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Marines Photo With Logo Resembling Nazi Symbol Should Be Investigated, Panetta Says

Marines Nazi Symbol

LOLITA C. BALDOR and JULIE WATSON   02/10/12 05:20 PM ET  AP

WASHINGTON — Defense Secretary Leon Panetta told the Marine Corps on Friday to re-investigate and take appropriate action against the Marine snipers who posed with a logo resembling a notorious Nazi symbol.

The top Marine officer apologized for the incident and ordered his commanders to look into the use of such symbols by snipers and reconnaissance Marines and make sure they are educated on how inappropriate such actions are.

The rapid-fire announcements came on the heels of demands from a leading Jewish organization and others for President Barack Obama to order an investigation into the incident and to hold the troops accountable.

Panetta met with Marine Corps Commandant James Amos on Friday to discuss, among other things, a spate of problem incidents involving Marines that have surfaced in recent months. A U.S. defense official said Panetta approved of the actions being taken by Amos to address the problems. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because the meeting was private.

An initial Marine investigation into the matter concluded that the troops would not be disciplined because there was no malicious intent. The Marines mistakenly believed the "SS" in the shape of white lightning bolts on the blue flag were a nod to sniper scouts – not members of Adolf Hitler's special unit that murdered millions of Jews, Catholics, gypsies and others, said Maj. Gabrielle Chapin, a spokeswoman at Camp Pendleton, Calif.

But the furor over the photo – which was taken in September 2010 in Afghanistan – grew as Jewish leaders and others questioned whether it was an innocent mistake.

Pentagon press secretary George Little said that racist and anti-Semitic symbols have no place alongside U.S. service members.

And in a statement released Friday, Marine Corps Commandant James Amos ordered individual instruction for the sniper and reconnaissance Marines about the prohibitions against inappropriate symbols.

"I want to be clear that the Marine Corps unequivocally does not condone the use of any such symbols to represent our units or Marines," Amos said. "On behalf of the Marine Corps and all Marines, I apologize to all offended by this regrettable incident."

Amos also contacted Abraham H. Foxman, national director of the Anti-Defamation League, to assure him that the Corps will not tolerate the use of Nazi imagery. The Marines, said Foxman, have made it clear that they are taking steps to ensure that all the troops are aware of why Nazi imagery has no place in the armed services.

The Marines involved in the photo are no longer with Charlie Company, 1st Reconnaissance Battalion, out of the base north of San Diego. Chapin said she did not know if they had left the Corps.

Military officials learned of the photograph in November and investigated immediately. It later surfaced on a blog of a military weapons company.

The photo, taken in the Sangin district of Helmand province, shows 10 Marines posed with sniper rifles in front of an American flag above a dark blue flag with the "SS" letters.

Rabbi Marvin Hier, founder of Los Angeles' Simon Wiesenthal Center, who had called for Obama and Panetta to investigate the incident, said he welcomed Friday's development.

"I'm happy to hear that at the highest echelons of the United States government, this is being taken seriously," Hier said.

According to Chapin, the Corps has used the incident as a training tool to talk to troops about what symbols are acceptable.

"I don't believe that the Marines involved would have ever used any type of symbol associated with the Nazi Germany military criminal organization that committed mass atrocities in WWII," Chapin said. "It's not within who we are as Marines."

It was the second time this year that images have surfaced showing Marines acting improperly and forcing the Corps to deal with the fallout. Last month, the Pentagon scrambled to contain the damage after an Internet video purportedly showed Marines urinating on Taliban corpses – an act that appeared to violate international laws of warfare and further strained U.S.-Afghan relations. Panetta called Afghan President Hamid Karzai to offer assurances of an investigation, and the top Marine general promised an internal probe as well as a criminal one.

Those Marines, like the ones in front of the flag, fought in former Taliban strongholds in Helmand province. They are based at Camp Lejeune, N.C.

Mikey Weinstein of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, headquartered in Albuquerque, N.M., said the scandals hurt U.S. military missions. His organization wrote to Amos and Panetta on Thursday, calling on them to "condemn this stomach-turning display without equivocation or delay and severely punish all of those responsible."

The Military Religious Freedom Foundation released another photo showing a Marine and his rifle with the "SS" logo. According to the Marine Corps Times, embedded electronic information in the image shows that it was released by the Corps in 2004 and taken at the Marine Corps Air Ground Combat Center at Twentynine Palms, Calif. Two Marines in it were with a scout sniper platoon.

