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Occupy Wall Street Members Say They Welcome Solidarity But Don't Want To Be Co-Opted

Occupy Wall Street Cooptation

First Posted: 10/06/11 08:00 PM ET Updated: 12/06/11 05:12 AM ET

As labor unions and some Democratic Party politicians express support for the Occupy Wall Street movement, the core group of occupiers themselves are increasingly facing the question of whether too much mainstream support could dampen their radical message.

Protestors seem generally appreciative of the increasing union support for the movement -- but more wary of Democrats and establishment figures getting involved.

"We're very excited to have our union brothers and sisters march on the heart of greed," spokesman Patrick Bruner told HuffPost before a 10,000-strong Wednesday march organized in coordination with labor.

“We don’t necessarily think that the way they’re structured is the best,” Bruner said, referring to the unions' top-down organizational style. "But we believe the 99% needs a voice, and they're one of the few remaining."

Other movement members are skeptical of whether people like Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke can claim to understand the protesters.

Bernanke discussed the movement on Tuesday, saying the protesters "blame, with some justification, the problems in the financial sector for getting us into this mess, and they’re dissatisfied with the policy response here in Washington. And at some level, I can’t blame them."

"Nice to know he feels he has to say that," replied David Graeber, an anarchist anthropologist who has been involved with the protests from the beginning. "Otherwise meaningless."

"Obviously we welcome support from anyone," Graeber continued in an email, "but yes, [being co-opted is] a serious concern because a huge part of our message is our own internal democracy. The moment you even have a funding base it seriously limits what people feel they can say and do. And a top-down organization will always try to co-opt you. So we have to be very careful and insist people come on our terms or not at all."

Occupy Wall Street's terms may seem alien for people who are used to expressing themselves through unions or Democratic party politics. Unions rely on elections, shop stewards, and rigid grievance procedures to correct problems. The General Assemblies in New York's Zuccotti Park operate on a consensus model, with decisions emerging from a "progressive stack" speaking order that seeks to ensure "women and traditionally marginalized groups speak before men, especially white men."

Occupy Wall Street's style of protest, moreover, has much more in common with the 1999 anti-globalization protests in Seattle than it does with most unions' cautious demonstrations. The group spends nights camped out in "Liberty Square" and days on unpermitted marches. Despite their differences, union members and the people behind Occupy Wall Street say they have found common cause in opposing Wall Street's assault on "the 99%."

Jonathan Willson, a 21-year-old student who attends Johnson State College in Vermont, found himself in New York City's Foley Square on Wednesday night for a solidarity rally. No union member himself, he was surrounded by thousands from the labor movement and wore a DC 37 Local 372 trucker hat he'd been given the night before.

Since Monday, Willson had camped out with friends from school, alongside several hundred other occupiers in Zuccotti Park. "It's a little hard to find a place to sleep now," he explained.

Willson believes fighting Wall Street is more important than quibbling with union organization charts. "Hierarchy can't be a priority right now," he said.

Unions, meanwhile, are lining up to back Occupy Wall Street. In just the past few days, major organizations like the Communication Workers of America, the AFL-CIO and AFSCME have voiced support for the protesters' targets, if not all of their methods.

TWU Local 100 President John Samuelsen, whose union made headlines after it was forced to bus protesters from the Brooklyn Bridge to prison, said he was happy to lend his union's support.

"Wall Street got bailed out after the recession. American working families didn't get bailed out," Samuelsen said at the Wednesday rally.

Samuelsen has been extremely critical of the NYPD's orders to bus drivers to transport the prisoners. Still, he continued, "these aren't rallies about police brutality. These are peaceful rallies with working families coming out here to say enough's enough, we need jobs, we needs jobs for us and for our kids."

Just hours after Samuelsen spoke to HuffPost, younger protesters broke off from the union rally and forced a confrontation with the NYPD that resulted in a wild melee of pepper-spraying and baton-wielding. Twenty-eight people went to jail.

