in return for supporting the White House push for broader changes in health care coverage. When the pay boost was sidetracked last week in the Senate, it undercut the doctors' leverage – just as final negotiations on the broader health bill intensify.

"I can't think of a more ineffective organization when it comes to dealing with Congress," said Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, who has tangled with the group in the past. "The lesson I've learned ... is if you agree to fix their compensation, they will basically get in the tank with their natural adversaries."

Democrats aren't as harsh, and they still fear alienating the doctors lobby. But Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid strongly suggested the group had failed to deliver on a pledge of lining up enough votes to pass its high-priority pay rate legislation. "I had been told" they had several Republican votes, he said – votes that didn't materialize.

The AMA's president-elect, Dr. Cecil Wilson, said the group had made no such promises but merely pointed out that many GOP senators had backed similar legislation in the past. The setback followed the AMA's airing of what it said was $1 million worth of television ads in targeted states, designed to bolster support for the bill. It failed because of bipartisan concerns that it would raise federal deficits.

Wilson defended his group's lobbying strategy, saying it has done what's best for doctors and patients and fought successfully to keep its seat at the table during sensitive negotiations with President Barack Obama's team and key Democrats on the final health overhaul.

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"We deliberately chose a strategy which said the best way to get health system reform in this country was for us to provide constructive leadership, to work with the people who were writing the legislation as well as the Obama administration," said Wilson, who stressed that the AMA hasn't decided yet whether to back the final health measure.

In the process, though, some doctors say the group has been willing to sacrifice what many of them consider crucial priorities: placing new restrictions on medical malpractice lawsuits and fighting any proposal that hands the government more control over how doctors practice and earn money. The AMA irked many members by deciding earlier this year to endorse a $1 trillion-plus plan by House Democrats that contained the pay raise but no malpractice limits and included the so-called public option for government-run insurance.

"The AMA is not as strong as they think they are – that's the bottom line," said Bob Feldtman, a cardiovascular surgeon in Dallas. He said the group has sacrificed crucial leverage in its intensive push for doctors' pay. "It's a sellout to whatever the Obama health care plan is," he said, "and the problem with that is, we don't know what that's going to be."

Next weekend, a dissident group of medical specialty societies and state delegations plans to try to force the AMA to drop its support for the health overhaul through a resolution that calls the legislation crafted so far "anathema to doctors and patients." The resolution, to be considered at a semiannual AMA meeting in Houston, calls on the group to oppose any deal that includes a public option, among other items, or one that doesn't contain malpractice changes.

"You always gain respect when you take a position on principle and don't try to do what's politically expedient at the moment to get a short-term gain. You always lose it when you don't," said Dr. Donald Palmisano, a former AMA president and current member who says the association has miscalculated in the health overhaul negotiations. "The short-term gain of getting more money without getting any promise of reform is not a victory."

House Republicans invited doctors at odds with the AMA to the Capitol Wednesday for a public hearing to air their concerns about Obama's plan.

The AMA has traditionally aligned itself with Republicans and filtered the majority of its sizable political contributions to the GOP, but last year it switched allegiances, devoting slightly more than half of the $3.3 million its political action committee spent to electing Democrats.

The organization's political giving is closely tied to the fate of doctors' pay. After Cornyn cast a procedural vote last year against legislation to reverse the cut, the AMA, which had endorsed him in his re-election campaign, quickly yanked its support. Then when the Texas Republican ultimately voted for a final version of the bill, the association offered its backing again. Cornyn, according to senior aides, angrily responded that he'd rather do without it.

When AMA president Dr. J. James Rohack approached Cornyn last week outside the Senate chamber asking for his vote, the senator tartly refused, then turned on his heel and went to cast his "no" vote.

The association is hardly the only health care lobby that opted to try to strike a deal with Obama and Democrats on the health overhaul instead of fighting it outright; insurers, hospitals, drugmakers and others have done the same, with varying degrees of success. The AMA has spent more than $32 million lobbying Congress in the last two years.

