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The GOP's 'Uncertainty' Talking Point, Debunked

First Posted: 11/11/11 07:20 PM ET Updated: 11/13/11 10:13 AM ET

WASHINGTON -- With the economy in a slump for nearly four years, corporate executives and conservative politicians have repeatedly invoked "uncertainty" as a major barrier to American job-creation. The "uncertainty" jab is a go-to talking point for any congressional Republican looking to tag President Barack Obama as a tax-raising, regulation-obsessed foe of American businesses.

But according to banking data compiled by economic research firm Moebs Services, the uncertainty plaguing the American economy has nothing to do with government regulations or taxes on millionaires. It's an uncertainty driven squarely by consumers and small-businesses who are worried about their short-term financial prospects. And it's been going on since well before Obama took up residence in the White House.

Since the end of 2007, bank customers have pulled over $900 billion out of certificates of deposits at major U.S. banks, parking their money in checking accounts and money market deposit accounts. Banks pay customers interest to park their money in CDs, but pay out next-to-nothing for money market accounts, and still less -- usually nothing -- for checking accounts.

"These are enormous shifts," Moebs Services founder and Chairman Mike Moebs told HuffPost. "We haven't seen stuff like this since the 1930s."

Money market and checking accounts offer consumers the ability to withdraw their money quickly, while CDs require the funds to be locked up for years. And that heavy reliance on short-term cash indicates a tremendous amount of uncertainty among the American public about the future -- people with jobs are uncertain about whether they will have one in a year, people without jobs have to pay the bills and don't know how long their unemployment checks will keep coming in.

"People are beginning to realize that zero is a good number if the alternative is a negative number," said Ed Friedman, a director at Moody's Analytics.

The total balance of retail CDs -- interest-bearing accounts targeting ordinary consumers -- has fallen by about $350 billion since the end of 2007. Checking accounts, meanwhile, have climbed by an almost identical amount over the same time period -- jumping from $620 billion to $960 billion, an increase of over 50 percent, which has occurred despite repeated threats from big banks to charge new checking fees.

Another $570 billion has been pulled from "jumbo" CDs -- bigger CD accounts that are used by the wealthy or businesses -- while money market deposit account balances have jumped from $3.9 trillion to $5.7 trillion, suggesting an additional flow of money from other investments, like the stock market and mutual funds.

"People continue to be very pessimistic," said economist Dean Baker, co-Director of the Center for Economic Policy and Research, noting that economic conditions like the trouble in Europe could dramatically disrupt financial markets in the near future. "It wouldn't be irrational to stay out now."

This rush to easily accessed, low-paying accounts is a symptom of the recession itself. When people are out of work, they cannot afford the luxury of having their money tied up in longer-term investments. The bills have to be paid.

The shift in consumer banking behavior has also tracked an overall stagnation in the federal money supply, making the change all the more significant.

Moebs runs calculations that correspond to a measure of the total supply of money that the Federal Reserve ceased to cover during the Bush years, once known as the "M3" metric. The metric aggregates the currency in peoples' pocketbooks, checking accounts, CDs, money market accounts and other assets that were viewed as highly liquid prior to the current recession. And according to Moebs, that supply of money has gone from $10.6 trillion in 2007 to $11.3 trillion in the first quarter of 2011 -- an increase of less than 2 percent per year. That compares to an increase of more than 9 percent over the course of 2007 alone.

This kind of uncertainty -- a lack of consumer confidence -- can become a self-fulfilling prophecy. When consumers pull their money out of longer-term investments, banks are reluctant to make longer-term loans, which in turn can hamper businesses, which become reluctant to hire without access to credit. The government can, in fact, take steps to alleviate the kind of uncertainty by boosting demand in the economy -- essentially, spending government money. But with congressional Republicans vilifying government spending on a regular basis, this prospect has been unlikely for years.

"It's really a function of the liquidity trap," said Josh Bivens, an economist with the Economic Policy Institute, a liberal think-tank. "We have way too little spending in the economy, which is why we have low interest rates across the board. But then once you see interest rates piling up near the zero-bound, uncertainty is going to drive people to cash."