As The New York Times noted on Wednesday, some in the union movement are "wary of being embarrassed by the far-left activists in the group who have repeatedly denounced the United States government."

Occupy Wall Street members, meanwhile, say they believe both unions and the movement can benefit from cautious collaboration.

"We have no trouble with allies as long as they don't corrupt the process," Graeber said. "There can be a great synergy if we are pressure from their left so they can get their reforms and they intervene to keep us out of jail ... but organizationally it's critical to keep them apart."

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As labor unions and some Democratic Party politicians express support for the Occupy Wall Street movement, the core group of occupiers themselves are increasingly facing the question of whether too mu...
As labor unions and some Democratic Party politicians express support for the Occupy Wall Street movement, the core group of occupiers themselves are increasingly facing the question of whether too mu...
 
 
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02:16 AM on 10/18/2011
“The adoption of Democracy as a form of Government by all European nations is fatal to good Government, to liberty, to law and order, to respect for authority, and to religion, and must eventually produce a state of chaos from which a new world tyranny will arise.”
Duke of Northumberland 1931

A good politician under democracy is quite as unthinkable as an honest burglar.
H.L. Mencken
02:08 AM on 10/18/2011
America is the Titanic, and it's going down regardless what the people do. We ran our course like all civilizations do, from a Constitutional Republic to a Democracy (rule by the rich through universal schooling and mass media). What comes next? You guessed it if you have a little education, WAR.
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Leah Watts
08:16 AM on 10/13/2011
Disappointed that no one seems to be emphasizing VOTING in this exercise, especially since much mischief is being done by various Republican-powered states' legislatures to restrict or even deny the votes to some of this demographic. This could backfire badly. I hope people realise that.
02:19 AM on 10/18/2011
Voting makes no difference, seriously..
04:08 PM on 10/12/2011
I lost all respect for them when the unions got involved.
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muddywood
First the truth, then opinion.
01:07 PM on 10/10/2011
So this weekend, my daughter and I were driving to the store in our sleepy little suburb, and what do I see? I see a group of people holding signs standing on the corner of the busiest intersecti­on. As I approach, the first sign i see reads "Smash Capitalism - Support Communism"­.
Well, as the son of someone that fought communists in Hungary, I was not going to let this go unanswered­. My daughter and I went to Home Depot(Evil Corporatio­n) bought supplies to make signs, made our signs and proceeded to counter-pro­test the "occupiers­"
My 8 year old made her sign that said "America is Good" and I made my sign that said "Capitalis­m equals Freedom" and "Restore the Constituti­on" on the other side.
We positioned ourselves ahead of the "Occupiers­" and excersised our 1st Amendment Rights.
Lots of thumbs up and Horn honking.
We even had 5 different people get out of their cars to thank us for what we were doing.
I was a good lesson for my daughter.
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Its Over
when I say so
06:27 AM on 10/10/2011
What a stark contrast to the Tea Party which was not only started but immediately co-opted
to do the bidding of global conglomerates.
11:47 PM on 10/09/2011
"We're very excited to have our union brothers and sisters march on the heart of greed," spokesman Patrick Bruner told HuffPost"

Dangerous combo.

What Bruner and the rest of the occupiers don't realize is this... the unions are as much the heart of the greed as the big bankers and corporations they're 'marching on'.
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Its Over
when I say so
06:28 AM on 10/10/2011
How so? Be specific using facts to show how unions are as much at the heart of the greed as the big bankers.
10:43 AM on 10/10/2011
Reposted ..specifics.
_____


"The thug union bosses and their members don't care enough about the survival of this country to make even the smallest of sacrifices.
They proved that in Wisconsin when they were asked to donate a small amount of their own money to their retirements.
They not only refused to take a little of the burden off the taxpayers.. they became destructive and violent in their refusal."