WASHINGTON — Does the AMA matter in the health care debate? Congress is beginning to have its doubts, despite the medical association's deep pockets and platoons of lobbyists. It's lost its pri...
WASHINGTON — Does the AMA matter in the health care debate? Congress is beginning to have its doubts, despite the medical association's deep pockets and platoons of lobbyists. It's lost its pri...
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- karela I'm a Fan of karela 85 fans permalink

I love it when these AMA type doctors, who are wealthy by the way, spend all their time talking about how they can get more wealthy and telling us it's for the patients. There are some doctors who are wonderful human beings. But I doubt that you'll find them in the AMA because they left that organization in disgust. I don't know what the answer is on medical lawsuits. I'm a nurse and in a hospital I once worked in, an eighteen year old boy once came back from surgery with the wrong leg amputated. And they still had to amputate the one with bone cancer. Should he have a right to sue? On the other hand, if doctors are continually ordering tests, that they don't really believe are needed, because they're afraid of being sued, then that costs all of us a fortune every year and it doesn't produce good health care. But, for every doctor I ever worked with who was a true humanitarian, there were dozens who were money grubbers. A person can make money and still practice good medicine, but when they demand so much money that millions of people can't go to the doctor when they're sick, then they have moved a long way away from their oath------Above all, do no harm.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:15 PM on 10/29/2009
- Lark817 I'm a Fan of Lark817 9 fans permalink

"We deliberately chose a strategy which said the best way to get health system reform in this country was for us to provide constructive leadership, to work with the people who were writing the legislation as well as the Obama administration," said Wilson,

Oh, you did that deliberately, huh? No one thought it was an accident, dumb a$$. I really doubt we could afford your idea of health care 'reform.'

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:26 PM on 10/29/2009
- HalEBurton I'm a Fan of HalEBurton 21 fans permalink
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The AMA is the health sector's version of the US Chamber of Commerce.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:59 PM on 10/29/2009
- NY Grandma I'm a Fan of NY Grandma 7 fans permalink
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All you people who are criticizing the AMA, who are you going to want to see looking down at you in the ER when you have chest pains or bleeding from a car wreck?

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:57 AM on 10/29/2009
- HalEBurton I'm a Fan of HalEBurton 21 fans permalink
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You have no idea what you're talking about. Do you know what they do?

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:00 PM on 10/29/2009
- karela I'm a Fan of karela 85 fans permalink

Most doctors have stopped belonging to the AMA because they're all about money and not about patient care. If you have a doctor who cares about you, be grateful, but don't waste your loyalty on the American Medical Association. One doctor I know refers to them as that yucky, toxic tasting coating you have on your tongue when you wake up in the morning after you've been sick for a week.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:18 PM on 10/29/2009

And next time you see a cop..give em a head. After all...who is going to protect you?

Next time you see a pilot, give him head...aft­er all who is going to fly you around.

Next time you see an accountant, give em head, after all who is going to protect you from the IRS

Next time you see a politician give em head, after all who is going to defend you when AQ att acks you.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:19 AM on 10/30/2009
- JiminNC I'm a Fan of JiminNC 275 fans permalink
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Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, who has tangled with the group in the past. "The lesson I've learned ... is if you agree to fix their compensation, they will basically get in the tank with their natural adversarie­s."

Sorry Cornynhole ... their natural adversary ? the same as ours, health insurance companies and their congressional errand boys.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:07 AM on 10/29/2009

If we can bring in unrestricted number of IT workers from abroad and keep the technology wages low, don't see any reason why we cannot do that for qualified Doctors as well.

Open the immigration doors for qualified doctors and other healthcare professionals from abroad.

If you believe that UK, Canadian and other European countries health care system is good enough, then their doctors should be good enough for us.