The Federal Reserve, however, has options. The Fed has kept interest rates low for years, and resorted to exotic maneuvers to encourage consumers and companies to spend money and boost the economy. But since 2008, the Fed has actually paid banks to park their excess reserves at the central bank, rather than lend them out into the economy. If the Fed wanted that money to make its way to consumers and businesses and stimulate job growth, it could simply reverse its policy -- instead of paying banks interest on excess reserves, it could charge them fees. At present, banks can actually make money by doing nothing with their money. If there were a penalty for doing nothing, banks would work harder to find good loan candidates.

"The money doesn't end up going out into the marketplace," Nomi Prins, former managing director for Goldman Sachs, said. "It would make sense to reverse the policy."

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WASHINGTON -- With the economy in a slump for nearly four years, corporate executives and conservative politicians have repeatedly invoked "uncertainty" as a major barrier to American job-creation. Th...
WASHINGTON -- With the economy in a slump for nearly four years, corporate executives and conservative politicians have repeatedly invoked "uncertainty" as a major barrier to American job-creation. Th...
 
 
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COMMUNITY PUNDITS
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MrBadExample 04:09 PM on 11/13/2011
Sorry, folks--you cannot 'debunk' GOP talking points, no matter how ridiculous they are. The older generation of Repubs are still holding onto the 'JFK stole the 1960 election in Chicago' lie, even though Nixon still would've lost even if Illinois flipped his way. And the McCarthy-led anti-Democratic meme of '20 years of treason' (blaming 'communists' in the FDR administration for 'losing' Eastern Europe  Read More...
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RepublicanDepression
Of the Greedy One Percent, by the 1%, for the 1%
05:23 PM on 11/19/2011
The GOP (Greedy One Percent) attempted to blame Democrats for problems they created?

I'm shocked. Shocked.
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
08:07 PM on 11/16/2011
cont.. from below.. how bad is this "problem" that justifies allowing govt. to interfere in an extremely successful system that, again, has clearly proved itself to be so in your situation??

And you continue to imply that I can't have a valid opinion about business if I'm not a business owner. You seemed to have some opinions earlier about abortion, gay marriage, pot smoking .. if you are not personally involved in these issues, your opinions are unqualified.. according to your logic. So, I assume you have no opinions on anything that you are not personally involved in. And if you do, you surely don't believe your opinions are correct.. they couldn't be.. right?

Try just debating the points.. and let yours and mine speak for themselves.. for some reason, you don't want to do that.
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
08:07 PM on 11/16/2011
@Steinpiaz.. I'm responding to your last comment to me here because the reply buttons have disappeared. You said "Don't you think you are reading quite a bit into my post. I never said anything about what anybody else, the "conservative right," "liberals" or, for that matter, Space Aliens are paying their employees. I simply stated what I pay and why I do (which was that it works in my vested self interest to do so). "

You still didn't answer my question.. what was your point against me?? Why did you "put your 2cents in" and tell me why you pay your employees well and then procede to accuse me of not knowing what I'm talking about?? What exactly was I "talking" about??

The Left wing / Right wing thing is what it all really comes down to.. hence your opposition to me and my comments.. right? So, still waiting for your explaination of your opposition and arrogant attack of my "unqualified" business related opinions. Where did I claim that workers shouldn't be compensated well?? What exactly are you arguing for?? Higher taxes on the wealthy? Govt. regulations that force "fair" pay?? And who are these people who are treating their workers unfairly? can you give specific examples of those who don't measure up to your generous practices? And what percentage of employers fall into this category? In other words..
10:40 PM on 11/17/2011
It was probably unfair to get on your case about it as you are entitled to your opinion. The reason I stuck my 2 cents in was that I've been having this exact conversation recently and it has gotten fairly frustrating. I have 4 friends who are "tea party" people, one is a retired government bureaucrat, one works in a hospital kitchen and 2 are housewives. I know and love them on a personal level, but the whole issue is starting to drive me crazy. Not one of the "tea party" people I know has ever owned a business or created a job in their life, yet they are constantly telling me what "job creators" want. On the other hand, I work with about 40 small owner operated businesses (customers and suppliers) and NONE of them mention "taxes" "over regulation," "tort reform" or "unions" as even being issues. Our big problem right now is nobody has money to buy anything. That's our concern (and why we aren't hiring).