The newspaper said that suggests the practice is more widespread and that the logo's use is meant to signify "scout sniper," a position exclusive to the Corps. The Army has scouts and snipers but considers the positions to be separate.

The photograph appeared on the blog for a military weapons manufacturer, Knight's Armament, in Titusville, Fla. Spokesman Jon Oxford said the company invites troops to send in photos so customers can see how its weapons are used in the field.

The company removed the photo Thursday because of the media attention, he said.

___

Watson reported from San Diego.

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This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
09:54 AM on 02/13/2012
5:7 12 ie. 5:1 1,2,3 3,2,1 7:1 ie hmmm. 5:1 ohhh. 6:4 10 7:5 12 affirm and access situation in less than 15 sec.
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09:05 AM on 02/13/2012
1,2,3 semi sq 1,2,3 adop hy hyop ad 5:1 6:4 10 7:5 12 db headed vulcani GQ. bs eat your heart out.
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02:14 AM on 02/14/2012
(once, twice, thrice) semi-square, (one, two, three) Adjacent/Opposite Hypotenuse, (angles) Opposite/Hypotenuse Adjacent, (angles) (5:1) 12 7:5 3,2,1 6:4 10 5:7 12 1,2,3.
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Thomas Alan
08:53 AM on 02/13/2012
are those nazi symbols on a nazi flag that was sold from a nazi memorbilia flag site ? yes, do most Americans know a blue flag with lighting bolts on it is a nazi flag, no.
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NYBill
02:04 AM on 02/14/2012
There has never been a Nazi flag of that design on record,Ergo, it is NOT a Nazi flag; just as it is not a Roman Legion flag or a Mayan flag...it's a Marine Scout Sniper flag!
The nazis also used the eagle, the skull and the Firebord symbols...is the entire world supposed to discontinue using those symbols as well? For who?

P.S. If you are able to produce a Nazi unit displaying that flag...please feel free to show it to us.

In the meantime, perhaps we should begin to discuss this and the attack on the USS Lincoln...

The prohibition 'Thou Shalt Not Murder' applies only "to a Jew who kills a Jew," write Rabbis Yitzhak Shapira and Yosef Elitzur of the West Bank settlement of Yitzhar. Non-Jews are "uncompassionate by nature" and attacks on them "curb their evil inclination," while babies and children of Israel's enemies may be killed since "it is clear that they will grow to harm us."

"The King's Torah (Torat Hamelech), Part One: Laws of Life and Death between Israel and the Nations," a 230-page compendium of Halacha, or Jewish religious law, published by the Od Yosef Chai yeshiva in Yitzhar, garnered a front-page exposé in the Israeli tabloid Ma'ariv, which called it the stuff of "Jewish terror."
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
08:30 AM on 02/13/2012
We're hoofing the bill for manufacturing and industries gas, durable and consumer goods and share the costs and burden of refineries and mining on the environment however unless you can pass the burdens on down along the way all the burden will always be centralized.
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07:04 AM on 02/13/2012
pseudo white christian supremacist american military elite values, if the two were more polar and oppositely configured, the one would have already split and turned against and engulfed one of the others entirely and left no remnants the one was gone at all to begin with, backwards and opposite to what is written and commonly believed.
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rbrain
no tea for me please
02:09 AM on 02/13/2012
For all the apologists of the military bringing up buddhist symbols and "the flag is blue not black", or claiming that nobody can use the letter SS anywhere, here's something to consider. These blue SS flags are available for purchase from NAZI memorabilia sites like "traders of the lost surplus". These sites are chock full of Nazi goods like the Shutzstaffel flag. Kind of hard to claim you didn't know its a Nazi Flag when you got it from a Nazi's R' Us website.

Its one thing to support the troops, but come on people. This was incredibly stupid thing to do and the lying excuse is worse, and not honorable.
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NYBill
03:41 AM on 02/14/2012
Congratulations...It only took you the better part of FOUR days to discover the vendor selling these replicas. I discovered it on the first day and have enjoyed the mindless drones crying and turning this thing into a bash the US Marines feeding frenzy, which is what the whole thing is about- Bash the US military whenever the opportunity presents. The Marines were not being stupid...they simply chose a flag they liked and they do not seek your imprimatur or sanction, therefore, no lie necessary,period!
If you choose to create a nexus of the two different styles...it's your creation,live with it.
Try as you might to make yourselves relevant at their expense is a fools errand at best, and this leftist freak show is a further demonstration of stupidity on a grand scale;