Fook the AMA who is using the American Citizens as their monopoly paycheck! The AMA members are making money off of our children and elders s!ck backs.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:56 AM on 10/29/2009
- NWBrunette I'm a Fan of NWBrunette 59 fans permalink

Exactly right. Couldn't have said it better myself.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:24 AM on 10/29/2009
- HalEBurton I'm a Fan of HalEBurton 21 fans permalink
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The AMA is a racket.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:00 PM on 10/29/2009
- bluemike I'm a Fan of bluemike 5 fans permalink

The ranks of America's saving angels also include this nation's greatest bandits.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:05 AM on 10/29/2009
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clinicians are ordinary citizens and not more powerful corporations

corporations hate unions and AMA is union-like because it represents a group of professional individuals

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:18 AM on 10/29/2009
- karela I'm a Fan of karela 85 fans permalink

The AMA used to represent most American doctors. It is my understanding that most doctors no longer belong to the group because the AMA's entire focus was on making ever more money and a lot of doctors thought perhaps there should a focus on taking care of patients. It's pretty bad when even the doctors think the AMA are a bunch of greedy crooks.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:21 PM on 10/29/2009
- dbawden I'm a Fan of dbawden 4 fans permalink
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AMA=Chamber of Commerce on global warming. What problem?

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:15 PM on 10/28/2009
- wdw505 I'm a Fan of wdw505 69 fans permalink

plants grow better with c02.......­.farmers should love it

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 11:24 PM on 10/28/2009

AMA is a socialistic union for Doctors. They are anti capitalism. They control the supply of doctors in our country tp keep the doctors fee very high. AMA prevents universities from opening new medical schools to prevent more Americans from becoming doctors.

AMA prevents qualified doctors from Abroad (Canada, UK, Europe and other countries) from wokring in the US

We need free market so we can allow qualified doctors from abroad coming and practicing here in the US.

We need more medical schools opened in the country so we can flood the market with more American doctors brining down doctors wages.

AMA would hate my solution.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:34 PM on 10/28/2009
- dwright I'm a Fan of dwright 309 fans permalink
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you want to bring down doctors wages, yet you have no problem with multi-million dollar bonuses for the executives of insurance companies. What is wrong with you?

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:15 PM on 10/28/2009

What does that have to do with prize of oranges in China?

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:52 PM on 10/28/2009
- karela I'm a Fan of karela 85 fans permalink

A hundred years ago doctors were paid in chickens and bags of potatoes in a lot of places in America, but people didn't die because a doctor wouldn't see them. Doctors were not a particularly wealthy group, but people were hugely grateful to them. Then in 1924, the AMA was founded. They fought to suppress the number of doctors who were allowed to take training. They fought in a thousand ways for doctors to get more money. And they succeeded. Doctors became the wealthiest professionals in the country. They no longer take chickens, they do turn sick people away and they are only the most loved person in the community sometimes. Doctors began to demand the right to huge houses, expensive cars and fancy country clubs. And we all went along. The AMA has been a very effective union for doctors. But along the way, they forgot to care about the patient's they were supposed to care about and more and more became doctors for the money. Finally the AMA became so money focused that most doctors no longer join their organization because the young doctors coming in were repulsed. The old boys doctor network in hospitals try to indoctrinate the young idealists into the club, but it doesn't work with all of them. Some of them actually love the people they care for.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 09:31 PM on 10/29/2009
- ibsteve2u I'm a Fan of ibsteve2u 137 fans permalink
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Still think we should be funding the mass production of doctors, anesthesiologists, and radiologists.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:18 PM on 10/28/2009
- vonPinto I'm a Fan of vonPinto 41 fans permalink
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AMA is an antiqued, moribund, old boys and fats cats organization dominated by the right wingers in the medical field.

