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California High Speed Rail Public Hearing Draws Critics

California High Speed Rail

First Posted: 11/16/11 02:48 PM ET Updated: 11/16/11 03:34 PM ET

By Brooke Donald, Associated Press

PALO ALTO, Calif. (AP) -- Supporters and opponents of an ambitious, multibillion dollar plan to build a high-speed rail line in California got their first chance Tuesday to bring their opinions to lawmakers who held a public hearing that at times got testy as environmental, economic and industrial concerns collided.

The bullet train under consideration would link San Francisco and Anaheim, and include the Central Valley.

A new draft plan that lawmakers will vote on next year was released Nov. 1. Assemblyman Rich Gordon, who heads the subcommittee that oversees transportation agencies, led the hearing at Palo Alto City Hall.

Three panels kicked off the four-hour hearing. Presenters included top officials from the California High-Speed Rail Authority, representatives of citizen groups, a member of the nonpartisan Legislative Analyst's Office and officials from business and labor groups. Residents and others advocates stepped to the microphone later.

Gordon, D-Menlo Park, said the goal was to express concerns or support and learn how the plan was drafted.

Opponents called the project a boondoggle, too expensive and a jobs killer, and questioned ridership and revenue projections.

They also said it wasn't the project originally approved by voters several years ago and urged lawmakers to allow residents to weigh in again at the ballot box.

Opponents also said the dependence on federal dollars to help build the rail is a flawed strategy with upcoming elections that could change the political landscape in Washington.

Assemblyman David Valadao, R-Hanford, questioned the rail authority on this point, drawing cheers from the audience.

"This is a very risky plan," Elizabeth Alexis of Californians Advocating Responsible Rail Design added later. "I urge you, I urge you — figure out a way to get another year on this because right now it's not something that works."

Some speakers' remarks drew various laughs, applause, signs of disapproval and finger-waving before Gordon urged respect for differing opinions.

An audience member twice shouted "boo," but the hearing went on without major interruption.

The packed house and enthusiasm from the crowd showed the concern many people share about the project, estimated now to have a cost of $98.5 billion in inflation-adjusted funding over a 20-year construction period.

While acknowledging the giant price tag, supporters, however, urged lawmakers to press ahead. They argued the cost of maintaining and improving other infrastructure is more than the rail project, which opponents dispute, and said it will put hundreds of thousands of people to work, especially in the hard hit construction industry.

"We are about to embark on the largest public works project in the U.S.," said Cesar Diaz, legislative director of State Building and Construction Trades. "It couldn't have come at a better time."

Cement masons, electricians, laborers and others would be put back to work, he argued. A rail line would create demand for new restaurants, stores and other businesses at stations.

"The naysayers today are wrong," he said to snickers from the audience. "Most of all we need jobs."

Several residents took their turn at the microphone but public comment was mostly dominated by activists.

Leonardo Hochberg, a web engineer from Palo Alto, stood in support of the project and warned lawmakers if they did not act they were voting against the future.

"If you do not lead today, we will have the same transportation problems and worse in 20 or 30 years," he said. "And that's going to affect me and my son."

Still others, however, said a rail project with routes near their Central Valley farms would harm their businesses and their livelihoods.

The public has 60 days to comment on the project. Lawmakers will not vote on whether to approve selling high-speed rail bonds until after they return in January.

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By Brooke Donald, Associated Press PALO ALTO, Calif. (AP) -- Supporters and opponents of an ambitious, multibillion dollar plan to build a high-speed rail line in California got their first chance ...
By Brooke Donald, Associated Press PALO ALTO, Calif. (AP) -- Supporters and opponents of an ambitious, multibillion dollar plan to build a high-speed rail line in California got their first chance ...
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TurnToTheLeft
It's only called CLASS WARFARE when we fight back
12:49 PM on 11/18/2011
We the People want High Speed Rail. 30 years ago I traveled throughout Japan on the Bullet Train - it was wondrous and inspiring. Faster than going to the airport, checking baggage, flight delays and flight times. The Bullet Train saves time and money. One could opt to go to the dining car, have a meal, watch the landscape whiz by and before you know it you are at your destination stress free. The USA has fallen behind Europe, Japan and China. It is tragic that parsimonious Republicans are holding our economy and future hostage because they are beholden to Billionaires with private jets. We need High Speed Rail to restore our economy and environment.
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Miracle Politics
Love is the answer; whatever the question.
12:35 PM on 11/18/2011
Conservative cry poor around anything that would reduce the flow of corporate campaign cash from the oil lobby.

