Will This Generation Of American Jews Abandon Israel? (New York Review)

The New York Review Of Books:

In 2003, several prominent Jewish philanthropists hired Republican pollster Frank Luntz to explain why American Jewish college students were not more vigorously rebutting campus criticism of Israel. In response, he unwittingly produced the most damning indictment of the organized American Jewish community that I have ever seen.

The philanthropists wanted to know what Jewish students thought about Israel. Luntz found that they mostly didn't. "Six times we have brought Jewish youth together as a group to talk about their Jewishness and connection to Israel," he reported. "Six times the topic of Israel did not come up until it was prompted. Six times these Jewish youth used the word 'they' rather than 'us' to describe the situation."

Read the whole story: The New York Review Of Books

Comments

[messy]

05:10 PM on 06/01/2010

Time marches on. It's been a century since the Russian pogroms and sixty five years since the Holocaust ended and the Arab boycott began. hell, it's been 33 years since the first camp David accords and 18 since Oslo. People don't remember the beginnings of things and to be quite frank, Jews here have it really good.

I'm not complaining about that, I have it great here, but Antisemitism outside of the Zionist/Israel thing is no longer a problem. There's no worries about getting thrown out of college because of one's background. I'm old enough to remember the tail end of this shit. Kids today don't.

The Holocaust is like Napoleon. ancient history.

[gymmy]

01:49 PM on 05/31/2010

...only Don Rickels has the right to make fun of Jewish Israelis........ only Don

[Abdi S]

08:04 AM on 05/25/2010

Israel will grow more enemies by destroying palestinian lives by bombing or continues wars that never ends. The war policy is more harsh and hated through out by it's opposition regarding respecting human rights laws.If Israel continues it's wars against its naighbors, and mistreat palestinians then it won't survive for too long.

[scottyknows]

02:34 AM on 05/25/2010

Only the liberal Jews, which is no surprise. Anything remotely to do with the Judeo or Christian God they reject out of hand. Too threatening to their after-world view.

[Jim Wiedenhoeft]

11:22 PM on 05/24/2010

sometime ago I sat with a Jewish Student who argued rather heatedly that she felt more Israeli than American , although she had never actually been to Israel. when I began to question her about her opinions, I found out she did not actually know ANY of the Political figures in Israel nor the fact that at the time they were having elections.......really sad.

[T4]

08:12 PM on 05/24/2010

I am not sure what abandon means but if we wouldn't consider Israel the 51st stae and the font of righteousness we would all be better off and probably have peace in the middle east without terrorism by now. Israel is a country withit's own laws, politics, religions, policies, etc. many people just don;t get that's it's not the US and we have kept it alfoat beyond all rationality for a generation. Without our foreign aid and jewish and righ wing apoloclytiptic christian donations the country would have sued for peace long ago. We have bought a weird perverted relationship of the tail wagging the dog. Israel says jump and we say how high and they know it and we know it. Time to get off that train

[pinkibus]

05:21 PM on 05/24/2010

It is difficult for me to think anyone could support to-day's Israel. It is founded upon a myth and sustains itself by justifying its terrible actions by citing the terrible actions perpetrated upon Jews. Israel's have to ask themselves why they have a right to oust people and demand exemption from international law when their very existence was due to recognition by the Un which it now ignores. Given that some posters refer to how the Romans ousted them and use that as a reason to justify their ousting the Palestinians the whole thing becomes a farce. The Orthodox Jews who inhabit the West Bank are about as humane as any persecuter of the Jews ever was. The situation has now become frightening.

[jakemd]

02:32 PM on 05/24/2010

This is not surprising to me...American Jews are not Israeli-Americans. If you ask me what my nationality is, it's "American". If you ask me what my country is, it's "the U.S." Most of us do not have Israeli ancestors. I happen to have one ancestor from Ottoman Jerusalem, which is very rare, and I'm *still not Israeli*.

I work, I pay my taxes, I sit in traffic, and I spend time with my friends-- I don't see how any of that makes me more "Israeli" than any other American.