Clearly, the union infested schools are (brainwashing) teaching our children that capitalism and success are a bad thing...
OWS.. "kick off the bedroom slippers and march on" [against any financially successful American who isn't union] ~ Union owned Barack Hussein Obama

OWS (the brainwashed) along with protesting the 'banks and banksters'.. should be protesting the greedy, America crushing unions.
Instead, they walk with them.. arm in arm.
They're walking with a group that has become one of America's greatest enemies.
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ronp121
09:46 PM on 10/09/2011
One thing I like about this occupy wall street is that you have republicans, democrats, independents, young, and old and even the tea party making a statement together. If not anything Congress should take a look and see how different parties work together. They may although I doubt it but they may learn something about how to run a government.
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Si1ver1ock
the bread of wickedness, the wine of violence
09:25 PM on 10/09/2011
Crowd dynamics can be tricky but effective. Here is what you do:
Get some people together at least ten but hopfully more, then march out to where people can see you, the center of the protest. At this point, start chanting loudly. You need a good chant something short like:
"Wall Street Sales Tax!"
"Wall Street Sales Tax!"
"Wall Street Sales Tax!"
"Hurray!"(gotta take a breather)
then chant some more.
Have a few of your cohort hold up signs that say "Tax Wall Street"

If you are lucky people will join in and soon you will have thousands of people chanting :
"Wall Street Sales Tax!"
"Wall Street Sales Tax!"

Get bumper stickers that say Tax Wall Street and put them everywhere, limos, corporate jets, Fox News Vans. Everywhere.

Get some Tee-Shirts that say "Tax Wall Street" or "Wall Street Sales Tax" or "I pay sales taxes. Why can't Wall street..

Anyway they make fine souvenirs.

And then, it is On to Other Occupations.
Occupy Washington?
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SuperDaveOsborn
02:47 PM on 10/09/2011
Bernanke & his predecessor cousin are happily lining their pockets with our misery, while we stand by idly with placards and other signs !

What we need is a firestorm of protest nationwide & the National Guard joining in with the crowds instead of disbursing us, and THEN what will our leaders do? .....
06:11 AM on 10/09/2011
We, the people of the United States of America, considering the crisis at hand, now reassert our sovereign control of our land. We Are The 99% that will no longer tolerate the greed and corruption of the 1%
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SuperDaveOsborn
02:49 PM on 10/09/2011
Where are you ? HOPEFULLY out in the streets gathering up others for a nationwide protest; otherwise, forget about it !
03:51 PM on 10/09/2011
Yes I was Occupy Buffalo
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robertstone1robert
My micro bio is too big.
10:16 PM on 10/08/2011
Last week three things happened which gave me long thoughtful moments. I read Mark Twain's "Innocents Abroad," Wall St. protesters hosted bigots and anti-Semites and my cousin's emergency hospitalization in Louisville, Ky, Jewish Hospital, The first thing about there about eight Jews in all of Ky. The first they do is build a hospital for for everyone. Then I thought about the anti-Semites protesting. The last thing I thought about its cause. Let me tell you at the outset far bigger and better brains worked on this problem. I thought that there are those who imbibe this with their mother's milk. To them I say any bigotry is a sure of no brains. You have a ready-made scapegoat whom you can blame for all failures, without the need to think of your own solutions. To those whom some Jew offended why is he lumped together, unlike any other individual. To those who are partisans in the Mid-east dispute read "Innocents Abroad." Mark Twain certainly had no stake there. He was only chronicling travels. He objectively describes what he saw. He characterizes the Holy land, occupied by the Turkish Ottomans for hundreds of yrs., as a wasteland, complete devastation. It is only after the Jews came, drained the swamps and made the land bloom that the Arabs came and to take the land from the Jews. I suggest some history and not be misled by the bigotry and you've been fed.
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KaAp
07:19 PM on 10/09/2011
Wall Street protestors hosted no such thing. And, many of us are Jewish. I am glad you appreciate the things my people have done in Kentucky and in other places. There were no antisemities protesting. If you mean the youtube video it was a Jewish kid arguing with an Orthodox guy (and we have signifiers we call those in the group ... but it was video-ed for other purposes) the kid's name was Klein.
The speaker from Eqypt is a nation that still has a peace treaty with the nation of my son's biological father who was a sabra (may he rest in peace) .. you are missing the point and you apparently do not understand the Jewish people ... we are part and have been part of social movements and we are mostly very progressive.
07:28 PM on 10/11/2011
Quoting Twain out of context on Palestine

http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Articles/Story845.html

The link above describes the dishonest and misleading way that Twain's commentary is used by Zionists to sell the lie that Palestine was uninhabited prior to Zionist mass immigration.