But watch Mitt Romney launch a war against Iran and trillions will be found instantaneously for the military-industrial complex to enrich Halliburton. Actually, debt-and-spend conservatives like George W. Bush will just put the coming Iran War on a credit card and then argue we have to dismantle what's left of Social Security and Medicare to pay for it.
11:28 AM on 11/18/2011
What bothers me the most is that we have to squabble over whether to build this. The United States has the money. No matter how broke we are, we still seem to rustle up the money to further subsidize our roads and airlines, build a useless carpool lane on the 405, not to mention fund our military bases in 140 countries. WE ARE THE RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD and our Federal Government doesn't care about the well being of its citizens. Instead, it chooses to continue functioning as a corporation and disregard our own personal well being for its business interests' profit margins. This country built a significant amount of the interstate system in a number of years simply because it suddenly appealed to our economic and defense interests. It's too bad they don't react the same way when it comes to developing green, affordable transit.
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Miracle Politics
Love is the answer; whatever the question.
12:32 PM on 11/18/2011
According to conservatives we have to give tax cuts to billionaires who don't need them.

Look at who the critics of high speed rail are on Capitol Hill and then look at how much they get in corporate campaign cash from the oil lobby.
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cityprole
old,sly, crafty,arty, leftie
04:51 PM on 11/17/2011
Have to wonder about who is really opposing this..must be the auto and gas companies..no one else in their right mind would be against anything that moves people, safely, efficiently, cheaply and in the least-polluting way possible..
07:42 PM on 11/17/2011
Are you serious?? Do you realize how much this will cost?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cityprole
old,sly, crafty,arty, leftie
10:25 AM on 11/18/2011
Do you realize how much more it will cost if they wait, yet again? The price for infrastructure never goes down...
What does road maintenance cost? Pollution in terms of public health? I grew up in LA, and haven`t been able to breathe properly, ever! Short term pain for long term gain..that`s the brutal truth.
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Miracle Politics
Love is the answer; whatever the question.
12:32 PM on 11/18/2011
Do you realize how much this will cost if we DON'T build it now?
02:09 PM on 11/17/2011
So - if every single person in San Francisco (pop 800,000) rode this 90 billion dollar train 4 times per year for twenty years, it would only cost them $1406 per trip. Please note this does not include any operating cost or maintenance - just construction.

If you you think my math is off, just use the numbers from the Acela line from Boston to Washington. If the California line can match the Acela line's ridership, they'd have 3,218,718 riders per year. Over a 20 year period, that would make the cost $1398 per trip not including operating cost or maintenance.

Sounds like a great deal to me.
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retrievals
TAX CUTS = JOBS = BIG FAT LIE
11:05 AM on 11/17/2011
I have never seen a commuter rail project that isn't packed to the gills with riders after it begins operation. People love being freed from their cars. I live within walking to distance to the Minneapolis light rail and was able to dump the car. When I did have a car, I drove it less than 50 miles a month.

I bet many of you red state white flight drivers drive 50 miles each way every day to go to work.
11:55 AM on 11/17/2011
Actually, spending the money on inner city transportation rather than this project would benefit far more people and have a greater impact on the environment. Getting from LA to SF is infrequent and easy compared to daily commutes. But that isn't the point of the project.
garystartswithg
el sueno de la razon produce republicans
01:36 PM on 11/17/2011
BART is a pretty good system as it is, I always see LA claim to be good, but its pretty awful. The city itself is sprawled mess and not an easy thing to deliver transportation services to.
I live in Atlanta, and we got our heavy rail the same time they started BART. We have population centers that grew up around stations. I am in an old neighborhood about 5 blocks from a station, and we have been innundated with midrises and high rises, shopping, restaurants, etc. Never thought I would live 3 blocks from a Ligne Roset, now I feel all special. Perhaps LA could focus on building a more comprehensive rail that has urban living/shopping included.
I am inclined to agree with you, but at the same time I grew up in FL right off of I-4, and I remember the locals gathering around wondering who would ever want to drive from Tampa to Daytona.
11:02 AM on 11/17/2011
Some people are so shortsighted. We can't go on down the road without making some changes in the way we get around. Gas is not going to get cheaper and a great mass transportation system is the answer.
garystartswithg
el sueno de la razon produce republicans
01:22 PM on 11/17/2011
What? Build infrastructure? St Reagan would not approve.
06:23 PM on 11/17/2011
Right! So,here's my plan. First,we pass this. (That 'll trick the Smart People into returning.) Then we pay it off in monopoly money.Except,we'll print it with Ronald Reagan's face in the center to lend cred. Imagine you're a Smart Person,JD (I know,but just try! ) Sounds good ,huh?
and,after the train, The Intra California Canal.
"If you Build It,We Will Float" TM
Sometimes,it's just too easy here.
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10:40 AM on 11/17/2011
Had it actually been built when it was suppose to have been built we would be just finishing it
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TommyObama
Abuse of power comes as no surprise.
11:31 AM on 11/17/2011
Which is actually why I'm less than enthusiastic about California taking the lead on this; as much as I favor HS rail, should this very expensive line be our first major investment? CA's record of adequately taxing itself to pay for things isn't so good, and I think the rest of the nation will end up subsidizing CA's line more than we would in say, Illinois or Florida or especially, the NE. I think we're setting up HS rail to fail, by placing CA up front. I hope CA proves me wrong, but I don't see a local willingness to pay for it.
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Just walkin the dog here
So, just where is this micro-bio? This it?
10:27 AM on 11/17/2011
Go to Europe sometime. You can get to just about anywhere by train. They just have a head statr on us. Gas isn't ever going to get cheaper.
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Miracle Politics
Love is the answer; whatever the question.
12:41 PM on 11/18/2011
You can also get better health care. France is ranked #1 in the world. We're ranked 37 and dropping.
10:37 PM on 11/16/2011
Call CA State Senators Joe Simitian (916) 651-4011 & Alan Lowenthal (916) 651-4027 and Assemblyman Rich Gordon at (916) 319-2021 (Simitian, Lowenthal, Gordon control CA HSR funds disbursement) & CA Tresurer Bill Lockyer at (916) 653-2995 & Governor Jerry Brown at (916) 445-2841 to demand that they end the boondoggle now.

