Yahoo! News:
SINGU.S. President Barack Obama and other world leaders on Sunday supported delaying a legally binding climate pact until 2010 or even later, under a compromise deal for next month's Copenhagen summit.
Hopenhagen Lets You Tell the World What Gives You Hope for A Better Planet
Want to reply to a comment? Hint: Click "Reply" at the bottom of the comment; after being approved your comment will appear directly underneath the comment you replied to
They had five year to consider. It is not time to delay. It is time for action!
Obama 71 vehicle motorcade!!!!!
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha green Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
http://www.politico.com/click/stories/0911/71_vehicles.html
Chinese greeting vehicles included....
So really you have no idea how many the President asked for do you?
some pretty nasty posters over there. I can see where you get your ideas. All of that just off of a tweet.
The Senate is not about to impose the taxes needed to discourage the unsustainable exhaustion of fossil fuels.
Yeah............The economy can really use the "boost". LOL
I thought this was an Onion or April Fools day article. The biggest issue of our time and world leaders determine in advance to delay signing a binding agreement. And what lame excuses are they using: "too difficult," gulf between rich and poor countries "too wide," time frame for a meeting "too short." Maybe the dog ate their homework too?
We have to be honest why this is the case: the US Senate. Plain and clear, the U.S. is unable to arrive at the meeting with a mandate and clear room to negotiate. Until we come up with a domestic plan, there is no use sitting at the table and being dishonest and speaking in platitudes. Please check out this photo (from the NYT) to see the parade of losers at the hastily arranged Singapore meeting:
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/11/15/world/15prexy_CA0/articleLarge.jpg
It's true that the delay is only necessary because of the U.S. Senate, whose Republicans and conservative "Democrats" have been so busy obstructing health care reform they haven't even gotten around to dawdling on global warming. But I don't fault leaders of other countries for putting that delicately. It's for U.S. citizens to call out the U.S. Senate, not foreign chancellors and prime ministers.
Conveniently, each of us has only two of them to call on the phone -- today and every day, until they pass Medicare for all and a climate bill that prohibits all subsidies to coal and petroleum forever, and all NEW subsidies for nuclear energy, whether production or research. Private corporations have failed to cleanup nuclear waste for decades, we must do it ourselves, with DoE personnel, or the Army Corps of Engineers, or whatever agency has jurisdiction. We must give up on private industry for nuclear waste cleanup and cut off their support for making more nuclear waste, they just aren't worth a plop.
Nuclear waste? Wow, I haven't heard that one for awhile. Look, Reed, congress is already spending money we don't have. We ARE calling our senators and reps to tell to stop the insanity. That is why health care and Cap and Trade are stalled. The problem is not climate change, it's Economics 101.
We need to drill here and get those nuclear power plants on line now.
Remember we couldn't wait?
“More "Scientists" are paid by governments to travel, write, go to "conferences", research, go to meetings, travel, get grants, etc. than work for the private sector. Government money is mother's milk for the scientific community. They will be glad to stick their finger in the wind to see which way the "wind" is blowing as long as the grant money keeps flowing. Nice gig for what is an over supply of talent. Not everybody can be on the Weather Channel.”
Copenhagen is just a third world shakedown of the West.
I'm convinced.
Scientists cannot be trusted
Scientists themselves are intentionally misleading us so they can make their ~100k a year after their 18+ years of education and a life-long dedication.
Thank you for letting me know.
You do what you need to do.........to keep the government grants and programs going.
Wow, when I read all the posts denying science on this page I feel like I'm watching a Glenn Beck episode. The arguments range from the hysterical to the paranoid. Fox New has everyone believing that their opinions on science is just as important and relevant as that of scientists. If it is one thing the deniers elevate above everything else, it is their own opinion. They hate to read so their opinions must suffice.
