London Riots: BBC Interview Gets Testy

With all the facts so far known about the London riots -- 700 people arrested, 16,000 police on the streets, unrest in half a dozen cities over four long nights -- it's surprising how little has yet to emerge about the rioters themselves: What are they after? What drove them into the streets, for four nights straight, to burn buses and shatter windows?

Earlier Tuesday, the BBC interviewed Darcus Howe, a 68-year-old radical West Indian writer and journalist from Brixton, where some of the most violent disturbances took place over the last couple of days. Faced with a stern and flummoxed interviewer, Howe offered a rare, unvarnished glimpse into the mind of the young people in the streets this week, describing the regular mistreatment exacted upon his sons and grandsons by the police.

"Our political leaders have no idea, the police have no idea," Howe said, of the level of frustration and discontent among the youth in England.

"I don't call it rioting, I call it an insurrection of the masses of the people," he added. "It is happening in Syria, it is happening in Clapham, it is happening in Liverpool, it is happening in Port-of-Spain, Trinidad, and that is the nature of the historical moment."

WATCH:

"Do you condone what happened in your community last night?" the interviewer, Fiona Armstrong, asked Howe, over the course of an exchange in which she cut him off several times.

"Of course not! What am I going to condone it for?" Howe replied. Later, after she accused him of taking part in riots in the past, he said, "Have some respect for an old West Indian negro instead of accusing me of being a rioter."

"The BBC will never replay this," is how the video is being described online.

CORRECTION: An earlier version of this article referred to Brixton as a city. It is in fact a district in south London. The earlier version also quotes Howe as saying "hysterical moment" in the interview, but Howe confirmed that he actually said "historical moment."

Comments

[jayszip]

10:42 PM on 08/14/2011

The establsihment worked very hard for over 100 years to take away the voice and freedom of the people. This I feel applies to most modern "democracies". But the flip side of that power grab, is when the people want to be heard, they are forced to resort to mass demonstration, bodering in on violence, and anarchy. And if you don't like it, then give the people back their basic freedoms that were stolen from them, to begin with. At which time, the general population will be happy to dialouge with the powers that be.

[CFL68]

10:48 AM on 08/15/2011

What basic freedoms are people in UK lacking?

[Tulka2]

07:59 PM on 08/12/2011

Have some respect.  Indeed.  Have some respect for the people.

[The Patriot]

10:03 AM on 08/11/2011

An insurrection of the Proles! In Airstrip One!!
George Orwell would have loved this...

[Little Princess]

05:23 AM on 08/11/2011

Well, Fiona Armstrong, we do know what happened to Mr. Duggan now, don't we?!
The man killed by the police never fired a shot. Established fact.

[Pounce the Cat]

04:46 PM on 08/14/2011

Good point, but you leave out that black gun-crime in London is at an all time high. In fact more blacks youths have been killed by black gangs than have Soldiers in Afghanistan.

So back to Mark Duggen , you do know that he was on his way somewhere with a gun when he was shot. That Op Trident (the police unit set aside for black gang crime) were watching him. and that, that afternoon , the 2 men who stabbed his best friend to death in March had been released on bail. Makes you wonder just where he was going with a gun doesn't it.

[Little Princess]

03:12 AM on 08/16/2011

What I know is that there was a gun at the crime scene that didn't belong to the police and wasn't fired. What I do not know is where this guy was going to, and I doubt that anybody knows, and he's dead and can't tell. What I know is that the police did not shoot him in self-defense. What I do not know is what went through the minds of the policemen involved.

I didn't leave out anything. The interview was just badly conducted and showed the interviewers unability to deal with disagreement..

[insightdeluxe]

12:11 AM on 08/11/2011

duggan was shot in cold blood. uk is one of the mother countries of white supremacy. i liked how the announcer failed to even acknowledge the shooting and then accuse the old guy of being a rioter. good on you uk!

[JustThinkingaBit]

05:39 PM on 08/11/2011

Faved.

[Sam Bark]

02:44 AM on 08/12/2011

insightdeluxe -- Not that I care for the bloody UK, they invented imperialism..... yet this is a silly excuse for the looting, burning and mayhem?

[simsum]

11:43 PM on 08/10/2011

One thing is clear:

As the gap between the rich and the poor widens, the society becomes gradually more unstable.

History shows over and over again that the wealthy expect to maintain their status indefinitely into the future, and they are always shocked - shocked - when the poor rebel.

[Vlady]

12:44 AM on 08/11/2011

>>As the gap between the rich and the poor widens, the society becomes gradually more unstable

Bogus argument. The society in the former Soviet Union was pretty even with a free health care, education and 100% employment. And you know the rest of the story. Russia try it now the American way.

[SmokingKills]

06:28 AM on 08/11/2011

>> The society in the former Soviet Union was pretty even with a free health care, education and 100% employment­.

You're talking out of your ass, you know that right. The first part of that statement is demonstrably false. Russia - like all other authoritarian countries - was an oligarchy by the time the Soviet Union fell. And they are going down that path all over again.