On taxes, it is embarrassing how little I pay. Virtually everything I do is tax deductible. I know people getting W2's that make 1/4th what I do but they're paying twice as much. Which, I do think is wrong (I can't reply to your other questions as I'm out of room).
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
07:01 PM on 11/18/2011
I can understand where you're coming from but just because you haven't heard any other business owners complain or express concern, that doesn't mean it's not a factor. Common sense is highly underrated I think among many today. People have opinions about lots of things and it is based on their reasoning. And debating is a great way of either validating or disproving that reasoning.. and often by those who actually live the experience as you do. So far, who's doing anything wrong? I think it's wrong to dismiss opinions based on anything other than reasoning or facts that disproves the actual point. It really shouldn't matter what background or experience they have.. just disprove the point. And really, your only argument is your own experience (which can be an exception) and that you haven't heard anyone else support the assertions. I argue based on common sense.. and I cannot logically see how the possibility of higher taxes, the existence of difficult regulations.. the possibility of additional regulations, unions and tort reform cannot affect a business owners decisions. These all have DIRECT affects on businesses. It's not REASONABLE to make the assumption that these things are not a factor.
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
07:10 PM on 11/18/2011
"Our big problem right now is nobody has money to buy anything. That's our concern (and why we aren't hiring)."

You've described your business as being very successful. So, higher taxes may not be much concern to you.. but many businesses are just getting by.. they are not doing so well that they can pay as you do. They don't want to hire anyone if they have to turn around and let them go later because of added taxes / expenses. They might have to then pay unemployment benefits making their situation even more difficult.
You are right, lots more people today have no money to buy anything. How to fix that? More jobs. How can we get more jobs? One great way would be if the govt. became business friendly, letting up on taxes and regulations.. giving owners the confidence and security to hire. The problem is that we do not have a business friendly administration.
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
07:12 PM on 11/16/2011
@ Swimbiker.. I'm responding here because the "reply" buttons in our thread mysteriously disappeared. You said: "Capitalism without government interference is nothing but sheer greed and wild profit-taking at the expense of the majority of workers. You evidently do not know the definition of socialism for you think it has to do with any efforts by people to help others. WWJD?"

I'm so glad you asked "WWJD".. First, you are wrong.. capitalism is extremely successful, that IS what has given this country the elite status that we have in the world. Your "sheer greed and wild profit-taking" assertions are exceptions.. no system is perfect. And there is none better than that which the Right are trying so hard to preserve despite aggressive liberal leftist efforts to implement a PROVEN failed system of socialism. Using fringe minority examples do not justify ditching the system and moving to another that will make things worse. cont..
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
07:20 PM on 11/16/2011
Yours/ the Lefts efforts to use govt. to implement your idea of social "justice" or "fairness" based on these few exceptions will destroy this country and the system that made us great. The system that ENCOURAGES people to come here for a better way of life. Your idea of fairness will level UNFAIR actions against those who are not participating in the "greed and wild profit making" "attrocities". What would Jesus do? Here's an example of what fairness really is... WITHOUT the interference of envy and bias. In Matthew 20 1-16 Jesus tells the story of the vineyard workers and the land owner. He hires people in the morning and promises to pay them 1 denarius for a days work. As the day progresses, he hires more workers up until the end of the day. When it's time to get paid the workers see that the ones hired later in the day (who did less work) got paid 1 denarius. So, they automatically expected to get paid more because.. now pay attention here.. this is what THEY deemed to be "fair". And guess what? They got paid the same amount... " When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner. cont..
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
07:32 PM on 11/16/2011
12 ‘These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’

13 “But he answered one of them, ‘I am not being unfair to you, friend. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius? 14 Take your pay and go. I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you. 15 Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’ "

Especially pertinent... "15 Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? "