This company sells replicas of German WW II stuff because the real stuff is extremely difficult to come by and very expensive. It's impossible to openly buy authentic Nazi SS items because the Swastika has been outlawed (Nice going Germany...how's that free speech thing working out for you? Anything else you would like to ban, books?, art works?, ideas?, people???) Some people never learn.
A friend who visited Germany, told me simulated imitation Nazi stuff is a big business over there...Like replica Statues of Liberty in NYC or the little White Houses and Washington Monuments in a snow globe in Washington,D.C.
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rbrain
no tea for me please
11:23 AM on 02/15/2012
What possible difference does it make if the item isn't a bona fide real original nazi artifact? The point is putting a nazi themed flag up next the American flag, while you are an active duty US soldier, is an idiotic thing to do. You may claim to be the fastest, best searcher on the internet, and the holder of all truth... but unfortunately, the Secretary of Defense doesn't agree with you.
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Freenation
01:58 AM on 02/13/2012
Foxman? Where was the outrage when the marines were photographed urinating on dead corpses...didn't Pam Gellar said 'she loved those marines'..where is the love now?
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fapescia
02:27 AM on 02/13/2012
I wonder like you. I will have to venture to her website to read her defense of the Marines.
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Freenation
10:00 AM on 02/13/2012
oh rest assured, she must be yelling antisemtic now...
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plepgeat
My micro-bio was empty.
12:52 AM on 02/13/2012
If these Marines have so little education in history that they don't know what the SS was, they need to go back to Paris Island and have a few thousand yards of shoe leather driven into their fundaments.
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NYBill
04:03 AM on 02/14/2012
plepgeat: YOU do not get it....No one cares about a bunch of old men who were running crazy 70, that's SEVENTY, years ago!!
They care even less about your selective outrage.....live with it!

This subject has been worn out, what say we discuss something with a bit more relevance,like the following:

The prohibition 'Thou Shalt Not Murder' applies only "to a Jew who kills a Jew," write Rabbis Yitzhak Shapira and Yosef Elitzur of the West Bank settlement of Yitzhar. Non-Jews are "uncompassionate by nature" and attacks on them "curb their evil inclination," while babies and children of Israel's enemies may be killed since "it is clear that they will grow to harm us."

"The King's Torah (Torat Hamelech), Part One: Laws of Life and Death between Israel and the Nations," a 230-page compendium of Halacha, or Jewish religious law, published by the Od Yosef Chai yeshiva in Yitzhar, garnered a front-page exposé in the Israeli tabloid Ma'ariv, which called it the stuff of "Jewish terror."

" while babies and children of Israel's enemies may be killed...""

Who did you say the Nazis were ??
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plepgeat
My micro-bio was empty.
02:20 PM on 02/18/2012
OK, I get it - you hate Jews, like Nazis, and selectively screen history to support your beliefs. As for what that has to do with the propriety of US military personnel adopting Nazi symbology, well, I still don't get it.
11:44 PM on 02/12/2012
SS= Marine Scout Sniper. The flag is blue for a reason.
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rbrain
no tea for me please
02:19 AM on 02/13/2012
The flag is blue because that is how it is sold from a Nazi memorabilia site. "Item #7180. ss double runic flag, a favorite and well know ss flag, 3' x 5' $7.50"

http://www.totls.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=16:close-out-corner&catid=1:home&Itemid=30
10:59 PM on 02/12/2012
Who made the flag? Why did somebody have that flag over there with them? Did that person understand the symbol? What was the reason that they posed with the stupid flag?
I think the real problem is that here is a group of men who are undereducated and proud of it.
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Anne Mccormick
11:34 PM on 02/12/2012
so, someone should straighten them out in a hurry
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NYBill
05:06 AM on 02/14/2012
Uneducated? Why, because they do not see need to worry about shtuff that took place 70 years ago?That's your drama play for special treatment... they are too busy killing their enemies.
You act like spoiled children.
Maybe we should discuss the attack on the USS Liberty, and the killing of 34 Americans by the Israelis.

The facts are clear. Nearly every researcher who has seriously investigated the circumstances agrees that the attack was deliberate. Evidence is overwhelming.

In any case, the attack on USS Liberty was a war crime even if one accepts the Israeli version of what happened, and we know that the Israeli version is untrue.

Most senior US government officials of the era and nearly every senior intelligence official agrees-- Israeli forces deliberately attacked a ship they knew to be American.
We were an intelligence ship and they were doing something that they did not want the US to know about. Intelligence analysts agree that they attacked because they feared we might learn something that they did not want the United States to know.