Spend limited California money for Schools and Seniors Not High-Speed-Rail.

A 9/29/2011 statewide poll (Probolsky) confirms California voters overwhelmingly vote to spend limited state money on education/tuition, mentally ill, water, environment (75%) over a “high-speed-train” between SF-LA (11%). And, 63% vote to end the HSR boondoggle now and 61% said they wouldn't ever take a HSR train from SF to LA. The results are not shocking. Due to California’s bad budget, in 2011 we saw: protests at UC & CSU from 26% tuition increases, lawsuits from cities/non-profits due to CA taking their money but releasing convicted felons into our communities, senior centers/state parks closing, raiding city redevelopment funds, cutbacks in social services, etc. In contrast, HSR cost estimates keep rising to $67 –100 billion and feds only providing $3 billion, with California liable for $97 billion. Poll here: http://www.probolskyresearch.com/california-voters-on-state-spending-and-high-speed-rail/ ans http://www.probolskyresearch.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Probolsky-Research-State-Spending-and-High-Speed-Rail-Results-Memorandum2.pdf
10:20 AM on 11/17/2011
Mother Jones said 8/11/2011 in article “California’s HSR Boondoggle – Now More Boondoggly” that CA HSR should be ended because construction costs have already ballooned to $100,000,000,000,000.00 in 2011-year dollars. Mother Jones said:

“If the cost of the entire project balloons at the same pace as the Central Valley section, the San Francisco-to-Anaheim railroad would cost from $63 billion to $87 billion, similar to what independent analysts have been predicting. And those figures do not include inflation, which could push the final cost toward a staggering $100 billion. When California voters approved the project in 2008, the state said it would cost $33 billion, but it soared to $43 billion a year later.

Look, I'm sorry, HSR lovers. I love me some HSR, too, but this project is just a fantastic boondoggle. It didn't even make sense with the original cost estimates, and it's now plain that it's going to cost three or four times more than that. What's more, the ridership estimates are still fantasies, and it won't be able to compete with air travel without large, permanent subsidies. This is just too much money to spend on something this dumb. It's the kind of thing that could set back HSR for decades. Sacramento needs to pull the plug on this, and they need to pull it now. We have way better uses for this dough.” Article here: http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2011/08/californias-hsr-boondoggle-now-even-more-boondoggly
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TommyObama
Abuse of power comes as no surprise.
11:34 AM on 11/17/2011
Sadly, I agree. Better to spend this money in places that have better histories of USING rail, like the NE and Chicago and neighboring states.
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dbrett480
06:22 PM on 11/16/2011
How can anyone think this is a good idea?
06:26 PM on 11/17/2011
Lot of Dems come to sites like this.Not very tech savvy. IQ's of maybe 83. Running downhill.With the wind at their backs.On a good day.
Good thing the resat of the state isn't like this,or it would be in real trouble.
Oh ?
You're sure?
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Miracle Politics
Love is the answer; whatever the question.
12:33 PM on 11/18/2011
The least educated states tend to be conservative and vote Republican.
06:21 PM on 11/16/2011
If the federal government gives CA enough money to build it and operate it for ten years then we should go ahead. It will produce local construction jobs and even if ridership is lower and costs are higher they will be shared by the whole country.
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skyslimit
05:33 PM on 11/16/2011
Too expensive? Not really. Just a few months worth of war.
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cityprole
old,sly, crafty,arty, leftie
04:53 PM on 11/17/2011
fanned and faved!
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GuyRC
FYI: there is a cream for micro-bio.
04:32 PM on 11/16/2011
High speed rail between the Bay Area and LA would be awesome. Carry it on to San Diego.