Look, certain things are a matter of opinion. This is not. There is the fact that we are making the planet unsuitable for the continued existence of our species, and then there are the interests of all of these other groups that are espousing ludicrous nonsense under the guise of civil liberties and freedom of expression. This issue is going to make those freedoms moot. Teapartiers, Roy Innis, even the authors of Freakonomics are trying to promote their own interests by 'taking a stand' against climate change. Well, one way or another they will be dealt with. I'm in favor of a Green secret service that eliminates those so impervious to logic. Now there's a green solution I could get behind-Get rid of all those who would so vehemently deny the truth. The world doesn't need them and neither do we it's population.
Plenty evidence going the other way, Pat. You are being "Chicagoed".
http://dotsub.com/view/19f9c335-b023-4a40-9453-a98477314bf2
Please direct us to actual peer-reviewed studies that "go the other way" and not right-wing blogs. In science, the two are not equivalent.
You call this little cute "documentary" evidence? That´s hilarious, but not at all surprising coming from someone with claims like yours. It´s symptomatic of all the attempts of debunking global warming. Its opinion based conjecture (politics), nothing more.
The people questioning human influence on global climate change are not scientists. This whole discussion is over long ago. Look into it, do some research (outside youtube and the likes). Go to some real sources (you will need to read more than blogs by non scientists I´m afraid).
it's not a fact... it's fiction.
a bunch of environmentalists with degrees say it's true doesn't make it fact.
Wow, so many uneducated in America with a real disdian for science! Too bad!
Yeah people with degrees in climate science dont know anything about climate science right? I think you are confusing activist and scientist. And you sir are an activist. Anyone can have an opinion, and so many incompetent people seem to know about climate science these days.
So yes, its fiction to you of course, and reality to people who have dedicated their time, intelligence, talent and effort to understanding climate via proven methodologies within a scientific paradigm that has made your youtube "education" possible.
Fiction for you is a hundred formula one mechanics telling you that you need new brakes in your car because they are worn down and will fail in the near future. According to you, you can still drive and brake too, so whats the problem?
Radical environmentalism has been the left's religion after the fall of the Soviet Union. The one grand banner to rally world control under. Look below the surface of this movement to find them.
good icon...there's no hope for you.
The good news for you is in 2012, Obama will be out of office and will be able to join the defense team for KSM!!!!!!
Yes, too bad there is no science to support your point of view or else it will be less hysterical.
You are just trolling man, give it up and return to the Alex Jones web forum.
yep world leader decide to not even talk about it.
The EPA has been given the mandate to reduce greenhouse gases in the U.S. and will do so.
A response to pollution and depletion isn't going to come from government, it's going to come from consumers. We created irresponsible consumerism, and only we have the power to stop it.
Due to the recent socioeconomic realignment in America caused in large part by the financial crisis, we are already halfway toward the emissions goal for 2020 under the Kerry-Lieberman bill.
We're not buying or traveling as much as we were just over a year ago, and the impact on our carbon footprint has been more dramatic that anyone in government would dare to impose on us.
Recent media attention has shined a light on the ecological (and moral) impact of agriculture, and Americans are, more than ever, considering the implications of their food choices at the supermarket.
The word is out, the writing is on the wall, and Americans are changing the way we consume. We are way WAY out in front of our ineffectual government that is desperately trying to prop up an industrial paradigm that is only "too big to fail" in its surreal fantasy world of conventional wisdom.
We've tried their way, it didn't work, and now we're going to do what's right. The collective consciousness is out there, like toothpaste out of tube, and the government can't make behave like the vulgar, overextended consumers we were before. We're moving on, with or without Washington.
As loquacious as it is, your response is misinformed. Sure, consumers have a part to play, but under no lens can it be surmised that they have been playing that part, except for maybe a marginal 1% or so. Legislation and policy are the way to make big changes, whether it's an imperfect system or not. People need to be forced to get out of bed and face reality, otherwise they'll keep dreaming forever.
I agree with your final sentence, but not the rest.
Legislation almost always has unintended consequences. Bad policy is often worse than no policy at all. Every cap-and-trade proposal I've read looks like a disaster waiting to happen. They all give freebies to big polluters, let financial institutions inflate carbon credit pricing through speculation, and have no mechanism for import tariffs and export exemptions to avoid gutting the American economy through international trade.