They are doing such a poor job handling the affairs of fellow doctors while they are very good in throwing a spanner in the wheel of progress in any thing that favors the masses.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:26 PM on 10/28/2009
- HalEBurton I'm a Fan of HalEBurton 21 fans permalink
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Exactly right. Wingnuts to the extreme.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:02 PM on 10/29/2009

No other physician group in the US comes close to having membership the size of the AMA, and only the AMA gives all physicians and medical students a voice in the future of medicine through a democratic policy-making process. Widely considered a powerful advocate for patients and physicians in the health care debate, the AMA gets high marks from the public in an independent poll, which finds that the majority of Americans trust the AMA to do the right thing on health reform.
The AMA is committed to reform that provides all Americans with a choice of affordable, portable, high-quality health coverage that can't be taken away by an illness or a job loss. Repeal of the broken Medicare physician payment formula is an essential element of health reform to ensure the security and stability of Medicare for seniors, baby boomers - and military families that rely on TRICARE. Congress made a commitment to America’s seniors with the creation of Medicare, and they must ensure that seniors’ have continued access and choice of physician. Without repeal, next year’s cut is projected at 21 percent with more in years to come. The gap between payments and costs will make it very difficult for physicians to keep their doors open to all Medicare patients and make quality improvement to their practices that benefit all patients.
We take our position at the center of the health reform debate as an honor an a serious responsibility.
J. James Rohack, M.D. President, AMA

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:05 PM on 10/28/2009
- RTIII I'm a Fan of RTIII 85 fans permalink

If you want our support, you have to support us, not insurance companies. We, the people, want health CARE not necessarily health INSURANCE.

When the AMA speaks out about the outrageous salaries made at the top of America's insurance companies, we'll believe in you. Until then, we don't trust you any more.

Oh, and we aren't intellectually or informationally challenged. We know that Tort Reform is high on your priority list but is actually a tiny problem in health-care today. When you get on board with your patients needs to eliminate pre-existi­ng-conditi­on exclusions and the like, then we'll consider what you need. Until then....
.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:17 PM on 10/28/2009
- miriamfl I'm a Fan of miriamfl 15 fans permalink

Tort Reform is a game played by the for profit ins companies to put the doctors and the gov against each other as an excuse for them to raise rates. As you said it is a small portion of insurance losses. It's a chess game just controling every aspect of doctors lifes. Every year they raise the rates and too bad, complain to you representative they don't care, that is exactly what they want and even if there was tort reform and there is in over 40 states they will still continue to raise the rates.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:49 PM on 10/28/2009

Right on, RTIII. You said it!

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:55 PM on 10/28/2009

That's not true. Physicians who do/don't belong to the AMA all want to do right by our patients. Of course the AMA looks out for the interest of physicans hence the name but also, there are standards set by the AMA that account for the best medical therapy in the world.
Doubtful that most people understand the many phone calls physicans make to insurance companies, pharmacies, social workers, schools etc . just make sure the patient's needs are met.
How silly to attack physicans when the trueth is we all had a hand to play in the current heathcare status.
Unneccessary visits to er, unneccessary law suits, increasing insurance premiums, hmos mandating a productivity schedule for physicains, practicing defensive medicine. The list goes on and on. Why turn on everyone else instead of looking at how to change the culture of medicine/healthcare in this country

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:35 AM on 10/29/2009
- moongal6 I'm a Fan of moongal6 76 fans permalink
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The percentage of cases where patients litigate against their physician is only 2-5%. And that per cent is declining every year, and yet, the malpractice Insurance premiums go up annually. America doesn't need tort reform, we need INSURANCE reform. Period. It is so hypocritical that the Republicans say the reason they won't back any Democratic healthcare reform is because it doesn't have adequate tort reform.
http://pnhp.org

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:15 AM on 10/29/2009
- RTIII I'm a Fan of RTIII 85 fans permalink

Oh, by the way, your choice to turn a blind eye to providing patients access to information to select good Drs is horrific and keeps us from trusting you. We need to know the failure rates as well as successes. We need to know rates up front. We need real competition among Drs, not this wall of secrecy you and yours advocate. You are clearly not interested in helping patients. True, you might argue, that's not your job - your job is to advocate for Drs, not patients. Well, you have had too much power in that regard for too long and we've had enough.
.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:20 PM on 10/28/2009

come now, anytime someone files a complaint against a physican, it goes on the record for good. That means some doctors have lots of negative marks even when there no issue.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:37 AM on 10/29/2009
- vonPinto I'm a Fan of vonPinto 41 fans permalink
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Yours is one fat lie. Go tell this to the marines. Ask individual doctors who have dropped your association like a sack of hot potatoes what they feel about AMA.