Among the points made are that

1) the route Twain traveled is still sparsely populated and not arable land.
2) When Twain passed through Palestinian towns that were located in arable land such as Nablus and Jaffa he described these places as being fertile and cultivated.
3) Twain also described the countries of Greece and Syria as being desolate and barren yet no one today quotes Twain to claim that Greece and Syria do not belong to Greeks and Syrians.
4) Twain was often quite racist in his commentary.
5) Twain was also antisemitic yet Zionists on the internet never mention this.
6) Other nineteenth century writers who visited Palestine described the land as being populated and fertile.
7) Palestine by 1900 had a population of four hundred thousand Arabs by 1860 and six hundred thousand Arabs by 1900.

You may follow my link for details.

To the points made on that website I would add one of my own which is that Twain was criticizing the ignorance of American tourists and pilgrims who saw what they wanted to see instead of what was actually there. I think many Christian Zionists are guilty of the same thing today.
05:41 PM on 10/08/2011
Have you noticed?

At every TEA party rally there is always a great big, beautiful sea of red, white and blue.
American flags of every size are proudly displayed by the patriotic, America loving ralliers.

Unnecessary bailouts, high taxes and out of control spending are what they attack (the government, in other words)..not our country.

How many American flags do you see being carried by the left wing/commie/socialist Occupy Wall Street protesters in NY and across the nation?

Are they protesting to help save our country..or do they protest only to enrich themselves with other people's money... helping to fulfill obama's dream of redistribution?
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pmoschetta
Where are the Jobs, Speaker Boehner?
06:22 PM on 10/08/2011
Here is what I have noticed:

The misinformed, the misaligned, and miscommunicated all seem to have made a comparison to the Tea Party demonstrations where there is no comparsion to be made. The Tea Party was corporate financed, they went home at night to sleep in the beds, and only demonstrated before a political audience
10:45 AM on 10/09/2011
The only thing you wrote on which I agree is that there is no comparison between the Tea Party rallies and the OWS.

No one paid me or any other TEA party rallier to attend the gatherings.
No one bussed us in. That's what unions do. They bus in their leftwing agitators.. 90% of whom have no clue as to why they're even at the demonstrations...until the union thugs hand them the posters they're suppose to carry.
Those who can read then know why they're in attendance.

We (the TEA Party ralliers) gathered because wanted to stand up for this country against the government's outrageous over spending (on both sides) and socialism, and that's what we did. We want to save this country for future generations.

Unlike OWS..we're not professional agitators who have nothing better to do with our time than lay around the streets for weeks on end..breaking laws, breaking into buildings, assaulting the police and defecating on police cars.

We're simply Americans who love this country and want to do our part to save it from bankruptcy and a tyrannical government known as the Obama administration.
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Michael Steaphens
It's all about liberty.
02:52 AM on 10/10/2011
"The Tea Party was corporate financed" No,we raise our own monies when needed.
"...they went home at night to sleep in the beds..." Yeah,it's because of that got to work the next day thing.I believe you have the TEA Party wrong there,holmes.
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edejan
09:05 PM on 10/08/2011
If you only look at the world with Faux-colored glasses, you'll never see what's going on.
11:36 AM on 10/09/2011
You who are convinced that FOX news reports one side of the news are very misguided. Do they have opinion driven shows?
Yes..but they're not the majority by any stretch.

There's a reason FOX destroys all others in the ratings and has for many years.

FOX reports ALL the news.. not just the news that protects and favors the politicians of their choice.