Jesus is addressing "fairness" and "rights" here. They go together. If you take away another's rights, there is no fairness.
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freedom is right
Just tired of all the liberal bias and hypocrisy
04:38 PM on 11/16/2011
Oh my gosh Liberals.. please stop running to govt. to FORCE you idea of social "justice".. just try doing it through a free democratic society. That works too.. and it works BETTER. That's why we are the best country in the world! Get a clue liberals. Giving govt. MORE power to take our freedoms away is NOT the answer! Familiarize yourself with actual world history (and the present) and you'll see.
jparikh1
My micro-bio is half empty.
09:11 PM on 12/11/2011
Only in "Real America" does eliminating free riders equate to taking away people's freedoms.
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jobscabin
Starry Eyed Liberal King
08:35 AM on 11/16/2011
“Mayor Bloomberg spoke to this "uncertain­ty" issue, blaming with both Parties and both the White House and the Congress. But his view of the uncertaint­y is that the Corporatio­ns are sitting on their stockpiles of cash due to the uncertaint­y of whether the Republican Party will be able to continue to block any legislatio­n or not. Why invest for the future if the GOP can keep on doing what they are doing? Why not wait and see if enough voters buy into their spiel and actually do away with the EPA, SEC, DOE, etc? Investing in dirty technology is profitable and cheap, that's what interests Corporatio­ns.”
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billy goat
Sniffing Out Bad Cheese Everywhere!
07:49 PM on 11/15/2011
What is described above is exactly how I feel and behave.
Whoahox
Let's go Mets!
07:20 PM on 11/15/2011
What has been "debunked" by Romney, Cain, Perry and the other usual culprits is the long-standing rumor that the GOP has something constructive to recommend.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
thecreeksedge
06:09 PM on 11/15/2011
The low interest rates are not stimulating the economy because consumers aren't sure what will happen to the money they have left. Those who have managed finances competently by saving money have been frustrated for years by the low interest rates. Encouraging people to load up on more credit these days is absolutely foolish...and it's not working.
HUFFPOST PUNDIT
swimbiker
09:22 AM on 11/16/2011
they're trying to create demand for products. Demand is what is lacking these days.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Dax baxter
searching for an honest liberal
05:28 PM on 11/15/2011
Why don't Puff Blo get some bloggers that are out of the third grade and know something about economics. The whole premise of this article is wrong. Examine WHY small businesses are worried about their short term financial prospects.............Taxes and regulations making their businesses less profitable because of the cost associated with implementing the regulations. And is Obama talking about higher taxes (increased revenue) Why yes he is. So Puff Blo states the problem in different terms but the underlying reasons are exactly as the republicans have been saying. But that doesn't really line up with Puff Blo's real intent...that of carrying Obama's water.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
axoaxo
100% public financing of elections!
05:34 PM on 11/15/2011
guess you made it to the fourth, anyway

demand drives business hiring and investment ~ not tax bracket
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Dax baxter
searching for an honest liberal
05:39 PM on 11/15/2011
An MBA from Princeton and own my own business. But you as a union thug probably have all the answers that nobody's asking.
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billy goat
Sniffing Out Bad Cheese Everywhere!
07:54 PM on 11/15/2011
This make sense to me as one of those people who has money but is not spending or taking any risks right now. I've got a good job and a good income. I'd love to pick a second home for retirement, but I'm uncomfortable that my future prospects could dim. At a more confident point in the cycle, I might be inclined to take a risk. Not now though. My hesitation has nothing to do with regulations or taxes. My hesitation has to do with not trusting the future. The result is no demand for goods and services.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
dannydmc
Liberalism/Socialism/Communism are all the same
02:52 PM on 11/15/2011
Debunked by a liberal economist, oooohhhh.

Seeing as how the liberal plan is to not make a budget for three years and then when spending record amounts of money say that the plan will be paid for by "Savings" that will happen in the future...I think I'll choose not to agree with the liberal rubbish
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
dino139
08:42 PM on 11/15/2011
Moebs $ervices is not "a liberal economist". They are a for profit economic research and consulting FIRM servicing the financial services industry. From their website:

"Moebs $ervices specializes in providing managers and directors of banks, credit unions and savings institutions with the data and the understanding necessary to generate growth and retain—or regain—competitiveness for their organizations."