I wish that government could play a useful role in regulating the production of fossil fuels and subsidizing the production of renewable energy, but that doesn't seem to be happening, and the lessons of history don't provide much hope for a sensible solution.
Our Congress isn't imperfect, it's downright dysfunction, demonstrably corrupt, and arguably fraudulent. If you're expecting Congress to be a part of the solution, then you're the one that should stop dreaming.
U.S. carbon emissions in 2009 are projected to be down 5.6% from 2008 according to the EIA (which is notoriously over-optimistic about energy production/consumption). Consumerism broke consumers, and the industrial economy slammed on the breaks.
Legislation and policy didn't create these big changes. This was a massive failure of consumers to keep up with Wall Street's impossible expectations. Consumers aren't going forget so quickly.
We don't need to be forced to face reality by the government. Market forces are driving it home and making it all too real in a way that government simply can't manage.
It looks like the trend lately is to force people out of work, not out of bed. I agree with jsarets on the incompetence of congress and we need to get a whole new crew of leaders who are not career politicians. At the rate we're going, legislation won't just be getting us out of bed, but telling us what to eat, what to wear, how many children to have, etc. Freedom, baby. Enjoy while it lasts.
"We've tried their way, it didn't work." Are you referring to a particular administration or just US government in general? From my perspective, we have the best country in the world and most opportunity for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. We are so happy we don't pay enough attention to the decisions government makes. I don't think consumers created irresponsible consumerism if there is such a thing.
It was government encouragement (both parties at fault) that allowed banks to give mortgages to people who couldn't afford them and government interference that failed to stop it when the early warnings went out.
Most of don't think collectively and aren't out there reducing our consuming because we want to save the world. We're cutting back so we have enough to pay our rent and put food on the table. I do recommend we all take a collective breath and stop this climate change paranoia. Quit redistributing the wealth, stop government spending, lower taxes on businesses that hire and get this economy rolling. You can't eat cooler temperature.
I'm referring to the political-financial-industrial-media complex that acts on their mutual interests to preserve an unsustainable economic paradigm that has made them rich and powerful.
I tend to agree that America has been offering more/better opportunities than other countries, although I don't necessarily agree that this will continue to be the case.
I also think that many Americans have an ideal of "happiness" that doesn't necessarily lead toward emotional, intellectual, and/or spiritual fulfillment and that doesn't necessarily jive with essential characteristics of the human condition.
From my perspective, a see a growing trend toward collective thought, voluntary associations, and appreciation of relationships (not just transactions) as vehicles through which we exchange value.
It's a process, and it isn't going to happen overnight.
I believe that we have more immediate and dramatic ecological challenges than climate change, although carbon emissions are somewhat related with most of them -- for example waste management, resource management, deforestation, intensive agriculture, developmental sprawl, etc.
"We believe it is better to have something good than to have nothing at all," Chilean Foreign Minister Mariano Fernandez said. Duh. Don't you mean Mr. Fernandez, better to have something, no matter how bad, rather than nothing? That's how our congress does it.
This a lose-lose deal for the US and other "rich" countries if we CAP and Tax domestically and give foreign welfare to keep poor countries from developing the way we did. Does anyone see a global welfare culture developing analogous to the war on poverty that institutionalized the welfare culture in this country?
Instead of another failed government bailout/stimulus/entitlement program, how about a pledge to aid, like we always do, when the disasters occur, if and when they do.
Spokesperson (for who?) Diane McFadzien: "Legally binding is the only thing that will do if we want to see real action to save the planet." After 4 billion years, it's about time. Quick, Watson. Not a moment to lose!
It is amazing how you deniers can talk about climate change all day and not learn anything. Like George Bush, your learning curve is zero. This is what I wondered initially when I asked why you guys even ask questions because whatever the answer given you either do not comprehend it or reject it.
You say we may create a world welfare culture when we are the one's responsible for 98% of the problem and the undeveloped countries, affected most by climate change, are only responsible for a negligible amount of co2 release. How is keeping people from dying of thirst due to lack of fresh water creating a welfare culture? I just can not believe how narrow the world views are of you guys on the right!