I've watched enough of the other channels (when there was no choice/FOX) to know that there is zero fairness in any of them.
The MSM's mission is not to bring you the news.. creating a well informed populace..it's to protect liberal politicians.

That's why all you leftwing posters are so ill informed...and are surprised when you hear that union thugs attacked a black conservative at a political event...that a union thug shot a man trying to protect his personal property from the thug's destruction of said property (a man who said NO to the unions.. he didn't want to be part of them)...that Eric Holder is buried in the Fast and Furious scandal up to his eyeballs and will not prosecute black criminals.

That Pelosi thought it cute when she said.. "You have to pass the bill to know what's in it."

What the hell kind of a nation's press lets her (and Holder and Obama) get away with such corruption?
The MSM. How sad for America.
04:58 PM on 10/08/2011
I am pleased to here Independents and Republican voters are joining in on this important protest.

We play by two different set of laws when it comes to many big Wall Street firms. When they commit a major fraud for a billion dollars they get fined for a small potion of their profits they made from the fraud and get no jail or admit to any wrong doing. This is called a None Prosecution Agreement that is used at a record pace with NYC Federal Prosecutors.

Any of us would be in prison for many years but now the government and the law of the land allows Frauds to take place and we pick up the tab when things go bad and the criminals still make a massive profit after the government fines them.

This protest cannot be defined as one specific item that is wrong with our Government and Wall Street but it is a very long list of abuse and decisions made that have them live under different laws that are not Democratic at all !

All politicians remained quiet after the the Supreme Court Decision last spring to allow unlimited political contributions by business .

We have lost the true meaning of our vote and almost every politician is corrupt regardless of what party they belong to.

Stand up my Brothers and Sisters this is your country and we can all agree things need to be changed BADLY.
oilfield
large employer per obamacare
01:43 AM on 10/09/2011
so if corporate contributions would be limited would union contributions be also?
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KaAp
07:04 PM on 10/09/2011
There is a difference and it would be intellectually disingenuous to think otherwise between corporate capital which is designed to protect corporate interests ... and yes I know citizens united has created corporate citizenship but I am sure I would never let my son and/or daughter marry one ... and I doubt if Texas would execute a corporation.
Unions are comprised of working people banding together to fight collectively for their rights as workers. Unions gave us the middle class.
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noknrc
happy to be retired
02:23 PM on 10/08/2011
I respect what these people are trying to accomplish but I feel they are wasting their time. They are trying to get politicians to go after the very people that fund their campaigns. This applies to both parties. Then you have lobbyist groups that donate to politicians and political parties. The left believes that the democrat party represents the working middle class. I hate to let you down but they have moved away from the true middle class over the last 10 years. The republicans represent the rich and upper income working class and the democrats favor the poor and those on entitlement programs and then add the minorities. The true middle class is actually representing themselves that is what actually allowed the independent party to grow as much as it has. The democrats and the republicans do not control enough votes within their own party of registered voters to win an election. The latest stats say each party controls about 30% of the voting public. The independents have become the winning factor. Both parties try to play up to this group to win support.I feel if the independent party continues to grow in strength it will start running their own candidates and actually start winning seats in congress and eventually the white house.
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tominnyc
03:28 PM on 10/08/2011
Feelings nothing more than feelings

take action esp when congress gets back

block the doors until they act

no party just which side are you on, no?
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SuperDaveOsborn
02:51 PM on 10/09/2011
There you go Tom !
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pmoschetta
Where are the Jobs, Speaker Boehner?
06:25 PM on 10/08/2011
The Civil Rights Movement of the 60's is what brought forth the changes that were long overdo for the minorities in this country. The Vietnam War protests brought forth the end of that long conflict.
In order to change politics by the people, especially in a government that no longer listens to the people and instead corporations and their money, people need to demonstrate, and demonstrate their frustrations.
This is only the beginning, noknrc. The fight has only begun
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SuperDaveOsborn
02:52 PM on 10/09/2011
AMEN !!!