The report cited in the article is reality based, unlike your comments.
HUFFPOST PUNDIT
swimbiker
09:30 AM on 11/16/2011
fanned for trying to get some reality and facts into the heads of people who just want to denigrate anyone with ideas from a different perspective.
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JMKeynes
Democratic Party Operative
02:46 PM on 11/15/2011
This quote is a lie:

"But since 2008, the Fed has actually paid banks to park their excess reserves at the central bank, rather than lend them out into the economy . . ."

The source of the quote isn’t clear. The last paragraph mentions GoldmanSachs, the firm that paid a record $550 million to the SEC to settle a fraud investigation last year.

The Fed doesn't pay banks to persuade them not to lend. They pay 0.25% customary interest on deposits. Banks don't lend for a reason but not because the Fed is offering them a better deal.

Banks aren't making money by depositing excess reserves at the Fed. They're losing money because the 0.25% interest doesn't even keep pace with inflation which slowly eats away at the deposits.

Banks would make more money by lending at 5% but they’ve become overly cautious.

The Fed tried strategies to encourage lending. Republicans ordered them to stop.

Suggesting that the Fed should charge banks a fee for holding deposits is outlandish. It would set a precedent for allowing negative interest rates. Right now they can't go below zero. If the Fed charges banks a "fee", banks will just pass it along to you.

What a scam! With Republican fingerprints all over it! This is how they operate. Sowing doubt and dissent with misinformation. Inciting anger against the Fed to encourage people to demand a policy that will only help the banking elite and hurt the rest of us.
03:47 PM on 11/15/2011
Wow, just think this all happened while the Democrats controlled the House and the Senate! Amazing how those republican rascals get away with that when they are in the minority going on 3 years now ......

Wake up, there has been record government spending since O'bummer took office and our debt is out of control. Spending government money does not help ..... encouraging businesses to operate here by lowering the worlds highest corporate tax rate would probably help stimulate the economy and increase revenues. Reducing government spending would help balance the budget and improve the credit rating for the USA.
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JMKeynes
Democratic Party Operative
03:58 PM on 11/15/2011
Your comment has nothing to do with what I posted.

You said: Wow, just think this all happened while the Democrats controlled the House and the Senate ...:
I say: All what happened??? It was over your head so I'll simplify. The writer of the article claims the Fed is doing something wrong. It isn't doing anything wrong at all.

You say: encouragin­g businesses to operate here by lowering the worlds highest corporate tax rate would probably help stimulate the economy and increase revenues
I say: It's the effective tax rate that counts not the marginal. The US tax code offers the most generous loopholes in the world so what the corporations end up paying is very low or zero.

You say: Our debt is out of control.
I say: 80% of the national debt was already there on Obama's first day in office. I never heard any Republicans express the slightest interest or concern about it till their man was out and Obama was in. You also misspelled Obama's name.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
axoaxo
100% public financing of elections!
06:16 PM on 11/15/2011
The Repubs controlled BOTH branches of Congress and the Presidency for nearly a DECADE and September 2008 and its aftermath clearly show their legacy
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
BoshSpong
My micro-bio does not meet HP's guidelines
02:44 AM on 11/16/2011
During the mortgage bubble heydays, and before wall street got used to ever growing profits and market share.

These sky-high profits came about because of the tech bubble followed by the mortgage bubble, the latter was caused exclusively by deregulation and greed.

With investors seeking ever higher profits, banks, funds, and others put tremendous pressure (still unabated) to produce more profits and higher market share.

Anyone with a lick of sense can tell you that such is not sustainable. It is impossible to keep generating obsene profits and larger market share.

We saw imvestors make a bundle by buying up companies and making them more profitable by selling assests, cutting wages, exporting jobs and now they are trying to destroy workers rights.