100% employment in the Soviet Union? Right, and it was fairies and gnomes that brought the house down? Also their breakup probably had nothing to do with their ten year long disastrous war in Afganistan. Does that ring any bells, btw?

Read up on some history and you'll see the truth of @simsum's words.

[saileyboy]

09:54 AM on 08/13/2011

Amazing how little is known about the USSR by Americans (particularly). They were fed this diet of propaganda for so many years their heads are up their a ss es in regards to the reality.

on another note; universal health care is not free. Most western nations offer it - and it is cheaper by half than what we have here in the US, where more than a fifth have no coverage at all.

[Sam Bark]

02:48 AM on 08/12/2011

simsum -- the looting and mayhem has nothing to do with rich and poor, but with simple criminal activity and lack of moral by the thugs..... these were not poor people, that was a juvenile delinquent mob, there is no excuse for such behavior.

[CFL68]

10:50 PM on 08/10/2011

IMO there is nothing really historical about this in a progressive sense. Young hooligans riot and burn things with some regularity. Weren't Paris and other French cities burning a few years ago? WTO conferences usually bring the mobs out too. For this to be a progressive political phenomena, there would have to be some rational agenda. In north africa and middle east it is pretty clear - liberalize the political system. That obviously isn't the case in the UK.

In tough economic time the money hose gets turned off, and young poorly educated kids with a sense of entitlement break things and steal stuff. Sorry but its no excuse. By world standards, people in UK are rather well off. If you try to violently shatter the rules of society, don't be surprised if society violently defends itself.

[simsum]

11:44 PM on 08/10/2011

Yes, let them eat cake I say.

[CFL68]

01:26 AM on 08/11/2011

OK. You think its like the french revolution. I don't. We'll see I guess.

Comparing these blackberry tweeting hooligans with desperately poor french peasants of the 18th century is a bit off IMO.

Clever as all heck though...

[valkyre]

08:28 PM on 08/12/2011

In Tottenham riots started over the police killing of an unarmed black youth. Tottenham is a multi-cultural poor community with high unemployment, who suffers disproportionately from recent austerity measures, where people are subject to frequent police harassment and abuse which these riots were clearly screaming out against. Tottenham residents are isolated politically and socially from the rest of British society and the rest of the working class and even themselves, as the community represents many cultures speaking a said 300 different languages - their revolt has taken a more chaotic form then organized resistance.

This is not dissimilar from the US, where groups that attempted to organize lower-class black communities - Congress of Racial Equality, Southern Leadership Conference, Black Panthers, etc - were met with assassination and police terrorism, (as documented by revelations contained in the US government's COINTELPRO papers) and criminal gangs have become the predominant default organizer. Our revolts could look a lot like Tottenham.

(http://www.truth-out.org/when-riot-revolt/1313008260)

[CFL68]

11:30 PM on 08/12/2011

Sounds romantic. Thats a nice narrative. Too bad other poor people around the world don't get free education, healthcare, and plenty of other social programs like the poor downtrodden blackberry tweeting underprivileged of the UK.

Heck, I think I'll go smash the corner grocers windows and burn his store!

[politicky]

07:57 PM on 08/10/2011

Dear UK,

I think the class war ignition was years ago, this is liftoff.

[Vlady]

12:48 AM on 08/11/2011

...towards Greece or Portugal

[blindfolded]

07:48 PM on 08/10/2011

Thinking the people screaming racism are the only racists, because people of all color suffer injustice today. Anyways, insurrection is worldwide, and if you read God’s Word you wouldn’t be saying, I have no idea what’s happening. Peace

[noudidnt]

02:51 PM on 08/11/2011

G F Y, Beck.

[lubell36]

07:41 PM on 08/10/2011

Chicago, Are Britain’s riots an example of what Chicago can expect?

http://www.urbaninsuranceagency.com/insurance-articles/1128/chicago-are-britainand8217%3bs-riots-an-example-of-what-chicago-can-expect%3f.html

[KriTiKiT]

06:26 PM on 08/10/2011

You got my Respect!

[noudidnt]

05:15 PM on 08/10/2011

Your eyes are fine.

Www.dailymail.uk.co

[MissRoseNylund]

11:26 PM on 08/10/2011

spam

[deese64]

04:22 PM on 08/10/2011

Sounds like London is having the beginnings of a civil rights movement.

[maccas83]

09:42 PM on 08/10/2011

Ridiculous. The UK has always been more tolerant than the US. We banned slavery a full 50 years before the 'Land of the Free' did and have led the way when it comes to liberal society.

[Lauren Kottwitz]

02:43 PM on 08/13/2011

Civil rights doesn't only apply to race relations.

[Tatters]

04:07 PM on 08/10/2011

Racism is alive and well and has gained confidence in these globally tough economic times.

[So-Clean]

04:29 PM on 08/10/2011

the internet offers a backstage pass into the world of racism eh

[QueueRS]

06:43 PM on 08/10/2011

Yes racism is alive and well. As shown we now have racists running around attacking people that are not white.

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2011/08/483304.html