You can paint all the rosy pictures about AMA as much as you want here but no one is buying this your hollow PR.

You cannot manage something as simple as Residency and Fellowship enrollments, talk of "advocating" for patients.

May be you are equating the number of hours you spent at board meetings with dues paid by unsuspecting doctors with success.

We are witnessing the difficulties about reforming health care today because of what AMA did with Ronald Reagan in the past.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:33 PM on 10/28/2009
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The AMA has made it very clear their priorities lie with their providers, not with their patients. That's fine - it's your association - do with it as you wish, but don't think we're dumb enough to believe your tripe about "benefit all patients."

You've helped your providers turn their practices into businesses to help themselves dig deep into the pot of gold and pull out all the riches they want at the expense of not only their patients, but to our entire economy. You're no better than the insurance companies taking their 1/3 off the top for nothing.

I've investigated too much medical provider fraud in my life - I know what providers do and I know how the system protects them from prosecution not only for their financial crimes, but for their incompetence in case after case. The AMA and the State Boards do next to nothing to clean out their own house.

When you start there - you will have taken one small step toward earning respect. Until that happens, you're just another bunch of greedy providers wanting to fill your bank accounts at the expense of the sick. Thank God many good docs are fleeing your organization. That alone gives me hope!

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 06:16 PM on 10/28/2009
- miriamfl I'm a Fan of miriamfl 15 fans permalink

Dr. Rohack, thank you for your remarks and I agree with you. I worked for 3 years for a surgeon just as office mgr but the reimbursements were not very good from insurance companies either and medicaid should be abolished and discontinued because there was barely reimbursements there. I just had a pan/endoscopy and my specialist billed the ins 675.00 BC/BS had a negociated rate with spec of 227.00 out of that amount they paid 181.00 my portion was 46.00. I don't think it is just Medicare that doesn't have good reimbursements. The insurance monopoly and control has to be stopped.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 07:42 PM on 10/28/2009
- Crappol I'm a Fan of Crappol 2 fans permalink

cross the border and the same service in private practice is $100. You don't need a genius to find what's wrong. My blood pressure medication (generic brand) is $3.25 PER DAY. In developing country like India it is $2.05 PER HUNDRED DAY SUPPLY for the same medicine. Here we have pharmacies counting your tablets and billing additional $1/tablet and doctors working with pharma companies to squeeze the patients. AMA is anti-capitalist and greed-driven.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:29 PM on 10/29/2009
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AMA BECAME IRRELEVANT AT LEAST TEN YEARS AGO

Dr. Rick Lippin
Southampton,Pa

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 04:25 PM on 10/28/2009
- vonPinto I'm a Fan of vonPinto 41 fans permalink
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I support your view 1000%.

They can pretend all they want about "advocating" for patients and "improving" health care but you and I know that AMA is as irrelevant as the Health Insurance Companies.

Thanks for pointing this out.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:36 PM on 10/28/2009
- Crappol I'm a Fan of Crappol 2 fans permalink

If you are indeed a doctor, thanks for saying that. My doctor friends are deeply offended by AMA's practice of only protecting their welfare and not about society's. Sad.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 01:31 PM on 10/29/2009
- skene I'm a Fan of skene 2 fans permalink

AMA members have morphed into technicians who can no longer make their own decisions.
It's too late to regain what they have lost.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 03:56 PM on 10/28/2009
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