Wash Post On Faith: Faith On The Front Lines

washingtonpost.com:

There has been debate lately about chaplains and their proper role, with some critics going so far as to say that the military chaplaincy is a First Amendment violation of church and state.

Read the whole story: washingtonpost.com

Comments

[guitargeorge1964]

09:57 AM on 06/02/2010

My tags always read "No Preference". I don't have any problems with chaplains, although my contact with one was limited to when I got in trouble while drinking while at 29 Palms, and I was forced to attend a class on alcohol abuse that the chaplain held.

And I agree with some of the comments that the majority of the men I served with were not very religious at all.

I've been told several times in my life that "There are no atheist in a foxhole". I always correct them and say first off, it's called a "fighting hole", then I say instead of calling on God to protect us, we used our Marine Corps training instead.

[julian101]

10:38 PM on 06/01/2010

I think a lot of people would be surprised, actually, according to the military's own demographics, the US Army has a higher percentage of 'no religious preference' than the population of the civilian population (of the UK no less).

[spcfish]

12:16 AM on 06/02/2010

The religious right has a bizarre image of soldiers. In my experience infantry soldiers, as a class are the most irreligious, irreverent and traditionally 'immoral' group I have ever encountered. Casual sex and heavy drinking are the order of the day; hardly a Baptist bunch, no?

[julian101]

10:37 PM on 06/01/2010

I honestly have no idea why christians join the army at all. Their prophet would frown on that stuff, guns and worldly secularism, killing for Caesar instead of praying and waiting for the 'end times'.....so forth.

Surprisingly enough though,

BTW:
"The combat soldier's is the only job description that includes dying." - i dont know about you, but when I was a combat soldier a major part of my job involved not dying. That is kind of the point....you are supposed to not die. This isnt the Al Aqsa Maryters brigade or something.

"with some critics going so far as to say that the military chaplaincy is a First Amendment violation of church and state."

I agree. They are basically the most useless job in the army. Most soldiers DONT talk to them, and their job could be done just better with a secular psychologist.

"I wonder who a soldier would call for if he had just one choice, if he was mortally wounded and bleeding out quickly, too quickly to be saved...a medic or a chaplain."

No need to wonder, the answer is a medic. I have no idea what kind of nut would call for the chaplain (it might be worth noting, there would not be one there because this isnt Normandy in Saving Private Ryan...Chaplains dont go out on patrols, there is one per battalion).
Also a btw...our medic was an atheist (in a foxhole no less!).

[spcfish]

12:14 AM on 06/02/2010

"I do believe that our army chaplains, take them as a class, are the very worst men we have in the service." - Abraham Lincoln.

Chaplains are useless. I went to one once, for a marriage issue, and got a lecture on Jesus. Never went back and since finishing OCS have never sent a soldier to one unless he specifically asked for a chaplain. We'd be better off with a clinical psychologist billet in each battalion.

[holyheretic]

08:22 AM on 06/02/2010

Dear julian101 - faved.

You are a holy heretic!

Thank you, as always for your wonderful comments.

[3in1]

10:33 PM on 06/01/2010

Lord's Supper on the line. The chaplain was Jewish perform our service. Learn some OT. He joke about not be able to partake with us. We thank him anyway. His enlisted Presbyterian serve us. I will always treasure that service with our Lord.

[eileenflemingWAWA]

08:44 PM on 06/01/2010

“Starting in 1987, Protestant denominations were lumped together simply as “Protestant”; moreover, the Pentagon began accrediting hundreds of evangelical and Pentecostal “endorsing agencies,” allowing graduates of fundamentalist Bible colleges—to fill up nearly the entire allotment for Protestant chaplains. Today, more than two thirds of the military’s 2,900 active-duty chaplains are affiliated with evangelical or Pentecostal denominations.

"For decades, the military built a sense of solidarity out of a singular purpose, the Cold War struggle between free markets and state-planned economies—the shining city on a hill versus the evil empire…meshed neatly with ideologies [that connected] nationalism and fundamentalism…Communism…the dark alternative should we fail to unite. Fundamentalism thrived…a neat, black-and-white [theology and] a foreign policy. The end of the Cold War deprived militant evangelicals of that clarity [and] the emergence of “radical Islam” [became] the object of a new Cold War."
http://wearewideawake.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1267&Itemid=219

"The duty of the Christian at this time is to do the one task God has imposed upon us in this world today. The task is to work for the total abolition of war. There can be no question that unless war is abolished; the world will remain constantly in a state of madness. The church [meaning all Christians] must lead the way on the road to the abolition of war. Peace is to be preached and nonviolence is to be explained and practiced."
http://www.wearewideawake.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1558&Itemid=228

[blue53]

08:20 PM on 06/01/2010

No one has a problem with offering comfort or guidance to the troops. I do have a problem with putting bible verses on rifles, passing out bibles to Muslims, and the Christian Nationalists who are rampant in the service, loving the fact that we are killing Muslims--women men and children.
Those who see the Muslim population as growing and a threat, love that we are in two wars, and will do whatever they can to continue. And that includes your friendly neighbrhood representatives in Congress, such as the many members of the C Street Family, and other wackodoodles like Bachmann.

[walks]

06:59 PM on 06/01/2010

'Chaplains are there to give support to members of their own faith group and to speak with anyone who might have questions about faith.'

this quote is at the heart of the problem with out of control chaplains.

they are present, first and foremost for all service members and a distant secondarily for those of their own faith group. the author needs to simply step aside as he has no concept of the chaplain corps.

[Usama]

06:48 PM on 06/01/2010

I recall some years ago watching an inbedded MSM reporter with the troops right before they started a patrol in Baghdad when the fighting was heavy, and the commander had all of his troops around praying to Jesus and in Jesus' name. Evangelicals took over the American military chaplaincy years ago.

[hyjanks]

06:21 PM on 06/01/2010

War and religion mix very well. Mankind has spent millenia killing, raping and pillaging those who refuse to accept a particular god as the Top Critter of gods. So, it's only logical that priest and other non-combatants be placed in war zones to cheer on the troops. The only difference in modern war is that the knights are killing for oil conglomerates, not for spreading the word of a ficticious god (at least on the Christian side).

[adoantarel]

06:06 PM on 06/01/2010

I think the problem is we want chaplains like Father Malkahey from MASH, not Pat Robertson.

[SilentSolidarity]

05:17 PM on 06/01/2010

Oh please. It can only help to provide spiritual support to spiritual soldiers.

[JohnFromCensornati]

04:31 PM on 06/01/2010

"death is one logical and often inevitable outcome of the work"

I stopped reading this idi0tic article when I got to that line. Often inevitable?

[rstewart3]

09:13 PM on 06/01/2010

We all die, do we not?

[JohnFromCensornati]

09:58 PM on 06/01/2010

What is your point?