When Reagan succeeded in changing the benchmark of success from the benefit provided for society to making more profits, when our values were changed to the worship of money and markets, we made the turn into the direction of social instability and injustice.

Unless we bring back sanity to our economy there will be more and deeper disaster ahead.

Anyone who suggests that ever increasing profits are sustainable does not understand history nor reality.
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JMKeynes
Democratic Party Operative
04:16 AM on 11/16/2011
One of the side effects of tax advantages for the rich and allowing them to acquire a much larger share of the nation’s wealth is never discussed. The immense wealth the accumulated didn’t produce promised benefits for the general population. Instead we got a series of financial bubbles that they caused by reckless speculation that damaged the entire economy.

• 1987 and 1997 brief shocks hinted what would come
• 1999-2002 A frenzy of dot com stocks, that no remembers today peaked in 2000, caused a recession which was the catalyst for more tax cuts.
• 2001-2002 – speculative energy trading suddenly appeared. Enron rose and fell.
• 2003 – 2008 - Conditions were prepared to ease real estate investing. Property values rose quickly in 2004. In some cities property values increased 50% in 2005. Wall Street packaged the mortgages into securities that depended on increasing property values and sold them worldwide. In 2006, real estate peaked then started to fall and we still have the consequences today.
• 2007 – Speculation in the oil markets drove gas prices up to $5 gallon in some cities.
• 2008-2011 – Speculation in wheat indirectly brought about revolutions in North Africa, Speculation in gold is not yet resolved and speculation in oil drove gas prices up once again.

With the damage that was done, it’s no coincidence the elites demand (through their enablers) honorary titles like job creator or wealth creator as if to erase any memory of their misdeeds.
05:05 PM on 11/16/2011
Loaning people money for homes they couldn't afford was a social experiment that failed miserably. Freddie and Fannie was a huge part of the reason we got in this mess.

The same sort of problem happened in Texas in the 80's and it took about 6 to 8 years to get out of that mess. Loaning out money to entities that cannot support themselves is bad business. Quit blaming people that have worked hard and made money.
RTIII
Poster of over 0.0135% of all HufPost comments
10:55 AM on 11/15/2011
If you ever needed proof that Obama (and all the Republicans) are NOT for the 98%, here it is:

"But since 2008, the Fed has actually paid banks to park their excess reserves at the central bank, rather than lend them out into the economy. If the Fed wanted that money to make its way to consumers and businesses and stimulate job growth, it could simply reverse its policy -- instead of paying banks interest on excess reserves, it could charge them fees. At present, banks can actually make money by doing nothing with their money. If there were a penalty for doing nothing, banks would work harder to find good loan candidates."

Obama CAN, if he wishes, compell the Fed to reverse this policy. If they won't when asked, he can replace the Chairman. And, he can wage a war of publicity on the point.

BTW, it was none too easy to get them to loan you money before. Today, you LITERALLY have to show you don't need a loan to get one.
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blarneydude
I can handle the truth. Now let's talk about you.
10:45 AM on 11/15/2011
Wow, the GOTea fundamentally misunderstands how economics work!

(Other than: him have big money. Me like him. Me like him whole whole lot, maybe he getum me serve on his board of directors.)

Big shock. So, let's add this to the list of things the GOTea doesn't understand:

1) Science
2) History
3) Sex
4) Women
5) Biology
6) ...oh god I just realized this might take me all day...
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Joel Mendez
producer of The Raptor Jesus Show, and REV.
01:20 PM on 11/15/2011
#238
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
marla singer
I am Jack's micro-bio
06:07 AM on 11/16/2011
That comment was so awesome, he's now up to #252! (which is me, full disclosure!)
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
BMcCue7
I'm Buddy McCue (and you're not.)
10:36 AM on 11/15/2011
The "uncertainty" argument was never believable anyway.

The implication is that President Obama is some kind of unpredictable, wild-eyed radical who might do anything, and that prevents businesspeople from "creating jobs."

What nonsense. It's especially nonsensical coming from people who don't see a problem with the under-regulated financial markets, which creates FAR more uncertainty than the mild-mannered tepid actions of our president or the Democratic Party.