[heroine addict]

02:22 PM on 05/24/2010

To Anbreen and Cheetahpea in a buried part of this thread:

Thank you for your comment. To boil it down, I grew up as a granddaughter of Holocaust survivors. One entire side of my family was wiped out. The size of that hole I grew up around had a strong shaping effect on me. My father and other older relatives are all VERY Zionist, and I was raised to share their views. I remember sitting in bed at 11 years old, examining diagrams of the facilities at Treblinka from a book I found at the library. However, as I grew older I read in the same way about the politics and history of the current conflict and year after year it was IMPOSSIBLE not to see Israel as the aggressor. So of course in my mind the fate of the Palestinian people oppressed by the Israeli military becomes conflated with what the N4zis did. The grief over the Shoah compounding my anger. My feelings of kinship with other Jews runs smack into my fury over the muted (to our ears) but relentless Palestinian body count. To forestall the predictable responses, I'm abundantly aware that many Israelis die in the conflict. The same way many matadors die in the ring after endless arrogant provocation. A nasty cynical side of me can't help but regard it with the same satisfaction.

The bleak result? Whenever I dwell on my Jewish identity it feels like standing in a field of skulls.

[heroine addict]

01:27 PM on 05/24/2010

To Anbreen and Cheetahpea in a buried part of this thread:

Thank you for your comment. To boil it down, I grew up as a granddaughter of Holocaust survivors. One entire side of my family was wiped out. The size of that hole I grew up around had a strong shaping effect on me. My father and other older relatives are all VERY Zionist, and I was raised to share their views. I remember sitting in bed at 11 years old, examining diagrams of the facilities at Treblinka from a book I found at the library. However, as I grew older I read in the same way about the politics and history of the current conflict and year after year it was IMPOSSIBLE not to see Israel as the aggressor. So of course in my mind the fate of the Palestinian people oppressed by the Israeli military becomes conflated with what the Nazis did. The grief over the Shoah compounding my anger. My feelings of kinship with other Jews runs smack into my fury over the muted (to our ears) but relentless Palestinian body count. To forestall the predictable responses, I'm abundantly aware that many Israelis die in the conflict. The same way many matadors die in the ring after endless arrogant provocation. A nasty cynical side of me can't help but regard it with the same satisfaction.

The bleak result? Whenever I dwell on my Jewish identity it feels like standing in a field of skulls.

[messy]

05:13 PM on 06/01/2010

By the way, what was the alternative to Zionism after the second world war? They wouldn't let the Jews back into almost everywhere they came from.

[SATELITE]

12:15 PM on 05/24/2010

america will abandon israel after it sucks iran, and iraq dry of oil.

[Jim Wiedenhoeft]

11:26 PM on 05/24/2010

I$real will abandon America at the earliest opportunity like it has again and again..after American Money and Blood has paid to remove their number one and number two enemies..then they can have all of "Old I$rael to themselves and extermt@te the remaining Palestinians...(See Wolfowitz Doctrine)

[runforfun54]

11:06 AM on 05/24/2010

I continue to be appalled by the hypocrisy of HuffPo readers. On the one hand, HuffPo readers claim to be so liberal and openminded -- but only if you agree with them. Some of the comments about Israel and Jews are just appalling and makes me very fearful as a proud American who is also Jewish with a profound love of Israel, fearful that we could be entering a new age of anti-semitism. I suppose most readers are fans of the great Dalai Lama who, too, has acknowledge fondness of the ability of Jews to still exist after 3,000 years of persecution. I just don't understand the nastiness and namecalling. Very sad.

[moflard]

02:05 PM on 05/24/2010

OK, firstly - being anti-Israel or Anti-Zionist is not antisemitic, it's a condemnation of a particular hyper nationalistic and ethnocentric political philosophy. Frankly the antisemitism charge has been so over-used I'm surprised anyone uses it anymore.

Secondly - the Jews have suffered for 1000 years of persecution (which, granted is 1000 years too many, but there you are) not 3000. The first recorded act of antisemitism took place in Toulouse Cathedral in the early 11th century (there was an Easter tradition of bashing a Jew and on this occasion the Jew was killed so I generally assume antisemitic acts had been going on for around a century beforehand), prior to that Christianity just had too much on its plate persecuting other Christians to single out Jews for special treatment. The idea that Judaism and a particular ethnicity were inseparable took some time to develop within external populations.