That could have been:
It is possible that they were afraid the Liberty might learn that Israeli forces were executing up to 1,000 Egyptian Prisoners of War at El Arish It is also possible that USS Liberty was attacked to prevent the ship from reporting a deliberate massacre of 14 Indian United Nations peacekeepers that took place in Gaza.

http://www.time.com/time/international/1995/951002/middleeast.html
09:48 PM on 02/12/2012
Bad timing more than anything. They used the S shape most commonly associated with the band Kiss's logo and NOT the lightening bolt of the SS. Any misunderstanding here is magnified by the truly deplorable video of Marines urinating on corpses. If an investigation should turn over some kind of Aryan secret society here than discipline away. What this most likely is though, is a teachable moment and should be treated as such.
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NYBill
05:08 AM on 02/14/2012
No teachavle moment unless the drones finally figure out that no one cares about your tender feelings of outrage and they are getting tired of hearing about it.

That's the word on the street and in the bus.
03:52 PM on 02/12/2012
So, is the problem the usage of the letters SS? Or, is the problem the font style of the letters SS?
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rbrain
no tea for me please
05:05 PM on 02/12/2012
don't be daft... read the article again.
08:35 AM on 02/13/2012
No sir, I am not daft. And I don't call other people that I don't know daft. But, I believe you are. Can you tell me, off the top of your head, how many Jews were killed by Stalin during the late 1920s and 1930s? More than 20 million. So pardon me if I don't get upset along with a couple of Rabbis from California because some men are fighting for our country and using SS, for sniper scouts, on a logo. Thanks for your comment.
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Anne Mccormick
11:35 PM on 02/12/2012
are you really that dense?
08:32 AM on 02/13/2012
No. You are. You're not in combat as these men are. You don't know what sniper scouts do. And the fact that a couple of Rabbis are offended is no reason for Americans to change. I don't see anyone crying over the 20_ million Jews that Stalin killed. Oh wait, Russia has a nuclear bomb. Okay, let's not nitpick.
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BMHVR
02:19 PM on 02/12/2012
So I can't even use 2 S'es to mean Social Security etc?
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
06:29 PM on 02/12/2012
Right, because the last time I was in a government office I did notice that the social security office had 'ss' on the door, and they'd used lightning bolts to depict each s, but they were meant to designate how fast the office operated...

Next door on the IRS office they'd used a death's head, but THAT only represented the departments new estate tax plan....

There's a difference between being annoyed at the overly PC and defending the use of a symbol which for all eternity will represent utter evil.
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NYBill
05:35 AM on 02/14/2012
"...for all eternity will represent utter evil."

For all eternity??? Wow, that's a long time to wallow in the murders of so many other people...you people must like digging up the bodies so you can demand some kind of special treatment.
Last week I was filling out a Gov. form and it asked for, Name:, Date of Birth: and SS Number! Should I have been outraged and demanded the form be changed this very instant?
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BMHVR
02:17 PM on 02/12/2012
I once saw a swastika symbol at the front door to a buddist temple when I was traveling in China. Its just the resemblance, it doesn't mean the same thing. So are we saying we can no longer use 2 S'es for inititals because the Nazi once used these initials fro something else? This is silly.
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Progress08
I've come to regard you as people I've met
03:04 PM on 02/12/2012
No it's not! The nazis stole that symbol from an ancient religion, but they invented the SS so no it's not silly.
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BMHVR
05:15 PM on 02/12/2012
Why are we letting the Nazis dictate what we can use and what we can't? This is childish. It clearly doesn't mean the same thing unless you take it out of context.
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NYBill
05:47 AM on 02/14/2012
...And over a million Americans and other Allied troops died taking them back! They paid for them in blood so they now own them to do what they want with them...they earned at least that.
Why not look at it as a cleansing of the ancient symbols instead of the macabre facination with death?
Let the dead rest in peace...for a change.
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rbrain
no tea for me please
05:08 PM on 02/12/2012
Silly? Its outrageous that the US Marines are posing with the American Flag next to a Nazi Flag. That is a disgrace and those who would trivialize or minimize it are a disgrace as well.
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The Mighty Cynic
12:15 PM on 02/12/2012
Stalin and Churchill helped kill just as many Jews through total war blockades intended to starve Germans and everyone inside their labor/prison camps.

I'm not apologize for anyone, I'm blaming MORE people.
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NYBill
06:09 AM on 02/14/2012
You should write your feelings down on paper.

Then put that paper next to the Charmin, where it belongs!