Disappointing news. What legacy do they hope to leave for children everywhere? Individuals can only do so much, we need our political leaders to fight for the planet too. They have the power and resources to turn things around in Copenhagen - change is in the air.
And when I voted for Obama, I thought he realized that climate legislation and a climate treaty would be his legacy. I know that he understands the magnitude of the problem, but he has advisers who are steering him away from action.
If only he listened to Holdren and Chu. But in Washington, Money Talks! and the fossil fuel money is pouring in.
Cap and Trade (TAX) will NOT reduce world CO2 one iota. It is a huge JOB KILLER and Democratic disaster. But it "feels" kinda Hope and Changey. .........and we know how "feelings" are sooooo important.
You say that change is in the air. My concern is that scientists have not yet determined if change in the air could have a warming effect. We know the precise amount of Co2 necessary to attenuate Mother Nature's thermostat is 350 parts per million. However, this anthropogenic climate stasis calculation makes no accounting for the effect of increased levels of change in the air. Until these variables can be sorted out, I would advise individuals NOT to get rid of all of their winter clothing.
We know squat about the climate in reality.
I agree very much. This is a huge let down. Frankly I find it mind blowing that they have the audacity to delay!
Sing along with me!!!
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it,
But I feel fine. Fine.
(Not)
Great song. From 1987. We're still here somehow, and lower Manhattan is still above water, in spite of Al's dire predictions.
Imagine that.
Oh, right. Tell that to the citizens of the Maldives, and all the flooded towns in Siberia.
Have you read the latest scientific studies from Antarctica? I guess not. Don't buy a home at the shore.
all you'll be able to do is imagine it pretty soon...'dire'? how about 'scientifically proven'
Al's still trying to make out of "Divinity School". The World Church of AGW..........
"So tell me, over and over and over again, my friend,
that you don't believe,
we're on the eve of destruction......." from 1968.
Despite that much of coastal New Jersey is flooded as we speak!
I am not willing to give Henry Waxman one more nickel or smidgen of my freedom for his promise to make it colder outside. If you're one of those wizards who believe that politicians can attenuate the forces of Mother Nature, you supply them with as much of your money as you like.
It seems like only three months ago major U.N. and European leaders were lecturing the world, saying the planet had only four months to take action, or horrible climate change disasters would absolutely occur.
Today, it is apparent that major world leaders didn't really believe the alarmist statements made by the U.N. and European leaders.
The tactic of predicted ever worse disasters has backfired. The public has looked around and noticed that the disasters aren't really happening, they are simply incredible predictions made by persons who now lack credibility.
you lack credibility and someone's puppet to boot. You're 'opinion' is a joke, and if you were anyone important it would be clear that you'd been payed off to make such ludicrous remarks. So who's paying you? you're a pawn in someone else's game.
...ARE someone's puppet...
Haven't been "paid" off by anyone, unfortunately. Seriously, if anyone truly believed that Global Warming was the greatest threat of the 21st Century, leaders wouldn't be kicking this issue down the road to next year or the year after. In the U.S., next year is an election year, making any global warming legislative action very doubtful.
Also, public opinion is shifting on global warming. The public is becoming increasingly skeptical of the alarmist rhetoric.
For example, three years ago a professor at the University of Colorado claimed that all the ski resorts in the Rockies would be out of business soon because of global warming. Each year, the opening dates would occur later and later, until there wasn't enough snow to ever open for skiers, because of global warming.
This year, the Rocky Mountain ski resorts opened earlier than normal, and a new storm is now delivering more snow to the Rockies. The only problem at the ski resorts this winter will be keeping the roads open for visitors. I wonder what portion of the population of Colorado now thinks man-made global warming is real?
You think there are no world disasters only because you are uninformed. There are tens of thousands of climate refugges leaving the Sudan. Bangladesh is losing its arable land and drinking water due to salt water incursion from flooding. The Himalayas are melting that will lead to water shortages for tens of millions. When you speak of no eco-disasters what you are really saying is "I have no idea what is going on in the world as I am educated by Fox News."
Historical! Just historical I tell ya!
Loading comments…
Posted: 11-15-09 12:32 PM