[messy]

05:16 PM on 06/01/2010

Then how do you explain the three Jewish rebellions of 66, 98, and 134 CE? How do you explain the attacks on Jews during the Christian phase of the Roman Empire from 330 onwards?

[Backspace2525]

02:10 PM on 05/24/2010

You confuse criticism with antisemitism. For the most part, the criticism of Israel you read on HuffPo is justified.
Just as the rants, riots and pogroms of Israeli settlers are not representative of all Israelis, the few over the top rants you read here are not representative of all HuffPo readers.

[messy]

05:19 PM on 06/01/2010

Criticizing someone for just about everything they do, good bad or indifferent, shows hate.

If you think someone can do no right, then you probably hate them.

[adzomelk]

10:33 AM on 05/24/2010

palestinians deserve there own homeland. israel deserves a secure border. too bad europe & the u.s. didnt work this out before may 14th 1948. now israel will never have a secure border & i seriously doubt the palestinians will ever have a real state. still it's important for me to work for both. i will not abandon israel neither will i forget the palestinian people deserve a homeland which will also be secure in it's border with eretz israel.

[runforfun54]

11:11 AM on 05/24/2010

This is by far the most honest and kindest post I have seen and I concur 10,000% -- probably to the surprise (and dismay) :) of others here. Fanned.

[Backspace2525]

02:14 PM on 05/24/2010

Please define the borders of "ersetz israel".

Is it from the river Euphrates to the river Nile?
Does it include all of Jordan, all of Lebanon and large parts of Syria, Iraq and Egypt?

[messy]

05:18 PM on 06/01/2010

the 1946 borders of Palestine.

[ghee99]

07:20 AM on 05/24/2010

as near as i can tell, Israel was founded upon stolen land, by the colonial powers that be after WW2
because they (rightly) felt bad about what happened to European Jews during that war

the people who were living in many parts of what is now Israel were not the ones responsible for what happened to the Jewish people, so it certainly doesn't seem fair to make them pay.

so, unless you consider the Bible to be a real estate document,
I can't really see how abandoning Israel, and having it returned to the people who were living there for hundreds of years (at least), would be so bad....

as opposed to what we have now, the unrightful occupants, who claim to be distant descendants of an ancient tribe that lived there thousands of years ago, being in charge.

[taiwanjohn]

10:09 AM on 05/24/2010

I grew up in Iowa, across the street from a Palestinian professor (still close family friends) and one of my best friends in high school was Jewish. We all lived on land that used to belong to the Kiowa people.

In the grand scheme of things, Europeans haven't been in Iowa much longer than Zionists have been in Israel/Palestine. Should we also vacate Iowa and return it to its "rightful" owners?

Whether we like it or not, Israel is an established fact, with a multi-generational history of people with "roots" there. Removing it now is not really an option.

Then again, neither is removing the Palestinians an option. These two peoples are just going to have to GROW UP and figure out a way to share that land and get a long with each other.

--jrd

[tonedef]

11:15 AM on 05/24/2010

"In the grand scheme of things, Europeans haven't been in Iowa much longer than Zionists have been in Israel/Palestine. Should we also vacate Iowa and return it to its "rightful" owners?"

Yes.

[Oleg1]

06:02 AM on 05/24/2010

Perspective for American Jews --- FBI statistics-- majority of violent crimes again religious In U.S. is directed against Jews.
In Europe---it is a lot worse.

[clevernamehere]

02:48 AM on 05/26/2010

That isn't true.

The majority of hate crimes (51%) were based on race (73% committed against African-Americans), religion was next with 17%.

Jews were the most likely to be targeted for religious hate crimes (66%).

There were 4,934 racial motivated hate crimes compared to 1,732 religious motivated hate crimes.

Hate crimes against Jews are a problem, but other groups are targeted more.


http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/hc2008/victims.html